Slapped on a turbo.. now what? AEM EMS vs. Rods + Pistons
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Slapped on a turbo.. now what? AEM EMS vs. Rods + Pistons
Hey everyone,
I wanted to make this thread to start up a good discussion.
Most people in the FI section have slapped a turbo kit on their car and are between 250whp-300whp between 7-10psi. Now you want more power!
What to do? What to do?
I feel the next step comes down to 2 decision which both bear an equal cost
Option 1
Rods ($400) + Pistons ($500) + Install ($2000) + Re-tune ($150)
Total: $3050 approx.
Option 2
AEM EMS ($2000) + AEM Boost Solenoid ($100) + Tune ($900)
Total: $3000 approx
Option 1 Pros
You are now boosting 16psi making over 425whp. Your car is OUT once you catch traction. AKA you prefer to race from a roll now.,
Option 2 Pros
10psi, Rev-Limiter, 2-Step, MUCH better boost control, Traction Control, Better Fuel & Ingition Control, Get rid of ____ty Black Box, VVTi Control. Lets say you are around 350WHP. Plus now you can sell your emanage, emanage harness and black box. Now you are ready to race in any situation.
Which one would you do?
I am going with option 2 + methanol + cams. Cannot wait to get the AEM in my car.
Anyways lets hear some thoughts!
I wanted to make this thread to start up a good discussion.
Most people in the FI section have slapped a turbo kit on their car and are between 250whp-300whp between 7-10psi. Now you want more power!
What to do? What to do?
I feel the next step comes down to 2 decision which both bear an equal cost
Option 1
Rods ($400) + Pistons ($500) + Install ($2000) + Re-tune ($150)
Total: $3050 approx.
Option 2
AEM EMS ($2000) + AEM Boost Solenoid ($100) + Tune ($900)
Total: $3000 approx
Option 1 Pros
You are now boosting 16psi making over 425whp. Your car is OUT once you catch traction. AKA you prefer to race from a roll now.,
Option 2 Pros
10psi, Rev-Limiter, 2-Step, MUCH better boost control, Traction Control, Better Fuel & Ingition Control, Get rid of ____ty Black Box, VVTi Control. Lets say you are around 350WHP. Plus now you can sell your emanage, emanage harness and black box. Now you are ready to race in any situation.
Which one would you do?
I am going with option 2 + methanol + cams. Cannot wait to get the AEM in my car.
Anyways lets hear some thoughts!
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Originally Posted by paul_dezod
A full standalone for power needs and reliability, is second to none for sure. You could still build the motor down the road too.
Better hook me up when the time comes Paul
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You can still go full stand alone down the road too. I'm going with option 1 to play devils advocate here....lol.
Nothing a good set of rubber won't fix when you are going from a dig with 400+whp.
Nothing a good set of rubber won't fix when you are going from a dig with 400+whp.
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Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
You can still go full stand alone down the road two. I'm going with option 1 to play devils advocate here....lol.
Nothing a good set of rubber won't fix when you are going from a dig with 400+whp.
Nothing a good set of rubber won't fix when you are going from a dig with 400+whp.
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Originally Posted by jrodTc
Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
You can still go full stand alone down the road two. I'm going with option 1 to play devils advocate here....lol.
Nothing a good set of rubber won't fix when you are going from a dig with 400+whp.
Nothing a good set of rubber won't fix when you are going from a dig with 400+whp.
Yes it is, but to be honest, I do not understand why this would even be a contest as to question. The EMS is the brains behind the operation to make sure the rest of your environment is doing it's job right and precise. The entire system works together as one, not competing components. This thread was posed absolutely incorrect in that fashion!
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Originally Posted by SLIVER007
^^I agree 10 fold^^
I am so sick of the damn piggy back computer!! I will be getting this real soon=aem ems from dezod!!!
Also when building the Tc motor dont forget to Sleeve the block!!!!
I am so sick of the damn piggy back computer!! I will be getting this real soon=aem ems from dezod!!!
