ding dong the witch is dead
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IMO, I think it's a sin to assume you know God's will. By nature, we are imperfect and incapable.
To assume God's will is to assume yourself to BE God. I think it is the worst sin you can commit.
I live my life constantly trying to learn, always assuming that I could be wrong, and trying to consider the alternatives. Even the Bible (supposedly) sent down from God is published, printed, and edited by people. Anybody ever play the "telephone" game?
My advice to people... Use the tools God (or Ala or evolution or whatever) have you (reason and logic) and make the best decisions you can. Do the most with what you have and have faith that you can do good if you put your mind to it. So long as you never become arrogant (as we are ALL imperfect, atheism or not), you should do well.
In a world with so much confusion and misleading paths, I'm fairly confident that God will be understanding. If not, well I wouldn't want a part in THAT heaven. Although I alwys give the benefit of the doubt, I'll stand up for what I think is right, even if it means eternal damnation.
Jesus would sacrifice himself for what is right, and that's the lesson I take away from him.
To assume God's will is to assume yourself to BE God. I think it is the worst sin you can commit.
I live my life constantly trying to learn, always assuming that I could be wrong, and trying to consider the alternatives. Even the Bible (supposedly) sent down from God is published, printed, and edited by people. Anybody ever play the "telephone" game?
My advice to people... Use the tools God (or Ala or evolution or whatever) have you (reason and logic) and make the best decisions you can. Do the most with what you have and have faith that you can do good if you put your mind to it. So long as you never become arrogant (as we are ALL imperfect, atheism or not), you should do well.
In a world with so much confusion and misleading paths, I'm fairly confident that God will be understanding. If not, well I wouldn't want a part in THAT heaven. Although I alwys give the benefit of the doubt, I'll stand up for what I think is right, even if it means eternal damnation.
Jesus would sacrifice himself for what is right, and that's the lesson I take away from him.
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Originally Posted by nameless_ak
ohh and somthing about church bs, you said where do you expect me to have learned stuff from the late show?
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Originally Posted by duck_dodgers_24_5
Originally Posted by Jenna
Originally Posted by duck_dodgers_24_5
how did he die for me when i wasn't even born yet???
cause i wanna see this scripture
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Originally Posted by seattledave
Originally Posted by nameless_ak
ohh and somthing about church bs, you said where do you expect me to have learned stuff from the late show?
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Originally Posted by nameless_ak
you guys must have really fast internet. ok jenna If someone is trying to live a pure life and then falls back into sin and they do not repent then yes they are going to hell, they have to realize that they are sinning (which they probably allready know) then they have to be sorry they did and repent, Another key point is that Jesus was a man and lived on earth and was tempted he knows what it is like Jesus and God because they are the trinity plus the hs, they understand sin is hard to get out of. God will help you get out of sin and know what is sin he gave you a concience (sp?) you know when you are messing up, and as far as why did God have to send jesus to die, God set rules in the begining of time there is good and there is bad (evil) satain is evil if we do evil we are accepting we want satains ways so we die we go to him we want Gods ways we go to him, that part seems easy, before jesus died (the old testament) people had to make sacrifices to purify themselves, because adam sinned in the beginning he gave satain the "keys" just stay with me, when jesus died he died without sin and was killed overall by satain working through people satain broke the rules, jesus took the "keys" back and now we have access to God, i know it sounds complicated but it takes time to reallly understand how everything works, but you will learn that on your journey to know God. there is simply not enough space and time for me to explain everything, but what you do need to know is that God loves you agape love.
I'll make this easier on me.
The bolded bits:
Why the hoops we must jump through? Why did he decide to torture a man so that we may be "forgiven" for our sin? Furthermore, why did he decide so many things in life are sinful and why did he decide that they'd be ever so tempting?
I can understand not killing people. I can understand the need to forgive people. I do not understand why, if I chose to do so, it would be a sin if I desired to kiss a woman and did so. I can see why breaking the law is a sin but I don't see why breaking a little teeny law can be the same sin as killing someone. I don't see why, if I were a Christian, I would go to hell for knowingly sinning by littering gum wrappers on the ground. (I am still not cool with the "all the sins are the same" thing).
