Just when I was about to buy the 2011 tC, this next gen SI comes out and I am impressed!! Yes it cost about 3K more… Now I am not sure which coupe to go with?!?! Input please…..

If you want the LSD, and more HP, then spend the extra $$ and get the SI... I don't see the pricing on the Honda site for the 2012, but if the 2011 is any guide, you're looking at around $25k or more with the 18" rims.

Out the door I was under 20k for my 2011 tC. *shrug*

I chose tC over Si because tC is 100% built in Japan while Si is in Canada.
If Si was built in Japan too, then I would've bought 4 door Si.

Release date : 5/11/11
Starting at $22,505

You gotta check out this custom cockpit (it's standard)...
http://automobiles.honda.com/civic-si-coupe/i-mid.aspx

My issue with the si is hondas mark up on them...around here they were going for 24-25k...I got my wrx for that much! :/ have you driven both of them to compare?

Both are great cars. The new Civic is definitely more upscale and nicer overall, but you're paying a premium for it. It also requires premium fuel and is probably also costlier to insure.

In summary:
tC: cheaper
Si: nicer

My issue with the si is hondas mark up on them...around here they were going for 24-25k...I got my wrx for that much! :/ have you driven both of them to compare?

I have drove the 2011 tC, but I'm going to wait and test drive the SI to be sure. It's only 2 weeks away. And yeah... I don't need all the extras on the SI. I rather save $$$

I just made a quick xls to upload onto the thread, to give you a breakdown comparison... ofc I can't upload it (to large...lol)

Here's a few things:
Horsepower 180 @ 6000 RPM 201 @ 7000
Torque 173 @ 4100 RPM 170 @ 4400
Bore x Stroke 90.0 x 98.0 87 x 99
Compression 10.4:1 11.0 : 1

Curb Weight (mt/at) 3060 lbs / 3102 lbs 2877 / 2897 (with Navigation)

Avg MPG is about the same, 1 better on the tC, but factor in the premium gas prices.. yuk

As well, like I said, if you want rims... stock tC, 18" gunmetal hotness... Civic Si, add 18s and you're up another 2k or so!!

No contest, dude. If you can afford it, Civic SI all the way. SI is lighter, fast, has better handling, and responds a lot better to bolt ons. It's not bad, the new ones are coming out around $23K......which is better than a turbo tC2.
I'm not a fan of the tC2 either.....

Civic SI + bolt ons = FAST for $23K

Turbo tC + turbo = REALLY fast for $23K BUT much higher upkeep with tunes, frequent oil changes, plus all the extra stuff you'll need to get too.

i don't like the new SI. i prefer the 8th gen sedan SI

people forget the 2012 SI gets the k24 treatment......

Honda Civics are like buttholes... My theory anyways. 23k for a Civic? NO thanks, I will admit they do look and sound sweet. Keep in mind 23K will buy you a 300hp V-6 Camaro...Just a thought!! The 2011 Tc is probably the best car around the 20K mark hands down. Yes it could use more power for fun factor, but for everyday driving it is plenty strong enough.

If you are in to performance you can get right out from factory, go with the SI.. 23K im sure pays for what you get from it. I havent been on the tc2 but I like how the 8th gen SI rides and handles compared to a stock tc.. but the biggest factor is lighter and more hp. If you can afford 23K plus premium gas go for it, if you want somehting that cost less get the tc.. What you pay is what you get :)

WOW, you come here asking about the Si ... I'm actually surprised you got some unbiased answers. Yet, most of us went ahead and chose to drive a Scion. I totally agree the Si is better, then and now. But if it's all about numbers. As XIEmperorIX said, with the $$$ of the Si you have more choices to think of, that'll perform better. If that's your thing then be sure to shop around.

I heard a rumor of a Type-R coming, it may be worth YOUR wait.

I chose tC over Si because tC is 100% built in Japan while Si is in Canada.
If Si was built in Japan too, then I would've bought 4 door Si.

So what's wrong with Canada?

I like the Si and yes it does have better features (ie: LSD), but the tC is unique and a lot of fun to drive. Plus, you have OE performance support. For a few grand you can make the tC a much better car than the Si.

Oh, and its torque that wins races, not HP.

If were to spend the extra money, I'd go with the Genesis 2.0T rather than the Civic Si. While I'll admit, I'm not sure what you mean by "LSD", but the extras the Civic has just aren't all that exciting. It's like auto headlights. What a waste.

At first when I was excited when i saw this, but personally the SI Coupe looks more girly than the old SI to me... The Sedan version looks pretty good though.

The new engine is pretty awesome though

So what's wrong with Canada?


I was thinking cars built in Japan are more reliable than the cars built in elsewhere.

