Custom Sub Enclosure Build for 10W6
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Custom Sub Enclosure Build for 10W6
Okay I built my first enclosure with the help of an experienced car audio installer who has been in the business for 25 years.
2012 Scion TC.
System: Pioneer Head Unit, Full dynamat sound deadening, 120 sq ft, Hertz Energy 3 way component fronts, Hertz Energy Coax rears, JL 300/4 amp, JL 500/1 Amp, 10W6v2 Sub, PAC LC1 controler for sub output, knukonceptz wire throughout.
Previous enclosure was a pre-fab tuned to 42 hz...
New enclosure is 38 wide x 13 high x 10 deep, 1.8 CF, Tuned to 31hz, L Port Length 22 total, 1.5 wide at back of box, angled from 1.5" to 2" at opening on the front of the enclosure.
Front speaker crossovers in door, neutral on tweeters, mid set to -2db.
4 channel amp crossover settings 55hz fronts, 60hz rears per hertz specs on speakers
Sub Amp settings, crossover 63hz subsonic 28, gain just bit over half, boost off.
The sub sounds really good but when first connecting it up the bass boost caused too much boom and almost seemed as if the sub was losing control, turned it off.
My initial crossover setting with the old prefab enclosure was 55, but when listening to the new enclosure which was lower tuned it felt like there was almost a gap between the mid and sub, so I bumped up the sub crossover to 63hz which seemed to let it blend much better.
Lastly when the sub level is too high certain frequencies in music seem to boom and lose control and almost have a delay, backing the sub level down seems to cure this, is this normal?
Is it okay, normal to move the subs crossover up a bit higher when the enclosure is tuned lower? Would this also be a main reason people add mid bass drivers to the front? Is it okay to have the sub crossed at 63?
Right now I'm at the listening and tuning phase which consists of driving to work and back and changing the settings slightly each day then listening again until I have things set to where works perfectly for all types of music I listen to and the only adjustment needed at that point is front the center position on the PAC LC1 sub level control to reduce or increase depending on music source.
Have enough material for a 2nd box was considering tuning it to 34 or 35 to see if this would provide better sq, but still thinking about that one and researching more. JL Spec ported box is at 37 with much smaller CF.
Any input, thoughts, advice are definitely appreciated.
Photo's:
http://flic.kr/p/cR7VGL
http://flic.kr/p/cR7VxU
2012 Scion TC.
System: Pioneer Head Unit, Full dynamat sound deadening, 120 sq ft, Hertz Energy 3 way component fronts, Hertz Energy Coax rears, JL 300/4 amp, JL 500/1 Amp, 10W6v2 Sub, PAC LC1 controler for sub output, knukonceptz wire throughout.
Previous enclosure was a pre-fab tuned to 42 hz...
New enclosure is 38 wide x 13 high x 10 deep, 1.8 CF, Tuned to 31hz, L Port Length 22 total, 1.5 wide at back of box, angled from 1.5" to 2" at opening on the front of the enclosure.
Front speaker crossovers in door, neutral on tweeters, mid set to -2db.
4 channel amp crossover settings 55hz fronts, 60hz rears per hertz specs on speakers
Sub Amp settings, crossover 63hz subsonic 28, gain just bit over half, boost off.
The sub sounds really good but when first connecting it up the bass boost caused too much boom and almost seemed as if the sub was losing control, turned it off.
My initial crossover setting with the old prefab enclosure was 55, but when listening to the new enclosure which was lower tuned it felt like there was almost a gap between the mid and sub, so I bumped up the sub crossover to 63hz which seemed to let it blend much better.
Lastly when the sub level is too high certain frequencies in music seem to boom and lose control and almost have a delay, backing the sub level down seems to cure this, is this normal?
Is it okay, normal to move the subs crossover up a bit higher when the enclosure is tuned lower? Would this also be a main reason people add mid bass drivers to the front? Is it okay to have the sub crossed at 63?
Right now I'm at the listening and tuning phase which consists of driving to work and back and changing the settings slightly each day then listening again until I have things set to where works perfectly for all types of music I listen to and the only adjustment needed at that point is front the center position on the PAC LC1 sub level control to reduce or increase depending on music source.
Have enough material for a 2nd box was considering tuning it to 34 or 35 to see if this would provide better sq, but still thinking about that one and researching more. JL Spec ported box is at 37 with much smaller CF.
Any input, thoughts, advice are definitely appreciated.
Photo's:
http://flic.kr/p/cR7VGL
http://flic.kr/p/cR7VxU
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From your post it seems like you care about how your music sounds. That boomy un-controlled bass you talk about is because of the vented enclosure. A sealed enclosure will give you a flatter response across a larger spread so you can pick your LFP up to @80-100hz. Sealed enclosures give a tighter, controlled and precise bass. Vented is more "efficient" for getting loud and low, but lacks musical refinement.
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I actually figured it out, the gain on the JL 500/1 was set to high, dropped it back just a little and everything smoothed out completely, it's back to perfect again, you can get good sq from a ported box just have to choose the right driver, enclosure, amp and tuning/settings. I will say sealed is easier to build thats for certain, but then if you want it louder then you have to up your amp power, once you start pushing higher watts/amps then you have to worry about the electrical system/alternator/batteries.
Everything has it's pro's and cons that's for certain.
The system sounds really good now after some more tuning tonigt. I'm extremely happy with it. I'm giving thought to replacing the rear speakers with 8" mid bass drivers... but that will be down the road.
Everything has it's pro's and cons that's for certain.
The system sounds really good now after some more tuning tonigt. I'm extremely happy with it. I'm giving thought to replacing the rear speakers with 8" mid bass drivers... but that will be down the road.
Last edited by Rob2012TC; Aug 16, 2012 at 07:12 AM.
