Next Bigger Scion xB to Be Exclusive for North America
Date Posted 11-29-2005

TOKYO — To build up the Scion youth brand, Toyota plans to make the next xB wagon bigger and U.S. exclusive, says a report in Tokyo.

Launching in 2006, the next Scion xB will be based off the new-generation Corolla platform and will seriously bulk up in size, according to the Nikkan Kogyo Shimbun industry newspaper.

The current xB (known as the bB, or Black Box, in Japan) is spun off the smaller Yaris platform. Confounding the critics who said it was too compact and quirky for the U.S. market, the xB has proved to be a smash hit. In 2005, U.S. Scion sales are expected to surpass 150,000 units for the first time.

Scion displayed the well-received t2B concept at the 2005 New York Auto Show, as a pointer, perhaps, to the next xB. Designed by Toyota's CALTY studio in Newport Beach, California, the t2B (Tall Two-Box) uses the same 2.4-liter, four-cylinder engine as the tC coupe and stands a full 10 inches longer and 4 inches wider than today's 1.5-liter xB.

Before the end of this year, Toyota will launch a new bB in Japan but that's a purely domestic 1.5-liter model.

What this means to you: Scion needs to be careful it doesn't lose its mojo by making the next xB wagon bigger all around. Others may argue that bigger is definitely the way forward for the youth-oriented subbrand.

hmmm...

If it's true it sounds like they are trying to snatch defeat out of the jaws of victory!

Thanks for the article. I also think that going bigger with the xB is not the way to go. Its "small on the outside, big on the inside" architecture is one of the major elements that drew me to the car initially. Hopefully the design team has realized this and the fact that the US market is over the SUV craze.

Time will tell...

-Alex

Wow. This just makes me even happier that I bought an xB and didn't wait any longer.

If I'd wanted a Corolla-based wagon I'd have bought a Matrix. If this story is true, I wonder if Nisson will rethink their decision not to import their Cube. There is a market for this form-factor.

RichC

The 2.4L tC engine will be a nice improvement for the box. I agree that the exterior size should not change. Most people are pleasantly surprised how spacious the box is in the inside, and looks compact on the outside.

Uggh...I was hoping the SUV craze was over. Glad I bought when I did.

definitely. I think that if the box gets bigger it'll definitely lose its appeal. That's what got me hooked on it too. Small on the outside and big on the inside

nice, I managed to sit in the xb at the dealer last week and was amazed at how big it is inside, so a bigger one would be interesting

xB - good size
Element - too big

as much as I'd LOVE to see the 2.4 from the tC in a box, the tC is already kinda portly and front heavy. would hate to see what would happen if they dropped the 2.4 into an xB sized vehicle... (or it *could* be cool if they get the thing light enough and balanced front to back)

If I'd wanted a Corolla-based wagon I'd have bought a Matrix.

Exactly.

If this story is true, I wonder if Nisson will rethink their decision not to import their Cube. There is a market for this form-factor.

RichC

I thought they decided not to import the Cube, and instead, we get the new Versa? Anyone know for sure?

as others have said above... glad i bought an xB b4 they ruin it

Doesn't the corolla platform run a 1.8l? I'm picturing a Matrix thats taller and squarer in the back.

Also, being on that platform might open it up to XRS type options. I don't see it being anything close to an SUV, but a little more storage space with the seats up and the power that everyone keeps wishing it had doesn't sound that bad to me. As a replacement for our minivan of course. I've got no intentions of parting with my Box anytime soon...

We're getting the Versa, and the Cube. You can build a Versa on Nissan.com

rant on

Concidering what we have been though with gas prices in the last few months, I think this is a BIG mistake. However, now that the gas companies have us fooled into thinkging that $2.00 per gallon is cheap we will never see prices drop to pre-war levels and we will just continue to consume higer quantites at higher prices. Fools, I say fools we are! Why don't the American buyers realize that most of the non US marketed cars have small footprints and small engines for a reason. Then of couse, we have a company that has a hit on their hands and have to screw it up "for the American market", and we let them buy buying it. :loser: :loser: :loser: :loser:

rant off :yawn:

Are you familiar with the Corolla line??? it is a small car that's rated as good as ours if not better:

