just something i've been wondering. i see the awesome turbo and sc stuff tc owners are getting and wonder why not the xa or xb? i'm mainly wondering what are the technical problems tuners are having or is it just a lack of interest? is 200 hp on an xa that far fetched?

The 2.4 liter in the tC is a much more stout engine from the factory. The 1NZ is a good little motor but under boost, the rod angle contributes to rod failure if you boost the motor pretty much over 10 psi, limiting power making.

Right now, the only way an xA or xB will make big power is through the 4efte swap, something I would consider down the line.

It is a 1.5L motor. I would contribute it more to lack of interest, which is dumb considering how simple the 1NZ is. If someone would make some cams, high comp pistons, and a fuel computer that plugs in, I might be on board to do some actual motor work. But unti there is a REAL plug and play computer with anti-knock, VVTi support, and OBDII compatibility, I say nay. There is nothing worse than hacking up the wires on your 1-2 year old car, then not having the ability to tune it perfectly, and then not be able to get it inspected. If someone is listening out there, make a plug and play box with all those features. I have a feeling with as light as the xA/xB are, with a good solid 150whp, they would be quite quick.

the problem is two things

1 . learning ecu. doesnt like mods or piggy backs.
2 . 15% offset crank. which honestly isn't too much of a problem. the major one is the ecu.

i always thought 150 whp would be beast on the xa. i won't spend any money on intakes or anything like that since it seems the performance gains are minimal. i'd consider a motor swap but they are usually a pain and from what i've read i'd have to go with an older toyota motor and i'd rather keep my stock low mileage motor anyway. so i guess the only option is to wait for a serious turbo or sc kit to hit the market.

there will NEVER be one. it will be totally custom and one off if anything. add bolt ones. trust it isnt a waste and if yer smart will be cheap...

and just wait for 1zz/2zz swap kits within the next few short years

if boltons could make the power i'd like, i'd do it, but i don't see that happening so i'll just chill. i'm sure they make the car a little peppier but they aren't going to give me the result i'd like.

maybe a motor swap one day. it would probably be cheaper and more reliable than a custom turbo anyways.

what are the specs on the engines you're telling me about? how old, displacement, na or fi, what cars were they in, etc.? i don't know much about toyota engines so the engine codes don't really tell me anything.

no offense but th xB and xA are more show than go. i could somewhat understand if they made a sc for the xA but the xB is not high speed friendly. Here is an example. The origanal shelby cobra was a great car and could kick a$$ and take names but later the car ran into a bottleneck. Aerodynmanicly the car hit a brick wall at 160-165 mph. It obviously had the hp but the body wouldn't alow the car to go any faster. So you could could have sc tc motor in the xB it wouldn't help that much Also, the xB trans has very high gearing. Good idea but bad car to work with.

i agree but i'm not trying to break speed records. i think all scions are sharp in their own way, but the xa and xb are the slow pokes and a little more punch would make them wicked fun to drive.

define "real power" though, how much power do you need to make a quick car on something so light

i would think 130-140hp on an xb or xa is pretty darn quick and peppy...and people are doing that now, not sure of xa's but ive seen some on this site alone who can hit 125-135hp

125+ hp on these light small cars is a good chunk of power i think

i wonder how much you can try just making the cars even lighter, with these it may become something where every tiny bit adds up like carbon fiber items here and there, no spare tire ...no back seats etc.... can add up

i want 200 hp. i know that's high but it's not a ridiculous number. tc's are making 220 or more at the wheels so 160 whp on a xa shouldn't be viewed as an impossible goal. though what i want vs what i can have might be different.

but remember the 1.5 liter motor the xA has was made for high fuel milage not for preformace so you may be pushingit on that motor. The compression ratio is high which isn't that good for SC. I understand what you are saying. The xA is 2300 pounds. that is 200 pounds lighter than a civic coupe. Although toyota wanted the scion to be modified the 1.5 liter motor gearing it to high. If you were to some how transplate the tc gearset into the xA and then SC maybe just maybe you could get a quick little car for what you are asking for

i want 200 hp. i know that's high but it's not a ridiculous number. tc's are making 220 or more at the wheels so 160 whp on a xa shouldn't be viewed as an impossible goal. though what i want vs what i can have might be different.

As it is right now, someone has 150whp on a 1nz motor, i believe in a Xb. I forget who it was, but they are on here.

The 1/4 isn't the Xb's strong side, however, autocross and road courses are. With a few suspension mods the Xb can handle very strong, and out handle a lot of things. I know, i autox and so on. So with the xa/xb, don't tune for 1/4 mile runs. No matter what you do, you won't the fastest time.

160whp isn't impossible. However, as it stands right now lots of parts would have to be custom, you would have to go with a turbocharger or supercharger. Turbo being more effient, with that much power in this car i would recommend it vs. super. You are looking at spending anywhere from $6,000-$10,000 to get 160whp as safe, and durable as possible.

120-130whp is all we need to be very quick. We are light cars, and yes, weight reduction helps a lot. I have an automatic with mods listed in sig, and i took out back seat, spare tire, jacks, back seat brackets.. And ran 16.4 in the 1/4. Thats my fastest time, with weight reduction i averaged 16.5-16.7 1/4. Makes a difference.

Good luck,
Cya

no offense but th xB and xA are more show than go. i could somewhat understand if they made a sc for the xA but the xB is not high speed friendly. Here is an example. The origanal shelby cobra was a great car and could kick a$$ and take names but later the car ran into a bottleneck. Aerodynmanicly the car hit a brick wall at 160-165 mph. It obviously had the hp but the body wouldn't alow the car to go any faster. So you could could have sc tc motor in the xB it wouldn't help that much Also, the xB trans has very high gearing. Good idea but bad car to work with.
who said we were going for topend? top end doesnt help much. it isn't too useable. and i know an xb could go like 140 or so aerodynamically.

if boltons could make the power i'd like, i'd do it, but i don't see that happening so i'll just chill. i'm sure they make the car a little peppier but they aren't going to give me the result i'd like.

maybe a motor swap one day. it would probably be cheaper and more reliable than a custom turbo anyways.

what are the specs on the engines you're telling me about? how old, displacement, na or fi, what cars were they in, etc.? i don't know much about toyota engines so the engine codes don't really tell me anything.
you can get 115whp on boltons. a vast improvement. but you do what you do.

the 1zz is a 1.8 liter with 130-140hp it is in corolla's , mr-2's , celica gt , and matrix's

the 2zz is the 1.8 higher comp vvtLi motor 173-180hp corolla xrs , matrix xrs , celica gts , modified for use in lotus elise with 190hp.

they were first sold in like 2000 or so and are still sold to this day and will be in use for at least 2 more years.

