greddy turbo.
or
greddy supercharger.

good question....

i think the turbo is a slight winner here.
but i don't really know the true numbers.....

I dont know, but does anyone know what the greddy kit comes with as far as fuel management or anything?

I would turbo a car, superchargers seem to be linear with boost to rpm,making boost at a high rpm ..... a small turbo would spool up at a low rpm and give you some nice low rpm tourqe. Also a turbo would be capable of much higher boost then a supercharger....The supercharger belt wont slip with a turbo also.

It all depends on who you ask,anyone with a supercharger will say get a supercharger.
A turbo with a automatic is even faster,NOBODY can shift a 5 speed as fast as a good auto transmission....spend some time at the drags and you would see that.

I love the whistle of the turbo also.

I'm a turbo lover,see my website,youl know why.

greddy turbo.
or
greddy supercharger.

Greddy turbocharger i've only seen one online dyno run, and that was 132whp paired with header and 2.5'' piping.

Greddy claims on the s/c 129.9whp, however i haven't seen an actual dyno sheet or run with it yet.

I would turbo a car, superchargers seem to be linear with boost to rpm,making boost at a high rpm ..... a small turbo would spool up at a low rpm and give you some nice low rpm tourqe. Also a turbo would be capable of much higher boost then a supercharger....The supercharger belt wont slip with a turbo also.

It all depends on who you ask,anyone with a supercharger will say get a supercharger.
A turbo with a automatic is even faster,NOBODY can shift a 5 speed as fast as a good auto transmission....spend some time at the drags and you would see that.

I love the whistle of the turbo also.

I'm a turbo lover,see my website,youl know why.
superchargers are capable of making the same abounts of boost, but like you said it comes on soo late.
and if a belt slips, the install or set up is wrong.

certain auto transmissions are good. ours is not one of them. the torque converter never really locks up and bleeds too much during shifts.

if you looking at PLug and play get the Greddy SC. it come with the emanage pre programed and very simple to install and look clean.. if your looking and willing to spend more time and money get the turbo.. the SC I have it and it does make a huge differnce.. Im still yet to get it dynoed but you do feel the diff..

I chose to go SC becuase of the way the install looks with out all that piping that goes right over the valve cover. And there are no Oil lines to be pumbed.. way less parts than a turbo..

I asked about the turbo kit they have out now and its just a basic kit no intercooler what so ever..

So it all preferance.. if you like turbos get the turbo if you like SC. get that.. Greddy would nver sell someting that didnt work..

BUt the SC is plug and play!! NO tuning needed..

It took me just 3 hours to install!

Hope this helps you out..

OH yea i have a five speed.. I had the chance to drive a auto withthe SC and I feel more diff with the 5Spd.

didnt make any lights come on or trigger any CELS right? if so, maybe i could get away with it in CA (the supercharger)

it didnt triger any lights waht so ever.. pluged the Emanage in and started it right up.. IF i did your install and didnt tell you i put it in you wouldnt even have knew it was in.. it ran as if i didn nothing to the car, untill you take it for a test drive and you feel the power!

A turbo can always be tweaked/tuned to make an engine put more horses to the rubber, but I think the reason that most people with these cars are interested in the SC is to get a decent boost and step in HP without pushing this little lawnmover engine too hard. As glamorous as we all are here, most of us still have our little cars as daily drivers. I would love to have a turbo on my box. :flame: Spool this little sucker up and watch it fly, but I'd only do it if I could tune and tweak every time I drove it- and I'd be trailoring it to and from the track. It's a good engine, sure. But pressurize this little sucker too much and...pop! :cry:

didnt make any lights come on or trigger any CELS right? if so, maybe i could get away with it in CA (the supercharger) lights don't mean anything. if you have a non carb part on yer car and u get yer hood popped. hello state ref.

they are both carb pending.

i know but even if it was carb #'d they would fail you, check engine or cels on diognostic = fail smog check

well yeah but a smog check is easy to pass illegally. pay 200 and bam illegal pass. but if u get yer hood popped yer screwed no matter what. without a carb that is.

