Before you guys start dismissing what i'm saying. Because i don't determine the exact COG of the box doesn't mean i don't know its not top heavy, regardless of the roof. Also, one of the tC's set ups was far more envolved than mine and i still beat him a total of about 3.xx minutes overall times.

Let's stop looking at what i drive, to be good at autocross, majority of skill. Thats obvious, but with skill comes with learning how to act when the car reacts, controlling your car and so on. It sounds to me some of you are almost starting to try and disprove what i'm saying simily because i drive a box and my COG statement. And all i said about it was i'd let raam go on about it because i'm not a very good in dept explainer with things along the lines of this..and still keeping it user friendly.

I get too much crap on some of the threads for nothing.

 

probably because your entire post had not one complete sentence in it?



but honestly, look at the HP/weight differences of the xB and the tC.. that alone should tell you how badly the tC sucks :D

 

If weight is almost everything in autox then the tc should'nt be compared or be competing with xa's or xb's anyway. Maybe i'll go get a shifter cart and race xa's and xb's.

 

life isn't fair.. if the tC guys dont like being in Hstock (which by the way is BOTTOM OF THE BARREL STOCK CLASS) then they can go back to Gstock where they honestly belong...

which means you're up against John Cooper Works MINI's :D hahahaha

 

here's the egg last year up in Ft Pierce FL.. street tires..
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...94586&q=tamago

 

So the "real" question is: Is the tc really unfit to be competitive due to poor balance and weight OR is it just that no one has set one up right yet?

Keep in mind
A: most people here are interested in street touring or street modified
B: tc coilovers with seperate height and spring rate settings are just now be developed/released

I'll really be disgusted with my ride if I spend a couple thousand dollars to set it up to race then have my @$$ handed to me by inferior drivers in superior cars. I decided to try autox in the first place because it supposedly tests driver skill not car prowess. Tc should be competing against similar weight/displacement vehicles like the mazda3/focus.

 

trust me, inferior drivers are the least of your worries.. superior drivers in inferior cars will be your biggest worry.

dude, you can't get any lower than Hstock.. and FSP is a faster class than STS (look up times from last years national events.. ) you dont want to be in FSP.. you'll get beat buy MKI rabbits, ITC legal 510's and even Focus's.

 

Actually superior drivers are the least of my worries...lack of autox experience is a handicap that can be overcome in time. An incapable car is a handicap that cannot be overcome. I "think" STS is the best place for a tc because it allows suspension mods that a tc severly needs without allowing extensive engine work(tc already has a nice strong torque curve). If your comparing a fully race tuned xa with a incompetently tuned tc then your comparison is invalid. If you have some facts that prove your position then i'd really like to see them. Otherwise your just spewing a bunch of hot air. A couple of you have come on here bashing the tc. Your points may be valid. If they are-give some proof. Saying some local dipsh!t that can't drive to start with and has a poorly tuned tc is way slower than you proves nothing. I could beat a formula car in my tc if the driver were incompetent enough. Does that mean a tc is faster than a formula? Hell no. It proves nothing. Fact=proof not personal opinion. As far as I know you tc bashers don't know your @$$ from a whole in the ground. Trust you:Yeah right! If you can't back it up it must be B.S.

 

No way. You get just enough!

Tomago is right though scholar. (IMO). By the time you are a good enough driver that the tC is whats holding you back, you will be in a position to get another car. The tC is a good car, and a fine car to learn on. It should not be considered "uncompetetive" but its definitely not the class dominator.