the 1zz can be had with a trd supercharger which bone stock will produce 163whp which is the same as the 2zz yet will cost less , be more abundant and have SOOO much more torque. add header , an intake , and full exhaust coupled with iridiums , lightweight pulley and hell you could even up the boost. but with stock boost plus bolt ons you're looking at about 180-200 whp.

and with the 1zz you dont have to worry about bending valves from an accidental miss-shift like you do in the 2zz

killerxromances know what he talkin about. If all you want is a quick town car then mod your suspention then begin with the power mods. Here is another example of this. The Abrams m1a2 has a top speed of 55 mph (i know that is so fast) and it has a 1500 hp engine. Englands tank is light and has a smaller engine but can go just as fast if not fast because of it better suspention and lighter weight.

good points all around. for now i'm not doing much to the suspension. eventually i'll go with some coilovers but not until i have the power to warrant making an investment like that. as of right now i'm enjoying the car for what it is, which is a nice little ride that gets great mileage and looks great.

i'm not looking for 1/4 mile or autocross, just something i can take on the road and enjoy. i'll have to start doing some homework on the 1zz. once i see someone else do it and figure out what problems are, i'll throw my hat in and see what happens.

what is the service weight difference going to be on a 1ZZ motor and trans VS a 1NZ? If they are roughly the same it wouldn't change the weight a lot and the car's handling dynamics wouldn't change much. I think the 1NZ is 190 pounds dry....

it wont be much more than 75 pounds.

I'm not really too big on power really...not say that power isn't damn rad. but i've come to terms with my little monster 1.5L engine...as long as I can make it quicker...not faster, but quicker...I'll be happy!! The thing that I care most about and most certainly REALLy do something about is the car's suspension set up. As alot of you may or may not know I like to run alot of mountain roads, and IMO 3/4 of what really matters is suspension set-up. the rest power. Whatever gains I can get from I/H/E a better clutch, flywheel, and lighter pulley, is fine enough for me!!

you are easier to satisfy. lol

good points all around. for now i'm not doing much to the suspension. eventually i'll go with some coilovers but not until i have the power to warrant making an investment like that. as of right now i'm enjoying the car for what it is, which is a nice little ride that gets great mileage and looks great.

i'm not looking for 1/4 mile or autocross, just something i can take on the road and enjoy. i'll have to start doing some homework on the 1zz. once i see someone else do it and figure out what problems are, i'll throw my hat in and see what happens.

If you go with all power mods, then suspension. You are going to have some fairly major traction issues, and you definitely are going to suffer around turns and just flooring it for a little thrill and fun. The stock suspension is fine up until, i dont know, i'd probably rate max whp on the stock suspension to be 95-100whp before you start getting weird reactions from the suspension. Body roll a big one. Of course, i could be wrong. I didn't have my stock suspension on very long. One thing is for sure, to get full usage of the new power you will need to modify your suspension and get some performance tires. At very least, buy the Tanabe DF210 springs. I have them, and they perform extremely well for springs. Anyone who has had them, or has them can prove my statement to be true.

Cya

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/365461

no offense but th xB and xA are more show than go. i could somewhat understand if they made a sc for the xA but the xB is not high speed friendly. Here is an example. The origanal shelby cobra was a great car and could kick a$$ and take names but later the car ran into a bottleneck. Aerodynmanicly the car hit a brick wall at 160-165 mph. It obviously had the hp but the body wouldn't alow the car to go any faster. So you could could have sc tc motor in the xB it wouldn't help that much Also, the xB trans has very high gearing. Good idea but bad car to work with.

dude.. please start paying attention to life..

1. the xA is not a show only car. mine for example... walks STi's evos, even viper SRT10's.. on intake, exhaust and iridium densos. keep in mind, this is a driver's race, not boring dragracing..

2. wtf does the shelby cobra have to do with the aerodynamics of a box? are we talking about track racing? 1/4 mile? please tell me what motorsport you're trying to say the xB wouldn't excel at with proper power.. because honestly, there is no need for the xB or xA to hit 165 in true motorsport.. look at the SCCA championship winners for HS racing.. we're talking 1.7 and under, who run like crazy.. cars like mk1 gti golfs, sprite bugeyes, TR1's.. do you think those guys are hitting speeds of 165 at watkins glen, with a lowly 100whp? see that's the problem. speed is relative. power is relative.

3. you mentioned the "sc tc motor going into an xB" .. why would you pick a heavy 2.4l to go int he xB.. do yo not realize that the xB is a toyota, which means ANY engine from toyota (honestly any engine from any make in the WORLD) could go into the xB, $$ being the only factor. why would you limit yourself to an econobox 2.4 from the camry?

4. xB has a high "tranny" ? do yo know what you're saying? first of all, the gearing is actually very short on the xA/B because toyota realized that 1.5L with less than 90WHP would not appeal to the average american, so to combat that, they slapped a shorter final drive in the two cars to make them feel "peppier" .. that's why the xA and B are screaming on the highway.

please do a bit more internet research before you continue to mis-inform the sheep..

that is all

Tamago is the one i kept thinking about lol i recalled seeing you beating faster cars with your xA because of just how it is designed, and upgrading suspension etc...


:clap:

tamago, you are my idol....i totally would take my car auto-x...but i have very little money to spend...booo!

when i upgrade, i usually do several things at once so i won't do something as drastic as a motor swap without making sure the rest of the car is up to par. ie brakes and suspension. i just want to be able to pass other cars easier than i can now.

I don't know about you but with my xb I can pass cars just fine like this weekend I was at exposed in dallas/ft. worth I hung with some tC's for like 2 miles before they eventually took off :come: the only mod I have now is an intake. Obviously I'm not a 1/4 mile star but on the hwy I can handle my own beside it not always power that makes the difference it's the driver look at NASCAR. Would I like power sure, will F/I be in my plans yes, but for now enjoy the fuel economy.

exactly.

Honestly, real power..think of it this way.

We have a 1.5L, 150whp is a 100whp per liter. That is an incredible amount of horse power. It may not be a significant amount of horse power compared to other motors, however, for a mini-motor in a mini-car thats a lot. Will it make you fast? Yes. 1/4 star? No. Autocross, and other cornering auto sport daily driving star? Yes.

In order for the tC to have the same horse power to liter, the tC would have to put down 240whp for it to have a 100whp per liter. Just to give you an example as to how more whp that really is.