Mileage Estimates (mpg city/highway)
Manual 32/41
Automatic 30/38

and the XRS at 26/34

first off making it bigger is a mistake 2nd using the larger engine is also a huge mistake. the camry was tuned well for fuel economy they put in the tc it sucks on gas so much compared to the camry and solara. other factor is i doubt toyota would actually spend the time balancing the cars weight to be distributed like mazda does sorry toyota is selling cars off from reliability not performance still.

the corolla is an excellent platform but does have the matrix wagon already. the xrs is tuned as one of the few performance orintated cars left. fuel economy is a big deal still right now. the whole gas being above around $2 a gallon is still bs last i heard prices should be $1.50 a gallon. the way production is. one reason why the xb and xa do well is economy. business will buy the xb for for the economy and the fact that is a bill board for them.

I agree with the Scionic Man, I wouldn't mind a few more inches behind the back seats, and a few more in width...Right now I can carry 0 gear with 4 people. it doesn't have to be huge.

Matrices are kind of ugly. that's why i didn't get one.

NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sure, stretch it a little bit, but don't turn it into another Matrix! The xB is cool as is.

It needs:
1. More optional power (or at least TRD or aftermarket support, a la tC)
2. Interior redesign (modernize, asap)
3. Maybe a little bit more trunk space (or they could do a sliding rear seat, a la Toyota Wish or Opel/Chevy Zafira.

No mo JDM!!! :(

bigger is not always better

KevinxB recently ran a couple of quick surveys here in ScionLife. In the survey that dealt with our Scions (http://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=92482&), here is his 8th question and my answer:

8. If you could tell Toyota executives something about the xB, what would it be?
It's an excellent design, don't spoil it by trying to make it fancy... "Longer, wider, lower" doesn't apply as a 'feature' to the box.

I hope that Toyota doesn't ruin what they have going with the xB.

I hope the mpg stays above 30 with the tC engine in there...but with the tC engine being 23/29 im getting worried...not too smart if they decrease the mpg

Full details on the Larger, more powerful "AMERICAN" xB can be found here:

http://www.edsel.com/

Sounds an awful lot like the Chevy HHR to me.... Now there is a very ugly rectangle! Looks like a pregnant PT Cruiser

This makes me really want the next gen bB... They plan on "keepin' it real" with a small car, while we get the "Americanized" bigger version...

Who knows... It might be nice. I used to own a Matrix XRS, it's a great ride. If they can capture the essence of the bB, and not ruin the looks or go overboard on size, it' might just be cool.

No Camry engine though... A 1.8 Corolla is big enough. And gets damn near 40mpg on the highway!

-THE DON

They didnt make the t2B for nothing, of course they plan on making that the replacement model for the xB. Its not even an origanal idea either, its a modern hippy van, kind of like the VW Bus. If I'm not mistaken, the VW Bus was quite the popular car for moding, atleast 1970's moding. Custom interriors, exterior paintings. It was also a popular car for road trips, band wagons, and such stuff. Personally I think it'd be cool to have a car like that, seems perfect for Scion to do. I'm waiting until next year to buy a Flint Mica xB, but if this new car looks better than I might just wait for that one.

I just talked to my DM and she dosent know anything about this.

Not saying this is incorrect but I do think its odd that my DM have never got the memo.

KevinxB recently ran a couple of quick surveys here in ScionLife. In the survey that dealt with our Scions (http://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=92482&), here is his 8th question and my answer:

8. If you could tell Toyota executives something about the xB, what would it be?
It's an excellent design, don't spoil it by trying to make it fancy... "Longer, wider, lower" doesn't apply as a 'feature' to the box.

I hope that Toyota doesn't ruin what they have going with the xB.

Yes, I like the gas mileage of the Echo engine and the storage of the current xB. I withhold judgement. But, I bet I will be glad I bought the original.

here's hoping they apply the same redesign philosophy that the Mazda team did with the Miata -- slightly wider (to incorporate side air bags), slightly longer (for more passenger compartment room), and a larger engine -- all while keeping the weight and overall 'feel' of miata-ness intact.
not sure, however, that i like the idea of a 'made for u.s.' xB. where will the JDM groupies get their fix?

