DO NOT make the mistake of pricing the xD base above 14K. It will hurt sales to the young people that you want to purchase the car. Your goal of selling Scions today to people who later buy a Toyota will not be reached. After destination charge and the dealer's markup, disguised as a doc fee, the car will be much more than what the others competing models will sell for next year. Think about it. Unless you want to have a bunch of AARP folks buying it, make it affordable ! Lose a little now, make a lot later.

DO NOT make the mistake of pricing the xD base above 14K. It will hurt sales to the young people that you want to purchase the car. Your goal of selling Scions today to people who later buy a Toyota will not be reached. After destination charge and the dealer's markup, disguised as a doc fee, the car will be much more than what the others competing models will sell for next year. Think about it. Unless you want to have a bunch of AARP folks buying it, make it affordable ! Lose a little now, make a lot later.
BTW, at 34 you're pretty much outside the target demographic yourself.

does being outside the demographic invalidate his opinion?

I'm under 35 which puts me on the far side of inside.

BTW you were never at any point in it Forty Deuce.

i too am outside the demographic, but he has a valid point. i bought my first box for 15,600, and my first xa for 13,600. very affordable. the new boxes that have come thru our dealership have all been over 18K. granted that the newer boxes have more engine, more safety refinements as well as the improvements for the xd, i would be a little more pressed to seek out alternatives. i love my scions and will prolly never get rid of them but any future purchase of them will have price in the picture.

My point exactly. It does not matter how great a deal they are offering for what you get. The bottom line is the bottom line for most really young buyers. When I was 21 I could not afford a car that cost 15k and not a chance of swinging a 18k car. I'm thrity four and now I can afford a 07 loaded 3 series beamer but I have no interest in throwing money away on a depreciating asset . I like my money in the market working for me. And the really young folks that scion claims to want are being priced right out of the market by the company that claims to want them. Its bipolar to say the least. Don't price the car above 14k. The xB is already out of the park. Don't make the same mistake on the little D. Give the young guys and gals a chance.

Some of you guys are pathetic. You say you want more power and more standard features but yet don't want to pay for it. If you can't afford what you're asking for in the xD, buy a xA.

We are talking about buying the xD. What the hell do you think we are talking about.
Read the posts before you make a stupid comments jagoff.

K, let's argue and tear each other apart nicely, please.

I'd rather have the xA over the xD, myself. Simple cars = better cars.

Some of you guys are pathetic. You say you want more power and more standard features but yet don't want to pay for it. If you can't afford what you're asking for in the xD, buy a xA.

:yawn :eyebrow: Who's "you"? I never asked for anything. I was happy the way things were. I don't need more power, I have to many tickets as is.

This site is great for shareing info with each other on the cars. But some people just want to throw off on everybody, which is causing me to visit less and less..... :(

This site is great for shareing info with each other on the cars. But some people just want to throw off on everybody, which is causing me to visit less and less..... :(

Yeah, this site has a purpose, users, and that isn't it. A lot of us here are trying to run a good, clean ship here. Don't ruin it for the rest of us, please.

does being outside the demographic invalidate his opinion?
Wasn't meant as an attempt to invalidate his opinion....sorry.
Just interesting how, in their attempt to target one demographic with inexpensive, optioned vehicles, Toyota ends up selling them to a much broader market.....myself included. It happened originally with the Matrix in '02/'03. Targeting the youth market, and getting a much older demographic. I don't think Toyota wants to admit that an older demographic doesn't necessarily want to buy a Camry or Avalon because that's what the marketing is aimed at. Personally, if Toyota offered the European optioned Yaris TS here, I'd be all over it even it did approach $18-20k. Small cars aren't just for the young because someone told us they were.

look, toyota has to price the xd at a point where it can make some profit. it is actually illegal for a company to sell something at a price that doesn't make a profit.

two, the demographic is the younger drivers, but lets face it, most buyers of new scions are their parents.

