My car went down about a month and a half ago. Oil spraying all over the engine block below the turbo, oil going into the intake pipe going to my engine. I also had a crack in my manifold. This all happened and talked to kenny. He sent me a new turbo first saying that the oil seals were bad on the turbo. I then noticed the crack in the manifold, i sent that back and got it re-welded by kenny. I got a new turbo, the manifold fixed, and put everything back on. SAME PROBLEM! I put everything back on, retighned to double check. Cranked the engine (taking the fuse out), letting it lube up, then after 4 or 5 trys, put the fuse back in, and started it up. The car barely started and trying to stay alive. I would have to give very little gas to keep it alive and even then the throttle was not responding good at all. Engine was still smoking, i figured it was some oil left on the block i couldn't clean off. I turned off the car, unplugged the battery, waited about five minutes, connected the battery and started the car. The car started better but was not running right at all. Still smoking and oil still spraying. The only thing i can say is that it is the return line itself, or the oil return flange. I did not have a gasket for it so had to go to Advance auto parts, and make my own and also got some sealant for it. I did recieve a new return line but it is wider than my first one and really loose on the flange, im guessing its not the right size sent to me so i used the same one i had. It was about 2 in the morning and about 45 degrees outside (im guessing) and called it a night. My dad is coming to pick me up to take me home for the holidays because my car is still down unless some miracle happens and get it fixed. Im going to give another crack at it when my dad does get here for his help, and hope something good happens. If anyone has any ideas i could use some help right now, i really want my car back and really tired of depending on others for rides.....NEED HELP PLEASE!

What part of tx are you in??? send and email to SGP racing they are located in houston they maybe able to help you out...they do wonders on turbos.

My car went down about a month and a half ago. Oil spraying all over the engine block below the turbo, oil going into the intake pipe going to my engine. I also had a crack in my manifold. This all happened and talked to kenny. He sent me a new turbo first saying that the oil seals were bad on the turbo. I then noticed the crack in the manifold, i sent that back and got it re-welded by kenny. I got a new turbo, the manifold fixed, and put everything back on. SAME PROBLEM! I put everything back on, retighned to double check. Cranked the engine (taking the fuse out), letting it lube up, then after 4 or 5 trys, put the fuse back in, and started it up. The car barely started and trying to stay alive. I would have to give very little gas to keep it alive and even then the throttle was not responding good at all. Engine was still smoking, i figured it was some oil left on the block i couldn't clean off. I turned off the car, unplugged the battery, waited about five minutes, connected the battery and started the car. The car started better but was not running right at all. Still smoking and oil still spraying. The only thing i can say is that it is the return line itself, or the oil return flange. I did not have a gasket for it so had to go to Advance auto parts, and make my own and also got some sealant for it. I did recieve a new return line but it is wider than my first one and really loose on the flange, im guessing its not the right size sent to me so i used the same one i had. It was about 2 in the morning and about 45 degrees outside (im guessing) and called it a night. My dad is coming to pick me up to take me home for the holidays because my car is still down unless some miracle happens and get it fixed. Im going to give another crack at it when my dad does get here for his help, and hope something good happens. If anyone has any ideas i could use some help right now, i really want my car back and really tired of depending on others for rides.....NEED HELP PLEASE!

First....if you cap the oil pan line and the vacuum taps...you can have your stock system back on within 2 hours. The turbo lifts out in 1 piece. That is if you kept the old exhaust manifold and intake.

You really need to find out where the oil is spraying from. Can you clean up all the oil and take some pics for us? Top, bottom, oil lines, charge pipe, etc. Nice big pics.
Where is the oil spraying from?

Have you tried ZPI/Kenny? I know others have been able to give him a ring on days off for urgent help

If your oil return line is loose like that, you will definatly have some leaks. You need to make sure you have at least a dash 10 line for the return side as well. Otherwise, you'll end up with blown seals in the turbo again. Aren't you the second one to have seal problems or did I hear that about you in another thread?

Charles

I think its all in the EVO III GT Turbo, Buy a Real MHI Evo B16g, that knock off turbo is junk IMO. Its a cheap turbo, but spend the money and get a real one.

My 2 cents.

I am the same guy with the blown seals. What do you mean by having a dash 10 line?? The thing is not loose, its tight as hell, Ill have more info tomorrow, going back at it at 8 in the morning.

Dash 10 line is the size of the oil line. I think it's equivalent to 5/8 but I could be wrong. Make sure there are no dips or kinks in the oil return line also.

I did recieve a new return line but it is wider than my first one and really loose on the flange, im guessing its not the right size sent to me so i used the same one i had.

This was what I was referring to. I thought you had the second one on there and it was to loose. If the line is to small, or if you have to much gasket maker on the flanges, and you accidentally block the drain hole, then you can cause a backup and result in blow turbo seals. Especially since only one side of the oiling system is pressurized.

Charles

The seals on the turbo you sent us did not look that bad. We sent you another turbo just for good service.
If there is oil spraying we need to know where it is coming from. We can't fix want we can't see.

I do not think that the oil leak is related to the car not wanting to run. It sounds as if you have a vacum leak some where. Check the o ring in the BOV this has been a common over looked piece.

We changed to -12 oil lines we must have sent you a new one line. We still have -10 line if you need a new one give us a call.

Check the oil fitting at the head. This is pressurized it can cause a spraying if not tightened correctly.

We are open tomorrow give me a call i will be there at 10

-Kenny

i had idling problems when i installed, in fact i still have some. when i first installed, i used silicon hosing because i thought the blue would cool. not a good idea. the hoses are too malleable and crimp when in vacuum. switch out to rubber with steel braided and the idling improves so much. so now my idle is ok, but fluctuates some when idle, and stalls if i dont downshift into first. hopefully ZPI's drilled antifoulers will take care of the CEL, which might also be affecting the idle. does anyone know if CELs affect idle? anyway, thats what i can tell you about the idle and it running more properly.

i had idling problems when i installed, in fact i still have some. when i first installed, i used silicon hosing because i thought the blue would cool. not a good idea. the hoses are too malleable and crimp when in vacuum. switch out to rubber with steel braided and the idling improves so much. so now my idle is ok, but fluctuates some when idle, and stalls if i dont downshift into first. hopefully ZPI's drilled antifoulers will take care of the CEL, which might also be affecting the idle. does anyone know if CELs affect idle? anyway, thats what i can tell you about the idle and it running more properly.
You know I think ScionDad was experiencing this and he switched to a colder plug and everything was fine after that. Give that a try.

i had idling problems when i installed, in fact i still have some. when i first installed, i used silicon hosing because i thought the blue would cool. not a good idea. the hoses are too malleable and crimp when in vacuum. switch out to rubber with steel braided and the idling improves so much. so now my idle is ok, but fluctuates some when idle, and stalls if i dont downshift into first. hopefully ZPI's drilled antifoulers will take care of the CEL, which might also be affecting the idle. does anyone know if CELs affect idle? anyway, thats what i can tell you about the idle and it running more properly.
You know I think ScionDad was experiencing this and he switched to a colder plug and everything was fine after that. Give that a try.

Yeah, that helped BIG TIME....but I think it also helps we have an automatic.

I hear of this issue on the manual shifts (more noticeable). This is due to the BOV being atmospheric and not recirculated. When the throttle plate closes from boost, the MAF already seen the airflow and the ECU adjusted for the fuel to expect that air...well the air never shows up and pig rich happens....car stalls.

That's a hard trade off:
Have better idle with recirculating Blow Off Valve or Cool sounding Whoopshhhhhhhhh! :P

What about one of those dual-vent BOV's? The ones that vent to atmosphere AND recirc. Sounds like the best of both worlds.