As for power to weight, for the xb with a driver it would be 17.3. Thats pretty quick, and with a little weight reduction, just a little, that can go down to a better power to weight. Also, with the right suspension set up, you can really take corners hard without putting too much stress on the car. Not to mention, with our gearing set up, we can take full advantage of that whp.

even 120-130whp the box would be pretty quick, fast for a 1.5l. Enough to definitely earn respect in the mini-motor mini-car tuner world. We can't compare ourselves with the 2.4's, 3.0's, so on when it comes to whp output. We have to stick with our own mini world. However, we can beat 2.4's, 3.0's and so on with the right suspension mods in cornering. Thats our strength, and if you plan on tuning the car thats what you should really focus on. Not 1/4 mile runs.

Anyway, thats my way of looking at it. Hopefully i didn't ramble on. Sort of tired.

Cya

I don't know about you but with my xb I can pass cars just fine like this weekend I was at exposed in dallas/ft. worth I hung with some tC's for like 2 miles before they eventually took off :come: the only mod I have now is an intake. Obviously I'm not a 1/4 mile star but on the hwy I can handle my own beside it not always power that makes the difference it's the driver look at NASCAR. Would I like power sure, will F/I be in my plans yes, but for now enjoy the fuel economy.

sorry i think nascar is not so hot...something about driving around in circles just doesnt appeal to me...plus it takes more talent to drive a road course than an oval....

I dunno but I made some pretty good power to the wheels in my xB...it was enough power to beat out a few tC's, a few integras, a pretty hooked up galant and a turbo civic. If you put a turbo or a s/c on these motors, you have an incredible power to weight ratio, and the car will just fly off the line. Just my .02 and if anyone is thinkin about going f/i I will be more than happy to answer questions...also check out our mini power hungry forum on the top of the page, as you will find some useful information.

I don't know about you but with my xb I can pass cars just fine like this weekend I was at exposed in dallas/ft. worth I hung with some tC's for like 2 miles before they eventually took off :come: the only mod I have now is an intake. Obviously I'm not a 1/4 mile star but on the hwy I can handle my own beside it not always power that makes the difference it's the driver look at NASCAR. Would I like power sure, will F/I be in my plans yes, but for now enjoy the fuel economy.

sorry i think nascar is not so hot...something about driving around in circles just doesnt appeal to me...plus it takes more talent to drive a road course than an oval....
s
Not to flame the meaning of this from my POV is that all the cars are about even so luck and skill needed more than power. Trust me I'm not a nascar fan by a long shot but I do have respect for them after driving around texas motor speedway with my xB :bow:

The drunker I get, the faster it is.

The drunker I get, the faster it is.

good one :rofl:

I don't know about you but with my xb I can pass cars just fine like this weekend I was at exposed in dallas/ft. worth I hung with some tC's for like 2 miles before they eventually took off :come: the only mod I have now is an intake. Obviously I'm not a 1/4 mile star but on the hwy I can handle my own beside it not always power that makes the difference it's the driver look at NASCAR. Would I like power sure, will F/I be in my plans yes, but for now enjoy the fuel economy.

sorry i think nascar is not so hot...something about driving around in circles just doesnt appeal to me...plus it takes more talent to drive a road course than an oval....Someone will probably take this as flaming, but I couldn't agree with you more. I don't doubt that there are talented drivers in NASCAR, many of them drive or have driven other formats as well. But all things being equal, what required more from the driver; left hand turns...or say a hairpin? Rallycross and Grand Touring are where it's at to me. All opinion of course.

To stay on topic though, I think learning to drive well will more likely be a better and cheaper power mod (and often overlooked).

left turn racing is almost as boring as drag racing.. ..

drag racing is alot more fun than left turn. lol

I dont really "like" much of the styles of racing anyway....but even going round and round and round cannot be "easy"

Ive been to one amature race once and I was amazed at how those guys could keep focused, handle the car and still plan the right times to take the inside or outside lanes and make the right moves to pass and such.

Reminds me a lot of Golf, why? I play sports, soccer, softball, tennis....growing up I always thought golf was so stupid and how in the world could it be considered a SPORT.....yeah until I tried it. Trying to put a tiny 2 inch ball into a hole thats 3 inches diameter ....yeahhhhhh ok

Looks can be deceiving!

A better example would be IROC rather than NASCAR. The cars ARE the same and the drivers are the difference.

just something i've been wondering. i see the awesome turbo and sc stuff tc owners are getting and wonder why not the xa or xb? i'm mainly wondering what are the technical problems tuners are having or is it just a lack of interest? is 200 hp on an xa that far fetched?
5th Gen 13-B swap... :lalala:

220 HP and .2 liters less then what you are running now. Just say goodbye to your 40mpg.

Fear the spinning triangle!!

all about the three rotor

just something i've been wondering. i see the awesome turbo and sc stuff tc owners are getting and wonder why not the xa or xb? i'm mainly wondering what are the technical problems tuners are having or is it just a lack of interest? is 200 hp on an xa that far fetched?
5th Gen 13-B swap... :lalala:

220 HP and .2 liters less then what you are running now. Just say goodbye to your 40mpg.

Fear the spinning triangle!!

<3 three rotors, it would definitely be sick to swap. Too bad converting drivetrains suck so much or otherwise i'd do it.

Cya

swap schmap... go all motor..

all motor with this motor? um yeah. lol. best way would be to do cams , some head work , lightweight this , lightweight that. and itbs. a lot of money to go a route which imo would probably not work so much.

all motor with this motor? um yeah. lol. best way would be to do cams , some head work , lightweight this , lightweight that. and itbs. a lot of money to go a route which imo would probably not work so much.

Thats not always true. With the right aftermarket support, you could have the xb at around 120-125whp with an all motor set up. Of course, with the right mods to back it up. RIght now it wouldn't be worth it, because it all has to be custom work and custom gets expensive way too easily.

There are lots of performance parts that are supposed to come out early-mid next year for all motor and boost set ups.
The best way to go with all motor IMO with this car:
4-2-1 header
stage 2 cam
stage 3 clutch
rebuild tranny
ECU upgrade to standalone (all motor, not boost)
Light weight crank pulley
Stroke to 1.6l or 1.7l at most, to keep it safe and daily.
Stage 2 ignition upgrade
port polish
fuel injectors and fuel rail
CAI
Full custom 2.25'' piping exhaust with high flow cats, or no cat at all with either universal muffler or custom to fit the piping and a decent outlet size. I'd probably go with a 90mm tip. muffler.

All of that, should put you easy 130whp. Only problem is, half that stuff isn't out for the 1nz. So having all that custom work, would be an easy $15,000. Worth it? To me, no. Only way to go right now is boost until more stuff comes out. And even then, i'd probably still go with boost then upgrade some things. You generally can always get more whp when you run boost vs. n/a. No matter what you do.

Cya

i don't remember who posted this link, but it's an 1nzfe engine kit....interesting I must say...price...it hurts my soul, I wonder what the gains are?