does being outside the demographic invalidate his opinion?
Wasn't meant as an attempt to invalidate his opinion....sorry.
Just interesting how, in their attempt to target one demographic with inexpensive, optioned vehicles, Toyota ends up selling them to a much broader market.....myself included. It happened originally with the Matrix in '02/'03. Targeting the youth market, and getting a much older demographic. I don't think Toyota wants to admit that an older demographic doesn't necessarily want to buy a Camry or Avalon because that's what the marketing is aimed at. Personally, if Toyota offered the European optioned Yaris TS here, I'd be all over it even it did approach $18-20k. Small cars aren't just for the young because someone told us they were.

i tihnk a that if a large number of buyers(not majority) is outside demographic, its can show the true "value" of a car

the first few scions-05,06,07 all were values-new styles, not often noticed, and blatantly different-this provides a open market for anyone wanting to be different, which really includes any age range

its cool-just originally came off as offensive, hence my comment

Let's take a Yaris 3-door and option it out as close to the xD as possible.

A loaded slushbox (because I can't drive stick) Yaris 3-door comes out to $15,770. The xD has more features than a loaded Yaris (larger engine with similar fuel economy, an extra pair of doors, better sound system, cruise control, etc. etc. etc.). For you to demand that it be priced under $14k is immensely unreasonable. Edmund's' $15,080 estimate, as thus, is pretty damn reasonable.

Honestly, I think $14,990 would be a better price. At least they could CLAIM it's under $15k. XD

Let's take a Yaris 3-door and option it out as close to the xD as possible.

A loaded slushbox (because I can't drive stick) Yaris 3-door comes out to $15,770. The xD has more features than a loaded Yaris (larger engine with similar fuel economy, an extra pair of doors, better sound system, cruise control, etc. etc. etc.). For you to demand that it be priced under $14k is immensely unreasonable. Edmund's' $15,080 estimate, as thus, is pretty damn reasonable.

Honestly, I think $14,990 would be a better price. At least they could CLAIM it's under $15k. XD

I thought the same way for a while, too. But them I thought "Hey, things might change." after I saw how the next-gen xB was priced. The equipment is comparable to Toyota's Rav4, but look at the price difference between the two:

The new xB is $4.7K LESS than the new Rav 4.

So, that just makes me think that they're able to make some changes and lower the price, somehow. I know it's not a %100 flawless theory, but there has to be something they can do about it.

Toyota always makes a profit. Sometimes more on some models than others. But pricing needs to be low for them to sell to the market they intened to sell they car to. They were selling to sell again on the 1st gen models. So far they appear to be moving away from that thus far on the 2nd gen. If they want to just sell cars to anyone then I think they are heading in the right direction. But the xD needs to be affordable for the young buyers. 14k is as high as they should go on the base price of the car alone w/out destination or dealer markup (doc fee). We will see. I'm sorry if my prior commets were out of line. I had a tough day at work.

I think all new Scions should come with a case of Chips A'Hoy.

I think that it is somewhat wrong to say that Scion Markets to young buyers. To me it seems like all their efforts are focused more on people who want to express their individualism. Now I understand that younger buyer, more often than not, fall into this personalization campaign, but there are many older buyers that also fall into it. And they are more willing to pay a little more to get a lot more in features.

I also have to agree with the earlier comment that for the younger kids, it is mostly parents buying the cars and not the kids themselves.
.02

I think that it is somewhat wrong to say that Scion Markets to young buyers.

Actually, the entire reason for the brand's existence is to bring in younger buyers. Toyota noticed that they had a ton of loyal customers, but the vast majority of them were over the age of 30, so they created a "youth-oriented brand" to lure us in younger. The customizeable-car model was introduced to appeal to us Generation Y people, who demand to personalize everything from computers to cheeseburgers.

The idea is that a 21-year-old Scion buyer today is a 31-year-old Camry buyer tomorrow, and a Highlander five years after that, etc etc.