I like the xb the way it is. I hope it doesn't lose it's boxiness. It's what keeps the xb different.

Confounding the critics who said it was too compact and quirky for the U.S. market, the xB has proved to be a smash hit. In 2005, U.S. Scion sales are expected to surpass 150,000 units for the first time.

Then why change it!?!?! Can't we keep the current model and then they can add the new "american" model to the line-up?

:tap:

I say fire those responsible at Scion for this dumb decision. It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that Scion customers like the xB because it's a REAL JDM small car, not another supersized vehicle exclusively designed for fat Americans!

Oh boy, A Scion Matrix? sounds like a sure flop. I don't want another frumpy American Toyota. Now what will I buy next?

Confounding the critics who said it was too compact and quirky for the U.S. market, the xB has proved to be a smash hit. In 2005, U.S. Scion sales are expected to surpass 150,000 units for the first time.

Then why change it!?!?! Can't we keep the current model and then they can add the new "american" model to the line-up?

:tap: That's a good idea! Maybe Scion will do what Ford did years ago. They were actually going to get rid of the Mustang and replace it with the Probe! Can you imagine that? Customers wrote to Ford and they rethought that stupid idea! Now look how good Mustang sales are. So hopefully Scion is listening. Also, every single vehicle Scion has sold they made money on! It's not like they lost money!

But the new xB will loose it's xbness for sure. I don't care for the T2B design at all and that's what it will be. They can have it.

Any chance that Scion execs are reading this? We are, by far, the biggest Scion community. By the time they roll out the new vehicle, many of us will be looking for new Scions. I'm sure that current Scion owners are going to make up a VERY large chunk of future buyers.

I agree, this is a VERY BAD IDEA. If Scion does this, I am out & will look elsewhere for my next car.

Any chance that Scion execs are reading this? We are, by far, the biggest Scion community. By the time they roll out the new vehicle, many of us will be looking for new Scions. I'm sure that current Scion owners are going to make up a VERY large chunk of future buyers.

I like my box, but i seriously doubt i will buy another Scion after this. Probably not even a toyota. I don't know.

I hope they do release something that will be absolutely retarded, it will make our 1st gen. worth a little more and much more popular than the 2nd gen Xb.

Cya

What a mistake! It needs a bigger engine, NOT a bigger body. I love love love that my xB is so small on the outside but huge on the inside.

^agreed

lets hope they don't go all "Honda" on us

2nd gen CRX = awesome
3rd gen CRX = Del Sol

bleh!

Like I said before, I don’t know why my Scion District Manager has never heard anything about this.

Don’t you guys think they would know a little?? Or is my thinking flawed.

A few things Scion needs to remember:

I bought a Scion. If I were looking for a bigger car, I would have bought one. They're not hard to find.

I bought an xB. Had I been looking for a faster car, I would have bought one. They're not hard to find.

I love my xB. It is the perfect car for what I needed - and I was happy that someone was smart enough to bring this vehicle to the US market. If my needs are the same next time around, I will be looking for another xB. if you make it larger with a larger motor (and obviously, more expensive) I will likely shop somewhere else.

-Justin

Very, very well said.

I think that pretty much sums it up for me, too. Thank you, Justin. :)

I bought a Scion. If I were looking for a bigger car, I would have bought one. They're not hard to find.
I bought an xB. Had I been looking for a faster car, I would have bought one. They're not hard to find.

For those who didn't see my post about a month ago...

Here is a 'SPY' picture from one of the auto magazines (AutoWorld) about the 'redesigned' 2007 xB.

Looks like an SUV/MiniVan hybrid to me:

http://tinypic.com/i4jzly.jpg

Or as one person put it... Looks like a Mini Cooper had sex with a Saturn Vue.

And if you'll notice, they even took away the 'box' design with inset windows, rounded front and tail, etc.

All the best -

Chris[/img]

That's a great idea... because we need another minivan or suv in the market place.

Then again, maybe this is what they need. Maybe the xB missed the youth market they were aiming for. I don't know if I (31) am really the buyer they were hoping for. I would say that at least half of the xB drivers I see around here ar my age or older.