Also when building the Tc motor dont forget to Sleeve the block!!!!
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Well, if you're currently running the greddy blue, I'd go with the EMS, but I'm running the AEM F/IC (shoulda went EMS in the first place!) so I'm good for now, and I'd go with the pistons/rods/bearings and EMS down the raod. The F/IC give me reliable running, and the build would give long term reliablitlty at 400+whp.
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i never meant it in a competition sense.. like you can ONLY do one of the above. but in my case i can only afford one of the options this year.. not both. this was the point of the thread... if you had a choice what would you go with and why.
i believe that is a fair question to ask.. and a good question to hear some discussionsand expierences
i believe that is a fair question to ask.. and a good question to hear some discussionsand expierences
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Originally Posted by paul_dezod
Originally Posted by jrodTc
Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
You can still go full stand alone down the road two. I'm going with option 1 to play devils advocate here....lol.
Nothing a good set of rubber won't fix when you are going from a dig with 400+whp.
Nothing a good set of rubber won't fix when you are going from a dig with 400+whp.
Yes it is, but to be honest, I do not understand why this would even be a contest as to question. The EMS is the brains behind the operation to make sure the rest of your environment is doing it's job right and precise. The entire system works together as one, not competing components. This thread was posed absolutely incorrect in that fashion!
Yeah, but like most, who are already turbo'ed (which this contest is an "After" turbo question), you will already most likely be running some form of EMS. So, what's the point of spending money on a Standalone before building the motor when the EMS you currently have still will do the same job it did before the motor was built.
In all actuality though, a person who purchases a built motor, usually waste no time in purchasing a Standalone right afterwards. This really should not be a "This" or "That" case. However, because our generation is more into "Immediate Gratification", a built motor is a direct route to "Immediate Gratification". A Standalone is not. Purchasing the Standalone first means nothing if you are still limited to the amount of abuse you can deliver to the motor that is stock.
I would take a GReddy blue box + built motor and 450whp before I take a Standalone + stock motor and 350whp.
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Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
Yeah, but like most, who are already turbo'ed (which this contest is an "After" turbo question), you will already most likely be running some form of EMS. So, what's the point of spending money on a Standalone before building the motor when the EMS you currently have still will do the same job it did before the motor was built.
In all actuality though, a person who purchases a built motor, usually waste no time in purchasing a Standalone right afterwards. This really should not be a "This" or "That" case. However, because our generation is more into "Immediate Gratification", a built motor is a direct route to "Immediate Gratification". A Standalone is not. Purchasing the Standalone first means nothing if you are still limited to the amount of abuse you can deliver to the motor that is stock.
I would take a GReddy blue box + built motor and 450whp before I take a Standalone + stock motor and 350whp.
The bolded comment is SUPER DUPER hilarous. Oh yeah, I want to spend $3K on an engine build to have a $300 E-mangle control my vfreshly built motor. NOT GONNA HAPPEN WELL! It lacks the control to put it simply. Hook up an OBD2 logger, try adjusting fuel trims, and ignition timing. Drive, datalog and see what happens as far as reliability, and I hope you don't wash some rings or detonate due to the ECU wanting 22 degrees of timing and your e-mangle HOPEFULLY alters the timing to save it from frying itself inside out. Why do you think Chris Rado, Dan Gardner, Kenny Tran, Leslie Durst and plenty others run EMS? Just because they want to look cool? Or sound cool? Or have the $$? No! They want and need the best to protect and coordinate their investment into the motor. EOS
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Originally Posted by paul_dezod
Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
Yeah, but like most, who are already turbo'ed (which this contest is an "After" turbo question), you will already most likely be running some form of EMS. So, what's the point of spending money on a Standalone before building the motor when the EMS you currently have still will do the same job it did before the motor was built.
In all actuality though, a person who purchases a built motor, usually waste no time in purchasing a Standalone right afterwards. This really should not be a "This" or "That" case. However, because our generation is more into "Immediate Gratification", a built motor is a direct route to "Immediate Gratification". A Standalone is not. Purchasing the Standalone first means nothing if you are still limited to the amount of abuse you can deliver to the motor that is stock.
