Is it worthless to do any performance upgrades on an AUTOMATIC tC? I really want a manual, but I have to share the car with my sister and she refuses to learn how to drive manual.

 

First, you need to smack her! Everyone should have to learn on a standard transmission.
Second, Do all the upgrades you would do if it were a standard transmission. The car will respond very well, and you will be happy with both the power available, and with the fact that you smacked her!

 

There's very little difference between the two when you really get down to it. Not to sound like a flame or a dis, but most people who knock the Automatic actually don't know HOW to drive an automatic correctly. Some day they will understand...

But the few HP gains you can get by modding (I/H/E) will help either model:

X + 3HP = the same gains as Y + 3HP, you're still just dealing with the difference between X and Y (which isn't much)

 

care to enlighten me? what do you mean exactly about driving an automatic "correctly"?

 

how can you not know how to drive an automatic

 

It's this mantra of "You have more control of your car in a manual" and "the auto is useless with only 108 HP" that makes me realize that most people don't know how to really drive an auto.

The idea that its just push down the gas or stomp the brake, that they are only for beginners, not "serious" drivers. The way that I see people drive in traffic with an auto, it's either on the brake or on the gas like a bumper car, no-one knows how to coast... or, God-Forbid!, downshift an auto. People are AFRAID to go below the D. You know what scared me? The shift points that the manual says are the speeds for downshifting, they are 10-20 mph OVER where i shift when I think I'm pushing it close.

This view of traffic like all the cars on the road line up based on their HP ratings and that this makes the Auto xB sit in line behind the stick. The minor performance differences between the two could easily be made up by reaction time, guts, recklessness level, points on your record, traffic, lane changes, blowing a shift during all the excitement, etc.

I have complete control over my car. With the feel of the pedal, I can make it accel without downshifting or with a downshift, depending on the power needs. I can shift every gear if I want and push it to redline if I need. I can stick it into second and keep my speed down in traffic or downslope. I can turn off the overdrive and tighten things up. I can just drive and let the car decide where it needs to be gear-wise, giving me more of my attention on the road, traffic, etc. I just don't understand what it is in the Auto that i can't do that a stick can.

I'm not saying the auto is better. For ME, it's better. If a stick works for you, that's great. I just hate to see people getting scared away from the auto when it may very well be a better option for them too.

I added the word "correctly" for a reason. You could say "Everyone knows how to use a computer", but that doesn't mean everyone is at the same skill level...

 

I'm with TheScionicMan. You dont floor the gas pedal in the auto. The 1NZFE's autosweet spot is around 3200RPMs. Not sure about the 2AZFE, it too has a sweetspot, you'll find it eventually. Also check your tach. Read the RPM and watch the needle go up and down (autoshifting). The faster the needle shifts from one gear to the next is your sweetspot. At the same time you need to coordinate with your gas pedal when to add more pressure on it or let go a bit so you can hit the spot faster. BTW, this is VVTi...it has a computer, it will know your driving preference.

Oh, BTW, not sure if the tC has it or not, but on the 1NZFE autos, we have overdrive. It will kill gas mileage with it off and it is pointless at less than 55MPH. It's best around 60-75MPH.

 

its proven that automatic cars lose about 10 hps......check the import tuner with the scion for ref..dont feel liek looking it up on teh net right now.

 

Wait... are you backing up my argument or debating it...

I know there's more HP lost to the drivetrain on an auto than on a stick... that's where the slight difference in times comes from. BUT a 6.25% loss isn't enough to make the stick a powerhouse but the auto a dog...

 

Thier is a BIG difference between a automatic and manual in general. However, with the xB auto I test drove- I found to be very responcive!! My moms 2003 Camry V6 is the same way. Once again though- a V6 auto gets up and goes compared to a 1.5, or 2.4 four banger. The difference between an auto and a manual is this. With a manual, you can shift into 3rd or 4th, and pin the gas pedal down to speed up quickly- with an auto- you do that and it will downshift and rev really high!!... It sounds like to me that if you sharing this car with you sister, you should deal with an auto untill one day you can buy one on your own...

 

autos have the capability of being faster than manuals and yes most people do not know how to drive them.

 

THIS is exactly what I'm talking about! If you give up control to the "magic" of the auto tranny, then YOU don't know how to drive an auto correctly.

What does the engine in a manual do when you downshift into third or fourth??? The downshift causes the engine to REV HIGHER. It is no different than the auto. If I just mash the pedal, sure, it might downshift out of O/D , even pop down to second in some situations. The trick is to not just mash - it's not GO and STOP pedals. Like I said, when you KNOW how to drive an auto, you can control the downshift merely with pedal control. I can make it accel in gear, make it come out of O/D or even grab second. It's not doing it out of the blue with no input from the driver., it can, but doesn't have to.

Besides doing it via pedal, I can click the O/D off button which tightens things up. I can stick it into 2nd or even first...

As much as you think you know about driving, you realize over time there's more...

 

autocross = manual
bracket racing = automatic

10 second car = automatic

all around = manual


i can go on forever (not really) but both have their strenghts and weaknesses

 

same problem.. having parent pay 1/2.. so i have to get auto.. oh well, its car to get around it! shiet!! :D

 

scionicman, i am really interested in what you have to say, because if I'm getting an automatic, I need to get the most out of it. Can you elaborate on what you mean about downshifting in an auto and pedal control?

 

Hey guys just so everyone knows 1st I drive for a living about 100-150 miles a day right now and I never knew that you could hit the rev limiter on an auto. After a few weeks with the car(about a year ago) I was doing it with no problem....I dont do it all the time because I dont really like to abuse the car but there is a way with the auto that you can take off and it will not shift untill you hit about 6k 6.5 maybe higher I really dont know becasue I just look at the road and the speedo and yes it is all about how you mesh the gas you can not just floor it...when you do it right you really feel the TQ not like it has a whole lot but you do feel it more then if you where to just floor it.


One more thing about what scionman said.......there is a way to keep it in 2nd or 1st just by working the gas just right when you do this the rpms stay still and auto will not shift unless you hit the gas to much or to little.

Being that some of us just like the auto because we dont want our leg to come off at the end of the day doesnt mean we dont like to play around with our cars.Again 100-150 in the city ok. Only reason I didnt mod my Corolla now is because I really didnt want the car in the 1st place but it was just right for my line of work

 

While i would agree that a manual is fun to autcross with, i've done very well with my autoTRAGIC focus running in STS. I turn off the OD, start in 1 and run most of the course in 2. Sometimes on the stretches I can get to 3rd. Auto's can be controlled. I'll never buy one again, but they CAN be driven "like" a manual. You've got to get the timing down and learn throttle control to be successful.

 

Ohh, thats funny- why is it then when Car and Driver tests MT and AT- the MT's are .5-1 second faster??- they have profession drivers doing the test- Am I msissing something??

 

A stock AT would never be faster then a MT driven by a pro, but when enough money is put into an AT it can and will out perform a MT.

 

OMG this thread is going nowere!! No ____ shirlock a auto tranny will out perform a MT with enough mods- Just like a MT will out-perform even more with mods- DUHH!!