I once had built in U.S. Toyota and had it for 6 years.
It felt like 6 year old car after 6 years.
All the other cars I had were built in Japan and they felt like were only a year or 2 old even after 6 - 8 years.
After that experience, I only look for cars built in Japan.
But I'd rather buy built in Canada Honda than built in Japan Nissan..., so I'm not really making sense here... :confused:

If were to spend the extra money, I'd go with the Genesis 2.0T rather than the Civic Si. While I'll admit, I'm not sure what you mean by "LSD", but the extras the Civic has just aren't all that exciting. It's like auto headlights. What a waste.

Sorry. By LSD I meant Limited Slip Differential. The Si uses a helical LSD, which is wicked.

At first when I was excited when i saw this, but personally the SI Coupe looks more girly than the old SI to me... The Sedan version looks pretty good though.

The new engine is pretty awesome though

See, the thing I hate about the Si is the engine. The heads have far too many moving parts and its just junk. Honda has been out of the roller/rocker game for a while and this return was anything but triumphant. My 2003 Civic SiR, the car I owned before the tC, cooked all the valvetrain from track use. A classic Honda would never have done that because of a solid or hydraulic lifter design.

...That and it was a torqueless wonder. Fun as hell to drive, but slow as molasses. The B-Series was much better built than the K-Series for consistent abuse. Unfortunately everyone has to change because of changing emissions standards...sad really.

Now before the bashing starts, again, I've owned 4 Honda's, my g/f currently has a 2002 SiR, and I have 2 family members that work for them...:icon_mrgreen:

So what's wrong with Canada?

I like the Si and yes it does have better features (ie: LSD), but the tC is unique and a lot of fun to drive. Plus, you have OE performance support. For a few grand you can make the tC a much better car than the Si.

Oh, and its torque that wins races, not HP.

Yea nothing wrong with being made in canada! The car was designed in Japan. Its being made to there specs.

But OE support for the tC is whack! Overpriced rebadged equipment that you can get much better quality from aftermarket with very comparable pricing. The SI is better out of the box. Responds better to bolt ones and will have way more aftermarket support! It looks way better too.

Now your torque comment is mute as the torque is almost the same and the SI has a decent amount more on HP which easily makes up for the 2 less torque.

Regardless both cars have pros and cons. I dont like the new tC but it offers alot. Cant knock the truth! It has potential just like the first gen! Its all about what ride meets your needs! Your also gonna get the same attention in either before i forget.

Your car has come along nicely though!

tC+ descendant turbo kit = bye bye Si.

sure compare a turboed tC to an Si! apples to oranges!

imo that si looks ugly! id rather spend that extra money youd be spending on an si and put turbo on the tc..

tC are cheaper to tuned, onced tune looks much cleaner stronger if go boost! you don't see many people boost their Si, but why not wait till the FS-R come out and get it? and if I have the money to get an Si, I would still gonna get the tC, add turbo if you need more power to stay in the game, and some add on to make it looks much more sleak!!!

nah, the coupe si looks funny.the sedan Si is ok . i stop by the dealer ship today seen them both.

coupe is for girl only! sedan is wat attract most young age nowadays

Where's the option for neither? lol

For the price point you're looking at I would consider the Genesis 2.0T if it has to be a new vehicle. In the newly USED car market you could probably find some bargains also. Then again like one also mentioned if you can wait there's still the possibility of the FR-S arriving 2012. For some reason the tC2 doesn't seem to "move" me when I see it. I've only seen 1 out on the road locally.

i don't like the new SI. i prefer the 8th gen sedan SI

same...
and yups. sedan Si 8th gen is better lookin than the coupe...
eldest bro has the sedan Si. so yeah. lolz

anyways, go for tC dude! :)

Thank you for all the input. Most likely I will end up with the tC. I rather save money and IMO the tC looks hotter!! I will still wait 2 weeks for the SI to come out so I can look at it and make my final... Both looks very nice, but eye likes the tC. The SI kinda killed it already because of the premium fuel!!

I look at the Civic, and I just think... The tC had that first, the tC had that first too... etc. etc.... Looks like a lot of the tC's styling was taken by Honda on the tC...

Glass roof
Shape of the headlights/taillights
Body lines... IDK
Maybe its just me, but I wouldnt pay an extra $4,000 for a car that looks so similar...

I've owned 2 Civics, one Civic Shell that ended up with a B16, and one '96 Integra GS-R, all great cars, but I just couldn't see spending the cash for the 2012 Si, a civic running 91 octane would hurt the wallet to much over the life of the car.

Plus I just hated the way the radio was tied into the car, the way the new setup looks, seems like it may be hard to add your own player, so you're out more cash OTD if you upgrade to the better sound system.

I just liked the tC better, hope the OP gets to drive the Si and reports in how they liked/disliked it.

...and I'm also amazed this did not turn into a flame/troll/blech thread. :)

I really dislike the look of the SI, that is why I have a TC. That being said I would much rather the FR-S, if you can wait do so. Another car you can look into is a city Golf. I didn't get a chance to drive one, my job requires a car and as I had 2 weeks to find a car while working, very short on time for such an investment. The closest car for me was the Kia Forte koup. I just didn't like some internal elements on the car so I chose the TC.