Toyota Echo 16V DOHC 2000-03
Engine
Code Stock
Bore Includes: Kit #/Price
1NZFE 75mm Complete Gasket Set
Performance Copper Head Gasket
ROSS/Wiseco Forged Pistons
(75, 75.5, 76mm) and
(8.5, 9.0, 9.5, 10.0 comp ratio)
Plasma Moly Rings
TOGA HP Main Bearings
TOGA HP Rod Bearings
Thrust Washers EKTO41MPX
$969

I wonder though...if it can still apply 03+ I swear, if I had tons of money I'd just have my engine taken out and sent to Japan to any of the tuners that participate in the Vitz Cup.

i don't remember who posted this link, but it's an 1nzfe engine kit....interesting I must say...price...it hurts my soul, I wonder what the gains are?

Toyota Echo 16V DOHC 2000-03
Engine
Code Stock
Bore Includes: Kit #/Price
1NZFE 75mm Complete Gasket Set
Performance Copper Head Gasket
ROSS/Wiseco Forged Pistons
(75, 75.5, 76mm) and
(8.5, 9.0, 9.5, 10.0 comp ratio)
Plasma Moly Rings
TOGA HP Main Bearings
TOGA HP Rod Bearings
Thrust Washers EKTO41MPX
$969

I wonder though...if it can still apply 03+ I swear, if I had tons of money I'd just have my engine taken out and sent to Japan to any of the tuners that participate in the Vitz Cup.

Hmm... Whered you pick this information up? Thats cheap.

Cya

yeah it is cheap. but will it be relaible for a regualr car. aka not being broken down and rebuilt after so many odd hours.

yeah it is cheap. but will it be relaible for a regualr car. aka not being broken down and rebuilt after so many odd hours.

When i built the n/a gs-r, i didn't have any problems with very similar mods to my list..and then some. I wouldn't see why it would be different for the 1nz-fe. Smaller motor, less whp gains..But as for reliability, i would imagine you could daily it for years before comming across any sort of issues. So long as everything is tuned correctly, you run premium and everything is working properly.

Cya

cheap? lol, I wish I could say that! here's the link

http://www.importperformanceparts.net/imports/pek-toyota.html

Toyota HP Engine Kits
IPP's High Performance (HP) Engine Rebuild Kits are designed for building motors for expected HP increases above stock. Our kits include everything you need to build and protect your motor from small to large HP ranges and up to 1000 HP (including use of turbochargers, Nitrous, Superchargers or all motor on gas).

the site said this also:
No more wasting time trying to choose the right parts for your application. Our engineering staff has done all the research and hard work for you. Plus, it's all available in a discount priced kit
So I assume that it's reliable...meh...I dunno

hmm i would hope it;s reliable.

i'm guessing they have done any scions or else people would have broken the 150whp mark and NOT blown up or run into mulitple engine management problems. let alone who cares nothing will ever be carb legal which blows total arse.

i'm guessing they have done any scions or else people would have broken the 150whp mark and NOT blown up or run into mulitple engine management problems. let alone who cares nothing will ever be carb legal which blows total arse.

Sucks to be in Cali.

Cya

i was just looking over these kits only good thing about them is pistons if you wanna go lower compression aka lots of boost . that's about it. or a 1mm increase in size. weak.

i've come up with an idea to safeguard cali peeps from hood pops.

and that would beee...?

pm me for details.

i'm guessing they have done any scions or else people would have broken the 150whp mark and NOT blown up or run into mulitple engine management problems. let alone who cares nothing will ever be carb legal which blows total arse.

I wonder if there's a difference in the pre-2003 Echo engine? Has it always had the offset crank? Maybe that's the engine that the swap-talkers are overlooking... Doubtful, but who knows...

just something i've been wondering. i see the awesome turbo and sc stuff tc owners are getting and wonder why not the xa or xb? i'm mainly wondering what are the technical problems tuners are having or is it just a lack of interest? is 200 hp on an xa that far fetched?
5th Gen 13-B swap... :lalala:

220 HP and .2 liters less then what you are running now. Just say goodbye to your 40mpg.

Fear the spinning triangle!!

<3 three rotors, it would definitely be sick to swap. Too bad converting drivetrains suck so much or otherwise i'd do it.

Cya

Hmm...but the ends so justify the means on this one. If only I was rich...
My dream one day is a quad-rotor El Camino...well...more like a converti-rx7 but...
Just think of pulling up to an El Camino and it smokes your but!

The three rotor may not fit in the xA bay without seious mods, not just converting drivetrain. It would be a pain in the but, with the 13B you at least have more room to work with.

I know a guy with a third gen RX7 and a three rotor, he has had it up to like, 180 MPH and just into 5th gear with the windows open... wonder what it can do with the windows up.

cheap? lol, I wish I could say that! here's the link

http://www.importperformanceparts.net/imports/pek-toyota.html

Toyota HP Engine Kits
IPP's High Performance (HP) Engine Rebuild Kits are designed for building motors for expected HP increases above stock. Our kits include everything you need to build and protect your motor from small to large HP ranges and up to 1000 HP (including use of turbochargers, Nitrous, Superchargers or all motor on gas).

the site said this also:
No more wasting time trying to choose the right parts for your application. Our engineering staff has done all the research and hard work for you. Plus, it's all available in a discount priced kit
So I assume that it's reliable...meh...I dunno

I noticed that none of the parts availible on there for the 1NZ-FE will give a single bit of HP for an N/A motor.. :(

We need cams, we need high-comp pistons, we need good fuel management....

are designed for building motors for expected HP increases above stock.

It's prepping it for boost...

[

I noticed that none of the parts availible on there for the 1NZ-FE will give a single bit of HP for an N/A motor.. :(

We need cams, we need high-comp pistons, we need good fuel management....

we need, we need we need..

dude.. a 1nzfe costs 150.. thats less than you spent on that fancy cold air intake you got, or the factory "interior lighting package"...

you see my point? you can buy a longblock 1nzfe for under 300 shipped.. custom high comp pistons and rods, $800, cams $400, head work, $500, valves/springs $400.. under 3000 dollars for a reliable, well built motor. and that's before the 100shot of nitrous you'd be able to run (if the ricer is strong in you) ...

try doing THAT with turbo.. ain't gonna happen.. $/hp, i guarantee NA will make you happier than turbo, mostly because it'll be "sleeper" (yes, i am a ricer).. if you autoX, you'll appreciate a NA build, as you do not get thrown in with the big dogs as long as you do just a displacement increase, valves, and agressive cams.. turbo your egg or box, and you're running against STREET MOD.. UNLIMITED MODS.. 500WHP AWD S4's turbo vipers, sick as hell Evos, STi's etc..

i will be building a 1nzfe before all is said and done. and i'll put those puny turbo/sc kits to shame.

cliffnotes: quit _____ing, go talk to real companies like ARP, Crane, MonkeyWrenchRacing, and see what they'll build.