For awhile, at least, it worked. Personally, I was a GM person, but I bought my first Scion at 24. It's reliable, it was dirt-cheap, and the looks are INSANE. A lot of incredibly old people bought them (60+), but most of us are young people who would otherwise have bought Civics or Aveos.

Unfortunately, the xB2 represents a GIGANTIC failure of this entire measure (stroll on over to their board for confirmation). In listening to bitter old people complain about the original xB's wimpy engine and insane shape, Scion created a BoomerMobile. Now the vast majority of people who drive one are in their 40's and 50's, or, as I call it, The Death Of Cool.

Hopefully the xD can pull the Scion brand out of their skyrocketing age demographic.

If not...IT'S UP TO YOU, tC PEOPLE. D:

$0.02

I guess we are kind of arguing the same thing. When I refer to 'young buyers' I mean more 16-21. But Generation Y is more 22-32. To me the difference would be 'young buyers' have still not graduated college or something close to that.

It just seems that they are trying to further appeal to the tuner/personalized audience/demographic now. And while I understand that these cars are not as cheap as they used to be, there is, not only inflation to consider and the fact that it is an import, but also the fact that even though Scion is the "entry level" toyota brand, it is still a premium brand. And as such it will still be more than just another "cheap" econo box.

Either way I think it is still to early to pass judgment on the new models. Time, and the consumer, will tell whether or not the masses, and not just scion life members, accept these new cars.

Scion does not want the masses. They want young people but 16 to 21 is not even young. People in that age range are usually not purcahsing cars on their own except a few of theose in early 20s. Most teenagers could not finance a snickers bar on their own. The 2gen xBs are selling close to 20k where I live. Not a lot of kids can swing those payments so its up to the xD for Scion. Don't screw it up SCION.

You're right to say the 16-21 can't finance a snickers bar. That was my point that that group has their parents to buy the cars.

I think that its safe to say any manufacturer would love to sell their cars to the masses. With the exception of exotic brands who like to have some sort of exclusivity to their brand, most would want to sell their cars to anyone and everyone.

Man I haven't seen any xB's up to 20k yet. All the ones i've seen are around 17k, which is still more than the 14k everyone here seems to be looking for. I guess a lot really does have to do with the distributor. Dont forget that its the distributor, not the manufacturer, that equips cars with all the extra features that bump the price of cars up. I know that doesnt lower the 16349 base price of the xb, but theres a big difference between affording 17k and 20k when you're on a budget.

I am 90% sure getting a Xd, UNLESS it is priced too high...i get under invoice for all toyotas but still...Otherwise i'll get a yaris, or more likely a fit or civic...or even a corolla...Im 29 here. I should find out my pricing next month hopefully.

you know what, i'd really like it if scion continues to expand it's model line up and offer more expensive higher performance models.

i would love that when my time with my tc is over, to be able to replace it with a new scion with a more powerful engine and a sportier drivetrain like rear or all wheel drive, but still be a blank canvas for me to express my individually and unique taste on.

scion could make a mid-life crisis mobile for me when i'm forty, if i live that long and i'd be very happy!

I'll buy xD for $14K, I'll buy it for $15K, I might even buy it for $16K. It's still a way better deal than anything else around.

you know what, i'd really like it if scion continues to expand it's model line up and offer more expensive higher performance models.

They do. They call them "toyotas."

People, Scion is the bottom of the barrel. Yes, it's the bottom of the TOYOTA barrel, but it's still the "entry-level" (read: cheap) end of the company. They're the cheap economobiles for twenty-somethings to buy before they trade up to the REAL meat of Toyota's business: Camrys and Highlanders.

If you can't tell from the ad campaigns, the Scion line is NOT directed at forty-somethings with two kids. And I don't know about you, but not many of my 23-year-old friends make $60,000 a year. So let's keep them nice and cheap, please, and if you want an expensive mid-life crisis-mobile I'm sure there'll be plenty of Mustangs around...at last until Ford goes bankrupt.