If you have any pointed questions please let me know.

Joe

Again!! go for the 1st gen tC and do a project!!! it'll be alot of fun!!! 87oct you can't beat that!!! I personally don't like the SI, my homie has one, helped him modding his car, and it's a paint in the a$$ compare to the tC which many things can be taken apart in minutes, tC is designed for modder. still not feelling the tC 2nd gen also, but I do like the look of those Turboed Genesis, but not sure if there's many mods availible for that car! but again I would wait for the FR-S if you got the patience! it's all gonna comes out good!!!

yea! i love the game what can you buy for $25K......Turbo Gencoupe, tC2, 305hp V-6 Mustang that romps the V-6 Camaro all day long. G35, 350Z......

i'd get both but somehow tCs always smokes out the hondas only depending on what they have under the hood

given that street racing is no longer popular i would go with what is the most fun to drive. The problem with that logic is that you have to pay a premium for it (literally)

I agree with others who said to check out the Genesis. Though ive heard they have trans problems.

But do you really want to jump on a 24k car when the FS-R is coming for around that?

sure compare a turboed tC to an Si! apples to oranges!

I'm comparing price vs price. For a $1,000 more than a Civic Si you'll have a 300 whp tC.

And Honda is a joke now, people complained about the lack of torque in the Si and what does Honda do? They take the lazy route and stick a low reving tsx engine in it...

I'm on the civic SI forums and tC forums and the more I read posts and look at pics of both cars I'm leaning more and more towards the 2011 tC. It has the looks I like, 5 star safety and the base 6MT has everything I want and at no extra cost unlike others! Plus the mods are easier and cost less!!! And that there is a BIG plus!!

yea! i love the game what can you buy for $25K......Turbo Gencoupe, tC2, 305hp V-6 Mustang that romps the V-6 Camaro all day long. G35, 350Z......

My tC had a MSRP of $18,995 w/ destination charge. The SI will be 22,955. There are a few extra doodads that are standard but are dealer options with the tC (bluetooth, fogs, spoiler), but overall it looks pretty similar. It has the limited-slip diff, which is pretty cool, but I guess I'd hoped after seeing Honda put a turbocharger in the RDX, and after seeing an incredible surge in the power of compact cars over the past few years, that the SI would be something really special this time around. I've always like them, and there's a little part of me that was waiting for the "See, you should have waited before shopping."

Another $1000 puts you in a MazdaSpeed3. A thousand less puts you in a >300 hp Mustang. Despite sleazing with Toyota these days, I've mostly owned Hondas, and it's a little sad to see a new SI as something that's not as exciting as it could be. The Integra/RSX Type-S had a 200 hp engine back in '02. The Prelude had it before that. The SI was supposed to be the substitute for the RSX and Prelude... What gives guys?

On the other hand, it is also about 200 lbs lighter than the tC. Still, with power biased toward torque, and steering that is more about comfy cruising than intense road-feel, I look at the tC as less a sporty car and more a bargain alternative to a larger coupe like the Accord or Altima coupes, but with sporty styling.

And there's NO way I'm paying for premium fuel with this crazy gas prices... tC has the edge here!!

And there's NO way I'm paying for premium fuel with this crazy gas prices... tC has the edge here!!

12k miles/year over 5 years is 60,000 miles. Divide that by 25 mpg, and you get 2400 gallons of fuel. An extra 20 cents per gallon will cost you less than 500 over 4 years. Even though gas has gotten more expensive, the cost difference of supreme over regular has remained fairly constant.

$480 is relatively insignificant compared to the cost of purchasing or insuring a new car. After 5 years, it'll come out to a bit more than 1 mpg difference in fuel consumption.

There's a decent power/weight difference between the two as well: 2877 lbs /201 hp =14.31 lbs/hp. 3080/180 = 17.00. Just for reference, a Civic EX coupe weighs in at 2703 and has a 140 hp engine, which comes out to 19.31 lbs/hp. It's fairly reasonable to view the tC as a compromise between EX and SI power, at basically EX prices.

12k miles/year over 5 years is 60,000 miles. Divide that by 25 mpg, and you get 2400 gallons of fuel. An extra 20 cents per gallon will cost you less than 500 over 4 years. Even though gas has gotten more expensive, the cost difference of supreme over regular has remained fairly constant.

$480 is relatively insignificant compared to the cost of purchasing or insuring a new car. After 5 years, it'll come out to a bit more than 1 mpg difference in fuel consumption.

There's a decent power/weight difference between the two as well: 2877 lbs /201 hp =14.31 lbs/hp. 3080/180 = 17.00. Just for reference, a Civic EX coupe weighs in at 2703 and has a 140 hp engine, which comes out to 19.31 lbs/hp. It's fairly reasonable to view the tC as a compromise between EX and SI power, at basically EX prices.