^^ I want to go the NA route too...any info to get started would be much appreciated!

too bad a built na motor probably wont pass smog yet if you had to smog unlike f/i you cant just unbolt the pieces...

you just have to tune the mixtures right is all and mostly keep a cat on it.

you don't know cali smog.

we need, we need we need..

dude.. a 1nzfe costs 150.. thats less than you spent on that fancy cold air intake you got, or the factory "interior lighting package"...

you see my point? you can buy a longblock 1nzfe for under 300 shipped.. custom high comp pistons and rods, $800, cams $400, head work, $500, valves/springs $400.. under 3000 dollars for a reliable, well built motor. and that's before the 100shot of nitrous you'd be able to run (if the ricer is strong in you) ...

try doing THAT with turbo.. ain't gonna happen.. $/hp, i guarantee NA will make you happier than turbo, mostly because it'll be "sleeper" (yes, i am a ricer).. if you autoX, you'll appreciate a NA build, as you do not get thrown in with the big dogs as long as you do just a displacement increase, valves, and agressive cams.. turbo your egg or box, and you're running against STREET MOD.. UNLIMITED MODS.. 500WHP AWD S4's turbo vipers, sick as hell Evos, STi's etc..

i will be building a 1nzfe before all is said and done. and i'll put those puny turbo/sc kits to shame.

cliffnotes: quit _____ing, go talk to real companies like ARP, Crane, MonkeyWrenchRacing, and see what they'll build.

I'm totaly into N/A buildup. The problem with that is, I'm not going to bankroll prototype parts... Simple as that. I'm a college student, they should have some of this stuff availible already, considering the amount of stuff done to 1NZ-FE's overseas. C-one makes parts for our engines, at least an ECU. If that thing has OBDII compatibility, I would be all over it. Cams seem simple enough, silly that someone hasn't ground some custom ones really. I would imagine with a P&P, cams, high-comp pistons, valve spring/retainers, and fuel management, you could make the engine a real screamer. Considering how much better the INZ-FE is than alot of 4-cyl motors on the market, and it gets almost 0 real parts support, thats pretty sad.

like i said before...if only i had the money to ship my monster of an engine to Japan! oh the wonders they could do....does anybody know BTW how much hp the cars that race in the Vitz Cup are putting out? NA or Turbo?

too bad a built na motor probably wont pass smog yet if you had to smog unlike f/i you cant just unbolt the pieces...

I think you would be alright Darren, especially if you let your ECU learn everything and try to compensate for it...If they are only doing a sniffer test then you should be alright. When your fuel trims get maxed out, dont pull the fuses, and let them test it then. You will have a richer than normal A/F ratio I would say but it should still pass the test.

too bad a built na motor probably wont pass smog yet if you had to smog unlike f/i you cant just unbolt the pieces...

I think you would be alright Darren, especially if you let your ECU learn everything and try to compensate for it...If they are only doing a sniffer test then you should be alright. When your fuel trims get maxed out, dont pull the fuses, and let them test it then. You will have a richer than normal A/F ratio I would say but it should still pass the test.

unfortunately they do a dyno test not just sniff sniff.

Dam man...that sux a lot. I really hope that NY doesnt resort to doing stuff like that but the way everything is going, I wouldnt be surprised if it happens within the next couple of years :nails: :doh:

like i said before...if only i had the money to ship my monster of an engine to Japan! oh the wonders they could do....does anybody know BTW how much hp the cars that race in the Vitz Cup are putting out? NA or Turbo?

Depending on the class of the race, most put out between 170-190whp.

As for cams not being a challenge. Being we have VVT-I, its a huge challenge to just swap cams.

Darren, quit your complaining and just go for it. lol :P

NC has an emissions test, its new. I had to do it last year. (first year they've done it) I believe its just a sniff sniff test, infact, i know it is. I haven't seen any emissions spot with a dyno or high-tech equpitment to use for emissions. *Whew*

Anyway, shipping our motors to japan would be nice. I'd do it if it weren't for the ship there, ship back expense. Not to mention, the cost of all the parts and labor for them to do it. Way too much of a hassle, if i could get the parts over here than thats one thing. However, i haven't found a website with parts i want over in japan. I wish the TRD turbocharger would fit on the USDM 1nz. Its a shame. I saw a bB video of a guy who had a modified TRD turbocharger pushing i believe it was 185whp (in that area) out of the 1.3l. That thing was nice. To my surprise, you could only hear inside the car motor and exhaust until he let off the gas for the nice BOV sound. Love the sound, but i'd love to meet him and find out how they manage to sqeeze so much whp out of a little motor, and still keeping it safe.

I'm used to dealing with 1.8s, 2.0s, 2.2s, 2.4s so on. But 1.5L is a different story. You can consider it a very small regular motor, or a very large mini-motor. I like to think of it as a mini-motor. Just me though.

Well i forgot why i even posted. So i guess i said everything...
Cya

Killerxromances sorry I didnt get back to you the other day, I forgot to sign off on AIM and I came back to the computer with like 10 messages from different people that day hahaha. If you have any questions shoot me a PM and I will try to help out as best as I can.

Killerxromances sorry I didnt get back to you the other day, I forgot to sign off on AIM and I came back to the computer with like 10 messages from different people that day hahaha. If you have any questions shoot me a PM and I will try to help out as best as I can.


haha, its cool man. I didn't have any questions really, just wanted to see what was up. But thanks man, i'll definitely keep you in mind. You've definitely been help to me already, if i can pay back the favor, hit me up and i can answer any questions you might have about something.

Take care,
Cya

if i may ask if you looked at the parts area on the website there where 2 S/C and 1 turbo
that reasonaly priced. wouldn't those get you the hp you are looking for?

if i may ask if you looked at the parts area on the website there where 2 S/C and 1 turbo
that reasonaly priced. wouldn't those get you the hp you are looking for?

If he still wants 200hp to the crank, that would be a 90hp gain off just a sc or a turbo. No company right now has a f/i set up running that much PSI. Definitely not safely.

120whp-130whp is what you will see just adding a s/c or t/c on the 1nz. Doesn't sound like a lot, but trust me, power to weight, gearing, it is. As for the goal of 150whp+. Daily driver? He/she/they/whoever will need to spend an additional $5,000+ on custom parts to keep it reliable. So to answer your question, no.

