What is the Max amount of boost being put out so far on the stock xB motor with a turbo or supercharger setup. Just curious. Also what type of turbo is being run, anyone drop in a garret unit yet, like possibly a GT28RS or would that thing just blow that motor to pieces? Just thinking for a little future notice if I really want to start playing with this motor. I get bored easily, :)

7psi daily anything more is asking for death

what type of forced induction are u running, model?

oh . here in smog strangled only the brave , stupid , and rich run forced induction. but any turbo or s/c setup for these cars will have 6-7psi.

6psi for me on a garrett T20

I am pretty sure Matchbox gets up around 10 with no problems so far.

I am pretty sure Matchbox gets up around 10 with no problems so far.
i have the same set up as matchbox, i run 12 psi daily.
have been doing so for about year with no problems (except a burnt out clutch).

I am pretty sure Matchbox gets up around 10 with no problems so far.
i have the same set up as matchbox, i run 12 psi daily.
have been doing so for about year with no problems (except a burnt out clutch).

12 psi is more like it, the other guy was saying 6psi max
if I can run 30 psi on a stock neon motor im sure this motor can handle 12psi daily
thanks for the info guys, but your all running small turbo units, anyone running something with some high cfm numbers

Snake, for turbo applications anything more than 6 psi continually will snap the connecting rods. IMHO, a supercharger is the better route of the two to go.

The bottom ends aren't built to withstand anything more than what Toyota had designed the car for, commuting.

I never said 6psi was the max.... I just said that was the highest I will go....

is anyone making rods and pistons so that it would be possible to push these more?

1nz turbo story

Turbo charging the 1nz-fe has proven to be chore. It responds to boost quite nicely with a properly sized turbo. But its downfalls are the internals and its engine management.
Lets touch on the internals. First and foremost are the rods. Although quite strong for their size, they are designed for normal aspiration only. A half point higher in compression is about all they can handle daily without failure. Once boost is added to the equation, it becomes Russian roulette as to when they will let loose. You may last eight months with 50,000 miles or blow it the first pass down the street; there are no warning signs. We know this because of the testing of our turbo kit for the last year. The testing started on the Echo then was transferred to a Scion. The testing was controlled and only once was it taken past its set 7-psi mark while in our possession. Its one time high boost pass on the dyno was done to see how much the turbo would produce at maximum efficiency. Fueling and timing were changed to handle this. Every month the pan was dropped and there were no signs of abnormal rod bearing wear. The compression was straight across the board every time. The first motor lasted 6 months with about 35,000 miles. Its life was cut short while at the paint shop. Rumors placed it at the local street races near the paint shop, which they had for 3 weeks. All the baked on rubber in the fender well was the first clue. It let loose on its way back from them. A fresh motor was installed ASAP to continue the testing. The old motor was broke down to find the rod broke right above the crank pin. The dangling rod was beaten into the walls and punctured holes on both sides of the block. The second one let loose 12,467 miles later. It had seen one race with 3 passes at 9 psi. Fueling and timing were also changed to handle this. Other than that it was daily driven. The rods let go again, the same way, only this time it punctured the water jacket and destroyed the head. These engines have the crankshaft offset 12mm to the thrust side of the cylinder bore centerline. This reduces the side force generated at maximum compression, for reduced friction and improved fuel economy. Toyota calculates the offset crankshaft configuration reduces fuel consumption by between one and three percent. Unfortunately, this throws the angle of the rod way out on its upward travel causing the rod to just give up under boost and snap. If there is any detonation or pre-ignition this breakage will occur at an accelerated rate. The movement and breakage of the cylinder walls is the same as Honda’s open deck. Although we have yet to split one, we designed a block guard just in case. This product keeps cylinders from moving around and from splitting open the top of the bore. We are currently designing a forged replacement rod as well as a rod piston combo for high boost applications. The first of the sleeved blocks is being tested now.
Now for the ecu. It cannot handle boost in its stock form. Its timing is set for the stock parameters only. It will not handle larger injectors either. Piggyback or stand-alone management is needed to fuel the turbo properly, end of story.
From what we have seen, these issues probably were found by the likes of Blitz and Greddy long before we did. That’s why the boost on their kits was so low. The stock injectors will supply enough fuel for 3 to 4 psi if the MAF reaches full voltage and gets the injectors to 85 percent duty. Unfortunately you end up with a 15:1 AFR at peak rpm this way. Good for passing emissions but bad for the motor. The RS turbo Vitz has an ecu calibrated for the larger injectors that feed 150 ps at the flywheel which in turn is 127 ps at the wheels. The blitz s/c was turning 122 hp to the wheels without an ecu for the US market. With the ecu (JDM only), the s/c put down 129 ps to the wheels. It seems like the kits are limited to 150 at the flywheel but no one says how long it will last. Our turbo kit produced 144 hp and 150 tq to the wheels. That’s 170 hp at the flywheel. We have worked with several management systems and we will inform the public of the best one for our kit. We will release our kit soon but cannot warranty it except for workmanship. This kit will push your engine over the edge in the long run but if you build it our kit will be able to provide up to 250 hp at the flywheel. That’s 217 at the wheels. With all this said, it is up to you, the consumer, to decide whether this kit is right for you.