Of course, I don't know if a minivan is the way into the wallets of the younger buyer. it seems like Scion will ave developed a market for the xB that they will then abandon, leaving the customers to buy the upcoming similar offerings from Nissan and Ford. So they basically did the legwork for someone else's future sales.

The box is the noticeable car from the Scion lineup. Although I notice the xa in traffic, I bet most people will confuse it with similar cars. The tC is generic. It's a good car... but it is generic and typical... more of the same stuff that leaves toyota with an ininspired lineup and and aging median buyer.

-Justin

For those who didn't see my post about a month ago...

Here is a 'SPY' picture from one of the auto magazines (AutoWorld) about the 'redesigned' 2007 xB.

Looks like an SUV/MiniVan hybrid to me:

http://tinypic.com/i4jzly.jpg

Or as one person put it... Looks like a Mini Cooper had sex with a Saturn Vue.

And if you'll notice, they even took away the 'box' design with inset windows, rounded front and tail, etc.

All the best -

Chris[/img]

If they did that design, still keeping it fairly low to the ground compared to most cars and didn't go too big with it. i could see this selling.

If it were to be as big as an suv, good luck scion.

Cya

...it looks like a Subaru.

If it looked anything like a subaru in person that would be pretty cool, being a big fan in subaru that is.

Cya

Like I said before, I don’t know why my Scion District Manager has never heard anything about this.

Don’t you guys think they would know a little?? Or is my thinking flawed.

I think you're thinking is flawed. . .

When you get to the lower levels of management in a company, you are more involved with selling the product at hand. They should be most knowledgeable in SELLING the product. . . and on a "need to know basis," they are the last whom need to know about future models. They need to know about competitors, sales tactics, allocations, etc. . .

Not only that, most dealer related employees of Toyota tend to be very unknowledgeable about future models. This of course applies to most, and not all. There are plenty of smart ones too. . .

At best, they will be informed a new model is coming, but they probably won't know much about it. And Toyota is VERY secretive about future product details and does an excellent job at staying covert.

^^^That just looks like a conceptual rendering, who knows if it was approved or morphed beyond it... When a team designs a new model they throw out a hundred sketches like that.

Hopefully the new model (if true) looks more like the t2B...

Oh geez, I guess it was a matter of time, before somebody has to screw up a good thing... Hope most of the parts are still interchangeable...

i like the corolla base and all, but yuckie. If scion only carries three vehicles why couldn't they add this supposed tc/corolla/bb thing to their line and keep all models currently in production. And as far as youth market goes, why would they lose any sleep over that in the first place, you don't need heavy target marketing if the things are impossible to keep on the lot.

Unfortunately, the prevalent thinking among all the auto manufacturers is that 'BIGGER is better'. I'm fed up of reading that every redesigned Honda or Toyota nowdays is "longer, wider, roomier, more powerful, more sheetmetal for the same $". Is it THAT hard for Scion to understand that people who buy Scions are NOT interested in getting the biggest (small car) that their $ can buy?

Maybe Nissan's upcoming Cube redesign will stay close to the original formula.

(The best example of runaway 'longer, lower, wider' to my mind is the car that started out in '55 as a quite small sporty two seater, the Ford Thunderbird, that grew over the years to a point where it was actually being built on a Lincoln chassis in '76! They've hit the 'reset' button on that marque recently, but I'm sure it will go through that same grotesque pattern again.)

http://tijil.org/55bird.jpg http://tijil.org/76bird.jpg

One can only wait and hope with the xB...

WOW... that spy photo is Horrible... I can only imagine what tooling up a new production line costs..... idiots

The size, weight and price are what attracted me to the xB in the first place. I don't see myself getting excited about a bigger, heavier more mainstream America looking xB replacement. But, I can see why Toyota might want to go that route.

The one thing that would make me jealous, would be if they equip it with a more powerful engine that equals or surpasses the fuel economy of the current model. I wouldn't have a problem with them making it *slightly* bigger and maybe 100 lbs heavier (reinforce those flimsy rear doors!!!) and dropping a 1.8 from the Corolla in it and lose the 1 ton dump truck final drive ratio so it doesn't roar at 4000 RPM at highway speeds. Do that and it would be faster AND get better mileage and it should be possible to sell it for within $2k of the original price easily--- that would appeal to me. But a 3000 lb minivan with the Camry 4cyl just holds no potential for excitement as far as I'm concerned.