That's a good point!! But my wallet does not have the luxury of paying $4.30 per gal premium vs. $3.87 regular (today's prices) in the St. Louis area. I've always liked the Civic SI for 15 years straight, but for some 'whatever' reason I ended up with another brand every time?!?!

That's a good point!! But my wallet does not have the luxury of paying $4.30 per gal premium vs. $3.87 regular (today's prices) in the St. Louis area. I've always liked the Civic SI for 15 years straight, but for some 'whatever' reason I ended up with another brand every time?!?!

You're complaining about an extra $5 a tank for premium but plan to pay $400+ for a car note and insurance each month???

That's a good point!! But my wallet does not have the luxury of paying $4.30 per gal premium vs. $3.87 regular (today's prices) in the St. Louis area. I've always liked the Civic SI for 15 years straight, but for some 'whatever' reason I ended up with another brand every time?!?!

That's a pretty wild price difference. Here is 4.21/4.31/4.41 for reg/mid/supreme at the last station I passed.

I've been hearing tC2's going for near $25 tax title and license

You're complaining about an extra $5 a tank for premium but plan to pay $400+ for a car note and insurance each month???

I would imagine insurance on an SI would be similar to a tC no?

I've been hearing tC2's going for near $25 tax title and license

That seems hard to do, unless they are loaded down with pointless accessories. The MSRP for a MT is 18,995, and I think the auto is just about a grand more. Even an unbelievable 15% tax (even here in the taxtacular killjoy state it's only about 9%) would only take a $20,000 sale up to $23,000.

The coupe looks like a mix between the new accord wagon and the old Honda Insight...

I would imagine insurance on an SI would be similar to a tC no?

They are both expensive to insure but I'll bet a Si is more. Reason #1 why I didn't buy one back in 07 when I was car shopping.

You're complaining about an extra $5 a tank for premium but plan to pay $400+ for a car note and insurance each month???

No, no... Not complaining at all. I just don't want to use premium fuel or pay for premium fuel!! Gas is already high. My mo pymts will be way less than 400 and we all have fo have insurance by law.

They are both expensive to insure but I'll bet a Si is more. Reason #1 why I didn't buy one back in 07 when I was car shopping.

Insurance for my 2011 tC and my wife's 2011 xB is a mere 230 a month with only a 500 dollar deductable through Allstate. If thats expensive to you, then I need to know who you go through...

Insurance for my 2011 tC and my wife's 2011 xB is a mere 230 a month with only a 500 dollar deductable through Allstate. If thats expensive to you, then I need to know who you go through...

Wow... And to think I was irritated over 165/mo to insure my '11 tC, '08 Ninja 650R, and renters insurance in my apartment. The tC alone is $560/6 mos, through State Farm.

If were to spend the extra money, I'd go with the Genesis 2.0T rather than the Civic Si. While I'll admit, I'm not sure what you mean by "LSD", but the extras the Civic has just aren't all that exciting. It's like auto headlights. What a waste.


X2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! are you kidding me? si for 23-24k? HELL NO! get a Genesis coupe

RWD turbo, looks much better!

X2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! are you kidding me? si for 23-24k? HELL NO! get a Genesis coupe

RWD turbo, looks much better!

I'd like to see what Kia's studios could do with that chassis. I abhor the new Hyundai design language ("Mr. Kim said add more creases, you add more creases!"), but the Kia cars look really sharp.

For $21k you can have a 'Stang with a 305hp V6. With a 3453 lbs curb weight, that's 11.26 lbs/hp... Rear wheel drive, classic looks, and decent enough fuel economy (19/31). What's not to love?

the only thing I don't love about V-6 "muscle cars" is they sound like crap....Not really a muscle car honestly. But yea, KIA has an Audi designer now. hence the clever look of the Optima. But it's your money. But what YOU like. there's no sense in all of the internet arguing over what's best for YOUR money. Go drive them all and make your decision. I could have done the same thing. Aks the internet what I should buy for less than $20K. I was looking for Saabaru's, Older Impreza RS, turbo Mazda Protege or wagon version, Integra 4 door or Matrix XRS. Any of the cars had to be manual transmission. I ended up with a xD on TRD suspension. I couldn't find anything around Chicago I wanted other than that.

Insurance for my 2011 tC and my wife's 2011 xB is a mere 230 a month with only a 500 dollar deductable through Allstate. If thats expensive to you, then I need to know who you go through...

I pay $78/month for my 08 xb2. $500 collision and comprehensive deductibles through State Farm.

the only thing I don't love about V-6 "muscle cars" is they sound like crap....Not really a muscle car honestly. But yea, KIA has an Audi designer now. hence the clever look of the Optima. But it's your money. But what YOU like. there's no sense in all of the internet arguing over what's best for YOUR money. Go drive them all and make your decision. I could have done the same thing. Aks the internet what I should buy for less than $20K. I was looking for Saabaru's, Older Impreza RS, turbo Mazda Protege or wagon version, Integra 4 door or Matrix XRS. Any of the cars had to be manual transmission. I ended up with a xD on TRD suspension. I couldn't find anything around Chicago I wanted other than that.