WE are not sure the problem is that the idling problem is not consistent acorss the board. We have customers that have the problem and customers that do not. We have seen a lot of the problem is with the BOV gasket not being installed correctly. There is defintly a potential issue with the car under load and the throwing it in neutral. This is not always able to be duplicated though. We are looking into other options.

What about one of those dual-vent BOV's? The ones that vent to atmosphere AND recirc. Sounds like the best of both worlds.

Yeah, I've looked for something along those lines...but the only thing I have found is this guy and it's near $400. You can adjust it....not the most attrective thing either, but a cool idea.

http://www.lltek.com/DBOV_turbo_divertor_blowoff.htm

Well me and my dad went at it again and re-did everything with turbo. Took it off, put the oil line back on, looked good then got a mirror had the car idle and saw oil dripping out of the clamp that holds the turbo together. We call kenny and tells us there is a pin we should remove that might not be able to let the turbo align right. Took it out after taking the turbo apart, put it back on, same problem. Called kenny back said there is another pin on the other side that we could take out to help it align. This one looked like it could of been the problem but no luck, still spraying oil. Called kenny back, he says the oil seals probably went bad again and now i have to send it off to the company of the turbos in houston which is 3 hours away from me. It has been a frustrating time with my car, the car ran good for a while the first time installed and didn't remove any kind of pins or anything. It had nothing to do with the return line, it runs straight to turbo, no kinks or anything. The gaskets on the wastegate also blew off immediately and will have to buy new ones again. I read in another thread that the zpi sells copper ones that will never go bad or something. Anyways, i reall want my car back, even if it is stock, just need something to drive. It is just a lack of tools and the fact my stock parts are at home in Corpus Christi. I really want to keep my car turbo because i have had a sample of it already, but so many are telling me to get rid of it and worry about the car because its brand new. I am just hoping this next time with the rebuilt turbo that the car is back to normal and ill be posting some videos and pics and get back to more mods. I have a wideband and emanage sitting in my room wanting to be put on but no car to drive. Sciondad, did you do any adjustments to your turbo when you put it on, any advice you can give me?? you got the kit running good and just need some help.

:shock: :eyes: Wow

man if i were you taking that turbo off so many times i would put it back to stock and start it up if it runs good then you know its turbo set up if not you have internal issues and start looking for a motor :doh: :doh: :doh:

ENGINE* problems dont cause a turbo to leak oil from the center section.

Charles

yea, im pretty sure its not the engine, dont want to jinx myself, but its bad because the turbo is throwing oil everywhere and into my throttle body.

I can't undertsnad how the 2nd one is doing the same thing.

Well, I took my turbo apart to send it off for coating and then to clock it...removing the pins. Putting it back together is fun. The pieces go together pretty firmly and 4 hands help. Other than that...I can't understand why it would be leaking where the turbo goes together.

Make sure the C ring is in there properly. There is a groove it fits into. It may still sit in there like it is holding, but the turbo is not together.

You didn't by chance mix up where the oil feed line and the return line bolt up did you? If you did that will blow the seals and do exactly what you are describing. My buddy did that by accident one time (not his car, was another friend's car that we put a custom kit on)...it was a 16g and did the EXACT same thing you are describing.

No one even thought of that... probally what it is.

This is interesting :shock:

The holes are far to different to have backwards I would think. The oil return flange will not bolt to the feed side. Its almost impossible to do.

Charles

At this point....TAKE SOME PICTURES :pray:

All the connection points.

The holes are far to different to have backwards I would think. The oil return flange will not bolt to the feed side. Its almost impossible to do.

Charles

I can't remember exactly how it is set up but it can't be impossible, but one friend did it. Then when he upgraded to a bigger turbo and sold that one on ebay the person who bought it did the same thing and tried to get a new turbo from him, he asked for pictures of the install and sure enough the lines were put on backwards....had a whole claim with paypal and everything, he ended up not having to give money back or a new turbo cause it was installed incorrectly. The problem if I remember is that he clocked the turbo 180 degree's to fit the way he needed it to and that reversed the ports and was opposite of other 16g's. Well...the ports aren't actually reversed from that, but just in different spots relative to the intake part of the turbo compared to a regular 16g.

Here is what im saying. The oil in side is one hole, that is threaded. Per picture below.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c40/turbocustomz/oilin.jpg


The oil out side is a non threaded hole with two threaded holes on either side of it. Per picture below.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c40/turbocustomz/oilout.jpg



With the return line flange, it can only go on the side its supposed to go on. As you can see.

Charles

Edit, Sorry for the crappy quality of this pics. They are from my camera phone. That is the exact turbo that comes with the ZPI kit btw.

The problem is when you do not remove the pins the center cartridge can not line up. After reveiwing the turbo that was sent back to us we determined this is the same situation that caused the first one to fail.

The first time this was installed this was our fault as there where no instruction.

Julio, We are 100% sure that getting this rebuilt will fix your problem. When the selas are losing oil like this it can fry a turbo in 10sec. I think that we just got lucky the first time that it lasted as long as it did.

-Kenny

The problem is when you do not remove the pins the center cartridge can not line up. After reveiwing the turbo that was sent back to us we determined this is the same situation that caused the first one to fail.

The first time this was installed this was our fault as there where no instruction.

Julio, We are 100% sure that getting this rebuilt will fix your problem. When the selas are losing oil like this it can fry a turbo in 10sec. I think that we just got lucky the first time that it lasted as long as it did.

-Kenny

:shock:

Well, that explains the problem for sure. If you don't remove those pins, it will not seal and actually sit cockeyed in the housing.

One thing for sure in the directions guys (I do know the turbo comes with a note saying it needs to be clocked different than factory)...if you don't understand what something means or how it is to be done....ask.

I'm impressed it worked as long as it did the first time.

Now I remember that I've seen pics. On the single threaded side he put in a threaded barb to attatch the hose with a hose clamp instead of using a banjo fitting. And my other friend didn't know which was which and just attatched the lines....wasn't pretty :nope: .

Man if i would of known that from the start i would have a running car right now. I did not have the instructions when i first put it on and it ran fine so i figured it was a dud turbo and just put the new one as is (only because the previous one had worked fine). I did not really read the instructions once they were finally put up, but i think it would be good for zpi just to take them out before shipping them out. The process only took about 5-10 minutes and would probably save zpi and the customer some money. But i guess since the instructions are up people can will know it. We did notice the turbo fit better once those pins were out (unless it was my imagination and hope). But anyways i guess i gotta get this turbo rebuilt and the car will be put back to stock on friday morning after we tow my car back to corpus christi. I just need a car bad now and once its fixed i can make it back to turbo. I'll talk to kenny to see what my next steps should be to getting it rebuilt.

That really sux that those instructions weren't up before you put the turbo in. How to clock the turbo is really something I wanna figure out how to do before I try to install my kit. Just sux that there's no pics of how to do it. :cry:

That really sux that those instructions weren't up before you put the turbo in. How to clock the turbo is really something I wanna figure out how to do before I try to install my kit. Just sux that there's no pics of how to do it. :cry:

Really a piece of cake. The pieces pull apart following below. Remove the bolt and ring clamp, exhaust side comes off. There is a pin between the two, remove it.

