DIY MT Clutch Pedal Position Adjustment (DIY in post #7)
05-10-2010, 01:42 AM
#1
DIY MT Clutch Pedal Position Adjustment (DIY in post #7)
I was noticing today my clutch pedal sits distinctly higher off the floor than the brake pedal. Just wondering if this is typical or if there's variation in the OE clutch pedal height relative to the brake pedal.
Last edited by MR_LUV; 06-05-2018 at 11:58 PM. Reason: Edit title
05-13-2010, 01:14 AM
#3
Thanks for replying 
! I think I'll look into the possibility of adjusting it downward to match the brake pedal. It's probably nothing more than a stop bolt adjustment. Personally, I find the clutch engagement height a little awkward too, but that's probably a different adjustment.
! I think I'll look into the possibility of adjusting it downward to match the brake pedal. It's probably nothing more than a stop bolt adjustment. Personally, I find the clutch engagement height a little awkward too, but that's probably a different adjustment.
05-15-2010, 08:13 PM
#5
Popped off the knee panel today to see how the clutch pedal is adjusted. Appears it's much the same as the original xB. There's a clevis pin and U-Bracket attaching the master cylinder rod that's reasonably accessable, and a heavy stop bolt with jam nut that's pretty much inaccessable. In order to access the stop bolt, you'd really need to remove or at least significantly lower the connector panel in the lower left dash. There is a four sided nut on the pedal side of the bolt bracket, but I think it's welded -- pretty hopeless to get tools behind that bracket with the panel in place 
!
Looking at the original xB pedal adjustment specs, its clutch pedal should be on the order of .4" to .6" above the brake pedal (diagonal measurement from the lower firewall). My xB2 clutch pedal is around 1-1/4" above the brake (1-1/2" if I directly compare the bottom front edges of the pedal pads), but I don't have the factory specs. In any case, the clutch stop bolt is clearly intended as a factory preset and forget adjustment.
So, t'was interesting, but obviously, I didn't get anywhere. Really would like to shave 1/2" or more off that height though, make the action feel less like a delivery van. If anyone has access to the xB2 pedal adjustment specs, I'd really love to know them 
!
!Looking at the original xB pedal adjustment specs, its clutch pedal should be on the order of .4" to .6" above the brake pedal (diagonal measurement from the lower firewall). My xB2 clutch pedal is around 1-1/4" above the brake (1-1/2" if I directly compare the bottom front edges of the pedal pads), but I don't have the factory specs. In any case, the clutch stop bolt is clearly intended as a factory preset and forget adjustment.
So, t'was interesting, but obviously, I didn't get anywhere
. Really would like to shave 1/2" or more off that height though, make the action feel less like a delivery van. If anyone has access to the xB2 pedal adjustment specs, I'd really love to know them !
Last edited by TrevorS; 05-18-2010 at 05:32 PM.
05-16-2010, 05:32 PM
#6
Came across the xB2 clutch pedal spec and the correct pedal height is aprox 6" to 6.4" measured diagonally from the firewall "asphalt" (sound and heat insulation) with the carpet flipped down out of the way. Haven't measured mine yet, but I think I will.
Last edited by TrevorS; 05-19-2010 at 04:59 PM.
05-17-2010, 03:27 AM
#7
Well guy's, I finished adjusting my clutch pedal height -- it's now aproximately the low side of the factory spec and hugely improved over that disaster Toyota originally foisted upon me ! Unfortunately, I'm not sure the average person will want to tackle the job, but in case you do, here is my suggested procedure:
(FWIW -- Spent some time trying to get a wrench on the clutch height adjustment bolt and jam nut from underneath and simply couldn't accomplish it, the angle of attack was all wrong and the clearance for working a wrench was hopeless (IMO). So, I went to the connector panel instead.)
1) Disconnect the battery positive and wait a couple minutes.
2) Adjust the driver's seat all the way down and back and the steering wheel all the way up for easier access to the clutch pedal area.
3) Carefully remove the lower dash panel on the driver's side (it's held by snaps and pulls out directly towards the driver's seat -- I find it easiest to start it at the right side of the steering wheel). The two or more panel connectors are released by pressing in their tabs.