The xB2 was already a gigantic step in the wrong direction, and there's still people on that board clamoring for heated seats and adjustable intermittent / water-sensing wipers. It's already too expensive and too big - it's a great car, but already Scion has abandoned an entire segment of the market - kids who are too smart to buy Aveos. The xD will fill that gap in the meantime, but if the geniuses at Toyota keep supersizing these stupid cars, Scion will become the next Buick.

Bottom line: if you want a Lexus, kids...BUY A LEXUS.

If I would of known the xD's ere going to look like how they are...I would of hold on "Trading in the xA with negitve amount" process and went with the xD.

I hate to admit this...but I kind of enjoy seeing the 40+ aged women driving around in their tC's. It reminds me the VW Beetle era...Affordable, good on gas, and has everything that you could need except the VW didn't have heaters back then. Then of course, this is coming from a 23 year old girl who wants '69 Cherry Red Rag-top Beetle :D

the xD needs to be priced THE SAME as the Versa. if not slightly less...that’s the direct competitor. If I cant get a 5spd xD for less then 14,500 its going to fail.

Here is what I think…
xD $14,500
xB2 $16,500
tC2 $17,500

that gives potential buys a range in price and style of car. If your looking for an xD your likely very “cheap” and looking for good gas mileage rather then 0-60 times. You want a cheap car that gets the job done. xB2 buys are trying to be a more stylish, being stylish costs money. tC2 owners are looking for performance, and are likely enthusiasts. And as we all know…enthusiast are well known for spending a little extra for the type of car they want.

You have to remember to keep an objective mind. If the xD comes out at 15k that might be too much for you but just fine for other people. To say it will fail is a bit much. Even priced more expensive I don't see it doing worse than the xA. That was a cheap fuel efficient car but it didn't sell because the same demographic that wants that personalization didn't want the bottom line car... for the most part. I know that xA owners love their cars and they're great, but they didn't produce the way the tC and xB did. I think, price aside, that the styling and features that the xD has is more in line with what Scion is about.
I would not compare the versa to the xD. Though the car segment is the same each car attracts different types of buyers. It's like the way Hyundai compares their SUV's and cars to BMW and Land Rover. Sure the specs can be close to the same or better, and of course the price is cheaper, but there are people who would still rather have the more expensive car; most likely for the "status" it brings. That is also true for Scion. even though it is more expensive than the other "econo boxes" out there, there is something about being a Scion owner that attracts people to the brand. There's an emotional attachment to be considered, it's not all numbers.

With the prices for gas being high though Xa have been flying out the door.

but here is the problem...toyota and lexus don't make many cars that i want. i want a sports car. as in rear or all wheel drive, and a manual transmission, a real manual transmission, complete with a clutch pedal. with those requirments, the only vehicles that toyota/lexus make that qualify are the toyota x-runner that i don't think is made anymore, and the lexus is250.

i am serious in that toyota/lexus/scion need to take notice that ALOT of scion owners move from their economical scions to true sports cars like nissan 350z, subaru impreza wrx sti, mitsubishi lancer evolution, and the honda s2000. toyota has nothing that competes with those cars. nothing even close. and also, i would love to stay in the scion family for a long time. but if they can't make a model that keeps me captivated, i'm not going to stay around.

also, remember, companies do grow and expand. toyota used to be nothing but cheap, fuel efficient, and reliable cars. now they have grown with luxurious models with bigger chasis and more powerful engines.

scion starts small and has the potential to go really big.

i'm pretty sure scion has a more vested interest in maintaining a constant stream of teens and twentysomethings than accommodating one driver who's already planning his mid-life crisis at 21 :lalala:

i totally respect that you want to stay in the family, but if you want a high-powered sports car, you're definitely buying cars from the wrong people. i absolutely agree - it'd be nice to buy scions that were appropriate for every stage of our lives.