hhahaa thats happened to me in my sr20'd 240 that i used to have and all the cop knew is my exhausr "looked" illegal" and somehow my intercooler was illegal. but the motor? haha didnt notice that. so on my xb, i would laugh if they popped my hood =) and i figured i would start worrying about smog a little more cause i polluted the environment more then i had to hahaha. but that 240 incident was a state ref ticket by the way, but i took care of it and got away with a 10$ court fee.

yeah if you swapped the motor back to stock. or knew a ref that was willing to put his job on the line. cause the sr20det is illegal in the us.

you care about the environment?

what's funny is that cops are being sent to school to learn common swaps . well the illegal ones anyways. like sr's and rb's , and such and such.

all i know is i got my hood popped and my aftermarket aem intake got me reffed. yet they poked and prodded and didnt see or didnt care about my header.

either way the less illegal stuff on my car the happier. ya know what I mean ?

ya thats what im saying, i mean doing it the other way is quite easy and painless if you find people but its much more of a hassle then being legal thats for sure.

all this stuff you guys talking about we dont have those laws in hawaii just this Recon BS.. but no smog or carb check.. its great to live in hawaii!!!

ya, sweet beaches, sweet water, awesome landscape, less to no traffic, no smog laws... the list goes on, except that your stuff is more expensive then ours, but that is one of the only dawbacks. i kinda wanna live there but i dont know anything about that place since ive never been =( oh and turbo can prolly get more power because you can probably force more air in that way. (haha just so im not completely thread jacking!)

Turbocharger kits are very reliable now,not like they were in the 80's (showing my age).....many turbos have ballbearing centers so theres no boost lag and the reliability is just as good as a supercharger.

correct superchargers dont have oil lines to run,but thats not to hard to do im sure,besides a supercharger has a oil "tank" im sure to keep things "wet"....you would need to change that,i would rather change my oil and be done.

Turbos are reliable now,you can keep the hood closed between oil changes.

you would need to keep a cool hand on the boost knob and not over boost it,I think these cars have weeeek 1.5 motors.

Turbo or charger you WILL FEEL...... the motor willl reach redline twice as fast in gear
things happen faster.

If you have a auto trans,look into a "shift kit" someone said the auto transmissions are slushboxs with bad converters, I dont know if anyone make a shift kit though for a scion.

My scion is daily driven,It has everything on it......The next thing it gets is a turbo....wish it was a automatic.

hmmm dont know about the traffic??? triffic here in hawaii sucks amost like LA..

who makes a shift kit?? that what the Auto Lacks.. and needs..

my car a drivin daily and i was hesitant on doing a mod like this before i bought the SC.. but ah screw the warranty and make more power.. so far it been inthe car for a week nad runs like a champ.. now have to make time to get some numbers on it..

Traffic in hawaii that bad? man that sux, didnt know our traffic was that contaigous. anyways, i want that supercharger soo bad but now the only thing that stands in my way is warranty, but the way i see it, almost everything is wear and tear and almost everything the warrenty covers is defects, but toyota and defects? sounds like a money scam this warrenty business. i dont know, but this charger sounds like its gonna be fun

So you knock my idea for a supercharger and then consider a different supercharger? Ohh K.

At any rate. Some of the 'facts' around here are just plain wrong. Superchargers if set up in the correct way will make full boost the instant you mash the accelerator. In my experience with superchargers I have never had a single instant where it did not provide full boost at a moments request.

Now, some of these kits for the xB use a clutch style pulley that only enables it at certain throttle percentages. If this is what you are talking about then yes, setting it to 100% throttle only will make it seem laggy.

A supercharger is linear... it should provide the same level of boost all the way through the RPM range give or take a pound. As the engine spins faster, so does the supercharger but the engine is progressivly eating more air at the same time keeping the boost level fairly constant.

Superchargers require power to drive them, turbo's use wasted exhaust energy. You can probably produce more peak power with a turbo almost any time. They both work in different manners. A supercharger should help your lower end power because of it's ability to boost right away (if you are not bound by a clutch setup as mine will not) however it DOES stay constant and doesn't ramp like a turbo can.

Anyway... I think either would be fun.. just have to plan it to what you want.

yeah i don't know supercharging. and I know how they work but was garning info as to if anyone has hard facts as to which has more power out of the box.

your supercharger is WAY TOO large for our lil motors.

your supercharger is WAY TOO large for our lil motors.


You keep saying this but never provide any real reason as to why?

your supercharger is WAY TOO large for our lil motors.