Mustang V6: 3453/305=11.26
Mazdaspeed3 3284/263= 12.49
Civic SI: 2877 lbs /201 hp =14.31
mini Cooper S: 2668/181=14.74
Nissan juke: 2912/188=15.49
VW GTI: 3034/200=15.70
Kia Forte Koup SX: 2844/173=16..44
Mustang V6 (pre-11): 3401/210=16.19
Scion tC: 3080/180 = 17.00
mazda3s: 3064/167=18.35
Ex coupe: 2703 lbs/ 140 hp = 19.31 lbs/hp.
Mini Cooper: 2535/121=20.95

So the Mustang V6 doesn't sound as nice as the GT... At least it's not the old 4-banger 'Stang! There's few (no?) other cars that offer such a fantastic combination of style, performance, and honest RWD driving dynamic for so cheap. I was VERY tempted, but I have two little girls who will likely grow up tall like me, so a functional back seat is a must for a car I plan to keep for a while.

Here's a list of the power ratios of some other cars in the SI/tC arena:
Mustang V6: 3453/305=11.26
Mazdaspeed3 3284/263= 12.49
Civic SI: 2877 lbs /201 hp =14.31
mini Cooper S: 2668/181=14.74
Nissan juke: 2912/188=15.49
VW GTI: 3034/200=15.70
Kia Forte Koup SX: 2844/173=16..44
Mustang V6 (pre-11): 3401/210=16.19
Scion tC: 3080/180 = 17.00
mazda3s: 3064/167=18.35
Ex coupe: 2703 lbs/ 140 hp = 19.31 lbs/hp.
Mini Cooper: 2535/121=20.95

I pay $78/month for my 08 xb2. $500 collision and comprehensive deductibles through State Farm.

Wow! $470/6 mos for an xB? I won't complain about the insurance on my tC. On my Fit, it was $230/6 mos. I'm a 29 y.o. dude with nothing on my driving record since 2004.

the new si looks like someone grabbed the front bumper and someone else got the back then they played tug-o-war till they made it as ugly as possible:icon_biggrin:

Dont take it personal Si fans.... im just playin

The exterior on the SI isn't bad, but the interior layout is horrendous. I'd pick my tC over an SI again and again.

Wow! $470/6 mos for an xB?

State Farm codes the xb2 as a van so Im sure that has something to do with it lol. Plus the xb2 isnt very popular with the young crowd like the tC, less speeding tickets and accidents = lower insurance premium.

State Farm codes the xb2 as a van so Im sure that has something to do with it lol. Plus the xb2 isnt very popular with the young crowd like the tC, less speeding tickets and accidents = lower insurance premium.

That seems a bit high though... the xB is a slowish, presumably low-risk-of-hooliganism hatch-thing like the Fit. I would expect the premiums to be far lower than that. It's currently $98.45 for full coverage and $500 deductibles on my tC and was (just looked it up to be sure) $53.60/mo on my Fit for the same thing. I get that the tC is higher, but I wouldn't expect the xB to be so close.

Then again, there are lots of other factors that play in, from age and principle garaging location to credit history and driving record.

The exterior on the SI isn't bad, but the interior layout is horrendous. I'd pick my tC over an SI again and again.

I don't care about interior looks - I care about interior comfort. The outgoing SI had a seat that couldn't be lowered enough or slide far enough back, and a handbrake lever that was designed to jab you in the right leg. That said, I would be more apt to compare the tC to the EX Coupe... the SI is one notch higher in the market.

If were to spend the extra money, I'd go with the Genesis 2.0T rather than the Civic Si. While I'll admit, I'm not sure what you mean by "LSD", but the extras the Civic has just aren't all that exciting. It's like auto headlights. What a waste.

Have you driven a 2.0T? I've driven a couple and they're actually kind of slow...my lightly modded 2006 tC felt faster. The GC 2.0T weighs like 3300lbs so that 210hp/223tq doesn't really move the car like you'd expect because of the weight. I'd bet my PT Cruiser GT could take it down in a straight line.

The 3.8L though...that one feels real quick. The TQ pushes you into the seat from a stop and the car pulls strong through the rev range.

That seems hard to do, unless they are loaded down with pointless accessories. The MSRP for a MT is 18,995, and I think the auto is just about a grand more. Even an unbelievable 15% tax (even here in the taxtacular killjoy state it's only about 9%) would only take a $20,000 sale up to $23,000.

Agreed!!!

Also about insurance to get the best deal, add an older car into the policy you get a cheaper price for 2 cars vs 1 car.

I was checking out both cars at the autoshow today. You really can't go wrong with either. They're both really nice cars. Personally I'd lean just a tad towards the tC, mainly for the fact that it's built in Japan and because the Civic is the second most stolen car.

Hows the legroom in the new civics? It seemed a bit tight in the last gen, and the seat felt a bit too high at its lowest setting.