however, scion came along and saved an entire generation from having to buy Aveos and Kias, and frankly I'd rather they not abandon the entire young-buyer market than stick with us - and our tastes - until we're in our fifties. what happens to the next generation, then? no good affordable cars :(

and they can't really do both. branding for a company that would produce a range of cars from expensive high-powered sports to ultra-cheap econoboxes for kids would be nearly impossible - americans simply don't have the brainpower to process that kind of dichotomy. the entire brand would suffer. :(

i wouldn't put any kid i know through the crap i went through trying to afford a non-crap car up until scion came along. i think we can take one for the team and suck it up for our next purchase. :P

in short: THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

Toyota needs to stop loading up the Scions. I mean sure all the features are nice and what not but not only does it bring up the price it takes the fun out of modifying the vehicle which most youths want to do themselves.

I think it would be a smart idea to make a barebone version of all their vehicles kinda like the yaris.

^^^ Don't agree. Like at all.

Power windows/locks/keyless/SABs, cruise control, MP3 HU are STANDARD car amenities these days. Selling a frame and then charging $500 for each standard option is the retarded approach. Not like Scion vehicles are overpriced with all these "extras" anyway. Build a "barebone" yaris with a CD player - it will cost more than xA with everything on it.

The xD is on my wish list and I AM OVER 50! Now that I know your
point of view let me share mine.
Yes I come from the baby boomer generation, but who do you
think started the trend of customizing their car?
That happened before I was born.

Being a child of the 60's/70's I am use to having things trendy.
That is why I will not purchase a trational "old peoples" car.
Our son who is 23yr hates our xB. He likes the other rice burner
Honda, but not the newer stuff as much as the older CRX models.

I have attended Scion's Corp forums talking about some of the upgrades
and the cost. People of all ages where there not just us "old folks".
I heard the 20 / 30 yr olds saying the same thing to Corp that I would
have said. Age had nothing to do with it.

So were is it written that just because your under 30yr you need to drive
a new car?. My husbands first car at the age of 20yr was a 67 Super Sport
(By the way new car's were out of our price range so it was used but new
to us.) Good used cars are still budget friendly. With the new models coming
out this year there will be plenty of Scions on the lot that the previous
owner's gave lot's of TLC to.

And yes our Envy Green xB is being customized. My husband attends as
many Scion events/shows as he can. He loves meeting the people who
share his interest in having a really nice ride. So if you are ever in Arizona
and see "It's 5 o'clock Somewhere" driving by, I will be the crazy "old lady"
behind the wheel or my husband "old Sckool" who claims it on weekends.

PEACE --- or if you prefer " Have a Nice Day" :silly:

the xD needs to compete DIRECTLY price/performance/everything with the Versa and Honda Fit. The Scion brand is not prestigious enough to demand a premium (IE: Ferrari, BMW, ect) Scion cant sell less car for more money. they will fail. They need to make it a bargain. they need to make ppl that are shopping in this price segment go "wow, it has all that and its only how much?" the price is whats going to sell this car. people can mod anything they want. And 99% of the ppl that are buying a car don’t care about mods anyway.

I'd also like to throw in the Suzuki SX-4 as competition...

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FirstDrives/articleId=116341

...merely to round out what the xD is up against.

i was checking that out the other day....its a pretty cool car. hard to argue with AWDi

I'll agree with some other posters here:

If xD debuts in the:

14k range: I'll buy it immediately.
15k range: I'll be weighing my options.
16k range: I'll feel that Toyota has gotten greedy, and I'll go buy an Aveo or a Rio... or an sx4 or a Mazda 3, or a Fit.

Just my 2 cents...

i'm not saying that scion has to make a high powered sports car, but it would be really nice if they produced a platform with more potential than the tc. all i would require is rear or all wheel drive, 6 spd manual, and a sturdy engine.

toyota doesnt know how to do that

^^^ Don't agree. Like at all.

Power windows/locks/keyless/SABs, cruise control, MP3 HU are STANDARD car amenities these days. Selling a frame and then charging $500 for each standard option is the retarded approach. Not like Scion vehicles are overpriced with all these "extras" anyway. Build a "barebone" yaris with a CD player - it will cost more than xA with everything on it.