Cya

Did anyone see that post by ZPI about their crank pulley? It mentions that they will soon have rods and pistons for the 1NZ!!

http://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=92086&highlight=

Did anyone see that post by ZPI about their crank pulley? It mentions that they will soon have rods and pistons for the 1NZ!!

http://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=92086&highlight=

Yep! :clap:

ZPI has been working on their xb now for a while, they will be coming out with a lot of stuff after the 1st of the year.

Cya

just read that nice.

how much do pistons make a difference anyway? bleh i am gonna go do some searching lol

just read that nice.

how much do pistons make a difference anyway? bleh i am gonna go do some searching lol

Considerable difference, especially in the terms of building up a motor. For us, pistons are manditory if you are seaking semi-to-major whp increases.

Do some research, you'll find it on your to do list im sure.

Cya

I'm aiming by the late spring to early summer to have at least 120whp. It's gonna run me a pretty penny to do so, but I believe I can do without the need of a tc/sc kit. I know a fellow at my work that has approached 115whp already with a very simular setup to what I am planning and a good chunk of that from what he claims was the K&N Typoon which pushed it up 5.3whp at a local dyno. I need to get him on this site, his knowledge of the 1nz is incredible and he has only put in so far, $1100 to get those results.

I'm aiming by the late spring to early summer to have at least 120whp. It's gonna run me a pretty penny to do so, but I believe I can do without the need of a tc/sc kit. I know a fellow at my work that has approached 115whp already with a very simular setup to what I am planning and a good chunk of that from what he claims was the K&N Typoon which pushed it up 5.3whp at a local dyno. I need to get him on this site, his knowledge of the 1nz is incredible and he has only put in so far, $1100 to get those results.

Interesting how he got 5.3whp with the typoon alone when i've personally seen a dyno run, with that exact intake dyno 2.9whp. :lalala:

There are tons of people here that have experience with the 1nz, that combined can answer any question thrown at them. Not to put your guy down, but, if he claims 5.3whp i'd like to see the dyno video, or a dyno video of a stock 1nz with just the intake dyno that much whp gain. Otherwise, :no: , sorry.

The most whp gain you are going to get is around 5whp with just an intake, cai for that matter. 5whp is a significant amount when it comes to a 1.5l, stock 86-93whp. Virtually all intakes rate their stuff at around 3-8hp.

If you want 120whp n/a, you can do it. But right now, all custom. $1,100, get real. You will be spending more money than that to get 115whp no matter f/i or not. Unless you get hooked up on items, than i can see it happening..Maybe.

Either way, good luck. Not trying to put your information down or anything, but, yeah... :rofl:

Cya

I'm aiming by the late spring to early summer to have at least 120whp. It's gonna run me a pretty penny to do so, but I believe I can do without the need of a tc/sc kit. I know a fellow at my work that has approached 115whp already with a very simular setup to what I am planning and a good chunk of that from what he claims was the K&N Typoon which pushed it up 5.3whp at a local dyno. I need to get him on this site, his knowledge of the 1nz is incredible and he has only put in so far, $1100 to get those results.

Interesting how he got 5.3whp with the typoon alone when i've personally seen a dyno run, with that exact intake dyno 2.9whp. :lalala:

There are tons of people here that have experience with the 1nz, that combined can answer any question thrown at them. Not to put your guy down, but, if he claims 5.3whp i'd like to see the dyno video, or a dyno video of a stock 1nz with just the intake dyno that much whp gain. Otherwise, :no: , sorry.

The most whp gain you are going to get is around 5whp with just an intake, cai for that matter. 5whp is a significant amount when it comes to a 1.5l, stock 86-93whp. Virtually all intakes rate their stuff at around 3-8hp.

If you want 120whp n/a, you can do it. But right now, all custom. $1,100, get real. You will be spending more money than that to get 115whp no matter f/i or not. Unless you get hooked up on items, than i can see it happening..Maybe.

Either way, good luck. Not trying to put your information down or anything, but, yeah... :rofl:

Cya

Haha, no problem and I fully understand... I haven't "seen" the video or the dyno results myself, i'm still waiting on those. I know K&N only rates it just under 3whp. He works a "second" job at a parts warehouse which is how I assumed he managed to get everything so damn cheap.

I already know i'm looking at around $2200 so far and that is the intake, axle back, perrin pulley's, and some other misc. items that i probably don't even need for the engine itself.

the 1nzfe is a high compression engine as is. raising the compression is getting closer to running a higher octane. simple rule of thumb there is no replacement for displacement. pistons do a make a big difference in a build if done correctly. you can easily make an engine breathe better but sometimes tuning the fuel system more than the factory spec will increase to a higher output result.

like i said before...if only i had the money to ship my monster of an engine to Japan! oh the wonders they could do....does anybody know BTW how much hp the cars that race in the Vitz Cup are putting out? NA or Turbo?

Depending on the class of the race, most put out between 170-190whp.



Erm..nope.

The cars in the Vitz cup are practically stock. There are no major engine modifications. The Vitz Cup was created specifically to be an entry level race series, one that a person without a huge budget could compete in.

You've got to buy a Vitz from Toyota called the Vitz MSB. It's basically a stock Vitz with some improved suspension components,tires, and a rollcage.

Although this is the Echo Cup in Canada, the cars are very much similar.

http://www.echocup.com/car_specs.php

You can see the cars run an AEM intake, B+G springs, Koni Yellow's..parts anyone could buy, really.

The cars in the Vitz cup are not massively built up by JDM tuners, believe me.

EDIT: Found what I was looking for. Here ya go. http://www.autobacsusa.com/feature_story/volume_00/toyota_netz_cup.php

The 1NF was built as a commuter/gas economy motor for a specific line of cars by Toyota. Thus the thin cylinder walls, and funky rod/crank offset/design.

like i said before...if only i had the money to ship my monster of an engine to Japan! oh the wonders they could do....does anybody know BTW how much hp the cars that race in the Vitz Cup are putting out? NA or Turbo?

Depending on the class of the race, most put out between 170-190whp.



Erm..nope.

The cars in the Vitz cup are practically stock. There are no major engine modifications. The Vitz Cup was created specifically to be an entry level race series, one that a person without a huge budget could compete in.

You've got to buy a Vitz from Toyota called the Vitz MSB. It's basically a stock Vitz with some improved suspension components,tires, and a rollcage.

Although this is the Echo Cup in Canada, the cars are very much similar.

http://www.echocup.com/car_specs.php

You can see the cars run an AEM intake, B+G springs, Koni Yellow's..parts anyone could buy, really.

The cars in the Vitz cup are not massively built up by JDM tuners, believe me.

EDIT: Found what I was looking for. Here ya go. http://www.autobacsusa.com/feature_story/volume_00/toyota_netz_cup.php

I stand correctly. I read something about vitz being built up for races, but, i guess that was something else. Oh well.