Did anyone notice that the 'SPY' shot looks a lot like the xB they feature in the new True Crime game (also on the front page news)? Could the game be a test platform for the new body style?

ummm. . . no. I doubt they would choose a 2nd rate video game to test a new body style.

Keep in mind here folks, that this info about the xB being larger, etc. came from Nikkan Kogyo Shimbun, an industry newspaper. So who knows? It mght not be true. This didn't come from Toyota.

It's not going to be an SUV or anything like that, just a slightly larger car that will resemble the xB and t2B. Don't freak out, its not going to be huge, it'll still be the size of a car, just logner and wider. Plus wider is better remember? haha. I personally hope it looks nothing like that concept, the t2B is far better looking. Is it just me or does that concept look like a cross between the xB and the mini? The fact that its going to be an American only car means nothing, look at the tC, its american only. American only does not mean SUV. JDM? who cares about that, I'm sure most of the 'JDM' parts that you can find arent legit anyway, I'm sure they are being made in america as duplicates of JDM parts. You think because your buying a bB emblem its JDM? please...
Thats all I have to say, and just a reminder, everything in this thread is personal belief and expectation. Like all of you, I am only stating opinion. There is no fact on this car yet, only speculations. So dont get all worked up.

I hope toyota isnt dumb enough to make another mini van... with a scion badge. I personally like the xB the way it is... nice and small on the outside, and pretty big inside.

After thinking about it for a few days, I could works with the extra feet of the supposed vehicle. More space for my a/v setup.

It's not going to be an SUV or anything like that, just a slightly larger car that will resemble the xB and t2B. Don't freak out, its not going to be huge, it'll still be the size of a car, just logner and wider. Plus wider is better remember? haha. I personally hope it looks nothing like that concept, the t2B is far better looking. Is it just me or does that concept look like a cross between the xB and the mini? The fact that its going to be an American only car means nothing, look at the tC, its american only. American only does not mean SUV. JDM? who cares about that, I'm sure most of the 'JDM' parts that you can find arent legit anyway, I'm sure they are being made in america as duplicates of JDM parts. You think because your buying a bB emblem its JDM? please...
Thats all I have to say, and just a reminder, everything in this thread is personal belief and expectation. Like all of you, I am only stating opinion. There is no fact on this car yet, only speculations. So dont get all worked up.

Well if you've been in the jdm part scene for a while now, you know the differences between knock offs and the real deal. You also know what parts are actually made in Japan and those that aren't.

I don't know about you, but i don't know any xb owner that buys a bB emblem and automatically believes his/hers box is jdm. Maybe some of the newbies, but thats the only thing i could possibly think of.

You need to lighten up a little bit, i respect your opinions but sheesh. Have a drink or something. :P :clap:

Cya

if I wanted a van I would have bought an Astro

They should leave the box alone! Small outside large inside is why I was so drawn to it, and i couldn't afford the TC. More powerful engine is good but they should keep it just like it is. They could release the new on and call it xB2. Keep the old style and have the new version too!

The Box NEEDS another 10 inches, 20-30 whp, and another gear. I'm all for a vehicle that looks like the rendering on the previous page.

I could use the additional 10 inches in the cargo area of the xB. For many items, the space is just to awkward and small if it's not a possibility to put the seat down.

I hope they dont change the box and I kinda hope they do. There is such a huge demand for them here in Ohio now that if they change the style (Ruin it), It may just make ours not devalue much at all. Scions here unlike California are still a really new thing. I live in a larger town here and I am the only proud owner of an xB here that I know of!!!

Ugh.. there's already more than enough room inside the xb!! It's just not being used to its full extent. Make the rear seats fold down FLAT, move forward/back, come out completely, put in a decent storage compartment, do something with the area under the front seats, etc. They should be trying to make the engine compartment smaller, not stretching it out like in the photo to accommodate the bigger engine.

Personally I'd love it if they made it about a foot shorter and brought the roof down 6 inches or so, but I doubt that will happen.

Let's wait when the new bB is revealed to the Japanese market in Feb/March 2006.

