engifineer

I still am baffled why people say stuff like "big brakes make it safer" or "its an economy car, so you cant expect much" blah blah.... The brakes on this car perform well guys.. like I said earlier, plenty of guys that compete in much more expensive cars than mine have been impressed by them.

And contrary to popular belief, big brakes are mostly not there to stop the car faster (your tires limit stopping distance under normal conditions.. unless your brakes cant engage abs then they are doing every bit they can). Big brakes, slotted rotors, etc come into play in high speed, repetitive braking conditions like on a racetrack, where overheating causes the brakes to begin fading. Bigger brakes have more surface area, thus dissipate heat faster, thus dont start fading as quickly. But as soon as you engage abs, you have exceeded the stopping power of the tires and more brake power is pointless.

Glad your issues is fixed though, I knew that it was not normal for this car. It still could have been a bad master cylinder and was just not bled well after install. Also could be it was never bled thoroughly from the start. ABS systems sometimes can be harder to bleed well.

andrewmartinez42

I'm pretty sure it was the damn brake calipers that were causing the spongy brakes because they tend to freeze up from time to time. I had the same damn annoying problem
as you did joey and they were the damn calipers and its barely a 2006 Scion tC and the brakes are already failing!!!

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engifineer

That is not a common issue.. one that needs to be fixed, but not common on the tC. And it can unfortunately happen on any car.

Fire It Up

im having the same exact issue as you
i dont want to sound like a noob but if i were to get my brakes fixed, i would tell the mechanic to release air from the abs or sumthin?

RS_5.0_wifey

I had a problem with mine feeling spongy too, on my 09. I'm only at 5,000 miles or something stupid low. I even had a couple of times where at low speeds I would go over some uneven pavement slightly downhill and the ABS kicked in. I took it to the dealer and they told me the same thing about not being able to replicate it. I also seem to have something wrong with the mechanics of the right front caliper, it's been grooving my rotor, etc. But the dealership just shrugs and goes their merry way, and I don't have a lift to check it out myself, and all the other mechanics in the area suck. Then I looked up on the national highway safety site and lots of people have complained about brakes failing, ABS kicking in for no reason, etc. My husband told me the tCs have denso brake and accelerator systems (idk if this is true), so they supposedly don't have the problems that the other Toyota's do, but I'm starting to wonder (but part of it could be people freaking out for no reason). I want to put the BBK on, and I know that wouldn't solve the problem if it's further upstream than the caliper, but I think it would just make me feel better for some odd reason. I have had a couple of times where I've had to brake suddenly and it didn't seem like I was getting enough power behind it. I'm just sick of fighting with my stupid dealership. I'm about to drive 30 miles away just to get oil changes.

Vlad1024

Go to another dealer and complain until you get results. That is absolutely unacceptable for a new car. Threaten to go lemon law on their sorry assumptions(I don't want to get pulled over for saying ___). That being said are you sure that there is a problem? It is normal for abs to kick in over bumps and our brakes do feel "spongyer"(i guess) than those on other cars. As for grooves on your rotor they could be caused by stuff caught under the pad.

Most of the parts(including the gas pedal) on our cars are made by denso so we don't have the accelerator issue.

RS_5.0_wifey

Well, see, they turned my rotor once already and cleaned everything up, and another groove came back in no time. So, I'm thinking it's something with uneven pressure with the caliper or something like that. I know on my Corolla, I had the same problem and it turned out to be a defective caliper that kept sticking so they replaced it.

I know I need to go to another dealership, it's just so hard to find the time to travel that far, and this one has a chauffeur service that they take me to work and pick me back up. It's just ridiculous that every time I go in this one, they either act like I'm completely stupid or a B**** (and then it turns out to be what I'm telling them is wrong) or they just ignore the problem. For example, I've had a problem with my suspension squeaking, but it may just be the bushings needing breaking it (but it is so annoying going over speed bumps). They kept ignoring me until I finally insisted they fix it. Instead of looking for the problem in the back (where the squeak is coming from and always has been), they replaced my strut braces in the front?? Maybe there's some logic to that...I've given it time to break in, but has anyone else had this problem and fixed it?