Cy

ZPI's got All Motor and Turbo applications pistons listed now:

http://www.zeropointindustries.net/store/index.php?cPath=83&osCsid=faccaf795c04691831e00de83ef21704

ZPI's got All Motor and Turbo applications pistons listed now:

http://www.zeropointindustries.net/store/index.php?cPath=83&osCsid=faccaf795c04691831e00de83ef21704

Yep,
n/a = 11:1 compression pistons
f/i = 8:5:1 compression pistrons

THey are not out yet though, their light weight crank pulley is though. I want to get it but i need to pay my credit down first, then go on an intense shopping trip. lol

Cya

newb ???

would pistons help a NA car with i/h/e?

i dont think it would much, just totally curious really lol

Has anyone ACTUALLY blown up an 1nz??? If so, at what WHP where you at?

All these talks of doomsday pushing the block to 150HP just doesn't seem right to me. It's not THAT crazy to imagine a 50% increase in power and having it handle it.

I may be dead wrong, but I would like to see some failure reports before I ever come close to thinking I need $5,000 in custom parts to make 50HP... :lalala:

:nails: :P many blocks out there have taken 100, 150, even 200% increase in power and MORE without failing. I do not see why this would be different.

Many of you say "The rods are weak!" Where is the evidence of this other than it being popular knowlege?

Not dissing anyone.. just want some real input here, not simple speculation.

Has anyone ACTUALLY blown up an 1nz??? If so, at what WHP where you at?

All these talks of doomsday pushing the block to 150HP just doesn't seem right to me. It's not THAT crazy to imagine a 50% increase in power and having it handle it.

I may be dead wrong, but I would like to see some failure reports before I ever come close to thinking I need $5,000 in custom parts to make 50HP... :lalala:

:nails: :P many blocks out there have taken 100, 150, even 200% increase in power and MORE without failing. I do not see why this would be different.

Many of you say "The rods are weak!" Where is the evidence of this other than it being popular knowlege?

Not dissing anyone.. just want some real input here, not simple speculation.

There are tons of accounts with rod failure with 140whp+. The major problem with our motors is the fuel management and ECU management. Piggy backs can only handle so much. Standalones is fine, but not for a daily driver.

150whp is more than a 50% increase. Most xbs/xas dyno between 86-93whp. 150whp is roughly a 60whp increase. Not exact, but thats roughly 60-65% increase in power. Give or take. If you are talking 150hp to the crank, that would be around 120-130whp which, the rods can take. The block can handle that, without any major parts other than what you get in s/cer and t/cer kits.

Once our fuel/ecu problem is fixed, we will then know what the 1nz-fe can handle. My guess is, by this time next year some of us will be breaking into the 170-190whp range. Its not impossible, its just right now all parts have to be custom and thats a lot of $$$ to throw around. ZPI is coming out with plenty of n/a and f/i application parts to back up our problems. We just have to wait and see what happens.

As for blowing up our motors. To make a long, long story short. A friend of mine has a shop in Ga, this guy came in with a xb with a huge, huge turbocharger. The shop warned him its too big and the motor won't handle it. He told them to install regardless of major, certain risk. They managed to get him to sign a contract stating they are not responsible for anything that happens after install. The 1nz survived the dyno run, 197whp with this turbo. Pulled it out. Guy came and picked it up, once he pulled out, guess what happend? Lots of noise, smoke, and a blown motor. More realistically though, i believe one or two have blown their motors around 150-160whp. Mainly due to incorrect tuning and other things surrounding that.

Cya

El Protytpes broke a few. Too bad their site seems to be down. According to their research, from what I recall, the main sticking point was that the crank is offset 3 degrees which helps with economy but makes for a weak point under very much boost. It's the ECHO platform, the MPG is much more important to their overall sales on this platform then HP does.

Estimation of gains needs to be realistic. Just pulling a number out of the air has no basis in reality. How much work do you think the TEAM of Toyota engineers put into getting 100 HP out of this engine? It shouldn't be too hard to double that just because someone else did it on something COMPLETELY different... :roll:

Please, somebody prove me wrong. And don't forget to make it cheap, able to bolt on at home, CARB approved and did I mention cheap? And maybe we can get an even bigger discount if we get a group buy? And of course a bunch of people will need to do it first before anyone will commit to the double-discounted group buy discount. I don't see why companies are falling all over themselves to make parts for us... :roll:

Sorry, it's late...

El Protytpes broke a few. Too bad their site seems to be down. According to their research, from what I recall, the main sticking point was that the crank is offset 3 degrees which helps with economy but makes for a weak point under very much boost. It's the ECHO platform, the MPG is much more important to their overall sales on this platform then HP does.

Estimation of gains needs to be realistic. Just pulling a number out of the air has no basis in reality. How much work do you think the TEAM of Toyota engineers put into getting 100 HP out of this engine? It shouldn't be too hard to double that just because someone else did it on something COMPLETELY different... :roll:

Please, somebody prove me wrong. And don't forget to make it cheap, able to bolt on at home, CARB approved and did I mention cheap? And maybe we can get an even bigger discount if we get a group buy? And of course a bunch of people will need to do it first before anyone will commit to the double-discounted group buy discount. I don't see why companies are falling all over themselves to make parts for us... :roll:

Actually, the echo puts out a little more whp than we do. So toyota didn't try hard at all. lol I'm not saying its impossible to pull 200whp out of the 1nz-fe, it can be done. However, we need tons more aftermarket support before we can even start to plan for something that drastic. Right now, people are trying very hard for 150whp. Spending lots of $$ to do so in the process. Honestly, 200whp would be ridiculously fast for how light we are. Next year should promise big things for us.

Cya

Sorry, it's late...

El Protytpes broke a few. Too bad their site seems to be down. According to their research, from what I recall, the main sticking point was that the crank is offset 3 degrees which helps with economy but makes for a weak point under very much boost. It's the ECHO platform, the MPG is much more important to their overall sales on this platform then HP does.

Estimation of gains needs to be realistic. Just pulling a number out of the air has no basis in reality. How much work do you think the TEAM of Toyota engineers put into getting 100 HP out of this engine? It shouldn't be too hard to double that just because someone else did it on something COMPLETELY different... :roll:

Please, somebody prove me wrong. And don't forget to make it cheap, able to bolt on at home, CARB approved and did I mention cheap? And maybe we can get an even bigger discount if we get a group buy? And of course a bunch of people will need to do it first before anyone will commit to the double-discounted group buy discount. I don't see why companies are falling all over themselves to make parts for us... :roll:

Sorry, it's late...


If someone said it would be easy and cheap to make 150WHP N/A on this motor, I'd be calling them all crazy right with you... but forced induction is different, it WILL make that HP, the only question is how much does it cost, and how reliable is it?