I'm 6'2" and I fit fine. Current coupe is much more cramped than the 2012.

I'm 6'2" and I fit fine. Current coupe is much more cramped than the 2012.

Overall height doesn't mean much... dThere are so many differences in how people prefer to sit, how much leg stretching room they demand, how they're proportioned - I'm 6'1, but with long arms and legs. I've never felt cramped by headroom in a car (never needed to raise the headrest, and I can sit in the back of my tC with no problem at all), but am all too familiar with the feeling of my knees being in the way!

Well I have a 32" inseam, 230 weight and a decent build. Most of the time I have to have the seat all the way back for my legs with the seat tilted back for the rest of me, leaving me stretched out with my arms which I hate. The Civic Si was good in proportion to me. I had just enough headroom, steering wheel I didn't feel too extended in my reach and my legs were decently stretched out compared to most cars. I did find for me I had just enough room to get my fingers around the wheel when my left leg released the clutch. Seats were very sporty and supportive and my reach to the shifter was well placed. I did have to stretch out reach the Navi. Didn't fall within reach.

tC2, room looks deciving due to the flat roof and higher belt line but headroom I had just enough. I didn't feel that stretched out with my arms in reach to the steering wheel, shifter, controls, and stereo. And I felt the legroom was more generous. I could really stretch out my left leg, which I would love for long trips. Seats were good, but not as nice as the Si. tC steering wheel had a better feel to it and wasn't as cluttered as the Si. Clutch position I couldn't do since the car was an auto but I can't see myself banging my knee against the steering wheel.

Hopefully you found that more helpful.

Well I have a 32" inseam, 230 weight and a decent build. Most of the time I have to have the seat all the way back for my legs with the seat tilted back for the rest of me, leaving me stretched out with my arms which I hate. The Civic Si was good in proportion to me. I had just enough headroom, steering wheel I didn't feel too extended in my reach and my legs were decently stretched out compared to most cars. I did find for me I had just enough room to get my fingers around the wheel when my left leg released the clutch. Seats were very sporty and supportive and my reach to the shifter was well placed. I did have to stretch out reach the Navi. Didn't fall within reach.

6'1, 35" inseam, ~185. That's right, I'm a lanky daddy-longlegs looking mother f---er!

tC2, room looks deciving due to the flat roof and higher belt line but headroom I had just enough. I didn't feel that stretched out with my arms in reach to the steering wheel, shifter, controls, and stereo. And I felt the legroom was more generous. I could really stretch out my left leg, which I would love for long trips. Seats were good, but not as nice as the Si. tC steering wheel had a better feel to it and wasn't as cluttered as the Si. Clutch position I couldn't do since the car was an auto but I can't see myself banging my knee against the steering wheel.

Hopefully you found that more helpful.

Cool, thanks!

The tC2's headroom is fine for me. I slide the seat all the way back, and I have good room for my legs, and plenty of headroom. I can't touch the passenger door without leaning over, which is different for me. I can't stretch my left leg completely, but enough to be comfortable, and I can fully extend it when I push in the clutch.

I still have to move my knee around the wheel to let out the clutch if it's turned, but it's fairly easy with the wheel straight thanks to the flat bottom. My knee doesn't rub against anything, thanks to Toyota not putting an obnoxiously large console in there.

The seats feel great to me... even moreso since putting the Clazzio covers on. The seat feel and ergonomics were a bigger seller for the tC than anything else. Honestly, I was looking at a Civic coupe, and finding them less than stellar in that department, was scouring for a certified used Accord EX coupe when the '11 tC popped up on my radar. the tC1 was a bit awkward to me, so I really just gave it a cursory sit, and was impressed from the get-go.

Funny enough, one of my best friends tried out my car, went to Toyota 2 days later, cursed at me for reminding him that he really wanted a sport compact, and cruised over to grab a '08 SI from a used lot, trading in his lifted Tundra crew-cab.

The exterior on the SI isn't bad, but the interior layout is horrendous. I'd pick my tC over an SI again and again.


The tC2 interior isnt that good looking either.. lol. you just got used to your interior. I bet most people with the tC2 have negatives to say about their own car.

The tC2 interior isnt that good looking either.. lol. you just got used to your interior. I bet most people with the tC2 have negatives to say about their own car.

I've heard a lot of negatives about the tc2's interior. It seems to come down to two things: the pattern of the plastic surface (complaining about hard plastic instead of padded vinyl in a sub-20k car is a bit silly) and the audio system (often derided for looking 'aftermarket.').

I like it, but it is decidedly retro in nature! You know, LED clock, scooped out shape. All it needs is HVAC controls with sliding levers and "off max norm bi-lev vent heat def". However, having owned an Element, wrangler, and a GMC truck in the past (which had my favorite ethos and interior until this one) I'm decidedly a function over form sort of dude. Every control, lever, and switch in the tC feels like it's in the right place save for the awful cruise control nub.