RS_5.0_wifey

By "what I'm telling them is wrong" I meant that what I'm telling them is indeed the problem, but they won't listen to me to begin with.

engifineer

Some kids who had no idea what ABS does used to complain that the ABS "kicked in too soon", which is does not. If you brake hard over uneven surfaces, ABS will engage, just like it should. Poor tires are the reason abs seems to work more than you think it should, and the tC's generally come with poor tires stock.

But that has nothing to do with a spongey pedal. That is air in the lines or a bad master cylinder.. if you actually do have a soft pedal.

The groove is somthing else. Most likely a trashed pad, but could be due to some foreign peice of metal (would almost have to be hardened) contacting the rotor somehow. Very obvious thing to troubleshoot since there must be something in contact with the rotor surface to cause this (should also make a lot of noise.)

RS_5.0_wifey

I know what ABS does, and when it should kick in. Even though the top layer of pavement was scuffed up, it wasn't an area ABS needed to kick in AT ALL. I was only so slow my speedometer wasn't even measuring my speed. And, I had nearly brand new Proxes on the thing. I wouldn't tell Toyo that you think their tires are poor; they might quit sponsoring some of us The dealership agreed it shouldn't have kicked in when I told them where this occurred, but they didn't do anything about it after checking it out, as usual, hence the trying to find another dealership close by. I took apart the brake pad assembly myself and did not see anything foreign that should be causing the grooving or warping, so I would assume there is a defect upstream of the pad. I also appear to have uneven pad wear, which tells me that either the rotor is warped, which I would assume wouldn't be the case since they just turned it, or there is a continual defect in the caliper. I have noticed that after they check the brakes and recharge the lines, I have excellent braking for about a day, and then it's back to the semi-ok normal. That tells me that the brakes could be better than they are, but something is causing them to lose pressure over time. Maybe a small leak, etc. Now the job is to just find a dealership that will do something about it because I'm not paying for parts that are covered under warranty.

I do have some mechanical knowledge. I've worked on my own vehicles for pretty much forever, so of course, I've already done as much trouble shooting as I care to do, given I have a warranty for a reason (so that I don't have to deal with this and let someone else do it for a change). I just want to know everything people have done to fix this same issue so that when I go to the other dealership, I can lay every single possibility out so I don't have to fight with them (maybe you don't have this problem because your a man ). Otherwise, obviously...I wouldn't have clicked on this thread.

jdrinkert

Rehashing this old subject. I have a 2012 RS 7.0 after 4,600 miles I'm noticing that my brakes are getting real soft already. Kinda scary in 5 O'clock traffic.

rancur3p1c

Now that you mention the calipers, when I changed my brakes I smothered them with some cheap valvoline silicon grease. It's very tacky, thick stuff.
What I feel when I brake is a delay in the brakes engaging. If I press hard, it takes a second or so for the braking to become more stiff.

I think my calipers themselves are fine-- I probably need to degrease them and put on a grease (lithium grease?) that will allow for smoother sliding of the calipers. Wait, no, you're not supposed to do lithium grease because it will eat away the rubber socks/covers for the brake calipers that slide in/out as you brake. Hm.

serith

For science, I thought I'd add to this thread and mention that my brakes are also spongy on my 09 tC. I don't remember it being an issue on my 06, but they're definitely a lot softer than other cars I've driven recently. Under hard braking they still stop okay, I just don't like the feel. I think I'll upgrade to stainless steel brake lines when I change out the rotors & pads in the near future. Hopefully it helps.

rancur3p1c

don't waste the money. I did and it didn't help me any.

engifineer

You were trying to fix a headache with a bandaid

SS lines improve brake feel to a small degree, but they wont fix a mushy pedal. A mushy pedal is going to be related to air in the lines, a master cylinder issue, etc.

ropes

So, In your oppionion, would you say that SS brake lines on a daily driver is more bling than anything else and are only "necessary" in high performance situations, ie. auto-cross, track racing and the like?

brandaman50l

I have and 08 tC and mine aren't spongy. I've changed the pads and rotors and they still weren't. you should try bleeding them.

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brandaman50l

dont waste your money on ss brake lines for street driving

INMY01TA

I'm having this same issue with the wife's 09 xD.

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TTCCC

Replace the wife, problem solved.