I am not saying make all the cars barebone I am saying have an option of either or. Who is to say someone buys a barebone version they will load up on all those features like power windows,locks, etc. Frankly I would be fine with anything that had A/C and moved. With a barebone version I bet more 16-22 yr olds would buy. Even if the money is coming out of the parents pocket not a lot of parents are willing to shell out 14k+ on a car for their kid that will get banged up anyways but they might feel more comfortable with 11k.

Well Toyota may not know how to do that ,but look who's #1 now . Gen. motor's ,Ford and Dodge aren't keeping up with Toyota.They all thought they had a better idea. But apparently not. By the way my other vehicle's are chevy [1958Impala 2dr. hardtop] and a Dodge Pickup 1935, now that what I'm talking about. Oldskool for sure.

the mustang and corvette are HUGE success.

^^^ Don't agree. Like at all.

Power windows/locks/keyless/SABs, cruise control, MP3 HU are STANDARD car amenities these days. Selling a frame and then charging $500 for each standard option is the retarded approach. Not like Scion vehicles are overpriced with all these "extras" anyway. Build a "barebone" yaris with a CD player - it will cost more than xA with everything on it.

On the other hand, iPod connectivity, air conditioning (believe it or not), cruise control (contrary to what you think), keyless (again, contrary to what you would obviously prefer), power windows/locks (once again, contrary to your fantasies) are not standard car ameneties. Standard car ameneties would be determined by what the standard features on the most bare-bones car on the market is, since that car would obviously have to be at the base threshold of reason to omit other features.

the mustang and corvette are HUGE success.
At the same time, they're HUGEly impractical.

so are full sized trucks, hummers, ferrairs, 99% of SUVs...but people buy them! if Toyota built a RWD sports car they would sell before they hit the dealers.

On the other hand, iPod connectivity, air conditioning (believe it or not), cruise control (contrary to what you think), keyless (again, contrary to what you would obviously prefer), power windows/locks (once again, contrary to your fantasies) are not standard car ameneties. Standard car ameneties would be determined by what the standard features on the most bare-bones car on the market is, since that car would obviously have to be at the base threshold of reason to omit other features.

Let me put it this way - be it a fantasy or not - but I would not own a car that does not have power locks/windows/keyless/AC and an MP3 HU. Cruise / SABs /iPod connector - not that important to me, but the way the market goes - it's becoming a standard, too.

Should power steering and brakes be an option, too? 30 years ago it was.

There is nothing impractical about a full-size pick up, in fact, it is the very definition of practical.

Right… because everyone that drives them needs to tow 10,000lbs, and get 12mpg...when 99% of the time a small or mid sized truck would do any job that the owner would ask.

"practical" is in the eye of the beholder. to me practical means being able to get me and up to 4 others where i need to go and get 30mpg and being able to go quickly and maybe haul some stuff around now and then (I just bought a GTI). To you it might mean being able to transport a large piano, to someone else it might mean something else.

Toyota is missing out big time in the sports car market. Ford regularly sells 100,000 mustangs a year. Chevy plans to sell roughly the same number of Camaros. Nissan isn’t having trouble moving the 350Z….Toyota has nothing to compete against these cars, let alone the GTI, Civic SI, ect.

Not everyone who buys one is looking to tow 10k lb. As a daily commuter, and nothing else, definitely impractical, but when you need one, there is simply no substitute. Every try bringing home 500 lb of fertilizer? Washing machines? Big screen tv's? Lumber? To me, it's a must have home neccessity. But you don't need a $36k 4x4 to do that, a $5k beater for weekend home projects is all that is needed.

Ford sells 100k mustangs/year, but 900k F-150's, and GM sells about 850k 1500's. The piece of pie that toyota is looking at is monsterous and the profit potential is un-real.