You keep saying this but never provide any real reason as to why?

i believe it would only make sense that the reason is because oh more boost pressure. Also the fact that if the charger is too big and the pully on it is too big, the motor wont be able to turn it efficiently to build boost pressure. just a thought though. :lalala:

wheres yer reasoning for putting a MUCH larger supercharger in yers? you do what you do. have fun. if it works cool. if it doesnt oh well.

i'm sure you can tame it's output down but then you wasted having the larger s/c . as well as having a different power delivery if you're using too large of a s/c for the motor. let me ask you what vehicle is that supercharger spec'd for and or commonly used on?

The motor it was on was 3.8L in displacement, and spun at near 16,000RPM to give that motor 7-8psi. They later ditched it because it was too small and ran to hot. They went to the M90 for the Series 2 version of the 3.8L.

It isn't MUCH larger... it's vary marginal. There is a benefit to running a larger blower. There is headroom to grow, it doesn't have to spin as fast and it's volumetric eficiency will be much better once boost is raised.

You don't have to like it, i'm only going after you for information because you seem so quick to dismiss it without much basis. *shrug* I'll let it go then. It's still being built though :P

I guess this is kind of OT, but I have to ask.

Where are you CA guys running into all of the state ref's and hood popping cops at?

I live in Central CA myself, and have never had to deal with it in my 11+ years of driving. I have more speeding violations and fix it tickets than I can count. Honestly, it is that many. And I have had so many "B.S." tickets it would make your head spin. Everything from too low, to window tint, to no front license plate.

Why do I say all this? Because in all these years, through all of these tickets I have not once been asked to pop my hood. And before you start asking what kind of cars they were, I did have two pre-'73 cars that I won't even consider for this discussion. But my truck is a '99 Dakota R/T that is extensively customized. Not once has an officer asked to look under the hood. My daily driver now is a '98 Prelude SH sporting a Tanabe exhaust with a dang "coffee can" tip. In all the times getting pulled over in that car I have never been asked to pop the hood.

The closest I have ever come is when I was stopped by a sheriff at 2:00 am because he thought my truck exhaust was "too loud." He let me off without even a warning when I told him that I had a stock "cat" and a 2 chamber Flowmaster.

central california maybe, not southern. i dont know, all cops are different. I go to irvine all the time and i never even see cops there but when i do they dont bother anyone unless its actualy something dangerous.

actually operation dragnet started in so cal.

cops are major dcks when it comes to illegal mods now. why? cause it generates cali LOTS and LOTS of money.

cops must just hate imports up here.

the most noticeable car to a cop is a honduh , 240sx. and or whatever they randomly wanna hood pop. and trust i am the most polite guy when i get pulled over.

it really does come down to choice, if you like turbo they have gotten very effecient and if you like s c they have gotten smaller and almost self contained. also i beleive that toyota uses a forged crank and rods in the 1.5's because they were planning that the rev happy little motor should be able to last like a toyota motor should. so you should be able to run up to about 7 or 8 psi boost without having to strengthen the bottom end. i am not pos of this but i ave herd it is so from some tech's i know. if ican find anything concrete i will post.

oh, i am also the proud owner of a bone stock 06 xa five speed. i plan on modding it as i can afford to, as i find things for it i will post. i did find a turbo kit ofr the xa by tsi, this kit comes with everything, you can find it at turbokits.com. it uses a garrett t-20 with intergal wastegate and say's it will give a 56%increase in horsepower at 6 psi.not sure how accurate that is because they have no dyno material to back it up. check it out if you get the chance, they have a similar kit for the xb listed on the same page.

As far as why peeps in SoCal get the hood pop stop more often...
I had a conversation not long ago with a police "acquaintance" of mine (in-law). He said that they actually get briefed on doing this, and they're told what to look for in a car. Now, I am trying to quote what he said word for word, but it was pretty much like this:

"Really you'll only get that done if you act like a jackass about being stopped and you've got too much bling going on with your car rolling on the gound, or if you've got a cannon of a muffler sticking 4 inches past the back of you're car- and "sticker mod" your car all to hell. Yeah, stickers are a big one... These goofy F'ers can't stand anything they can't show off, so if it's under the hood they're gonna add fifty stickers to make up for the fact that nobody can see how much they spent."