4) The connector panel is now visible inside the lower left dash. Disconnect all the front panel wiring connectors up to the top of the three tall ones (they all have release tabs). If the right hand tall connector doesn't want to come out (mine didn't) then just leave it and cross your fingers.
5) Release the cable strap at the bottom of the panel so as to free the thick harness secured there. I had to pull from the front to get the strap to let go (it inserts into the clip from the front) -- don't cut it since it needs to be reused.
6) Being careful of the nearby wiring, remove the two upper bolts (in the left and right panel mounting ears at the top -- takes lots of turns, so be patient) and one left lower machine screw to dismount the panel (1/4" drive ratchet with 10mm socket for all). Pull the top of the panel towards the front to free it from the crossbrace.
7) Depress the clutch pedal to gain room behind the panel. (Wedge it maybe? For example: I positioned a scrap 16" piece of 2" PVC pipe over the clutch pedal and behind the brake and accelerator pedals). Carefully manouver the panel down and to the right so the bottom left mounting point is below the dash and just to the right of the hood release. Try not to overly stress the still connected wiring and harnesses, take your time.
8 ) You should now be able to see the clutch pedal height bolt and jam nut to the upper left of the displaced connector panel. You'll need a 14mm open wrench to release the jam nut (give it a few turns so you have operating room), and a 14mm wrench to adjust the bolt (if you press the clutch pedal down, then the bolt will probably turn by fingers alone).
9) Fold down the carpet behind the clutch pedal so you can measure the height from the firewall hard surface (not the felt) to the face of the pedal (measurement should be perpendicular to the face of the pedal). Factory spec is 5.9764" to 6.3701". Adjust the clutch pedal height bolt for the correct pedal height (I went for 6").
10) When at desired setting, finger tighten the jam nut (be careful not to rotate the bolt as well), and then lock it with the 14mm wrench (12 lb-ft). It just needs to be tight enough that it doesn't come free from vibration.
11) If you're satisfied with the clutch height, reposition the carpet, reinstall the connector panel (make sure the upper bolts are fully installed -- lots of turns), also the cables and connectors in reverse order of disassembly. Make sure everything is exactly like you found it (all connectors plugged fully in with their release tabs locked -- if you cut any cable ties, replace them). Reconnect the battery positive and do a little basic checking to make sure your electrical system is still OK (BUT DON'T START THE ENGINE).
12) Time to adjust the clutch pedal free play so that you don't damage the clutch mechanism. This part requires lying on your back with your head under the dash -- lying over the door sill worked fine for me. You'll need a 14mm open wrench for the clutch master-cylinder rod U-Bracket nut, and a 12mm open wrench for the jam nut.
13) With the 14mm wrench anchoring the U-Bracket nut from rotation, apply the 12mm to the jam nut and release it (clockwise rotation viewed from the dash). Give the jam nut a few turns so you have room to work.
14) Rotate the clutch master-cylinder rod far enough to just release tension with the clutch pedal fully up (counter clockwise rotation viewed from the dash). The rod should be free at that point, so don't rotate it further. Correct free play measured at the pedal face is .197" to .591" (range of motion between pedal fully up and the beginning of clutch resistance).
15) Finger tighten the jam nut (make sure the rod doesn't turn) and then lock it with the 12mm wrench (counter clockwise rotation viewed from the dash) while again anchoring the U-Bracket nut with the 14mm (9 lb-ft). It just needs to be tight enough that it doesn't come free from vibration.
16) Verify the master cylinder rod is free with the clutch pedal fully up, and also verify the free-play setting.
17) If all is well, reinstall the lower dash panel (be careful to properly align all the snaps and don't forget the connectors), readjust the driver's seat and steering wheel, start the engine, and check out your clutch. Speaking for myself, it's a huge improvement (thank goodness!)
! Unfortunately, I'm not sure the average person will want to tackle the job, but in case you do, here is my suggested procedure: (FWIW -- Spent some time trying to get a wrench on the clutch height adjustment bolt and jam nut from underneath and simply couldn't accomplish it, the angle of attack was all wrong and the clearance for working a wrench was hopeless (IMO). So, I went to the connector panel instead.)
