A Story of Three Motor Mounts (GGP, TS, OEM)
12-19-2011, 05:40 PM
#1
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A Story of Three Motor Mounts (GGP, TS, OEM)
Hello ladies & gents,
1) GGP Motor Mount is probably the way to go. I purchased mine from Geoffrey Pakis at NurSpec -- excellent customer service there, by the way. The quality of construction appears to be top-notch, and overall it's more substantial than the TS mount. The GGP mount arrives with two sets of bushings, one set at 70 durometer hardness, the other at 88dm. Inside the car with the 88dm bushings, you'd swear you're in a V8. The sound and vibrations are muscular and convincing, and the engine doesn't flop around noticeably in the engine bay. The 88dm bushings will expose you to a level of vibration you might not be comfortable with for extended cross-country excursions, however. Step out of the vehicle and your body will be quivering. With the 70dm bushings, the ride is quieter and vibrations are reduced markedly. Doesn't sound anything like a V8, though. Still, much better than stock sound, and the engine isn't flopping around as much as with the stock mount. This represents a good compromise, IMO, for a daily driver. Swap in the 88dm bushings whenever you want that experience, however -- with the right tools, it doesn't take more than 15 minutes to go back & forth.
2) The TS motor mount (acquired from the good people at THMotorSports) arrives with one set of bushings, at 75dm hardness. Curiously, the bushings and mount don't fit flush with each other, as I would have expected them to, leading me to believe either I received the wrong product, or TS quality control is lacking. THMotorSports assures me I was sent the correct product, but ultimately Torque Solution would know this, but I can't get ahold of them. As I am not confident in the craftsmanship of the mount/bushing combo I received, I can't give you useful thoughts on this mount, except to say that I tried to contact Torque Solution on multiple occasions to have them answer some questions I had, but they never got back to me. At one point I spoke with Mike, at Torque Solution, who sounded like he was attending a NASCAR race and as such couldn't speak to me conveniently at that time. He promised to call me right back, but never did. Several polite e-mails to Torque Solution were similarly un-replied-to. In any event, the vibration and noise level of the TS mount/bushings were slightly higher and more muscular than the GGP mount w/ 70dm bushings, but my impression is that the TS motor mount permitted just slightly more engine flop vs. GGP w/ 70dm bushings. I'm not sure why that would be.
3) The OEM motor mount is just sad; it's clearly bettered by both the GGP and TS mounts. If you've never driven a car with a firm motor mount then don't know what you're missing, as you have no point of reference. The OEM mount is super quiet, soft, allows the engine to flop around like a fish on the deck of a slicked-up boat.
With a firm motor mount, as an example, driving through the parking lot at slow speeds, the experience is smooth and steady, not urch urch urch urch like with the stock motor mount where the engine is flopping around and continually dispensing with and taking up slack. With the engine more fixed in its position, you get more immediate power to the ground, as the engine doesn't have to twist itself around first, and then twist the driveshaft & tires. This rigidness is applicable to any sudden change in power, whether it be between gears while shifting, where there's a momentary disconnect which permits the engine to rock back to its normal position, or starting off from a stop, or whatever. You want the engine to sit still, and the tires to move, not the other way around. Firm motor mount is the only way to do this. The difference is palpable.
In conclusion, I can whole-heartedly endorse the GGP motor mount and bushings. I won't speak good or ill of the TS mount, at least not with 100% conviction, because I'm honestly not sure what I've got here. I will say this about Torque Solution -- despite my repeated attempts to reach somebody there with questions, they never got back to me. I was very patient, as I wanted to post as fully informed a review as I could, but a month has gone by and I've given up waiting. If anybody else with the TS mount could post a picture of it installed in their vehicle, I'd appreciate it. In the meantime, I'll be using the GGP motor mount with 70dm bushings, swapping in the 88dm bushings when I feel like going commando.
-John
1) GGP Motor Mount is probably the way to go. I purchased mine from Geoffrey Pakis at NurSpec -- excellent customer service there, by the way. The quality of construction appears to be top-notch, and overall it's more substantial than the TS mount. The GGP mount arrives with two sets of bushings, one set at 70 durometer hardness, the other at 88dm. Inside the car with the 88dm bushings, you'd swear you're in a V8. The sound and vibrations are muscular and convincing, and the engine doesn't flop around noticeably in the engine bay. The 88dm bushings will expose you to a level of vibration you might not be comfortable with for extended cross-country excursions, however. Step out of the vehicle and your body will be quivering. With the 70dm bushings, the ride is quieter and vibrations are reduced markedly. Doesn't sound anything like a V8, though. Still, much better than stock sound, and the engine isn't flopping around as much as with the stock mount. This represents a good compromise, IMO, for a daily driver. Swap in the 88dm bushings whenever you want that experience, however -- with the right tools, it doesn't take more than 15 minutes to go back & forth.