http://elprototypes.com/1nz%20turbo.htm

7-8 psi daily.

157.6whp so far. Still in the tuning process.

On a 10 to 1 compression motor for a daily drive I would never go over 7 psi. Even 7 is a large amount of boost on stock internals. These motors were not designed for boost, adding boost is a roll of the dice. Adding boost without timing changes is even worse. The 12 psi motors I have a hard time believing, it's piossible but not safe in my eyes. The above mentioned kit putting down twice the amount of power as the stocker is a great claim. I've also seen pullies for my truck claim 80hp (Yeah if you build everything else to handle it) Detonation is a killer, I know I toasted 3 turbos and 2 blocks on my SVO, playing with boost. I now take boost much more seriously. I think the understanding of how turbo's and superchagers work is a bit misunderstood here. Neither generates constant PSI. There is Vaccum, and it is most of the time. Even when I'm driing around I hit boost pressure once or twice for a couple of seconds. It's possible to put a 20 PSI blower on these motors and last forever, if you never got into the boost it is just a noisy pretty object mounted on the motor running vaccum all the time. The harder you drive it the harder the motor is beat. One persons driving habit is not anothers. Even if you had a 12 psi turbo you could never drive it all the time in the boost, it is physiclly impossible, even on the freeway. It looks like ELP has some serious projects going on, I will keep watching as it's only a matter of time before the xa is boosted. But it will take quite a bit more than a 'Turbo intake" off ebay, a turbo and some fuel injectors to get me to play with that. One slip on the fuel or timing on my truck and boom the block now has air conditioning. I just want to excercise a word of caution to anyone that takes on a project of this size. I'll do it, not sure when but some time, be safe in the mean time. I can not stress how much forged internals are worth. I personally would never run boost on any car without forged pistons and rods.

gotta love all the different turbo lessons everyone gives out lol

Daily driving I'm hitting around 7psi. But when I feel like goosing it I hit 10 to 11lbs. My hi-flow cat helped a bunch. It is way to restrictive.

gotta love all the different turbo lessons everyone gives out lol
Come up to the Ave on friday...I will show you my setup :lalala:

On a 10 to 1 compression motor for a daily drive I would never go over 7 psi. Even 7 is a large amount of boost on stock internals. These motors were not designed for boost, adding boost is a roll of the dice. Adding boost without timing changes is even worse. The 12 psi motors I have a hard time believing, it's piossible but not safe in my eyes. The above mentioned kit putting down twice the amount of power as the stocker is a great claim. I've also seen pullies for my truck claim 80hp (Yeah if you build everything else to handle it) Detonation is a killer, I know I toasted 3 turbos and 2 blocks on my SVO, playing with boost. I now take boost much more seriously. I think the understanding of how turbo's and superchagers work is a bit misunderstood here. Neither generates constant PSI. There is Vaccum, and it is most of the time. Even when I'm driing around I hit boost pressure once or twice for a couple of seconds. It's possible to put a 20 PSI blower on these motors and last forever, if you never got into the boost it is just a noisy pretty object mounted on the motor running vaccum all the time. The harder you drive it the harder the motor is beat. One persons driving habit is not anothers. Even if you had a 12 psi turbo you could never drive it all the time in the boost, it is physiclly impossible, even on the freeway. It looks like ELP has some serious projects going on, I will keep watching as it's only a matter of time before the xa is boosted. But it will take quite a bit more than a 'Turbo intake" off ebay, a turbo and some fuel injectors to get me to play with that. One slip on the fuel or timing on my truck and boom the block now has air conditioning. I just want to excercise a word of caution to anyone that takes on a project of this size. I'll do it, not sure when but some time, be safe in the mean time. I can not stress how much forged internals are worth. I personally would never run boost on any car without forged pistons and rods.

wow....just wow...most of what you put up is just babble...
my supercharger puts 12psi into the motor at redline.
crusing on the highway its at a contsant 6psi (no vacuum).
this is a stock motor and an unmodified supercharger.

i have a 55 mile one way commute and 50 miles of it is at highway speeds (60-80).
all of this time its boosting.

wow....just wow...most of what you put up is just babble...
my supercharger puts 12psi into the motor at redline.
crusing on the highway its at a contsant 6psi (no vacuum).
this is a stock motor and an unmodified supercharger.

i have a 55 mile one way commute and 50 miles of it is at highway speeds (60-80).
all of this time its boosting.

All on stock internals :lalala: :bow:

if your cruising down the highway at say. 3500 rpms, how are you in boost? your only in boost when you are accelarating. so if the cruise control is on, or your just driving a steady speed, your not in boost! its just not possible. check your boost gauge while cruising.

and i don't see a problem running 12 psi on the XB motor every once in a while. but i would have to agree, forged internals are well worth the money. 12psi all day, everyday would kill our motor very fast! is anyone running a FMIC? its even harder on the motor with out one. nothings worse than forcing HOT air into a N/A motor! Thats asking for the death bed!

supercharger is still spooling just as much as long as the crank is spinning at a given rpm... im not exactly sure but im guessing it bleeds the other 6psi because of a throttle vacuum line?

-jon

is anyone running a FMIC? its even harder on the motor with out one. nothings worse than forcing HOT air into a N/A motor! Thats asking for the death bed!

http://www.scionlife.com/gallery/data/500/medium/turbo002.jpg

supercharger is still spooling just as much as long as the crank is spinning at a given rpm... im not exactly sure but im guessing it bleeds the other 6psi because of a throttle vacuum line?

-jon

He has a centrifugal blower, there's nothing to bleed because it only produces 12psi at higher rpms near redline



if your cruising down the highway at say. 3500 rpms, how are you in boost? your only in boost when you are accelarating. so if the cruise control is on, or your just driving a steady speed, your not in boost! its just not possible. check your boost gauge while cruising.

and i don't see a problem running 12 psi on the XB motor every once in a while. but i would have to agree, forged internals are well worth the money. 12psi all day, everyday would kill our motor very fast! is anyone running a FMIC? its even harder on the motor with out one. nothings worse than forcing HOT air into a N/A motor! Thats asking for the death bed!

as long as that cranks is turning that blower there is postive pressure, because its centrifugal the pressure builds with the rpms unlike a twin screw which has the same pressure at whatever rpm (i think)

Man, i feel like a total idiot. For some reason i was thinking he had a tubo. Of course the s/c will have boost because its belt drivin so you are right... if the crank is turning, so is the s/c!

Now a turbo is a diffrent story. I own a 97 Eclipse GSX, and i built this baby from the ground up. while vruising at highway speeds, a turbo is not in boost.

i didn't mean to jump in like king ____. sorry for the confusion.... i thought we were talking turbos :P

Simplyscion....if thats your ride, that is a nice ___ set up. However, i'm not digging the accordian looking pipe up top. looks tacky as hell. is there any way to swap that for a hard pipe?