Remove the snap ring, pull the intake/charge side apart. see where the pin sticks thru in the small opening...remve it.


http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y47/kirchwrk/housing.jpg

Well I know how to take those pins out now but did not know about it because i never had instructions in the first place. The car ran fine the first time so i figured it was just a dud turbo and put this one back on the same as the other one as it ran fine. Now the turbo is messed up and kenny says i need to rebuild it. I hear it cost more money to rebuild and should just buy a new one. I took my car to toyota because i put my car back to stock and the car still didnt run right. We took it and they noticed the MAF sensor was messed up and replaced that. They then noticed the throttle body, spark plugs and wires were also messed up and needed to be fixed. This turbo kit is just costing me more money day by day and just want to get rid of it. Oh yea my oil pan is also leaking, toyota informed me friday. So i now i have to put my stock oil pan back on, the funnest part of the install. So looking back from the beginning i got the turbo kit late like everyone, got the kit incomplete ( no bolts and oil return flanges and the other flange on top of the turbo came later), oil seals go bad on turbo, manifold cracks, MAF sensor goes bad, throttle body goes bad, spark plugs and wires go bad, new turbo is messed up as well, im also boosting 8.5 psi for some reason (maybe wrong wastegate??) I think that is it right now, unless you wanna add that i havent had a car in 2 months. So from day one i have had nothing but problems with this turbo kit from not having the bolts to worthless turbos. My car is still at toyota and i am in a different city car-less. I really dont want to put this turbo kit back on my car with my luck that i have been having. Nothing has gone right since day one and i dont think it is meant to be for me. Even if i do rebuild the turbo and kenny says he is 100% positive that the little pins caused these problems, i still feel very nervous putting it back on my car and have something else go wrong. So as one of the first zpi turbo kit customers, that has been my story. Now i do want to clear up that im not flaming zpi or anything, i do appreciate that they are the company producing parts for the tc and all and i love the crew over there at zpi, all have been very helpful and nice. I simply wanted to state my experiece.

You do realize that all of the issues are the result of a not-done-right install... despite whether you had no instructions or had instructions, you CANNOT shortcut on these kinds of things... If you don't know how to do it and you don't properly test and re-test a turbo for fitment and leaks... OF COURSE problems are going to happen... This is why I run my backup 72 beatle, so when I'm doing mods, I can invest the time to check and recheck everything... and if something isn't right, shut my car down for a week or two to get it there...

I'm sorry to hear your experience, BUT....

My frustration lately is with Scion "Tuners", who think that turbo installs and higher end engine modifications don't share some kind of risk and aren't always plug and play... If you are going to go anything other than N/A, expect some kind of tweaking and especially know exactly what you are doing... if you even attempt to do it outside of a shop... Even TRD played with their SC setup for a whole year or more, before getting it right, and it's still not the best thing to install outside of a dealer...

Since we have only one real TC setup out there right now and ready to go... you MUST expect the things and tweaks that go along with it...

I'm just not a fan on unrealistic expectations when it comes to the turbo market.... you must realise that you are mounting a turbine to your exhaust, spinning it at insane speeds and forcing air into an engine.... it's complicated and a million little items can compound very quickly to make it go wrong... ESPECIALLY if it was installed incorrectly, which this seems to be the case...

Bummer the first stages of the turbo game for the tC take out a few cars for a while... but, that's the game... anyone who thinks its simple and risk free, isn't being honest.

well said!!!

My frustration lately is with Scion "Tuners", who think that turbo installs and higher end engine modifications don't share some kind of risk and aren't always plug and play... If you are going to go anything other than N/A, expect some kind of tweaking and especially know exactly what you are doing... if you even attempt to do it outside of a shop... Even TRD played with their SC setup for a whole year or more, before getting it right, and it's still not the best thing to install outside of a dealer...

Since we have only one real TC setup out there right now and ready to go... you MUST expect the things and tweaks that go along with it...

I'm just not a fan on unrealistic expectations when it comes to the turbo market.... you must realise that you are mounting a turbine to your exhaust, spinning it at insane speeds and forcing air into an engine.... it's complicated and a million little items can compound very quickly to make it go wrong... ESPECIALLY if it was installed incorrectly, which this seems to be the case...


Werd....I have been tryin to tell people this for I dont know how long now...seems to be the new breed of "tuners"...this "lets turn up the boost and go" attitude has got to go...its gone way to out of hand

You are telling me something i already know. i know there was an error in install, the pins werent removed. If i would of known i would have done it. Im not "turning up the boost" or whatever yall think. Im not some turbo genius but i have my resources for help as well. When i bought this kit it was sold as "complete bolt on kit". They were going to send it with emanage for tuning but decided the stock ecu can handle it. Im not turning any boost up or whatever yall think, that was the wastegate it came with. I already know it was an error in install, i simply was telling my experiences. What i do want to know is how much is it to rebuild a 16g turbo? just an estimate would help.

I have a 16g turbo that you can buy. It is used, as I had it on my car for about 3K miles or less. PM me if you are interested.

On another note, the rebuild kit is around 135 dollars, but then you have to pay someone to do it. I don't recommend that you do it yourself as you need some special tools and its easy to mess it up.

Charles

P.S. If any of you are hitting 8.5psi on the stock ecu, pull over, shut off your car, get out and walk to where ever it was you are going because that is going to be what you are doing eventually anyway.

lol!

I have a 16g turbo that you can buy. It is used, as I had it on my car for about 3K miles or less. PM me if you are interested.

On another note, the rebuild kit is around 135 dollars, but then you have to pay someone to do it. I don't recommend that you do it yourself as you need some special tools and its easy to mess it up.

Charles

P.S. If any of you are hitting 8.5psi on the stock ecu, pull over, shut off your car, get out and walk to where ever it was you are going because that is going to be what you are doing eventually anyway.

Ain't that the truth :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Wowguy, sorry, I wasnt directing the comment to you, just saying in general.

You are telling me something i already know. i know there was an error in install, the pins werent removed. If i would of known i would have done it. Im not "turning up the boost" or whatever yall think. Im not some turbo genius but i have my resources for help as well. When i bought this kit it was sold as "complete bolt on kit". They were going to send it with emanage for tuning but decided the stock ecu can handle it. Im not turning any boost up or whatever yall think, that was the wastegate it came with. I already know it was an error in install, i simply was telling my experiences. What i do want to know is how much is it to rebuild a 16g turbo? just an estimate would help.


I totally feel your pain, the same thing happend to me, and currently am waiting for the rest of my parts to attempt my install. I know I'm not a turbo expert, and totally went into this turbo install knowing there might be possible leaks or issues. I got my stage 0 with the mindset that everything I needed was in the box, bolts, parts, ect. It took me one failed install, broke the incorrect bolt "too long" while installing the wastegate to the manifold. Luckily this happened becuase I never removed any pins from the turbo as well, there were no directions, and not even a parts list of what the kit contained. Anyway I had to get the manifold machined, wastegate was missing the vacuum fittings, also had to get the correct bolts for the wastegate, also I got a cheap blue filter came with the kit, that doesn't fit. I was told that I recieved the worng one, when I questioned it's fitment. I'm still wating if the correct one which "looks like a k & n" who knows when or if that will come? Anyway I think ZPI needs to make things more clear if thay are marketing this turbo as a all-in-one bolt on kit. I don't think it would be that hard to take a few pics during one of their installs to outline what clocking is, or how things should look. Luckily there are people like sciondad, and others who post pics and fixes for many of the issues those of us are experiencing with our "bolt on" stage 0 kits.

Verum vadum paro vos solvo.


Does anyone have a dyno chart with the a/f from a stage 0 kit?

That really sux that those instructions weren't up before you put the turbo in. How to clock the turbo is really something I wanna figure out how to do before I try to install my kit. Just sux that there's no pics of how to do it. :cry:

Really a piece of cake. The pieces pull apart following below. Remove the bolt and ring clamp, exhaust side comes off. There is a pin between the two, remove it.