He's not my favorite person, but I had to laugh 'cause that sticker part is so true. If you're sponsored, you've got to represent- but I think everybody knows somebody who feels the need to plaster their car in stickers for every little thing they've added to their car (sometimes even for stuff that's not on their car). I saw this glass display at autobacs one time with a bunch of Tein stuff in it, a bunch of stickers and crap--and they were selling the stickers for $14.00 each!! So I asked a guy there if people actually buy them, and he said: "Oh, yeah. all the time.". So I asked him why somebody would buy them if the Tein stuff comes with the stickers when you buy it. He said: "I don't know, they think it looks cool."
Dude, if it's not on your car- don't go and buy a sticker for it. That is so f#@king loser stupid.

I also did not know that you can legally swap almost any engine with your car, but the state legal requires that it may not be older than the model year of your car. They(police) also know where to check your engine #, and can actually run it from their car to check on it.

He also said that the #1 car they will check most is any Honda that fits the above criteria. ...he he he ( I don't love Honda).

^ I don't know about that, you can't swap any motor. At least around here, you can't motor swap to a different code'd motor. Especially in terms of insurance, it looses all reliability when they look at a car with a swap (just take a 95' civic thats swapped with a k20a for example) because they don't know how this was performed, and wether or not it was done properly. If it was legal, you would see much more people swapping. Now of course, this doesn't stop people from swapping and never will. But i have never heard anyone (including a few law enforcement) say that swapping motors is legal in any way.

Probably... I don't remember exactly what he was saying. Maybe he was saying with the same engine (like 1nzfe) that it had to be same year as the car, not older. The part about the hood pops was interesting to me, but he kind of lost me when he started to get all technical anyways.

Probably... I don't remember exactly what he was saying. Maybe he was saying with the same engine (like 1nzfe) that it had to be same year as the car, not older. The part about the hood pops was interesting to me, but he kind of lost me when he started to get all technical anyways.

Thats more than likely what he meant. You can swap motors legally providing its the exact same engine code, and can't be older than the car itself. This is legal because if you blow your motor, you have the option of rebuild or direct replacement. But i seriously doubt its legal to swap from a 1nz to a 1zz for example. It makes no sense in the eyes of government and insurance policy. However, like i said before it doesn't stop anyone and we will continue to see sick swaps. Specifically in hondas because their bays are virtually universal. One thing i'm strongly let down by toyota with.

It is legal to swap different motors into a car. Yup, even in California. To do it right, you do have to jump through some hoops. I'm not to familiar with it, but the term is "BAR legal." Essentially the swap that is performed is inspected and checked for legality by the Bureau of Automotive Repair. Hence the "BAR Legal."

My brother has a swapped '95 Civic EX that has a BAR legal B18. I don't know all of the details, but I coudl get them. I know that every single part he has on the motor (Header, Intake, etc.) is CARB (California Air Resource Board) legal, and he has the sticker/tag to prove it.

It is legal to swap different motors into a car. Yup, even in California. To do it right, you do have to jump through some hoops. I'm not to familiar with it, but the term is "BAR legal." Essentially the swap that is performed is inspected and checked for legality by the Bureau of Automotive Repair. Hence the "BAR Legal."

My brother has a swapped '95 Civic EX that has a BAR legal B18. I don't know all of the details, but I coudl get them. I know that every single part he has on the motor (Header, Intake, etc.) is CARB (California Air Resource Board) legal, and he has the sticker/tag to prove it.

Interesting..But the people that i know, or know of with swaps haven't gone through the trouble of this "Bar legal" situation. Which, who would want to? I've never heard of this, but if it does exist so be it. I'm not complaining about it but it still doesn't seem completely right in terms of law goes. Either way, whatever. People will swap regardless.