It really doesn't bother me no matter what they do. Its not like i'll be buying another one. This one is fine and when i sell it i probably won't buy another scion.

Cya

That's whack that would make the xB like a vw vanagon and ____.

Look at the New Mazda5, Its not even really a Mini Van, its so small. Has seating like an SUV, but an exterior like a Mini Van. However its not big enough to be a Mini Van, and its just so cool looking. Mazda can pull of a hot looking Family Car, so Scion will too. Scion's Youth Customers are growing, so they've got to accomidate for it by giving them a slightly roomier car. The xB does not have enough room to travel with 4-5 passengers and luggage. Sure it's got plenty of room for 2 passengers to travel with luggage, but considering in most cases those two people are going to be spouces, with soon to come children, they are going to need more cargo room. I think it's a good idea, I can't wait to see what they come up with. I'm considering maybe getting the Mazda5 anyway, because Mazdas look better than toyotas , and it has more room than the xB. However its MPG is bad compared to the xB, but it's performance is far better, considering Mazda's have amazing performance. It cost a lot more than the xB also, I'm still not bought. But we'll see when this new Scion comes out, might just like it better. It just better have three rows of seating like the Mazda5.

scion is base market is the youth market don't expect them to be changing modles to accomadate the growing youth. when they first came out its more likely that scion owners will become lexus owners over toyota. mazda may have the performance but toyota has the true mpg on there side.

yeah they do have the mpg, but i wish they'd pick it up with there design teams

Take a look at the new Avalon and 06/07 Camry. I like the new design direction.

The Box NEEDS another 10 inches, 20-30 whp, and another gear. I'm all for a vehicle that looks like the rendering on the previous page.

I could use the additional 10 inches in the cargo area of the xB. For many items, the space is just to awkward and small if it's not a possibility to put the seat down.

Problem is when you add 10 inches, 20-30 horsepower (and thereby another 150-200 lbs or so) it's no longer the same kind of vehicle and it's no longer going to MSRP at $14k. There are lots of bigger, more powerful vehicles in that class already for those who want one. Lightweight, nimble, roomy cheap little cars like the current model are extremely rare in the U.S. so those of us who enjoy light, tossable little cars that you can park in a motorcycle spot are usually resigned to cars that are too small inside and devoid of features. The xB is a great compromise IMO.

Add that extra foot of length and extra weight and a bigger engine and you might as well just be driving a Subaru Forester or a Mazda 5 or a Jetta wagon etc. All nice cars, but we don't need another vehicle choice in that same size class when there are so many already. We'd be losing something there isn't nearly enough of and gaining just another 2 something liter, 3000 lb compact-midsized wagon.

I don't get people that complain about what the xB isn't. There are plenty of vehicles that have what you're demanding in the xB. Get a Matrix XRS if you want a 6 speed and more horsepower. Get a Mazda 5 if you want 3 rows of seating. Get a Forester if you want a turbo and AWD. Let the xB be the $14k wonder it is instead of turning it into another $20k luxowagon we don't need.

The Box NEEDS another 10 inches, 20-30 whp, and another gear. I'm all for a vehicle that looks like the rendering on the previous page.

I could use the additional 10 inches in the cargo area of the xB. For many items, the space is just to awkward and small if it's not a possibility to put the seat down.

Toyota didn't make the wrong vehicle - you bought the wrong vehicle for your needs.

-Justin

The Box NEEDS another 10 inches, 20-30 whp, and another gear. I'm all for a vehicle that looks like the rendering on the previous page.

I could use the additional 10 inches in the cargo area of the xB. For many items, the space is just to awkward and small if it's not a possibility to put the seat down.

Toyota didn't make the wrong vehicle - you bought the wrong vehicle for your needs.

-Justin

With the extra weight of a foot in length, 20-30whp difference would be more like 5whp gain off your current style xb. It would make little difference in acceleration. Another geat is the most ridiculous thought ever. Its a 1.5l, the gears are short to be able to accelerate faster and stay within a logical power band. You would never use sixth gear except to coast, so basically unless you travel long distances frequently it would be a waste. Not to mention, no six speed manual is a bolt on to the 1.5. You'd have to go to a different motor, add a little more space in the engine bay and whens all said and done base is $18,000 and it wouldn't sell because it would put it with tons of sport compacts, and that would be more than the hhr. Just be giving chevy business.