Remove the snap ring, pull the intake/charge side apart. see where the pin sticks thru in the small opening...remve it.


http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y47/kirchwrk/housing.jpg
:bow: :bow: Thanks so much.

You are telling me something i already know. i know there was an error in install, the pins werent removed. If i would of known i would have done it. Im not "turning up the boost" or whatever yall think. Im not some turbo genius but i have my resources for help as well. When i bought this kit it was sold as "complete bolt on kit". They were going to send it with emanage for tuning but decided the stock ecu can handle it. Im not turning any boost up or whatever yall think, that was the wastegate it came with. I already know it was an error in install, i simply was telling my experiences. What i do want to know is how much is it to rebuild a 16g turbo? just an estimate would help.


I totally feel your pain, the same thing happend to me, and currently am waiting for the rest of my parts to attempt my install. I know I'm not a turbo expert, and totally went into this turbo install knowing there might be possible leaks or issues. I got my stage 0 with the mindset that everything I needed was in the box, bolts, parts, ect. It took me one failed install, broke the incorrect bolt "too long" while installing the wastegate to the manifold. Luckily this happened becuase I never removed any pins from the turbo as well, there were no directions, and not even a parts list of what the kit contained. Anyway I had to get the manifold machined, wastegate was missing the vacuum fittings, also had to get the correct bolts for the wastegate, also I got a cheap blue filter came with the kit, that doesn't fit. I was told that I recieved the worng one, when I questioned it's fitment. I'm still wating if the correct one which "looks like a k & n" who knows when or if that will come? Anyway I think ZPI needs to make things more clear if thay are marketing this turbo as a all-in-one bolt on kit. I don't think it would be that hard to take a few pics during one of their installs to outline what clocking is, or how things should look. Luckily there are people like sciondad, and others who post pics and fixes for many of the issues those of us are experiencing with our "bolt on" stage 0 kits.


Well i didnt know this had happened with others, thought i was the only one. Well im sorry to hear about your kit sounds like we have the same waiting game going on. Well i did pretty much the whole time with my kit, now i am just waiting to see what is going to happen with this turbo. Kenny says for me to go get it rebuilt and pay for it, but my parents nor my friend will let me pay saying its not my fault. I am pretty short on money now with the holidays and this car not wanting to run. But anyways sad to hear there is another person in another same situation. By the way the filter is a k&n filter, i dont know what the whole blue filter thing is. But good luck with your situation.

Welcome to the world of car mods guys. You learned the hard way and I hope it serves as a good example that if you don't know anything about serious modifications, you need to stick to TRD exhausts and stock superchargers. ZPI is new company with new products that they are trying to bring to this market as fast as they can (more successfully then others); therefore, there is no way to avoid small kinks and problems. Add the fact that certain individuals decide to install parts themselves instead of paying professionals to do it. :lalala:

Pay for the rebuild... it's the product of an incorrect install... If a pro shop did it, they would pay for the rebuild, as they'd be responsible for making the mistake in the install... that's why it's best to have pro shops handle even "Bolt-On" kits... you get an installation gaurentee...

Since the product failure is the result of an install nor performed correctly, the individual performing the install should be responsible for the repair... which unfortunately is, you...

Thus, the life of a tuner.... start playing with Turbos and fun stuff and these things are bound to happen.... unfortunate that some are not prepared to spend the cash to be on the front-lines...

Give it a year.... it'll all be good... and then you'll see me move from a tuned N/A to FI...

Lesson learned for others as well I hope....

I understand that it was installed incorrectly, we declared numerous times in this thread. I think anyone would of done the same thing though. There was no instructions when putting the turbo on the first time, i talked to kenny numerous times when installing it and he never told me during the process to take the pins out the first install. That right there messed up my car from the start with oil circulating through my car already messing up my wires, spark plugs and throttle body. That was said at toyota. Kenny sends me a new turbo and doesn't tell me that i left the pins on the other one and that was the problem, he told me he really didn't know how the first turbo messed up. Once the second one messed up and then finally asked about the pins he said that was the reason for the first. The car ran fine for about 2 months the first time (with the pins in the turbo) and nothing went bad. So any normal person would figure that the turbo just went bad and put the new one on the same way. It worked the first time, why wouldn't it work the second time right?? fine error in install, but i would not say its totally my fault. lesson learned is that yea dont be the first to install a turbo kit without instructions and just be the guinea pig. Your car goes down and only others get to learn off it and to keep your car running, pray you got deep pockets.

That's why the trailblazers are usually the ones with deep pockets....

Turbos are expensive and they tend to cause expensive problems... those who know this... we're patient... I'll let the kinks get worked out and come in from behind....

I'd consider yourself pretty lucky with such a cheap fix on this... but still think it would be cool if kenny just hooked you up on it for solely PR reasons...

Sorry to be hard on you... but the modification game is not always friendly price wise and you really do have to be prepared for anything, including how much that anything costs...

Mine and others toughness comes from seeing a lot of recent Scion Owners jumping in over their heads and seeing things go wrong... No one likes to see that happen, and that's why we all suggest getting things done at pro-shops....

I hope your turbo rebuild goes well and that you can get things up and running good soon...

That's why the trailblazers are usually the ones with deep pockets....

Turbos are expensive and they tend to cause expensive problems... those who know this... we're patient... I'll let the kinks get worked out and come in from behind....

I'd consider yourself pretty lucky with such a cheap fix on this... but still think it would be cool if kenny just hooked you up on it for solely PR reasons...

Sorry to be hard on you... but the modification game is not always friendly price wise and you really do have to be prepared for anything, including how much that anything costs...

Mine and others toughness comes from seeing a lot of recent Scion Owners jumping in over their heads and seeing things go wrong... No one likes to see that happen, and that's why we all suggest getting things done at pro-shops....

I hope your turbo rebuild goes well and that you can get things up and running good soon...

Exactly. :bow:

If wowguy was in my neck of the woods, I would certainly help him out. I had a guy help me decades ago when I was learning the hard way. I probably would have stopped and never stayed in it if not for him. Now, if I could go back in time...I would probably kick his a$$ for keeping me in this. :rofl: j/k

^^^ i know who to go to when i go turbo...lol, but i am also reading books like maximum boost to help me understand a bit more about turbos.

^^^ i know who to go to when i go turbo...lol, but i am also reading books like maximum boost to help me understand a bit more about turbos.

Come on over....it's what...2 hour drive? :clap:

I dont understand how you all can be"hey you installed it and its all your fault" yeah it would have been his fault if he just followed instruction and tried to shortcut something and it messed up. I mean comeon zpi boasts how the kit is a bolt on and that any person with some mechanical knowledge can get it on no prob, now i dont know about you guys but when a company whose turbo kit iam buying says that I exepct it to be true because that influences your choice in what kit to buy.

So in my opinion zpi not providing the correct instruction and boasting that their kit is completely bolt on and how peopel can save money on labor, they come out to be at fault.

I dont understand how you all can be"hey you installed it and its all your fault" yeah it would have been his fault if he just followed instruction and tried to shortcut something and it messed up. I mean comeon zpi boasts how the kit is a bolt on and that any person with some mechanical knowledge can get it on no prob, now i dont know about you guys but when a company whose turbo kit iam buying says that I exepct it to be true because that influences your choice in what kit to buy.

So in my opinion zpi not providing the correct instruction and boasting that their kit is completely bolt on and how peopel can save money on labor, they come out to be at fault.

Well, it goes either way. ZPI did already send him another turbo. On the other hand, yeah, maybe they could rebuild the 2nd one for him and he pays for the parts and not the labor kinda thing.....