I've heard a lot of negatives about the tc2's interior. It seems to come down to two things: the pattern of the plastic surface (complaining about hard plastic instead of padded vinyl in a sub-20k car is a bit silly) and the audio system (often derided for looking 'aftermarket.').

The negatives could be because Scion decided to downgrade the interior from the 1st gen:

Hard plastics vs. padded material
HVAC used to be push button w/ aluminum knob in center.
outside temp gone
cargo cover gone
waterfall w/radio cover gone
2 tier padded center console gone
auto up/down passanger window gone
the vents used to be nicer and more upscale looking
removed glass wind guard from sunroof

I didn't check but I'm guessing them removed the pump thing that regulated the decent of the glovebox...that gave it an upscale feel when you opened it.

The new gen has a more corollish looking interior which I think is why it gets knocked...they cheapened it out while raising the price. The TC2 has seats are nicer though.

The negatives could be because Scion decided to downgrade the interior from the 1st gen:

Hard plastics vs. padded material
HVAC used to be push button w/ aluminum knob in center.
outside temp gone
cargo cover gone
waterfall w/radio cover gone
2 tier padded center console gone
auto up/down passanger window gone
the vents used to be nicer and more upscale looking
removed glass wind guard from sunroof

I didn't check but I'm guessing them removed the pump thing that regulated the decent of the glovebox...that gave it an upscale feel when you opened it.

The new gen has a more corollish looking interior which I think is why it gets knocked...they cheapened it out while raising the price. The TC2 has seats are nicer though.

The tc1 has a closer resemblance to the Corolla's dash - waterfall console with lots of fake aluminum, rectangular vents at the top, etc.

What is the advantage of pushbutton AC? My accord had it, most f my other cars had knobs... Seems to work just the same. on the plus side, the tc2 uses a direct mechanical connection so there are no servo motors to fail.

The outside temp display is still there, but like most cars, it seems inaccurate.

The local dealer tried to sell me on a leftover '10... Despite the lower power and small engine, the mileage was worse and the legroom was tight, and they only had 4 speed automatic models... Hello 1995! ;-)

Also wondering, what was the major benefit of the waterfall covering the radio, most of the threads I've seen of tC1 people putting in aftermarket DDs all go on an on about chopping off bits of plastic to make the door close... Seems a bit..off.

Everything else in the 2011...just seems like it works. I will totally agree with Occam though, the cruise control is just... wrong.

The tC2 interior isnt that good looking either.. lol. you just got used to your interior. I bet most people with the tC2 have negatives to say about their own car.

I have a few negatives to say about it. But, at least it flows. The inside of the Civic looks like a blind person started throwing vents and knobs and left them where they fell, lol.

^^ like the round airvent on the tC2 dash?

^^ like the round airvent on the tC2 dash?

Yes! But the whole thing, haha.

http://images.gtcarlot.com/pictures/39521519.jpghttp://media.dealeron.com/photo/pix320/SSCUSA/Scion/tC/2009/3CO/dashboard.jpg

http://beta.images.theglobeandmail.com/static/drive//images/izmo/pix/640/SAAB/9-3/2009/4SA/dashboard_570.jpghttp://www.dragtimes.com/images-classifieds-large/2011-11-2012-TOYOTA-SCION-TC-SCION-Tc-DASH-TRIM-KIT-SET-for-sale_150578086169.jpg

Toyota has never been the most original company. They tend toward copying very popular designs:

http://image.dieselpowermag.com/f/9111167/0704dp_10_z+toyota_fj40_turbo_diesel_engine_swap+land_cruisers.jpg
Jeep CJ

http://www.myautomovil.com/uploads/img/ToyotaTundra1_th_2.jpg
Ford F150

http://team1.poweredbyaloe.com/images/dustin_mr2.jpg
Fiero

http://images.usedcheapcars.org/used-lexus/1999-lexus-ls-lexus-4-0l-8-cylinder-premium-5-speed-automatic/f632aad0-108f-45d7-baef-095b6eee2259-ucc.jpg
Mercedes Benz

But c'mon... this:
http://autoweek.com/storyimage/CW/20110217/CARNEWS/110219878/V2/civic-dash.jpg
Came from here:
http://www.siwiak.com/archives/asdb/images/galaxy/ed-bridge-generations%5B1%5D.jpg

wow didnt look at the new Si interior. Very odd!

I really like the last gen Si interior.

Also what Toyota is that interior from in the very first pic you posted?

But c'mon... this:
http://autoweek.com/storyimage/CW/20110217/CARNEWS/110219878/V2/civic-dash.jpg
Came from here:
http://www.siwiak.com/archives/asdb/images/galaxy/ed-bridge-generations%5B1%5D.jpg

lmao I agree! And it wasn't a good idea.

wow didnt look at the new Si interior. Very odd!

I really like the last gen Si interior.

Also what Toyota is that interior from in the very first pic you posted?