Cya

Look at the New Mazda5, Its not even really a Mini Van, its so small. Has seating like an SUV, but an exterior like a Mini Van. However its not big enough to be a Mini Van, and its just so cool looking. Mazda can pull of a hot looking Family Car, so Scion will too. Scion's Youth Customers are growing, so they've got to accomidate for it by giving them a slightly roomier car. The xB does not have enough room to travel with 4-5 passengers and luggage. Sure it's got plenty of room for 2 passengers to travel with luggage, but considering in most cases those two people are going to be spouces, with soon to come children, they are going to need more cargo room. I think it's a good idea, I can't wait to see what they come up with. I'm considering maybe getting the Mazda5 anyway, because Mazdas look better than toyotas , and it has more room than the xB. However its MPG is bad compared to the xB, but it's performance is far better, considering Mazda's have amazing performance. It cost a lot more than the xB also, I'm still not bought. But we'll see when this new Scion comes out, might just like it better. It just better have three rows of seating like the Mazda5.

Mazdas have amazing performance? Have you driven them, or have you just watched all the Zoom Zoom commercials? In their present lineup, there are only really three models you could consider truly exciting.

The xb was quite obviously not meant to carry your whole family on vacation. It can take a couple on vacation, or it can take two couples to dinner.

My 240sx cannot fit passengers in the rear because of the roll bar. It doesn't get the best gas mileage since I turned up the boost on the SR20DET. It also doesn't have much cargo space since I relocated the battery to the rear. Not to mention, the downpipe scrapes on some speedbumps. Should I jack up the car and put skinny tires, a 1.6 liter motor and a station wagon back instead of the hatch? No, because it serves its purpose very well. I would be an idiot to expect practicality from that car. Apply that as you will.

-Justin

xB: $14,420.
Horse power: 103
mpg city: 30
mpg highway: 33-34
length: 155.30
width: 66.50

Corola: $14,005.
Horse power: 126
mpg city: 32
mpg highway: 41
length: 178.30
width: 66.90

Both: have the same turning Diameter.

Hmm, the way I see it is if they make the next car anything like
the corola they can not only have a faster more fuel efficient car,
but they can also have more cargo space, passenger space, and a less
expensive car...
Bigger in Toyota's case does not mean less MPG which everyone is claiming
in the forum, it does not mean slower, or anything bad. The corola is not
a huge car, and if they made the next scion on a corola platform than I
personally think it'd be a better car. More cargo, more passenger room, more power,
more miles per gallon, and less expensive. Sounds like an ideal car to me, and it sounds like a way to solve any and every complaint I've ever read about the xB.
All just my own opinion, so dont yell at me and call me an idiot for stating my mind. If you can't handle my opinion, than forget I even posted it okay, no need to start a fight.

Not a valid comparison.

The $14k Corolla does not have power windows, locks, remote entry, VSC, ABS, Trac, or MP3 Player and has less interior space. VSC and Trac are not even available options.

Also, the Corolla and the Corolla-based xb would be manufactured in the US. I'm no JDM-tyte fan, but it does make a difference in quality.

-Justin

See, now thats how you shoot down an opinion the right way, I did not know any of that info, I agree justinb, all of those points are very good arguable stands, I infact want each of those in the next car too.

justinb made some very good points there. First of all the Corolla has much better aerodynamics than the xb, that helps fuel mileage. The base model Corolla is completely stripped and comes with virtually nothing. The Corolla, despite being longer and bigger, has no more passenger room than an xB.

They ALREADY make a wagon-like vehicle based on the Corolla, it's called the Matrix. Check one of those out. They are actually a little slower than an xB and have less passenger room, or about the same. Fuel economy is about the same, maybe slightly better, but you make it box shaped and that's out the window.

Not saying you don't have valid points there, curtydc, but there are multiple factors to consider there. That said, I do think it's possible to build a better xB, but not for $14k, it would be hard to do, especially when you consider that in the whole process of designing the car they kept low cost/value as a main priority.