However, there is also some responsibility of the installer to actually "know" enough to be doing it. At least enough to say hey, how can I actually "clock" this thing right if this pin is in the friggin way. Or...what does clocking actually mean and I want to know in detail.

There is some other issues as well. He stated he now has an oil pan leaking. That has nothing to do with ZPI, unless.....it is leaking at the bung weld. Then that falls under warranty.

ZPI is a stand up company with very fair business people running it. Wowguy sounds like a fair minded man and I'm sure both of them can find middle ground that is fair. I would really hate to see him not stay turbo when it's less than $200 in parts and some rebuild skills. Maybe there is middle ground?

Dude, I think that its a sign from a higher power. Get your money back from ZPI and just get the SC. With all of the time and frustration you are having, would'nt you rather just have the 200 horses and a warranty on a car that you can drive. Last time I checked the 88 camaro on blocks in front of my house was not reeling the women in. Just a thought.

hm i do agree with you that compromise is the best way here i just dong agree with zpi not doing anything to help him not because its their fault but because they right ontheir site that its completely bolt on that means that they expect people to put it on themselves therefor you should write the proper directions for everything making. Saying that even a person with avergae machanic skills can do this and then not writing directions isnt right.

Anyways yeah common ground should be found perhaps not for zpi to pay for everything but help out somehow since it is Partly their fault and partly wowguyz fault.

Hm.. I dont know if i necessarily agree with the statement that you should give up on the turbo, trial and error. You should figure out your goals and see which is better. I personaly like both systems, but for me a sc might be a slightly better idea because of the easier install and less hassle with maintance ( not that iam lazy, iam learning) this is my first tunning car, hehe someone with a very nice turbo car is covincing me towards turbos though

Absolutely, but tuning should not be done per-se on ones daily driver, or only mode of transportation. I ran into this problem myself. In fact that is one of the reasons that I decided to go with the Tc. You can get a lot of power and fun that you can use everyday. I sold my 300+ hp Trans Am, to buy the Tc, largely because 13 MPG is no fun and having carbeurator problems almost every month is also a serious drag. As far as the SC, remember that you get the warranty and daily driver function. With turbos (aftermarket) you are rolling the dice if the car is your daily ride. However, no pain no gain as they say and lets face it a well functioning turbo would be a heck of a lot of fun on a Tc. Good luck and just remember to think with your best interests in mind.

yes absolutely with the daily driver in mind. I use to think that man I can make a 400 hp monster haha that was before i read up a lot and understand more. My goal is 300 hp that I wil be running at the track and also that is my daily driver. One question about the whole daily driver thing, what about a boost controler? anda unichip? cant i use the boost control to ride aroun with say 6 psi, and use one map on the unichip? but for the track witha build up ofcourse run teh car at 8-10 psi and have a diff fuel map on the unichip that way gas mileage isnt as much of a problem? am I speaking nonsense if so just correct me lol iam new to this.

While I do agree, when you have a kit that is "bolt on" and works "fine", to someone who doesn't know better - it's easy to buy something and find its a whole other ball game.

This happend w/ my last car and its turbo. Nothing was as bolt on as they claimed and they had ____-poor instructions with the kit and provided crappy support. A little different situation, I know.

The reason you pay someone all this cash for a kit is so you don't have crazy issues - other wise I can piece together a kit myslef and jack my ____ up for much less $$ :)

It's not that simple.... changes in altitude also effect fuel maps.... so... unless you live in flatlands and only travel in flatlands.... to pull almost double the horsepower out of a car, kind-of pushes the daily driver hassle-free limit....

I still think that Beginner tuners should give things more time before jumping into the hard-core modifications.... there are plenty of other places to start and you will have increased maintenence and down time with ANY setup other than the SC, as it's built down solely for the ability for it to be used on Daily Drivers.... I have the strange feeling that as people start turning up boost and tweaking the SC setup outside of it's stock settings, that other "Issues" will arise as well...

You must pay the price to be on the front-lines....

BTW, The kit is bolt on.... if you bolt it on... CORRECTLY

and to do it correctly you need CORRECT DIRECTIONS, anyways ways for the advice, but what would be these begginer modifications? if you mean the regular i/h/e setup i mean comeon that would get boring and annoying real fast and youll want to upgrade. In my opionion (and I use that loosely since its based on opinions of others) You can run 8 psi pretty safely with some forged pistons an intercooler, a managing systems and maintaine a daily driver. I mean look at the sti 14-17 psi boost daily driver. Yeah yeah the engine is built for the abuse but also we arent running 17 psi.

If you want a 300+ horsepower daily driver you are going to have to up the cylinders. I would have to "see to believe" a 300 horsepower daily driver with 4 cylinders that didnt cost someone 70k. Sure they are out there, but you cannot realistically expect to tweak a basically stock motor to 300 ponies without sacrificing some utility. Ive seen Dyno charts with the ZPI pulley on the SC pushing 220 that can be driven daily. All Im saying is that putting a 13 second or faster car with 4 cylinders is going to be pricey and a little rough on the commute.

Good luck, but if I had the cash I would pop for the SC and the ZPI pulley. With a few other mods ie, header, exhaust, possible SC intake and the eventual intercooler for the SC you can get some solid #s out of a sleeper car that can make a daily commute.

I tried this whole mod deal in high school with my old Trans Am. I put the big heads and carb and exhaust ect on the car. Sure it ran low 13s, but It ate my wallet , was louder than hell and since I live in the Peoples Republic of Montana could only be driven a few months out of the year.

Yep, I had a few issues with my IS300...cost a lot of cash... valve body, tuning, spark, cylinders 5,6 lost compression bla bla. I eventually sold those headaches.

OMG, I just read Matt's sig and almost pee'd on myself.

70k? ok i might not be the msot knowledgeble person about cars but i do research, I am thinking you might have meant 7k then ok def agreed. Ive seen cars with 300hp daily drivers stock are sti's, evo's, for four cylinders, plenty more for v6s and 8s. Modified ive seen 4, - An integra with insane mods up to 12 grand about 350 hp I beleive. A gti w 280 hp totaly rebuil motor for 8,500 k the person figured he d rebuilt instead of buying a new car. A spec v witha motor swap and some mods also about 280hp - about 4k. rsx s turbo stock motor 260 hp=2000 grand total. Impossible no. costly for power depends in my opinion the 300 horses are worth it.

But back to the original point. I want a 300 hp daily driver ok I didnt mean with in a year. I meant little by little i wanted to get there. My first step is this comign summer get eitehr a sc or a zpi 0 turbo and slowly go from there VERY slowly and very carefully. So far iam goign towards the sc cause its easier to install ( i dont care about warranty) a little easier to upgrade and easier to maintaine, yes iam fully aware that itll cost me more in the end.

N/A mods are good for beginners.... and then work up to FI....

But... forged pistons... P&P Head Swaps.... and other N/A mods a FAR MORE than "Bolt On"

Start Small... Work your way up and get to know how each modification works...

Of course you are not going to pull 300 HP out of the easier and smaller modifications, but you also don't have to spend the cash to do it... It'll cost a bundle to get a tC reliably up to 300+

Just a PnP head and Forged Pistons with install in going to add you over a grand EASY, probably more.

The tC is not an STI or EVO... those engines are built from the ground up to produce that amount of HP reliably, and to get our little 'ol camry engine into their ballpark would take thousands upon thousands of dollars on top of a turbo install. Plus, if you go 300+, you MUST upgrade your safety equipment.... Brakes (~1200), Suspension (~1300), Bar/Seats/Harnesses (~1500-2000) It all adds up... unless go cheap... which just makes you a risk on the road...