Yes it exists. In CA this is what i know about it having swapped motors in a different vehicle i have owned and its not that difficult. The motor does indeed have to be the same year or newer then your vehicle first off. Next, it must have all the proper smog equipment (so basically oem unless all your mods for it if you have any must be CARB legal) so it must have all the proper EGR Valves etc... then after the swap is performed you must take it to a state ref inspection station and tell them it is a motor change (if they ask why tell the the other motor blew or something but they wont normally ask) Then procede to tell them the year of the motor and all that info. The inspector will then procede to inspect your motor, takes usually about an hour or so because beleive me they go through it pretty well especially since the motor is from another vehicle. Then if all is well you get a stamp in your door jamb saying what year the motor is and what smog equipment to use for the furture and you get paperwork and you go on your merry way. sounds complicated but its not. Plus when you put a motor in your car that makes much better power in your car stock then your old motor its still awesome, and it will be legal! haha, anyways hope this helps. and if anyone knows if theres new laws this year, say so because this was a couple years ago. see ya guys

^ I don't know about that, you can't swap any motor. At least around here, you can't motor swap to a different code'd motor. Especially in terms of insurance, it looses all reliability when they look at a car with a swap (just take a 95' civic thats swapped with a k20a for example) because they don't know how this was performed, and wether or not it was done properly. If it was legal, you would see much more people swapping. Now of course, this doesn't stop people from swapping and never will. But i have never heard anyone (including a few law enforcement) say that swapping motors is legal in any way. how does insurance even know ?

Yes it exists. In CA this is what i know about it having swapped motors in a different vehicle i have owned and its not that difficult. The motor does indeed have to be the same year or newer then your vehicle first off. Next, it must have all the proper smog equipment (so basically oem unless all your mods for it if you have any must be CARB legal) so it must have all the proper EGR Valves etc... then after the swap is performed you must take it to a state ref inspection station and tell them it is a motor change (if they ask why tell the the other motor blew or something but they wont normally ask) Then procede to tell them the year of the motor and all that info. The inspector will then procede to inspect your motor, takes usually about an hour or so because beleive me they go through it pretty well especially since the motor is from another vehicle. Then if all is well you get a stamp in your door jamb saying what year the motor is and what smog equipment to use for the furture and you get paperwork and you go on your merry way. sounds complicated but its not. Plus when you put a motor in your car that makes much better power in your car stock then your old motor its still awesome, and it will be legal! haha, anyways hope this helps. and if anyone knows if theres new laws this year, say so because this was a couple years ago. see ya guyscorrect.

^ I don't know about that, you can't swap any motor. At least around here, you can't motor swap to a different code'd motor. Especially in terms of insurance, it looses all reliability when they look at a car with a swap (just take a 95' civic thats swapped with a k20a for example) because they don't know how this was performed, and wether or not it was done properly. If it was legal, you would see much more people swapping. Now of course, this doesn't stop people from swapping and never will. But i have never heard anyone (including a few law enforcement) say that swapping motors is legal in any way. how does insurance even know ?

I was just saying..

by yer reasoning tony , any horsepower adding mod would void your insurance as well. "oh wait you have intake and exhaust?" VOID!. lol

by yer reasoning tony , any horsepower adding mod would void your insurance as well. "oh wait you have intake and exhaust?" VOID!. lol

Nu uh. :rofl:

A motor swap to a different engine code is completely different than modding your motor that the car came with. In terms of insurance, of course you aren't going to tell them. But in the event you wanted to have that particular motor covered with the car, i seriously doubt they would do anything for you if not cancel your insurance because of it.

Its considered a saftey and reliability issue when you go from, okay..lets take the xb for example. going from a 1nz to just say a 2zz. The modifications needed to fit the 2zz, can be considered un-safe for street use which is why i find it odd that the government would approve of this. I mean, if done correctly yes its just as safe but usually the government doesn't see it that way.

It doesn't make sense to me, especially in cali how theres such strict laws in regarding CARB and a few other things, yet do approve motor swapping. I don't know, it just seems backwards to me. Then again, most laws are very much so backwards in regards of how they are written and acted upon.

I'm lost, when did this become a motor swap thread anyway?

Darren, either go boost or don't. But quit thinking about it and just do it or don't! :rofl: :rofl: jk

dude. motorswaps r cool. carb is not cool.

dude. motorswaps r cool. carb is not cool.

Indeed.

Spend some time at the track walking the stagging lanes,people are more then happey to talk, and you can see what cars are running well,you might need some help from them after your kit is in turbo or supercharged.
If your lucky youl have a dragstrip near home,Im 3 hours each way from one.

no one in sac is turbo. or supercharged cept a rich crazy guy with a custom made 5 grand jdm supercharger.