But yes, a rear-drive sports car would be a welcomed addition to the line-up. Actually, a few would be welcomed: something to compete against the Solstice/Miata, a rear drive inexpensive 4 banger with unlimited mod potential and a hatchback, and then a ready to race off the show room floor model.

Every try bringing home 500 lb of fertilizer? Washing machines? Big screen tv's? Lumber?

I brought home 800 pounds of topsoil in my Gen 1 xB. :) [Also two 10' x 2' shelving uprights, but that was on a separate trip.] As long as your passengers don't mind sprinting alongside the vehicle, it's fine!

I wish I'd taken pictures with the topsoil. It was like a poor man's lowering kit. :)

And yes, I'm attempting to distract you so you don't bring the age-old-and-UNGODLY-tiresome Utility Vs. Feeling Manly debate onto a board about tiny, fuel-efficient imported Japanese commutermobiles.

And yes, I'm attempting to distract you so you don't bring the age-old-and-UNGODLY-tiresome Utility Vs. Feeling Manly debate onto a board about tiny, fuel-efficient imported Japanese commutermobiles.
I hear ya, just pointing out that the p/u isn't inherently bad, just the way they've been turned into the family vehicle over the past 20 years.

And yes, I'm attempting to distract you so you don't bring the age-old-and-UNGODLY-tiresome Utility Vs. Feeling Manly debate onto a board about tiny, fuel-efficient imported Japanese commutermobiles.
I hear ya, just pointing out that the p/u isn't inherently bad, just the way they've been turned into the family vehicle over the past 20 years.

i agree. a guess you can say a practical vehicle is one that you use for your intended purpose regularly. IE- commuting, hauling stuff. hauling ppl...it wouldnt be practical for a single guy that drives 30miles to work to own a big pick up as it would be dumb for a general contractor to try to haul his supplies in a yaris. sports cars are RARELY good all around vehicles, they are toys.

Pickups or SUVs are not partical for the majority of people who own them to drive by themselves on a highway to work everyday. And maybe once or twice a year use them to haul stuff in. They get terrible mpg and are higher in maintance costs. How many SUVs go off road nowadays? Probably less than 10 percent in the majority of the US. Most of them are not even bulit to go off road anymore. Their are primarly for people who are trying to keep up appearances with thier coworkers(95%), and construction workers, landscapers and boat owners (5%). That is my rant for the day.


DON'T OVERPRICE THE xD, SCION! :no:

toyota doesnt know how to do that
Have you ever heard of a SUPRA??
Sure, it wasn't in the same pricing range as the scions are now, and the turbo model brought it up to the $40,000 range, but dont say that toyota doesn't know how to do that....And with the FT-HS approved for production, Toyota will once again have a car just as good if not better then the s2000, 350z, etc. for the "mid-life crisis" buyer.

...Back to the main topic though, the xD will most likely be under 14k. Although scion has raised the price on the xB2 and tC2 compared to the 1st gen models, they've added sooo many standard features that you're actually saving money. And if you cant afford the 14k xD then you're much better off buying a used xA compared to a new Aveo, Versa, Fit, or any Kia.

the mustang and corvette are HUGE success.

Comparing these two is like comparing apples to oranges.

Mustangs here in NYC area are being sold for less then $200 a month with a Pony Option Package which includes sport grill, some kind of graphics, fog lights, and upgraded wheels. With little to no money down to boot! Ford cant give the Pony Car away.

Corvette is the last thing that is keeping GM from entering the same territory as Chrysler on the domestic chopping block. I have noticed that as of late, there really isnt the advertising that there was months ago for the big 3 and their cars. Lately its more the imports and what they have to offer. Maybe the big 3 are taking a time out and stepping back to rethink and re-do their marketing.

you have to remember they now have the hatchback Yaris.

Personally I like the look, I don't like the feel.

I'm 30, the Hatch Yaris is perfect for college kids. I'm starting to feel like the Scions are for mid 20s to late 30s with no children.