 

neither is the xA/B the class dominator. in Hstock, your main worry is most likely an older honda civic SI.

scholarbb, you're so hung up on people calling the tC "crappy" that you think i'm saying the same thing, which i'm not. driver skill accounts for a very very large part in autocross. how else would you explain a STOCK subaru STI (an ASTOCK car btw) posting FTD (fastest time of the day) against beasts such as fully built, race prepped Camaros, insanely fast Z06's, and AWD 500HP Audi S4s? ... the driver is the key.

there are three things that make you fast in any race.

seat time

seat time

SEAT TIME.

good luck with the tC, you'll enjoy the car, no matter how badly you suck at first. just feel lucky that you got classed in HSTOCK and not Gstock, cuz you'll NEVER see a trophy there

 

AIGHT i'll take that. Forgive me if I have a hard time believing that I suck as a driver though. But if it makes yall feel better go on and believe.

 

Okay, this will probably be my last post since i'm leaving the community...

I never said the tC was a crappy car, what i said was the tC isn't ideal for autocross..Obviously it can be, look at what raam is doing but the average buyer, even beyond that is not going to put that much time in effort into their tC and make it a pretty much full blown track car thats still driveable and showable.

I also never said the xb/xa were cars that could just kill anything on the track, obviously there are a good amount of cars we can't beat. But its much more ideal than the tC on a stock platform without doing major modifications.

I get just enough crap? Okay, you don't like what i have to say about the tC fine, but that is just what i have gathered from personal experience and others experiences, combine that with my knowledge of the car i'm not going to say sorry for not pleasing you or anyone else. But i don't think that should justify giving me crap either just because of what i drive and i don't personally own ___ car. Tons of people on here make fun of cars on here all the time, but when it comes down to criticize their own car it gets personal.

Also, when have i ever said the tC was crappy? It's obvious it can become a drag queen, i give it respect and support when i feel support is due.

Think i'm hating the tC all you want, if thats the case then you are reading into what i'm saying wrong. I'm done. Have fun and stay safe.

 

If i have s-techs along w/ 18's would that be bad to try and get into autox

 

aside from the 18's i'd say you're OK.. 18's will be pretty scary in the cones.

 

Hows that? What can happen? sorry im new to this

 

no, glad you asked..

the problem with plus sizing wheels is that you end up with shorter sidewalls.. most people think this is a good thing, and in some cases it is, however, in my opinion, once you pass the 50series tire, your sidewall flex is pretty much minimal, so the shorter it is, the closer to the ground your beautiful 18's are, and more likely you'll roll a tire off the rim. may not be a problem, but on bumpy/hilly terrain, i've seen some very nice wheels ruined.

 

 

The solution to that is to bump up the tire pressure for the day. Most novices haven't had a high camber alignment so their wheels are going totally positive in corners which not only totally ruins the size of your contact patch and causes all your grip to go away, but also increases the sidewall rollover in the process. Put 40-45 psi in the tires before your runs and your sidewalls will stay intact with ease. Remember to put the pressure back to normal at the end of the day though

If you come back for more, you'll want to play with your tire pressures to find out what the tire likes for best performance. Also if you want to come back for more, you'll want a new alignment. The factory specs are designed for long tire life and understeer from hell. Cranking a couple of extra degrees of negative camber into the front and rear will make a world of difference in lateral traction - and reduce the risk of sidewall rollover at the same time.

 

in addition to what GrantR said...

to reduce understeer, only add camber to the front...

 

Ok everybody, let's play nice.

I remember in the early '90s I autocrossed my stock Mazda B2000 pickup, because that's all I had and I loved to race. I never won my class, but it was nice to occasionally beat Joe Novice in his Porsche.

Not many people can afford to have a dedicated autocross car, and I feel lucky now that I can. But I spent 10 years autocrossing inferior cars until I could by a new Neon ACR. And once you get a competitive car and some other drivers who are equal to you, THAT's when you really get a chance to step up your game.

Seat time makes you faster, but competition is also necessary. You can have the best car in your class and be a good driver, but if there are no other drivers in your class at your level or higher, you will never get better.

That's where autocross schools can help too. Here in the Wash. DC area, we have dozens of schools each year, at level 1, 2 or 3. They are taught by nationally competitive drivers, give you 20 or more runs in the day, and are the best way to quickly improve your skills.