This post should be a SOLID lesson to all people starting out.... Tuning costs money, and those who get the huge gains also run the huge risks... and the cars you see in mags that run 2X horsepower have 10-20 grand in them in professionally installed parts at least....

There are a million "Forum-Tuners" online who know "Everything" about cars... but the reality is.... Reliability costs money, time, and a lot of effort... and nothing in this world comes cheaply...

Well, you do have a point. An STI or an EVO are 300hp cars on 4 cylinders that are daily drivers, but my point still stands. Who can afford these? I dont have 42k and about 160/mo for insurance. Like I said that has also been reiterated. There is a great amount of $ that goes into these cars. I like where you are heading though. If you go with the SC you can bolt-on your way to roughly 240 possibly 250 horsepower. Its going to take time and money, but it will be a hell of a lot of fun when you get there. If its speed you crave be kind to your Tc and just go get a crotch-rocket bike, you can get a used one for 6k and be topping out at 165mph. But as in life, always wear a helmet.

42k for an evo? how much of a markup do you pay? my buddy just bought a used one for 22k. jake, i fear that you are a complete idiot and have absolutely no clue wtf you are talking about.

sometimes you don't need 300whp either. i've seen 6k dropped into a honda civic hatchback, to do a motor swap & turbo kit and the car run 11s @ 260whp with stock block. but i guess atleast you do understand it does cost money to go faster, but if you have a good tune, it doesn't cost a ____load to go 300+whp.

Good God, everyone is a "tuner" these days. Bolting on a turbo kit doesn't make you a "tuner". This thread frustrates me.

Charles

^ Amen ^

That's my point... TOO MANY "Tuners" (Note the Quotations) out there getting themselves into trouble by not knowing enough about performance before taking a leap into HP heavy modifications...

Problems are BOUND to happen.

Good God, everyone is a "tuner" these days. Bolting on a turbo kit doesn't make you a "tuner". This thread frustrates me.

Charles

Why does it frustrate you? It's been going on for decades. This should be a lesson if nothing else. It's no different than someone that can wire up a simple electrical outlet....it doesn't make them an electrician as they try to wire in a 3 phase service panel. A wise person will know the difference and know their own limits.

However, if they so choose, they can learn. Just don't be suprised by some hard, real world lessons....huh. :lalala:

Good God, everyone is a "tuner" these days. Bolting on a turbo kit doesn't make you a "tuner". This thread frustrates me.

Charles

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Im frustrated mostly because this thread shouldnt exhist.

:rofl: :rofl: Yeah, Did I hear "tuner" or "tuna" as in taking the bait, hook line and sinker for the unsuspecting 'fishes' out there??? :rofl: I agree there will always be folks paying a lot more than others.... without REALLY knowing why :doh:

As you mod over time, you tend to learn more about your car and be less critical on the "show" and more on the "go" :P

"Just because no-one understands you, that does'nt make you an artist"

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Always does it for me...

-ZPIracing Okay we have been out of town as this thread has continued to blossom. We have already issue one free turbo and have provided hours of tech support on this issue. We set up for the turbo to be returned to the manufacturer which is only two hours from the customer. Thus there would be no overnight shipping to save money. We also said to Julio and his father that we would consider paying for the repair but we would need the turbo to get the manufacture first.

To this day we are still not aware of the turbo being sent in, or a follow up on the situation. We will always stand behind our product but we can only stretch so far when the issues are due to improper installation. This is not to say that we will still not stand behind it regardless of the situation. In this situation we did not tell him he is on his own we simply said he had to get the turbo to the other side of Texas at his expense. Then we would make a decision from there. Either way we are talking about fewer than 100 dollars of repair.

Turbo kits are a bolt on affair but you are still adding over a 100 whp to your vehicle. We can stand behind our product but there is an issue that may arise and there is more maintenance that will need to be done to keep your new turbo car in tip top shape. We can only assume so much liability till you get to a point where you have to say hey we screwed up we are not looking for anything for free just some help. I am not saying this is the situation here but these issues have come up. We can only help those who want to be help, this is a bolt on affair but if you have no idea of even where to start or what a turbo looks like or how it works or what an oil return line is then unfortunately you should not install our turbo kit.

^
Well Said.... Hope this turns out for the best...

No doubt in your guy's support... and very good points made...

Unfortunately... TOO many haters out there and youngins' trying to get into higher end mods a little too early.

Shoot, he can't ask for more than that. :bow:

Does anyone think for one minute if I installed a new pioneer head unit and burned it up because I installed it wrong...they would send me a new one? :no: But dang, the box said it had all the parts, but I needed to go get another harness, some connectors, solder, tape, wire taps...... I then had to find all the proper connections and the risk of improper connections fries the ECU because there was no directions on how to wire to my TC specific? :lalala:

ZPI seems to be the whipping post for a few on here and it's getting really old. :tap: There are many on here that enjoy their FREE information for this community and the products they R&D for us as an OPTION to purchase or not. It really is that simple folks. If you can do better...then do it and show us. If not...respectfully STFU and let ZPI and their customers handle the situation without the jaded comments and hidden personal agendas clouding the issue.

:eyebrow: :come: :clap: :relief: :blah: :silly: :no: :nope:

:P Good 'ol ScionDad with his Smiley Usage :P

:bow: :yawn: :ttth: :rofl: :pray: :doh: :nails: :love:

Sorry... Had to lighten it up a bit in here....

http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/spezial/Fool/bath.gif

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

edited for better judgement

It's good to see that Charles hasn't lost any of his finesse today..

So much for "Lightening" the thread up....

Turbo, unfortunately, your credibility regarding commenting on ZPI products is kinda shot, due to earlier comments and behavior, so everything you say I take with a grain of salt...

With that said, I do agree somewhat with your statement regarding how ZPI marketed the kit... but, given your knowledge,you have to admit that turbo installs are not for the amature, even the bolt on applications... as there are many tolerances that must be taken into account... and items that must be checked and triple checked for accuracy... if you don't know.... always ask...

ZPI has already gone the extra mile to assist with this problem... so they've taken many steps to ensure that the way they marketed the kit is held accountable to any problems... which they've supported again here more than neccesary in my opinion.

Anyways... Glad to see this getting resolved in a fair manner... Hate to see this thread go south because of past beefs.

I wasn't aware truth ruined credibility. No wonder some sponsors on here have so much.

^^^^^ My Response Taken to PM's ^^^^

Won't allow those comments to corrupt threads

Still hope this situation turns out good... Have confidence that with the right attention, it can be resolved perfectly.

If you want a 300+ horsepower daily driver you are going to have to up the cylinders. I would have to "see to believe" a 300 horsepower daily driver with 4 cylinders that didnt cost someone 70k. Sure they are out there, but you cannot realistically expect to tweak a basically stock motor to 300 ponies without sacrificing some utility. Ive seen Dyno charts with the ZPI pulley on the SC pushing 220 that can be driven daily. All Im saying is that putting a 13 second or faster car with 4 cylinders is going to be pricey and a little rough on the commute.

Good luck, but if I had the cash I would pop for the SC and the ZPI pulley. With a few other mods ie, header, exhaust, possible SC intake and the eventual intercooler for the SC you can get some solid #s out of a sleeper car that can make a daily commute.

I tried this whole mod deal in high school with my old Trans Am. I put the big heads and carb and exhaust ect on the car. Sure it ran low 13s, but It ate my wallet , was louder than hell and since I live in the Peoples Republic of Montana could only be driven a few months out of the year.

LOLOLOLOLOL! ALL my dsm buddies have around 250-450 whp! And to get there took them maybe around a couple grand! Screw this camry engine, there is a limit to what you can and cant do. I love racing, I KNOW im slow, I KNOW I wont get to 300whp, If i truly wanted that I would spend all my money on a dsm beater car and just bolt on everything i could. But then again, im not rich and paying 340 a month fot he tc + 200 for insurance sucks.