1) Disconnect the battery positive and wait a couple minutes.
2) Adjust the driver's seat all the way down and back and the steering wheel all the way up for easier access to the clutch pedal area.
3) Carefully remove the lower dash panel on the driver's side (it's held by snaps and pulls out directly towards the driver's seat -- I find it easiest to start it at the right side of the steering wheel). The two or more panel connectors are released by pressing in their tabs.
4) The connector panel is now visible inside the lower left dash. Disconnect all the front panel wiring connectors up to the top of the three tall ones (they all have release tabs). If the right hand tall connector doesn't want to come out (mine didn't) then just leave it and cross your fingers.
5) Release the cable strap at the bottom of the panel so as to free the thick harness secured there. I had to pull from the front to get the strap to let go (it inserts into the clip from the front) -- don't cut it since it needs to be reused.
6) Being careful of the nearby wiring, remove the two upper bolts (in the left and right panel mounting ears at the top -- takes lots of turns, so be patient) and one left lower machine screw to dismount the panel (1/4" drive ratchet with 10mm socket for all). Pull the top of the panel towards the front to free it from the crossbrace.
7) Depress the clutch pedal to gain room behind the panel. (Wedge it maybe? For example: I positioned a scrap 16" piece of 2" PVC pipe over the clutch pedal and behind the brake and accelerator pedals). Carefully manouver the panel down and to the right so the bottom left mounting point is below the dash and just to the right of the hood release. Try not to overly stress the still connected wiring and harnesses, take your time.
8 ) You should now be able to see the clutch pedal height bolt and jam nut to the upper left of the displaced connector panel. You'll need a 14mm open wrench to release the jam nut (give it a few turns so you have operating room), and a 14mm wrench to adjust the bolt (if you press the clutch pedal down, then the bolt will probably turn by fingers alone).
9) Fold down the carpet behind the clutch pedal so you can measure the height from the firewall hard surface (not the felt) to the face of the pedal (measurement should be perpendicular to the face of the pedal). Factory spec is 5.9764" to 6.3701". Adjust the clutch pedal height bolt for the correct pedal height (I went for 6").
10) When at desired setting, finger tighten the jam nut (be careful not to rotate the bolt as well), and then lock it with the 14mm wrench (12 lb-ft). It just needs to be tight enough that it doesn't come free from vibration.
11) If you're satisfied with the clutch height, reposition the carpet, reinstall the connector panel (make sure the upper bolts are fully installed -- lots of turns), also the cables and connectors in reverse order of disassembly. Make sure everything is exactly like you found it (all connectors plugged fully in with their release tabs locked -- if you cut any cable ties, replace them). Reconnect the battery positive and do a little basic checking to make sure your electrical system is still OK (BUT DON'T START THE ENGINE).
12) Time to adjust the clutch pedal free play so that you don't damage the clutch mechanism. This part requires lying on your back with your head under the dash -- lying over the door sill worked fine for me. You'll need a 14mm open wrench for the clutch master-cylinder rod U-Bracket nut, and a 12mm open wrench for the jam nut.
13) With the 14mm wrench anchoring the U-Bracket nut from rotation, apply the 12mm to the jam nut and release it (clockwise rotation viewed from the dash). Give the jam nut a few turns so you have room to work.
14) Rotate the clutch master-cylinder rod far enough to just release tension with the clutch pedal fully up (counter clockwise rotation viewed from the dash). The rod should be free at that point, so don't rotate it further. Correct free play measured at the pedal face is .197" to .591" (range of motion between pedal fully up and the beginning of clutch resistance).
15) Finger tighten the jam nut (make sure the rod doesn't turn) and then lock it with the 12mm wrench (counter clockwise rotation viewed from the dash) while again anchoring the U-Bracket nut with the 14mm (9 lb-ft). It just needs to be tight enough that it doesn't come free from vibration.
16) Verify the master cylinder rod is free with the clutch pedal fully up, and also verify the free-play setting.