2) The TS motor mount (acquired from the good people at THMotorSports) arrives with one set of bushings, at 75dm hardness. Curiously, the bushings and mount don't fit flush with each other, as I would have expected them to, leading me to believe either I received the wrong product, or TS quality control is lacking. THMotorSports assures me I was sent the correct product, but ultimately Torque Solution would know this, but I can't get ahold of them. As I am not confident in the craftsmanship of the mount/bushing combo I received, I can't give you useful thoughts on this mount, except to say that I tried to contact Torque Solution on multiple occasions to have them answer some questions I had, but they never got back to me. At one point I spoke with Mike, at Torque Solution, who sounded like he was attending a NASCAR race and as such couldn't speak to me conveniently at that time. He promised to call me right back, but never did. Several polite e-mails to Torque Solution were similarly un-replied-to. In any event, the vibration and noise level of the TS mount/bushings were slightly higher and more muscular than the GGP mount w/ 70dm bushings, but my impression is that the TS motor mount permitted just slightly more engine flop vs. GGP w/ 70dm bushings. I'm not sure why that would be.
3) The OEM motor mount is just sad; it's clearly bettered by both the GGP and TS mounts. If you've never driven a car with a firm motor mount then don't know what you're missing, as you have no point of reference. The OEM mount is super quiet, soft, allows the engine to flop around like a fish on the deck of a slicked-up boat.
With a firm motor mount, as an example, driving through the parking lot at slow speeds, the experience is smooth and steady, not urch urch urch urch like with the stock motor mount where the engine is flopping around and continually dispensing with and taking up slack. With the engine more fixed in its position, you get more immediate power to the ground, as the engine doesn't have to twist itself around first, and then twist the driveshaft & tires. This rigidness is applicable to any sudden change in power, whether it be between gears while shifting, where there's a momentary disconnect which permits the engine to rock back to its normal position, or starting off from a stop, or whatever. You want the engine to sit still, and the tires to move, not the other way around. Firm motor mount is the only way to do this. The difference is palpable.
In conclusion, I can whole-heartedly endorse the GGP motor mount and bushings. I won't speak good or ill of the TS mount, at least not with 100% conviction, because I'm honestly not sure what I've got here. I will say this about Torque Solution -- despite my repeated attempts to reach somebody there with questions, they never got back to me. I was very patient, as I wanted to post as fully informed a review as I could, but a month has gone by and I've given up waiting. If anybody else with the TS mount could post a picture of it installed in their vehicle, I'd appreciate it. In the meantime, I'll be using the GGP motor mount with 70dm bushings, swapping in the 88dm bushings when I feel like going commando.
-John
12-19-2011, 06:06 PM
#3
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I have the ts one and it works great. Its probably not flush because there may be air between the bushings. Just pull the metal sleeve out put the bushings on and then the sleeve and it should be fine. Great review
12-19-2011, 06:43 PM
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Look at the GGP motor mount for a picture of how what a flush fit should be. Flush all over, everywhere. With the TS, I can have the gap on one side, or the other, or a small gap on both sides, but a gap nonetheless must remain somewhere. I could push the bushing one way or another, it won't address the central issue which is that the whole motor mount + bushings just isn't wide enough to fit flush.
12-19-2011, 06:52 PM
#9
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Will get back to you guys on a link/price shortly. At present, I'm not finding it on their web site, which is www.nurspec.com.
12-19-2011, 07:17 PM
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Look at the GGP motor mount for a picture of how what a flush fit should be. Flush all over, everywhere. With the TS, I can have the gap on one side, or the other, or a small gap on both sides, but a gap nonetheless must remain somewhere. I could push the bushing one way or another, it won't address the central issue which is that the whole motor mount + bushings just isn't wide enough to fit flush.
12-19-2011, 08:11 PM
#11
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The GPP bushings are separate as well, one for each side of the motor mount.
Air isn't my problem here. The bushings were completely flush to the motor mount itself prior to installation. Tightening the mount That would still leave the bushing making no contact on the right hand side.
Air isn't my problem here. The bushings were completely flush to the motor mount itself prior to installation. Tightening the mount That would still leave the bushing making no contact on the right hand side.
Last edited by johnmk; 12-19-2011 at 08:45 PM.