That argument is funny. some people care about what car they drive IN ADDITION to how fast / hp.

I had a turbo lexus is300 with 320rwhp. Everyone said just get a civic and drop this and that and youll be faster.

who the ____ cares... the is was a nice ride, drove awesome, tons of nice features and it was very quick. Thats the combo I wanted.

I want a quick tC.... so what.

ok Iam really not trying to start anything here just posting my opinion and tryign to make a sound arguiment. Look when you buy a pioneer head unit and install it you messed up you messed up correct, totaly your fault. When you buy a pioneer head unit saying its a direct plug in for your wires ( like what a bolt on means to me) and a persons buys it and installs it but no where in teh instructions did it say remove the security tag or your system will short circuit, Then its their fault. I mean look i def understand when you buy a turbo kit that you messing up is a possibilty and its your fault BUT this isnt the case zpi marketed it as a true bolt on saying anyone can install it, and that it comes with all the directions to do so. Obviosuly this isnt the case, so they are wrong. Look iam not bashing zpi i think its great theat they are releasing all this stuff for the tc and that they are loved by many onhere i just dont think that in this certin situation they are correct. I think people are not willing to look past the everyone saying zpi is amazing and see that they are wrong here. Just my opinion though, I dont hate zpi or anything.

btw I dont necessarily agree with turbo customz either i mean tuner doesnt mean a guy who knows everything about cars and does everything. In my opinion a tuner s a person who tries to tune his car for performance and thats exactly what he is doing. Yeah my opinion might not mean squat since i havent done too much myself.

But thats the point its the difference of opinion you are allowed to have yours and he is allowed to have his, free country after all, but there is no need to bash the guy for his opinion.

I know it must seem like iam trying to start something but trust me iam not i just think people are harsh on the guy and I can def see myself being in a similar situation and I am sure others can too the guy wants help not for other too bash him unfortunetly iam not knowledgeble about turbos to help him out but i know others on this website are.

ok Iam really not trying to start anything here just posting my opinion and tryign to make a sound arguiment. Look when you buy a pioneer head unit and install it you messed up you messed up correct, totaly your fault. When you buy a pioneer head unit saying its a direct plug in for your wires ( like what a bolt on means to me) and a persons buys it and installs it but no where in teh instructions did it say remove the security tag or your system will short circuit, Then its their fault. I mean look i def understand when you buy a turbo kit that you messing up is a possibilty and its your fault BUT this isnt the case zpi marketed it as a true bolt on saying anyone can install it, and that it comes with all the directions to do so. Obviosuly this isnt the case, so they are wrong. Look iam not bashing zpi i think its great theat they are releasing all this stuff for the tc and that they are loved by many onhere i just dont think that in this certin situation they are correct. I think people are not willing to look past the everyone saying zpi is amazing and see that they are wrong here. Just my opinion though, I dont hate zpi or anything.

What did ZPI do that was wrong? I bought one of their first kits. It was installed without instructions. Frankly, I bolted it on. The oil pan bolts on. The manifold bolts on. The dump tube, waste gate, down pipe...it all bolts on. The turbo even bolts on. Do tell me exactly what "ZPI" didn't different to him than they did to me? Sure, instructions would have been helpful, but ZPI is also making it right for him.

As I see it, when someone decides to buy a navigation system/head unit and decides they are going to install it....it's all on them for any issues arising out of installation...period. Same with the turbo as a "bolt on" product. You can't "learn" on a company product and expect them to cover someone's learning curve. The reason being at some point, the customer has to assume some level of competence to do the install. If not....PAY SOMEONE.

I'm not bashing wowguy at all. I actually feel for the guy. He felt the power. And frankly, he is capable of having it all back. He needs to take the time and have it installed right. If he was in St. Louis, I would help him myself.

In my opinion, ZPI is doing everything to make it right. Scionspeed had their turbo system out and where are they? A turbo is a turbo is a turbo....it's the company backing the kit that counts in my book. Rest assured, they all make mistakes. It's the company that fixes it that counts.

And, I'm with you. A tuner is someone that tunes their car, audio, visual, power, handling...whatever. A mechanic is someone that makes a living working on cars. The tools and information is out there for all to learn.

The wise ones will know the limits of their wallet and their skill. One thing leads to another.

I do agree with you on many points, like a zpi is helping and they are def a good company, b everyone makes mistakes good and bad companies what sets them apart is how they fix it. if zspi helps him out to fix the prob then def they are doing the right thing. My point was just that when you make a bolt on kit and say its bolt on I mean i could be worong here since I am no expert on any of this stuff but id expect instructions to go with it.

Yeah its true you are learning you should expect things like that to happen and make mistakes like someone eesle said it could be he put the pipes the wrong way or something totaly his fault then and zpi would be being nice helping. But like i said i am not bashing on zpi i just disagree with them not helping out when they advertise the kit is bolt on, and not having proper direction. If zpi helps then great if not then well i just disagree with it doesnt mean i dont likezpi anymore I mean if i decide to get a turbo i wouldnt go to anyone exept for them seeing as to how they helped everyone else and post lots of usefull info.

i am not sure if you missed the fact that we did help him out and gave him a free turbo. When the second turbo was installed the directions where on our site.

We may or may not assume the finacial responsibility of the second turbo and we will detrmine this once the turbo is looked at by our texas dealer and we are informed of the situation.

Thanks

-ZPIracing

ok Iam really not trying to start anything here just posting my opinion and tryign to make a sound arguiment. Look when you buy a pioneer head unit and install it you messed up you messed up correct, totaly your fault. When you buy a pioneer head unit saying its a direct plug in for your wires ( like what a bolt on means to me) and a persons buys it and installs it but no where in teh instructions did it say remove the security tag or your system will short circuit, Then its their fault. I mean look i def understand when you buy a turbo kit that you messing up is a possibilty and its your fault BUT this isnt the case zpi marketed it as a true bolt on saying anyone can install it, and that it comes with all the directions to do so. Obviosuly this isnt the case, so they are wrong. Look iam not bashing zpi i think its great theat they are releasing all this stuff for the tc and that they are loved by many onhere i just dont think that in this certin situation they are correct. I think people are not willing to look past the everyone saying zpi is amazing and see that they are wrong here. Just my opinion though, I dont hate zpi or anything.

What did ZPI do that was wrong? I bought one of their first kits. It was installed without instructions. Frankly, I bolted it on. The oil pan bolts on. The manifold bolts on. The dump tube, waste gate, down pipe...it all bolts on. The turbo even bolts on. Do tell me exactly what "ZPI" didn't different to him than they did to me? Sure, instructions would have been helpful, but ZPI is also making it right for him.

As I see it, when someone decides to buy a navigation system/head unit and decides they are going to install it....it's all on them for any issues arising out of installation...period. Same with the turbo as a "bolt on" product. You can't "learn" on a company product and expect them to cover someone's learning curve. The reason being at some point, the customer has to assume some level of competence to do the install. If not....PAY SOMEONE.

I'm not bashing wowguy at all. I actually feel for the guy. He felt the power. And frankly, he is capable of having it all back. He needs to take the time and have it installed right. If he was in St. Louis, I would help him myself.

In my opinion, ZPI is doing everything to make it right. Scionspeed had their turbo system out and where are they? A turbo is a turbo is a turbo....it's the company backing the kit that counts in my book. Rest assured, they all make mistakes. It's the company that fixes it that counts.