I would take a GReddy blue box + built motor and 450whp before I take a Standalone + stock motor and 350whp.
The bolded comment is SUPER DUPER hilarous. Oh yeah, I want to spend $3K on an engine build to have a $300 E-mangle control my vfreshly built motor. NOT GONNA HAPPEN WELL! It lacks the control to put it simply. Hook up an OBD2 logger, try adjusting fuel trims, and ignition timing. Drive, datalog and see what happens as far as reliability, and I hope you don't wash some rings or detonate due to the ECU wanting 22 degrees of timing and your e-mangle HOPEFULLY alters the timing to save it from frying itself inside out. Why do you think Chris Rado, Dan Gardner, Kenny Tran, Leslie Durst and plenty others run EMS? Just because they want to look cool? Or sound cool? Or have the $$? No! They want and need the best to protect and coordinate their investment into the motor. EOS
How about this part for a BOLD comment....
In all actuality though, a person who purchases a built motor, usually waste no time in purchasing a Standalone right afterwards. This really should not be a "This" or "That" case.
You nit picked one little comment....Wow.. Opinions are meant to be taken in whole, not pick and choose what you want to respond to to make your argument sound better... I still stick to option # 1.
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Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
In all actuality though, a person who purchases a built motor, usually waste no time in purchasing a Standalone right afterwards. This really should not be a "This" or "That" case.
Touche! I did catch that comment, but the
of the other comment made it null and void. I like it when Travis and I debate. (to an extent)
Usually lots of goo info comes about.
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Yeah, I'm sure some how MAGICALLY now your car will become undriveable if you have stronger piston and rods in it with your GReddy Emanage...
Leslie, Kenny, Rado....Hmm...last time I checked, they all had cars in the 600-750whp range...Thanks for pointing out the OBVIOUS that you wouldn't run an Emanage to handle their elaborate setups! Throwing them into this is comparing Apples to Oranges...LOL.
Unless you have some sick belief that after us normal people build our motors, we all going to somehow Run 9's in the 1/4 mile, or take the Time attack record at Willow Springs Raceway....
Leslie, Kenny, Rado....Hmm...last time I checked, they all had cars in the 600-750whp range...Thanks for pointing out the OBVIOUS that you wouldn't run an Emanage to handle their elaborate setups! Throwing them into this is comparing Apples to Oranges...LOL.
Unless you have some sick belief that after us normal people build our motors, we all going to somehow Run 9's in the 1/4 mile, or take the Time attack record at Willow Springs Raceway....
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Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
Yeah, I'm sure some how MAGICALLY now your car will become undriveable if you have stronger piston and rods in it with your GReddy Emanage...
Leslie, Kenny, Rado....Hmm...last time I checked, they all had cars in the 600-750whp range...Thanks for pointing out the OBVIOUS that you wouldn't run an Emanage to handle their elaborate setups! Throwing them into this is comparing Apples to Oranges...LOL.
Unless you have some sick belief that after us normal people build our motors, we all going to somehow Run 9's in the 1/4 mile, or take the Time attack record at Willow Springs Raceway....
Leslie, Kenny, Rado....Hmm...last time I checked, they all had cars in the 600-750whp range...Thanks for pointing out the OBVIOUS that you wouldn't run an Emanage to handle their elaborate setups! Throwing them into this is comparing Apples to Oranges...LOL.
Unless you have some sick belief that after us normal people build our motors, we all going to somehow Run 9's in the 1/4 mile, or take the Time attack record at Willow Springs Raceway....
This man is too funny.
I spoke my piece about control and all. Dan Gardner is not breaking 12s or 9s let alone of anything! He has a road race/TT car. Why does he need that much control then??? He could have used an E-manage or Ultimate or FIC for that matter!
So just to clarify, from the tone of your response....You expect to make reliable 400+whp, which is over 276% power increase over stock?