17) If all is well, reinstall the lower dash panel (be careful to properly align all the snaps and don't forget the connectors), readjust the driver's seat and steering wheel, start the engine, and check out your clutch. Speaking for myself, it's a huge improvement (thank goodness
!)
Last edited by TrevorS; 06-16-2010 at 07:00 PM. Reason: Added some further detail
05-17-2010, 03:30 AM
#8
If I had a MT and if my clutch pedal was mis-adjusted from the factory, I'd so do this!Yes, I see it's a royal PITA but when something is wrong, it should be made right and I applaude those who make the effort to do so. Well done.
05-17-2010, 08:10 PM
#9
Thanks much Fred !
Took the car out for a longish drive at various speeds today to allow the ECU to once again learn how to properly control my engine (I always hate to disconnect the battery because of this, but if I gotta, then I gotta). The difference in the clutch pedal is like night and day -- all of a sudden, I have a car instead of a UPS van .
If your clutch pedal is misadjusted (measurements will tell), I can't recommend enough having it corrected. Whether you take it to a technician or do it yourself, the difference is well worthwhile. The clutch not only feels much better, but it's also much easier to use -- it engages and disengages when you expect, instead of some other time
!
!Took the car out for a longish drive at various speeds today to allow the ECU to once again learn how to properly control my engine (I always hate to disconnect the battery because of this, but if I gotta, then I gotta
). The difference in the clutch pedal is like night and day -- all of a sudden, I have a car instead of a UPS van .If your clutch pedal is misadjusted (measurements will tell), I can't recommend enough having it corrected. Whether you take it to a technician or do it yourself, the difference is well worthwhile. The clutch not only feels much better, but it's also much easier to use -- it engages and disengages when you expect, instead of some other time
!
05-18-2010, 04:25 AM
#10
Thanks much Fred !
Took the car out for a longish drive at various speeds today to allow the ECU to once again learn how to properly control my engine (I always hate to disconnect the battery because of this, but if I gotta, then I gotta). The difference in the clutch pedal is like night and day -- all of a sudden, I have a car instead of a UPS van .
If your clutch pedal is misadjusted (measurements will tell), I can't recommend enough having it corrected. Whether you take it to a technician or do it yourself, the difference is well worthwhile. The clutch not only feels much better, but it's also much easier to use -- it engages and disengages when you expect, instead of some other time!
!Took the car out for a longish drive at various speeds today to allow the ECU to once again learn how to properly control my engine (I always hate to disconnect the battery because of this, but if I gotta, then I gotta
). The difference in the clutch pedal is like night and day -- all of a sudden, I have a car instead of a UPS van .If your clutch pedal is misadjusted (measurements will tell), I can't recommend enough having it corrected. Whether you take it to a technician or do it yourself, the difference is well worthwhile. The clutch not only feels much better, but it's also much easier to use -- it engages and disengages when you expect, instead of some other time
!Also, I hate to say it but I suspect that today's Toyota is not quite the Toyota of old. They've likely grown lazy from their past success. Hopefully their recent DBW problems will rectify that. I'd hate to see them follow in GM's missteps...
..........ok, 2 beers.
05-19-2010, 01:07 AM
#12
Thanks Dude !
It's interesting how different people react to this kind of thing. I'd expected the concern to be with the connector panel and disturbing the wiring (my concern), whereas the actual pedal adjustments strike me as safe!
If it helps any, as long as you absolutely DO NOT start the engine before instructed to in the very last step, then the only concerns are you set the pedal height to some value at least roughly within the 6" to 6.4" spec, that you verify the master cylinder rod is indeed free after locking the jam nut, and that as soon as you start depressing the pedal, the master cylinder rod tightens up (the rod freeplay spec is 1mm to 5mm -- although I favor the 1mm, just be in spec). If you follow the free play instructions exactly as I wrote them, your clutch pedal adjustments will be in factory spec, and that should surely be safe.
The only other possible consideration is that the jam nuts aren't tightened properly. The reason I said "It just needs to be tight enough that it doesn't come free from vibration", is that some people have a tendency to haul on bolts and nuts as though their lives depend on it. You want both jam nuts to be firmly tightened, but that doesn't translate into feats of strength -- just be firm. (Same for the two panel mount bolts and the lower left machine screw -- firm and secure, but not more than that.)
