When are they gonna come out with cams, i know there making them i think, what about throttle bodys too. Also you guys think a computer chip will come out cus they make mad power, im just wondering cus i want more power and e manage is really expensive and expensive to tune it... later

 

Well.. a chip makes "mad power" depending on the application. On some vehicles they suck ****. On this car, even an emanage tune on the stock setup will get you a less than impressive gain.

Cams for the stock motor will probably get you very little, and with vvti they will be very hard to get right as far as design is concerned.

Someone makes an oversize tb I think, but it is pointless unless you machine the hole in the intake manifold to match.

A big hint: power costs money. Cheap power either will not live up to the claims or will be horribly unreliable. Todays cars are designed to be pretty effective at squeezing good power and reliability out stock, so cheap bolt ons will get you next to nothing for this car.

 

Very true, I agree what is stated above 100% ... I know it's been said over and over but it remains to be true...

"you got to pay to play"

modifications to cars are not cheap. never have been never will be.

 

yeah, seriously, there are no chips for adding horsepower for our cars and there never be any that actually do anything. there are no cheap power adders out there. either get another car, or go turbo.

this isn't gran turismo where you just buy and install parts and get generous hp gains. you have to pick and choose and research parts and applications before you buy and install them.

 

https://www.rippstore.com/ProductDet...Code=00TCSCC01

 

those cams are for the supercharger only

 

yup

 

That's all a little misleading and generalized.

A. You can't guess what cams will do without comparing the specs of the new cams and the stock cams. I would guess a 15hp increase would be pretty easy to come by.

B. I have spent very little on bolt ons for this car and I am very happy with the results. It's not Supra or Evo but 25hp feels nice and makes the car more driveable.

 

It is not generalized in the least. Shops have already talked about cams for this car and mentioned in the past that they would only be of real used for FI... hence rippmods only making them for FI, imagine that. And 15 hp for the cost of the cams, the headwork, etc is a total waste of money. And saying it would be pretty easy to come by is a rash generalization in itself. Cams would do more if they were designed properly around the VVTi system and had a full head to go with them, along with some fuel management. It is not a matter of swapping out the cams and knowing you will gain power. But if you add in the mods above you are spending considerable money for your power.

A full IHE setup gets people (that have actually compared dyno results on the same dyno under controlled conditions) about 15whp... nothing magical there. nothing against you if you did that to the car, but I dont see spending upwards of $1000 on parts for 15whp (which in reality is NOT across the whole band) a great deal or cheap. So again, power costs money, just as I said before. There have been a million threads about this, magazines testing the mods, etc. All discussed before.

And what did you spend very little on to gain 25whp? How did yo umeasure that power (hopefully not by adding up the manufacturer claims... that is bs... plus you cant add gains together like that)? Did you measure it before and after on the same dyno? If you removed rotational mass (flywheel for example) then if you measured on an inertial dyno you got an incorrect number unless you threw out the power gain from the mass change.

Just curious.

 

Again, no one has actually used cams on this car except for supercharged application where it did make a pretty impressive gain. I did not mention headwork, as I don't really consider it as necessary until much higher horsepower. Cams on the other hand have always been a good performer for most 4 cylinder cars.
Basically, until someone tries it, there is no place to knock it. Were all just speculating. Oh and cost for cams is usually around $500-$600 which is really nothing. It's the labor that hurts but some folks can do it themselves.

Also, I think there are enough dynos posted around here that show a 20+WHP gain from I/H/E. I'm sure you can search around and find plenty. And so far I've spent ~$1000 which is nothing considering the 25hp gain. And yes, the powerband from 3,000rpms on is stronger and thats all I care about anyways. Only time I am below that is on the highway in fifth gear.

 

As I said, the people DESIGNING The cams have found that the impact is low for a stock motor, which is why they havent built any. So that is better than an assumption. This engine is more efficient at delivering power than a 80's or 90's honda, which is why simple, cheap bolt ons have such good effects on those motors.


