bhatfield99

OK, I have been dealing with this issue for quite some time. My CEL, VSC, & Trac Off lights have been a permanent fixture in my Box for about the last 20,000 miles and I have been to the dealer and tried myself and nothing has done the trick.
Well I just found the fix:

I'm sure there are a lot of dealers that may have caught onto this already but mine had not. There is an issue with water getting into the charcoal canisters and plugging them and shorting out the pump and switching valve. The main canister is sold as an assembly which includes the pump and valve and runs you a steep $300. Anyways, there are a couple of fuel neck seals/covers that are supposed to keep water from draining back down the Evap tube. Well they are a bad design and need replacing with an updated part. If anyone has access to TSB's here is the # EG047-06. The reason it kept getting overlooked was that the bulletin was only issued for the xA which has the exact same set up and problems. Unfortunately once the canister is contaminated it is toast.

Here is a list of the updated #'s:

77248-52040 Fuel tank filler pipe cover holder
77219-21010 Fuel tank filler pipe cover
77740-52100 Charcoal canister Assy.
77706-52011 Charcoal canister filter no. 2

The repair is not that bad and does not take up much of your time. If your mechanically inclined that is. I'm sure I'm not the only one that has figured this out but hopefully it will be helpful to someone.

_____

borozinski

I had those same lights come on yesterday, VSC, Trac OFF and the CEL. I went to Autozone to get them checked and it was all emissions type stuff. Like what you listed. I don't have an exact print out or remember any of the numbers. He reset them and I haven't seen them back again, it's only been a little over 24 hours though. But, sounds like I got the same thing going on. The problem is the "filler neck"? So how do you fix it? Just find that part # you listed? If you could, would you elaborate more on how to fix it? Thanks.

Forget most of that stuff I wrote. I researched a little and found out what you're talking about. Here's a link to the TSB, http://tijil.org/Scion_TSBs/eg04706.pdf In case anyone else may need it.

dagarhart

This is the same problem I have. The dealer had to order the parts. I took the TSB printout with me when I took it to the dealer.

Being that my car is just over 36,000 with 36,800 it is out of factory. They said my extended covers this. Heck, being that close, I would have asked Scion to cover this part "In Good Faith". Either way, I do not have to pay out of pocket.

I wonder why Scion just does not recall this part if there is an issue with how it was made?

borozinski

Anybody have any more updates on this? I still haven't had the dealer look at mine yet. It's getting kind of annoying, everyone who gets in my car says, "did you know your check engine light is on?" No ____. Anyways, just wondering. Any help would be appreciated.

TWBeck

Thanks to borozinski for pointing me to a copy of the TSB. I just took my Scion xA into the dealer as Check Engine Light came on. I was told it was caused by water intrusion into the fuel evaporation system and repair would be $830 as the car is 2 mos out of warranty (although it only has 24K miles). My extended warranty, Easy Care, won't cover it as they claim it is not caused by a component failure. It is obviously a design defect or a redesigned filler pipe cover holder would not be specified by the TSB. I'm quite upset with Scion and Easy Care. Toyota has always meant "quality" to me, and I think this should be covered.

borozinski

Mines definetly out of warranty. It's a certified pre-owned one, but I don't think it means ____. I called a couple different dealers and got fed up with both of them. The first one was a woman, it was like talking to a tape recorder. And she was a woman. Next one was guy, which didn't really help much. They'd charge me $95 to scan the car for codes, when I already know them. If the codes pertain to a problem they'd fix under my warranty, they wouldn't charge me. If not they charge me, how ___ is that. You'd think you'd get treated a little better with having a certified pre-owned warranty, guess not. What the hell is the warranty even worth then. They're gonna try to weasel there way out of ever having to fix anything on the car. I HATE DEALERSHIPS! Sucks for you TWBeck, you have the car with a TSB and they won't even do crap for you. I definitely try running it up the chain. I don't really know how much good it'll do for you, but it's worth a shot. Good luck man.

dexter_5000

printing this tsb now i just had all these codes come up at like 96k miles so go me.

amysxa

I just had those codes come up for the second time(1st time at 14k and now at 60k). I took mine back to the dealer. They tried to charge me $645.00. I said no thank you. My husband ended up emailing the dealer after that and told them how unhappy we were. I also called today and spoke with the general service manager and again told him how unhappy i was. I now have to pay $27 in parts and i'm sure the labor. This seems to be a big problem in no just the xAs but the xBs also. Apparently they have put out a new TSB.

dagarhart

As you can see, I had this issue at 36,800 and they replaced the parts in the TSB. All was good. Now I have about 58,000 and the codes return. I am guessing this is a very poor design.

turtlesworld

I am so irritated with Toyota that this is my first post.

You live in fear that when you bring your Scion to the dealership that they are going to charge you the $98 fee just to look at your car. Course, if it is something that is covered on the warranty, then they won't charge you... but it still sucks not knowing what the stupid CEL is being triggered by.

It is truly disappointing to say that this is the 4th time the CEL has come on. I have a 2006 xA with about 60K miles and have already replaced the whole charcoal canister (and parts) 3 times. What do you think the codes were for the CEL that popped on yesterday? P043E, P043F, P2401, P2402, and P2419. THIS IS A LOAD OF GARBAGE. Fortunately, PepBoys will tell me the codes for free and all I have to do is look them up (which brought me to you guys).

I can't remember off the top of my head the date when the canisters broke, but I can tell you it has been about once a year. The last time was actually about 2 months ago. I WAS ASSURED that this was going to be the last time and that the previous times, it was caused by a FAULTY filter. So when I picked it up the last time, they said there was some special protectant around the filter and that this filter should last for 4-5 years! What a load of garbage!