!It's interesting how different people react to this kind of thing. I'd expected the concern to be with the connector panel and disturbing the wiring (my concern
), whereas the actual pedal adjustments strike me as safe!If it helps any, as long as you absolutely DO NOT start the engine before instructed to in the very last step, then the only concerns are you set the pedal height to some value at least roughly within the 6" to 6.4" spec, that you verify the master cylinder rod is indeed free after locking the jam nut, and that as soon as you start depressing the pedal, the master cylinder rod tightens up (the rod freeplay spec is 1mm to 5mm -- although I favor the 1mm, just be in spec). If you follow the free play instructions exactly as I wrote them, your clutch pedal adjustments will be in factory spec, and that should surely be safe.
The only other possible consideration is that the jam nuts aren't tightened properly. The reason I said "It just needs to be tight enough that it doesn't come free from vibration", is that some people have a tendency to haul on bolts and nuts as though their lives depend on it. You want both jam nuts to be firmly tightened, but that doesn't translate into feats of strength -- just be firm. (Same for the two panel mount bolts and the lower left machine screw -- firm and secure, but not more than that.)
05-19-2010, 05:30 PM
#14
Yeah, as Fred observed, it's a PITA! But then again, I installed the Scion Security accessory as well, and that was certainly no less so. In fact, I think the Scion Security was worse since I still don't see how to do it without leaving blood behind (except for using gloves, if you can make that work). Whereas, although I got a good cut on the tip of my left forefinger during this, it was only because I was trying to figure out how to free the inside dash connector panel -- that's done now! The DIY instructions have the 20/20 advantage of hindsight !
As a general rule though, try to avoid rubbing your arms or fingers against raw metal edges, many of them are amazingly sharp. Like you said, the PITA factor with this task is it's of the plodding painstaking sort, you really can't rush through it. Takes thinking and care at virtually every step.
!As a general rule though, try to avoid rubbing your arms or fingers against raw metal edges, many of them are amazingly sharp. Like you said, the PITA factor with this task is it's of the plodding painstaking sort, you really can't rush through it. Takes thinking and care at virtually every step.
05-20-2010, 05:27 AM
#15
Yeah, as Fred observed, it's a PITA! But then again, I installed the Scion Security accessory as well, and that was certainly no less so. In fact, I think the Scion Security was worse since I still don't see how to do it without leaving blood behind (except for using gloves, if you can make that work).
OTOH, having installed aftermarket security systems before, it was really nice not having to splice and solder connections under the dash while in some horrendously contorted and uncomfortable position that strains muscles you didn't even know you had! I loved the PnP aspect of it and hate scotchloks and crimp connectors.
Last edited by ScionFred; 05-20-2010 at 05:32 AM.
05-30-2010, 03:16 AM
#16
Member
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Pennsburg, PA
Posts: 25
I know I'm a little late to the party, but as a fellow MT xB2, this seems like a "must do" mod. Anyway we can get this stickied? I HATE the clutch pedal throw of these cars vs. the tC. Never understood why the same engine and trans couldn't have the same clutch pedal.
05-31-2010, 04:26 AM
#17
I know I'm a little late to the party, but as a fellow MT xB2, this seems like a "must do" mod. Anyway we can get this stickied? I HATE the clutch pedal throw of these cars vs. the tC. Never understood why the same engine and trans couldn't have the same clutch pedal.
. Every infrastructure review I read before and after getting my 2008 commented on the delivery van clutch that was inclined to stall the engine when starting from a stop. It's easily the worst clutch feel I've experienced over several manual cars -- making it very awkward to transition back and forth with my Eclipse.It took awhile for me to finally crack, but ultimately it was just too much
. That was why I did the DIY, there were just too many complaints over too long a period of time. It seems to me both the owners and the xB2 deserve something better! If it's asking too much for Toyota to meet their own specs on the clutch pedal setup, then we need to know how to take care of it ourselves.