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From your post it seems like you care about how your music sounds. That boomy un-controlled bass you talk about is because of the vented enclosure. A sealed enclosure will give you a flatter response across a larger spread so you can pick your LFP up to @80-100hz. Sealed enclosures give a tighter, controlled and precise bass. Vented is more "efficient" for getting loud and low, but lacks musical refinement.
An appropriately tuned ported enclosure with a good subwoofer can be more musical and also allow you to deepen the range of the sub.
An advantage of a sealed box is that with higher power on the sub, the air cushion prevents the motor from botoming out under excursion. Another advatage is that the box is much simpler to design and build.
A ported sub enclosure will frequently require a port length greater than any of the boxes lengths and nessasariliy make the cunstruction more difficult as you will have to turn it around a corner and compensate for the displacement of the port.
Most folks with strong leanings to sound q on bass go for a infinite baffle set up as it will be very detailed and have low power requirements. However that isn't a realistic option in a hatchback as there is not trunk to seal off from the cabin to make the "infinite" baffle enclosure.
Fortunately a small cabin hatchback like ours can benefit from quite a bit of cabin gain, especially with the big rear window reflecting all of the soundwaves.
I am glad that Rob2012TC figured out that his gain was set too high.
You mentioned swapping out the rear speakers for mid bass drivers and I don't recommend that. Mid bass can be directionally identified, unlike sub bass, especially when vocals dip down into that range. This can muddy your sound stage. I know you said that you've fully deadened the car, but did you seal the doors properly?
Those hertz speakers should be capable of some glorious mid bass, provided their back waves are sealed out of the cabin properly. I am using a pair of 8" speakers as midbass from 400hz down to 63hz and they can handle going lower and the bass from them alone is quite good.
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Good post Jericho. I really played with the software and worked with an installer that has competed and has 25 years of experience. We used three different software applications and looked at everything, I went over this for a week actually before finally deciding on what I wanted. It worked out extremely well. I see your point about replacing the rears with mid bass drivers changing the sound stage and will stay away from that. The Hertz are amazing speakers, very detailed and your correct with getting good mid bass from the long throw drivers in the door. I'm going to leave the system as is, I have the doors sealed well, sound deadening on the outside and inside skins. Everyone that has heard the system can't believe how amazing it sounds.
Nopi is coming up soon, will be definitely going, really want see and hear other car systems so I have something to compare mine to. To date I haven't found anyone in my area that has anything I can compare mine to.
I have considered changing the 6.5 drivers in the door from the hertz 6.5's to 8's or 6x9's. But it sounds really good as is so I just don't know if I want to go through the trouble of doing it.
I also agree with your observation on people giving ported boxes a bad rap in the SQ world. Most of the time people with ported boxes are going for SPL, or will have off the shelf smaller boxes that are tuned higher as you have said. They just don't want to spend the extra money involved with getting a custom tuned box that matches up with the sub they purchased, or they will buy a sub woofer that is designed more for SPL.
Sealed enclosures are more forgiving but even then you need to check or go custom to insure you have the correct size enclosure and internal volume for the driver you are using.
Nopi is coming up soon, will be definitely going, really want see and hear other car systems so I have something to compare mine to. To date I haven't found anyone in my area that has anything I can compare mine to.
I have considered changing the 6.5 drivers in the door from the hertz 6.5's to 8's or 6x9's. But it sounds really good as is so I just don't know if I want to go through the trouble of doing it.
I also agree with your observation on people giving ported boxes a bad rap in the SQ world. Most of the time people with ported boxes are going for SPL, or will have off the shelf smaller boxes that are tuned higher as you have said. They just don't want to spend the extra money involved with getting a custom tuned box that matches up with the sub they purchased, or they will buy a sub woofer that is designed more for SPL.
Sealed enclosures are more forgiving but even then you need to check or go custom to insure you have the correct size enclosure and internal volume for the driver you are using.
Last edited by Rob2012TC; Aug 20, 2012 at 12:36 AM.
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In the end, what sounds "good" is subjective. I would liken it to what tastes better, Budweiser or Guinness. A lot of it depends on what type of music you're listening to also. If you're a fan of Skrillex and Lady Gaga then a ported box is more often than not a better choice. Even the harder stuff like Metallica and Linkin Park will sound good.
I listen to a lot of blues and classical, so I like my subs to play a little higher and tighter.
The problem with shop built enclosures is that most of the time its a run of the mill slot port box. Chances are it will be better than a pre-fab, but no where near being custom tuned for your vehicle. Proper sound staging takes lots of time and money.
I listen to a lot of blues and classical, so I like my subs to play a little higher and tighter.
The problem with shop built enclosures is that most of the time its a run of the mill slot port box. Chances are it will be better than a pre-fab, but no where near being custom tuned for your vehicle. Proper sound staging takes lots of time and money.
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I agree on the sounding good being objective, it also depends on the source music and how it was mastered. I have older rock music that just doesn't have the same quality of sound as newer rock due to how it was mastered. I mostly listen to Rock, Dub step, Trance and a bit of easy listening once in awhile so the ported box works well for me in my system. If you buy higher end equipment and set it up right it will sound good and can be easily tuned with just a few settings to make almost anyone happy. I'm my own worse critic when it comes to my equipment but it gets to a point to where I'm happy with it and don't want to spend more money or go completely overboard... I have enough in the system now!
I'm am also going to build a sealed enclosure here soon just so I can put it in the car and listen to the difference and compare it to what I have now. Who knows I may end up changing my mind.
I'm am also going to build a sealed enclosure here soon just so I can put it in the car and listen to the difference and compare it to what I have now. Who knows I may end up changing my mind.
Last edited by Rob2012TC; Aug 21, 2012 at 07:19 AM.
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