We had an entire thread about IHE gains recently..... and the dynos posted (from articles on the car and from shops) showed around 15whp. And if there are others, where they done under the same conditions on the same dyno?

And lets also not forget that peak power means very little. Mods like these tend to move power around, so they are not across the band gains. A comparison of track times before and after (at least that I have seen) have typically shown very very small improvements.


And again, how did you measure your power gains??? That is what I am trying to find out. If you didnt do it on a dyno you have zero idea how much you gained. Do you have before/after dyno sheets on the same dyno? Do you have track times before and after?

 

Well, if you have insider information about cams, please let us know. What lift and duration did they test? What lift and duration is the stock cams? What companies have tested cams?

The reason they have offered F/I cams is because that is the market. It's much easier to slap a turbo kit on there and make 100hp. Problem is, I don't feel want my daily driver to be a ticking time bomb waiting to blow up, and I don't want to spend $10,000 to turbo the car correctly. I have put enough money into my other car.

And again, I don't need to dyno test my bolt on mods, there are plenty of graphs out there already. You say 15whp, I say 20whp. Ehhh whatever. No need to argue that. Peak power doesn't mean squat anyways. Most of the dynos are missing the mid-pipe which I have so "maybe" I have 5 hp more. I spent $1000 and the car is much more enjoyable and that's great for me.

If I spend another $1000 for cams and get another 20hp I'll be quite happy.

 

[quote="tcengel
Well, if you have insider information about cams, please let us know. What lift and duration did they test? What lift and duration is the stock cams? What companies have tested cams?
[/quote]

Oh, and if you do have this info, please post it! I would love to see what cams do to the torque curve because peak power does not mean much to me anyway.

 

So your power gains are all assumptions. Not trying to be rude, but you cant use any of that in the argument since you have no idea what you really gained on a real application.

 

since it's somewhat on-topic, does anyone know:

1. ease of installation - i've only been around the install of cams in a v6 camaro, whose engine is rotated 90 degrees from ours with loads of space in front of it.
2. idle quality - lumpy or prone to stalling?

 

^ I dont know the answer to question 1 but question 2 is dependent on the tune the car has. From what i hear .... its pretty nice teamed up with the emanage ultimate

 

Again, you said yourself 15WHP so thats 20hp and close enough. I'm not going to waste time and money to do what many have done already. The results are out there.

Anyways, please fill us in about the cams. That's what this thread is about. There is a sticky with dynos and such already. I'd like to know what was tested and by who so I can follow up with them. I guess Crane Cams is going to be the first to release N/A Cams. Who has tested them already???

 

^ where is the info on the crane cams? This is the first I am hearing about them. Ide like to see what they have to offer eventhough Im s/c'rgd

 

It's not insider info, really. Just search for all the companies that have promised to deliver cams for the tC.

 

No one has.. the reason I have heard in the past from manufacturers is that after looking at our setup, NA cams would bring negligible power to the table, not being worth the cost and effort. Now, if you want to do custom head work, use more lift, larger valves, emanage, etc etc etc.. you may see a decent gain, but then you are still putting a lot of money in for a small gain in the end. I just dont see (and apparently neither do the people who build cams) a big gain from a simple cam swap on this car. As a matter of fact, a full NA build will yield less than ideal gains on this car when you look at the costs involved. And dont get me wrong, at some point I would like to buy another short block, sleeve it, bore it, add high comp pistons, rods, head work, higher lift cams, emanage, etc... but for 99% of people who actually care about getting power for thier money, they will go with FI all the way. This isnt a 350 chevy that you can push 500hp out of easilly NA, it is a small econo motor that is already nearing its peak operation as far as power output, so boost is the best way to go. The NA build would be a fun experiment, and should yield a nice power curve out at the end. Not to mention having a rock solid motor.

Maybe someone will come up with some good NA cams for it. .who knows. And that would be cool, but most likely still not worth the small gains for most people, other than those of us who enjoy building it as much as driving it.