From what I understand, it sounds like most of the issues are with tuning and not the overal strength of the motor. It also sounds like rods fail before anything else. If this is such, with a small motor like this the turbo shouldn't be super expensive and even if the rods must be changed out, that will not add a huge amount more money.

I personally think until the ability to rewrite the code in the ECU exists, this car will be hard to boost past ~4psi.

4psi? people do 6-8 currently without any problems..but yeah you have some good points. not that im Mr Knowledge in this stuff lol just doing reading

what parts would need to be stronger so you could push the psi to 9-12 and have no worries? pistons? what else?

still learning here....what other parts would need to be beefed up to make things less stressed?

seems to me a motor swap would be the most affordable and reliable option. i've pretty much made up my mind to go that route, don't know about anyone else.

seems to me a motor swap would be the most affordable and reliable option. i've pretty much made up my mind to go that route, don't know about anyone else.

I'm with you. I'd rather wait untill EL works out their 4EFTE swap kit, and run that motor. 4E's can take tons of boost thrown at them without a hiccup. Some minor bolt on's will make 170 whp with them quite easily.

Much better ( and cheaper) deal than building up the 1NZ.

Want some proof? Check out this post:

http://www.wheelsjamaica.com/wheels_forum/index.php?topic=10561.0

An exhaust, downpipe, intercooler, used turbo upgrade, and a boost controller netted 180 whp at only 12 psi of boost. And believe me, that engine stock can hold 20 psi of boost without a problem.

good luck passing a swapped motor by new obd II emissions testing though.

I'm from Florida...we don't have to worry about such things here : )

ditto.

ditto x2 :rofl:

hooray for florida!!!!
hahaha

http://www.scionlife.com/parts/?part=10081

i love florida....minus hurricanes

boo california!!!

yeah, Cali can kiss my a$$!

boo california!!!
Hurray beer!!!

mmm beer....i want a guiness now!

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c186/mussersloveshack/DSCN2058.jpg http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c186/mussersloveshack/DSCN2046.jpg http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c186/mussersloveshack/DSCN2067.jpg

Nice set up, i would put some black mesh up front just to make it more of a sleeper, i just love to suprise those who think they are faster...i wish i had forced induction

Its a good enough of a suprise. Plus the blow off valve is Way too loud to try and be a sleeper

what setup are you running?? I sold my turbo box a couple of months ago.

Mussbuss has told me several times custom fab. 6psi turbo. He claims 160whp, with my experience im seriously doubting his numbers, actually im not considering his numbers till i see it for myself.

No offense mussbuss, but you said so your self it wasn't tuned. Get it on the dyno and show us with vid+dyno run. I will apologize if im wrong. :clap: Either way, im sure its pretty quick. 120-130whp on a 2,400lbs car is great.

Cya

i juss put in a weapon-r secret air intake... and boy i can feel the difference in the pull.... funny thing was it was a short ram but from wut saw puttin git on it was working like a cold air... the filter was behind my fender

Sorry, was getting a headache from just page 1 with all the "its a 1.5L you cant get power out of that small of a motor" talk. So far I have seen guys only asking to hit 200hp. Thats not wild thinking. Ive seen MKII MR2's with 2.0T push 800+rwhp AND 800 ft/lb and manage to run 9 sec. 1/4's. Yes the motor needs to have some mods and reinforcement but in time someone someplace will make the parts to create unbelievable power out of these engines too.

the 3sgte is a MUCH better platform than the 1nzfe will ever be

the 3sgte is a MUCH better platform than the 1nzfe will ever be

Check out a few echo/yaris forums. I've seen one 1nz build up in a echo hit 210whp, daily, safely. I've also seen on other forums a few canada yaris's hit 150-170whp, and also some vitz (overseas) hit in the higher 100's without motor swap.

Its very possible. Zpi plans to hit some pretty respectable numbers as well so i hear.

um yeah i 1 don't believe that 210 number and 2 . um yeah the 3sgte kills that number. it can run 400whp daily.

um yeah i 1 don't believe that 210 number and 2 . um yeah the 3sgte kills that number. it can run 400whp daily.

210whp was proven on a echo forum with dyno run, videos, and pictures.

I'm not comparing the 1nz to the 3sgte, obvious the 3sgte is a better platform. But, 1nz isn't hopeless. Just a few major problems/issues to work on and you are home free.

yeah we have one HUGE difference between us and an echo. our 64 bit ecu.......

I didn't bother to read through pages 2,3,4 because it all adds around the same whining talk. But it just seems like so many people kick the 1nz to the curb, there are plenty of things you can do to the motor..but with more HP comes more money and problems. But isn't that what building a motor or even making a car go faster is all about? You gotta be willing to pay the price...if your not, then why even worry about making a car go faster? Swap it, mod it, boost it..all the same thing.
Personaly, i've thought about the prius bottom end b/c of the much higher compression and going all motor...just me though.

Personaly, i've thought about the prius bottom end b/c of the much higher compression and going all motor...just me though.

I have been saying that to people for a really long time now and nobody listens...13.5:1 N/A compression...WTF...why doesnt anybody listen :doh:
Thats a pretty good starting platform if you ask me

the prius motor uses the atkinson cycle.

the prius motor uses the atkinson cycle.

Interesting.

http://www.answers.com/topic/atkinson-cycle

http://www.answers.com/Toyota%20NZ%20engine

it does benefit to be a toyota rep :)

I knew there was something with the Prius gas side that didn't produceas much and that's where the electric side balanced things but not the particulars.

I learned something new, can I go home now?

only if you wipe your desk clean.

the 3sgte is a MUCH better platform than the 1nzfe will ever be

Check out a few echo/yaris forums. I've seen one 1nz build up in a echo hit 210whp, daily, safely. I've also seen on other forums a few canada yaris's hit 150-170whp, and also some vitz (overseas) hit in the higher 100's without motor swap.

Its very possible. Zpi plans to hit some pretty respectable numbers as well so i hear.

Sorry I never got back to you... I left the Scion community online for about 7 months and now have a 06 RS 3

That turbo setup IMHO was the best one I have seen yet. I was running 18 psi at the end and that was for Race only and I could smoke any of your bolt on Honda's, Acura's, Nissan's etc.... I did it mostly to prove that with enough know how and money anything is possible... Yes even with a box. That was a year ago and I have yet to see another box in person that was faster. I am currently just making my rs 3 a comfortable show only car. Bolt on mods will be the only thing that touches this xb untill my warrenty is up and after that the box will be getting a new Motor, tranny, suspension and all!!!!

Correct me if I am wrong and there have been MUCH faster xb's out since I was last around