Don't get me wrong, I love my Scion. I hate having to deal with the dealership and having to fix the filter. This should not be happening. I don't overfill the tank. I turn the car off when I pump gas. Someone at Toyota needs to get their act straight and fix this problem.

I will post my progress with this issue.

turtlesworld

Here is my follow up...

This past Tuesday, I brought my xA to the dealership where all of my warranty repairs have been completed. I had asked to speak with a manager ahead of time, but the lead service rep was the only one available at the time. He included the rep I had worked with 2 months ago for the same problem. I was quickly given a loner car and was on my way.

1 day later, I was called and prompted to pick up my car. When I arrived, it was explained to me that when they involved Toyota, it was realized that Toyota already considered this as a "known issue." Supposedly, 90% of the cars are fine and 10% of them have these ongoing, reoccurring charcoal canister issues. (I was not clear if this was for all Scions, just Scion xAs, or all Toyotas.) I was issued a case file with Toyota in case there are future issues with the charcoal canister. For the 10% of us with this problem, THEY ARE INSTALLING A CUSTOM SHIELD to protect the canister. I am not sure how many times you have to have a problem in order to become part of the 10%, but it is something to be aware of.

Since the first 2 times the charcoal canister broke, I was still within my original 3 year warranty (with Toyota and not Toyota's extended warranty company) and the third time it broke, I was in the extened warranty period, the 2 different parties did not communicate to each other that they were fixing the same problem.

Clearly, this 90/10 situation will not apply to everyone. They state that these charcoal canisters are supposed to last 4-5 years. I have had 4 replacements within 60K miles. However, if you have had a reoccuring issue with this, I would emplore you to escalate the issue to your Toyota service manager.

All I have to say is THANK GOD we purchased the extended warranty.

I still love my Scion xA.

thayer

Found this thread very helpful and wanted to contribute a few bits of info. My xA suffered this problem at ~115k miles at 5 years old (2006 model). First, buy the parts online. The local dealer quoted me ~$500 for all the parts. I found them online (an OEM parts dealer online, who turned out to be another local dealer that would only honor these lower prices if you ordered online, even if you went to pick them up in person...???) for ~$320. Second, the part swap is practically as easy as an oil change. The pump assembly and filter are really easy to access and come off the car by unplugging a few things and undoing 3 bolts. The filler neck parts are easy to replace too, but took me a bit longer since the assembly wasn't shown in any manual. I had to figure out how it was put together; they're simply press fit into the rubber surrounding the parts. Third, the factory service manual has a multi step process to check the function of the pump assembly (the most expensive of the parts at around ~$250) to figure exactly what was wrong with the part, but I didn't bother. I didn't see/hear any water in any of the parts though. Lastly, here are pics of the parts:

Top is the filter and bottom is the pump assembly.



Old filler neck parts, notice the protrusion on the right side. There seem to be drain holes up inside that protrusion.



New filler neck parts installed, notice no protrusion on the right side, but there are still holes there. I don't know how this design can be less prone to having water go down that vent pipe on the left.
If anything, I would think that protrusion on the old part would help keep water from splashing in to this filler neck part...??? If I get this CEL again, I'll examine these parts a little closer, but I was just happy to be done.

profipix

@thayer,
Where did you find all the parts? I have been looking all over the place, these parts are nowhere to be seen!

thayer

If you google "OEM Scion parts", you'll get numerous links to OEM part dealers. Go to one that you like and search for the 4 parts listed in the above threads.
All the dealers seem to work off the same part database. Almost all of them are cheaper than what my local dealer quoted me in person.

I'm in no way recommending these places, but they all come up in a simple web search and seem offer the parts that you need:

http://www.trdsparks.com/
http://www.trademotion.com/partlocat...?siteid=214915
http://www.trademotion.com/partlocat...cfm?siteid=840

______

mnevar

I'm also a lucky winner with an xA and the 5 codes.
I'm trying to buy the parts, but I can't find the canister filter(77706–52011). Does it by chance come with the canister assembly?

profipix

http://www.trdsparks.com/

mnevar

Thanks, but when I search for that part number there, it returns not found. If I search by keyword (using canister), it returns the canister assembly (for $257). Can someone who ordered the canister filter check how they ordered it?

profipix

Also try checking with local junk yards, get the part and if it's no good, most of them offer 30 day warranty.

rhothird

Thayer,

My daughter-in-law's 2006 Scion xA had these codes come up last week. I have the TSB in hand and have found the parts that are listed in the TSB to fix this problem. My question to you is since you have pulled the assembly out, did you notice if there was any way to open it up and perhaps blow out the water or whatever contaminate has gotten into the system to cause it to not perform? Since it's only suppose to handle gas vapor I would imagine something like a liquid in the system might clog up the orifice. Were you able to disect the assembly any to see what makes it tick?

I live in Oklahoma and these codes came up after about a week of a deluge of rain. Either water got into the system through the problem with the filler tube or directly into the charcoal canister assembly, considering where it's positioned, and passing through some of the deep puddles that were on the streets. I read in another post somewhere that someone had recommened making a custom cover for the charcoal canister assembly. We also had some record snowfalls this past winter. They don't plow neighborhood streets here and basically you have to follow tire ruts. The Scion's low profile caused the strip between the ruts to hit the bottom of the car. So, I'm wondering if this may have caused some damage to the canister again considering where it's positioned?

profipix

rhothird,
Looking at the assembly right now, it's sealed up pretty good, so I'm guessing you'd have to break the seal (without any good chance of putting it back together) and take a look. I got mine from the junk yard, we'll see how good that thing goes. ____ed off by Scion by far..