12-19-2011, 10:45 PM
#13
I'm probably going to try this one out. The TS mount I had to modify so it didn't make a horrible squeaking noise (much like the sound of a serp belt going bad). I had to cut down the sleeve and grease the bushings. It's fine now, but for something as simple as a front motormount, I shouldn't have to go through the trouble. Especially, for it's price tag.
Great info. Thanks.
Great info. Thanks.
12-21-2011, 01:48 PM
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12-21-2011, 04:28 PM
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Thanks for the kind words johnmk 
I can's speak for the TS mount, but you might be able to tap the mount with a dead blow hammer to seat that bushing a little bit better. If there is no more room for it to move you could probably get away with taking out both inserts and trimming off an 1/8 of an inch from each one. Trimming will most likely result is a voided product warranty. Again, this is my opinion only. Contact TS before doing anything like this to get the real answer.
The mount cannot be found on the nurspec site. Give me a call at 602-284-6033 and I will try to get one out same day.
tC1 65 shipped
xB2 or tC2 85 shipped
Comes with both sets of inserts
Sorry for the delay in any responses. My sister just had the first baby in the family.
Too young to get him in a shifter cart?
Some additional photos for you guys
"The GGP Engineering benchmarks adhere to the highest standards of quality.
• Extremely close tolerance – Our designers and technicians measure to the thousandths to ensure precision fitment.
• Only USA manufactured parts, material and labor.
• We utilize only the highest grade of tool steel, aircraft grade alloy, and component pieces.
• Designed and engineered by experts –aiming to meet and exceed customer expectations targeting ease of installation.
• Life time limited warranty of all GGP Engineering products
• NO COMPROMISE ON QUALITY
Front lower motor mount tC1, tC2, xB2
When preparing your Scion for club racing, autocross or spirited street driving, eliminating flex in the drive train is a top priority. This innovative product helps deliver full power to the wheels. The GGP Engineering motor mounts are constructed under the highest standards of quality and precision.
The mount is machined from aircraft grade 6061-T6 aluminum and paired with the perfect formulation of polyurethane co-developed with Energy Suspension® to withstand high horsepower and high torque applications. Designed using sophisticated CAD/CAM engineering software, this component provides the utmost in strength and fit while adhering to strict ISO 9000 quality standards.
This mount is not required to be pressed into the factory housing. Simply bolt in the factory location using your OEM hardware. This mount it computer engineered and track proven!"
I can's speak for the TS mount, but you might be able to tap the mount with a dead blow hammer to seat that bushing a little bit better. If there is no more room for it to move you could probably get away with taking out both inserts and trimming off an 1/8 of an inch from each one. Trimming will most likely result is a voided product warranty. Again, this is my opinion only. Contact TS before doing anything like this to get the real answer.
The mount cannot be found on the nurspec site. Give me a call at 602-284-6033 and I will try to get one out same day.
tC1 65 shipped
xB2 or tC2 85 shipped
Comes with both sets of inserts
Sorry for the delay in any responses. My sister just had the first baby in the family.
Too young to get him in a shifter cart?
Some additional photos for you guys
"The GGP Engineering benchmarks adhere to the highest standards of quality.
• Extremely close tolerance – Our designers and technicians measure to the thousandths to ensure precision fitment.
• Only USA manufactured parts, material and labor.
• We utilize only the highest grade of tool steel, aircraft grade alloy, and component pieces.
• Designed and engineered by experts –aiming to meet and exceed customer expectations targeting ease of installation.
• Life time limited warranty of all GGP Engineering products
• NO COMPROMISE ON QUALITY
Front lower motor mount tC1, tC2, xB2
When preparing your Scion for club racing, autocross or spirited street driving, eliminating flex in the drive train is a top priority. This innovative product helps deliver full power to the wheels. The GGP Engineering motor mounts are constructed under the highest standards of quality and precision.
The mount is machined from aircraft grade 6061-T6 aluminum and paired with the perfect formulation of polyurethane co-developed with Energy Suspension® to withstand high horsepower and high torque applications. Designed using sophisticated CAD/CAM engineering software, this component provides the utmost in strength and fit while adhering to strict ISO 9000 quality standards.
This mount is not required to be pressed into the factory housing. Simply bolt in the factory location using your OEM hardware. This mount it computer engineered and track proven!"
12-22-2011, 05:43 PM
#18
Hey everyone, just ordered my GGP motor mount from nurspec. I like the idea of being able to switch from the same stiffness as TS for daily driving, and then much more stiff for when my girlfriends out of town 