And, I'm with you. A tuner is someone that tunes their car, audio, visual, power, handling...whatever. A mechanic is someone that makes a living working on cars. The tools and information is out there for all to learn.

The wise ones will know the limits of their wallet and their skill. One thing leads to another.

i agree 100% here with sciondad, i'm somewhat mechanicly inclined, but that doesn't make me a mechanic, i wouldn't install a turbo kit on my own unless i the help of a professional, or someone who has been doing this type of work for some time. a perfect example. a lady buys an amp from us and doesn't want to pay for the install she wants to save money and do it herself. no she gets home and has no idea what to do, so she calls us up and asks us for some help. we help her the best we can from what she is explaining to us, but she doesn't quite get everything we say and does something wrong. she blows up the amp, does that make us responsible for it? no of course not, the install wasn't done properly.

Well the reason I haven't got the turbo to houston is becuase my car is in corpus at a toyota dealership that got the throttle body replaced, spark plugs and wires replaced. I dont have a car to get to houston, i have finals, i have to work and pay for my car payment for the car that i cant drive. Right now my number one priority is doing good on finals and getting my car running. The turbo kit comes next when im back on my feet. The kit is a bolt on kit, yes. I got a free turbo because the first one went bad. Kenny could not figure out what was wrong with the first. So he sent the new one. He had my first turbo and did notice the pins were still in there. Yea instructions were up but why would i check them if my kit is already installed. We rechecked everything and it was all fine. So i get the new turbo and just like the first one i bolted it on. After many trial and errors with kenny on the phone he asks if we took out the pins. We told him what pins? He said there was one on this side, take it out and try it. Still didn't work. We call him again and he says try taking out the other one on the opposite side. Why didn't he just tell us to take them both out the first time? i dunno? How did he not notice the pins in the first turbo to tell me about the new one when i install it. I talked to him plenty of times before i got the 2nd turbo. My manifold cracked and had no gaskets and talked to him numerous times. After taking both pins out, it still did not work because now i burned the oil seals out. Kenny says i need to get it rebuilt. We put the car back to stock after this so i can at least have a car. Nope, not gonna happen. My car idles horribly and have bad everything. I know i may not be highly mechanically inclinded but i know my father is. He's been working on cars all his life, been the service manager at Pep Boys, Ford, and more. He is now a field mechanic and deals with much bigger engines then we do. So I trust him before anybody else. I have plenty of friends with turbo cars and even some that own shops. I have my resources. That was my experience and just a little bit of what im going through.

Well the reason I haven't got the turbo to houston is becuase my car is in corpus at a toyota dealership that got the throttle body replaced, spark plugs and wires replaced. I dont have a car to get to houston, i have finals, i have to work and pay for my car payment for the car that i cant drive. Right now my number one priority is doing good on finals and getting my car running. The turbo kit comes next when im back on my feet. The kit is a bolt on kit, yes. I got a free turbo because the first one went bad. Kenny could not figure out what was wrong with the first. So he sent the new one. He had my first turbo and did notice the pins were still in there. Yea instructions were up but why would i check them if my kit is already installed. We rechecked everything and it was all fine. So i get the new turbo and just like the first one i bolted it on. After many trial and errors with kenny on the phone he asks if we took out the pins. We told him what pins? He said there was one on this side, take it out and try it. Still didn't work. We call him again and he says try taking out the other one on the opposite side. Why didn't he just tell us to take them both out the first time? i dunno? How did he not notice the pins in the first turbo to tell me about the new one when i install it. I talked to him plenty of times before i got the 2nd turbo. My manifold cracked and had no gaskets and talked to him numerous times. After taking both pins out, it still did not work because now i burned the oil seals out. Kenny says i need to get it rebuilt. We put the car back to stock after this so i can at least have a car. Nope, not gonna happen. My car idles horribly and have bad everything. I know i may not be highly mechanically inclinded but i know my father is. He's been working on cars all his life, been the service manager at Pep Boys, Ford, and more. He is now a field mechanic and deals with much bigger engines then we do. So I trust him before anybody else. I have plenty of friends with turbo cars and even some that own shops. I have my resources. That was my experience and just a little bit of what im going through.

i hope this doesn't come off the wrong way i'm not trying to be an ___. i mean no offense to your dad but did he look at the turbo before putting it on? you say he was a service manager for ford so i'm assuming he has some knowledge when it comes to dealing with forced induction (as far as i know ford doesn't have any turbocharged cars just supercharged), but has he ever worked on a turbocharged car? i would think someone who has some turbo knowledge would know you have to clock the turbo (again i'm not really sure but i'm assuming all turbos have to be clocked). i'm no trying to be an ___ just trying to make you see things from an unbiased standpoint.

Does anyone know of anyone besides sciondad that has a stage 0 running fine, or is he the only one?I can't recall hearing of anyone have a good outcome installing the stage 0 kit but him. :ponder:

Seeing these threads about people messing there tC's up by trying to install turbo kits themselves has pretty much gotten rid of any thought I had about installing this kit by myself. :nails:I'm just gonna let a proffesional shop install it and if anything messes up, it's on them. :tap:

I would let a proffesional shop do it but then I wouldnt be learning lol, however when I install my turbo (if i go turbo) it wont be just me its going to be with a person thats done turbos a lot.

Lol arguing about this seems to be geting us nowhere I keep saying its not right you guys say its his fault so lets leave it at that and hope that zpi finds some compomise between our opinions.

Btw about the amp thing, amp wasnt advertised as a bolt on you can diy install was it? my whole point with this is that zpi used that 'its a bolt on and can be installed by customers and save the money on labor" as a selling point not a huge selling point but a point nonethe less.

Anyways not trying to argue just trying to show my way of reasoning, I dont expect you to agree. Like I said I hope that zpi finds a compromise to help the guy because I know id be devasted if my car wasnt running anymore, and that was my dailydriver and I had school and work going on.

Does anyone know of anyone besides sciondad that has a stage 0 running fine, or is he the only one?I can't recall hearing of anyone have a good outcome installing the stage 0 kit but him. :ponder:

See this is the way auto web forums work, noone ever post when they get something and all is great they only post when there is a problem. This is no diffrence with the news 1 out of 10 stories are a positiive story but no one likes a love story we all strive on drama.

If all the other kits where having problems you would see a 100 threads just like this one.

Julio,

We talked to your dad yesterday he is going to get the turbo out today we will see what we can do. It is hard for us to offer a solution until we get the part. I agree school is much more important that boosting your tC. We should have a better idea of what we are dealing with tomorrow.

Thanks

-Kenny

Does anyone know of anyone besides sciondad that has a stage 0 running fine, or is he the only one?I can't recall hearing of anyone have a good outcome installing the stage 0 kit but him. :ponder:

See this is the way auto web forums work, noone ever post when they get something and all is great they only post when there is a problem. This is no diffrence with the news 1 out of 10 stories are a positiive story but no one likes a love story we all strive on drama.

If all the other kits where having problems you would see a 100 threads just like this one.


The Kaeon review will come soon enough... Hopefully everyones questions about installing it and how well it performs will be answered...

Does anyone know of anyone besides sciondad that has a stage 0 running fine, or is he the only one?I can't recall hearing of anyone have a good outcome installing the stage 0 kit but him. :ponder:

See this is the way auto web forums work, noone ever post when they get something and all is great they only post when there is a problem. This is no diffrence with the news 1 out of 10 stories are a positiive story but no one likes a love story we all strive on drama.

-Kenny

Scared of a girl's car are ya.....trying to keep a girl down huh? Well, one monster automatic turbo tC driven by a girl next spring to beat up on Kenny at the track. :come:

:rofl:

Oh snaps. Lock this in.