Simplyscion....if thats your ride, that is a nice butt set up. However, i'm not digging the accordian looking pipe up top. looks tacky as hell. is there any way to swap that for a hard pipe?
Im thinking about getting somethin bent up but its gonna be a pain in the a$$ cause the pipe would have soo many bends in it.

Ok... Why is it that everyone that does these HUGE posts, are always the ones that are N/A? I find that to be rather funny.... I am up to 5-7psi daily depending on how I feel.

As for forged internals, the factory rods ARE forged. If you dont believe me, stop by and look at the one I have in my hands.

As for the not making boost at a cruising speed, that is correct with a turbo. At constant speed, you are NOT making any boost. You are in vacuum.

Ok... Why is it that everyone that does these HUGE posts, are always the ones that are N/A? I find that to be rather funny.... I am up to 5-7psi daily depending on how I feel.

And thats only running it conservatively...they can be pushed a lil more w/ the right settings. Im sure that most of these people that threw a rod were running unsafely lean at the point of rod failure.

just run 7 psi but then again sometimes 7 might be to much it all depends on the tunning i would recomend using a hks fcon vpro or something to that extent the better you can control everything the more reliable everything becomes

Naa...7 is fine...as long as you dont spike over like 11psi your good

7lbs day to day unless i get gas happy. :P

I am pretty sure Matchbox gets up around 10 with no problems so far.
i have the same set up as matchbox, i run 12 psi daily.
have been doing so for about year with no problems (except a burnt out clutch).

12 psi is more like it, the other guy was saying 6psi max
if I can run 30 psi on a stock neon motor im sure this motor can handle 12psi daily
thanks for the info guys, but your all running small turbo units, anyone running something with some high cfm numbers I dont know whos running 30 psi on a stock neon motor but i call bs..... now if you are talking a srt4 motor thats a totally diff motor then the 2.0L sohc and dohc.... the srt has 8.1:1 compression instead of the stock 9.8:1 on the 2.0L and the internals are alot stronger

i run 8 psi all day evry day, and anyone from this area can verify i beat the hell out of my car. On the track i have done two full passes at 12psi, but i was HEAVILY overfueling the motor and bogging to the point where my 60' were in the 2.5 range lol. (a/f gauge wasnt responding correctly and i programmed my neo extra rich to be safe. I have since then tuned my vehicle a little further and will be running tomorow at Lebanon Valley. If i can, i will try and get someone to tape a few full passes.

i run 8 psi all day evry day, and anyone from this area can verify i beat the hell out of my car. On the track i have done two full passes at 12psi, but i was HEAVILY overfueling the motor and bogging to the point where my 60' were in the 2.5 range lol. (a/f gauge wasnt responding correctly and i programmed my neo extra rich to be safe. I have since then tuned my vehicle a little further and will be running tomorow at Lebanon Valley. If i can, i will try and get someone to tape a few full passes.

Are those 12psi on a blower or a turbo?? Im pretty sure the engine will hold up to 12psi on a blower, but not so sure about a turbo. Alot of people claim to be pushing 10psi plus on a turbo, but i just don't think its possible. Im going to be running a GT25R at 7psi, which hopefully (with correct tuning) will put me at 130whp (i hope).

turbo, i can get some vid together for evryone when my clutch is in this weekend.

turbo, i can get some vid together for evryone when my clutch is in this weekend.make sure everything is perfect for VIP cause i wanna good race. :P

^^^^ i feel there is a good race in between you to.

BTW, how are you not breaking your block with 12 psi of boost??

i put out 15 psi once...

once....

I'm running 5.8 right now cause im conservitive.

My lord!! There is so much misinformation and myth in this thread that it's sickening!!

I guess having a boosted Civic for the last 3-4 years has taught me a lot. I suggest some of you people do some TECHNICAL reading before basing your opinion on he-said, she-said info.