2010 Corolla.

My favorite of the Toyota knockoffs:

http://image.automobilemag.com/f/features/collectible_classic/1012_1976_1977_toyota_celica_gt_liftback/34955979+w440/1976-1977-toyota-celica-GT-liftback-rear-three-quarters.jpg
http://image.mustangandfords.com/f/10393895+w750+st0/mump_0111_05_z+1966_ford_mustang_gt_hi_po_1969_ford_mustang_fastback_restore+golfing.jpg

A guy I work with has a really clean one. He has a copy of the Popular Mechanics that had that year Celica in his office in a page protector, and said the he got it from the P.O. The P.O. claims that it was the actual car used for the photoshoot, but doesn't have any documentation to prove it.

But I digress.

Kia is the absolute worst when it comes to knock-off designs.

Kia is the absolute worst when it comes to knock-off designs.

Until recently I would have agreed. However, the new design language seems to be working for them.

http://media.il.edmunds-media.com/kia/optima/2011/fd/2011_kia_optima_f34_fd_902104_717.jpg

I see a touch of Lexus IS in the rear window, but otherwise, it's pretty original. Love it or hate it, it stands on its own.

The Forte still looks very Civic, but it's a 2008 design. I'm curious how the next Forte will look.

WEAK!! it looks like a baby prius... when will Honda bring the 2 door Hatchback back!!! only other si that comes close is the 4 door bc duh, its a sporty 4 door... I'm glad I got my 2011 tc and my 94 si hatch.. garbage...

well, all the features it has like that I-MID sounds nice.. so its fancy garbage, we'll call it garåge..

If they make another hatchback, I'll trade in the tc on day 1..

The seats, armrest and digital speedo are really nice on the SI, but thats about it for interior. IMO... Over all I still like the tC inside and out.

Figured i'd bring this back from the D E D... I was just recently choosing between these 2 cars.

Went with the scion for a few reasons but mainly because while the torque between the 2 cars is close, it's available throughout more of the rev range in the TC.

Horsepower will give you a decent top speed... but i don't drive any faster than 125 or 130km/h anyway. So, i was specifically looking at torque and 0-60 times..

For the premium price of the SI, and the cost of insurance and premium gas... the TC was a no brainer for me! manual to manual, the SI get's to 6-0 in .5 to .9 Seconds faster. To me, it just wasn't worth the extra $5 grand (Canada) + cost of ownership...

The SI would look awesome in the orange with a black roof IMO though!

EDIT: the limited slip in the SI is sweet too!

Being a previous si owner I first looked at the 9th gen,.....with huge dissapointment. They completely failed on the cosmetic appeal. Similar to 8th Gen but tweaked the wrong way.
Apples to apples the 2arfe doesn't even touch a k series engine. But my so was $20k in 06, I couldn't see shelling out even more forms similar looking car but on the other side. The k24 will see huge power gains with hondata, etc.......Toyota needs a reflash support company.

I would imagine insurance on an SI would be similar to a tC no?

They are around the same price for insurance. I quoted them both.

I havent looked at the new SI. Out of my price range. I am picking up my new tC Tuesday. I love Scion and am a former owner of the 06 xB. Was a great car. I also looked at Honda. Just the basic Civic coupe. Only avail in 2 colors??? I work at Honda. I dont build Civics but I work in the Accord plant. I should have bought Honda to help keep me in a job, but the value to me is in the tC. I am gonna say buy the Honda but, I didnt. If you wanna save a little money on a car thats every bit as good as a Honda buy the Scion. Either way your not gonna lose.

just throwing in my .02. i actually picked the 2012 si sedan over the tc2. i test drove the both of them and hands down the honda is faster all the way around. i got mine for 26k with an extended warrenty. money is the biggest issue because the tc2 is def. the cheaper of the two to buy+maintain. i love the styling on both cars but the civic si gives you something extra that you really cant compare with the tc2. plus the 2.4 liter motor they put in the si makes it a way better dd than the 8th gen. (i owned a 8th gen si also). interior wise si compared tc2 is also a no contest but you get what you pay for. i hope this helped you out.
heres a couple pics of mine.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/thevietboi33/2012-05-25112653.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/thevietboi33/7130385111_7773e892cd_o.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/thevietboi33/7130365055_9e1b7818a5_b.jpg

just throwing in my .02. i actually picked the 2012 si sedan over the tc2. i test drove the both of them and hands down the honda is faster all the way around. i got mine for 26k with an extended warrenty. money is the biggest issue because the tc2 is def. the cheaper of the two to buy+maintain. i love the styling on both cars but the civic si gives you something extra that you really cant compare with the tc2. plus the 2.4 liter motor they put in the si makes it a way better dd than the 8th gen. (i owned a 8th gen si also). interior wise si compared tc2 is also a no contest but you get what you pay for. i hope this helped you out.
heres a couple pics of mine.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/thevietboi33/2012-05-25112653.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/thevietboi33/7130385111_7773e892cd_o.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/thevietboi33/7130365055_9e1b7818a5_b.jpg

Can you take some interior pics?