The italiced bit:
I went to Christian school for 8 years. Every single day of school we had an hour long Bible class or an hour long Chapel.
I never thought to ask all the things I wonder about these days back then. However, I do remember a lot of any explanation on the "who what when where and whys" came as "you got to just have faith" or "there are some things we just cannot understand". I don't know if I like that.
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Originally Posted by seattledave
Originally Posted by nameless_ak
you guys must have really fast internet. ok jenna If someone is trying to live a pure life and then falls back into sin and they do not repent then yes they are going to hell, they have to realize that they are sinning (which they probably allready know) then they have to be sorry they did and repent,
Heaven or Hell?
Originally Posted by nameless_ak
Another key point is that Jesus was a man and lived on earth and was tempted he knows what it is like
did you make up that key analogy? pretty impressive if you did.
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it doesn't make sense if you believe in the holy trinity, that jesus dying on the cross meant squat.
No real death actually accured, and what kind of sacrifice is it if you know the future, and know you'll come back to life minutes later?
the only thing i can see that happened was jesus took in some brutal pain. Would it really be a sacrifice for me if I gave my son to die, if I knew he'd come back to life with superpowers?
No real death actually accured, and what kind of sacrifice is it if you know the future, and know you'll come back to life minutes later?
the only thing i can see that happened was jesus took in some brutal pain. Would it really be a sacrifice for me if I gave my son to die, if I knew he'd come back to life with superpowers?
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Originally Posted by nameless_ak
your second question know jesus did not have sex, and no he did not get drunk he said not to get drunk allthough he did drink wine, and no he did not lust, he was tempted to do all those things (being tempted is not sin acting upon that temptation is sin.) and what analogy are you talking about?
the one were adam hands over the keys to satan and jesus get's them back
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Originally Posted by Jenna
Originally Posted by nameless_ak
you guys must have really fast internet. ok jenna If someone is trying to live a pure life and then falls back into sin and they do not repent then yes they are going to hell, they have to realize that they are sinning (which they probably allready know) then they have to be sorry they did and repent, Another key point is that Jesus was a man and lived on earth and was tempted he knows what it is like Jesus and God because they are the trinity plus the hs, they understand sin is hard to get out of. God will help you get out of sin and know what is sin he gave you a concience (sp?) you know when you are messing up, and as far as why did God have to send jesus to die, God set rules in the begining of time there is good and there is bad (evil) satain is evil if we do evil we are accepting we want satains ways so we die we go to him we want Gods ways we go to him, that part seems easy, before jesus died (the old testament) people had to make sacrifices to purify themselves, because adam sinned in the beginning he gave satain the "keys" just stay with me, when jesus died he died without sin and was killed overall by satain working through people satain broke the rules, jesus took the "keys" back and now we have access to God, i know it sounds complicated but it takes time to reallly understand how everything works, but you will learn that on your journey to know God. there is simply not enough space and time for me to explain everything, but what you do need to know is that God loves you agape love.
I'll make this easier on me.
The bolded bits:
Why the hoops we must jump through? Why did he decide to torture a man so that we may be "forgiven" for our sin? Furthermore, why did he decide so many things in life are sinful and why did he decide that they'd be ever so tempting?
I can understand not killing people. I can understand the need to forgive people. I do not understand why, if I chose to do so, it would be a sin if I desired to kiss a woman and did so. I can see why breaking the law is a sin but I don't see why breaking a little teeny law can be the same sin as killing someone. I don't see why, if I were a Christian, I would go to hell for knowingly sinning by littering gum wrappers on the ground. (I am still not cool with the "all the sins are the same" thing).
The italiced bit:
I went to Christian school for 8 years. Every single day of school we had an hour long Bible class or an hour long Chapel.
I never thought to ask all the things I wonder about these days back then. However, I do remember a lot of any explanation on the "who what when where and whys" came as "you got to just have faith" or "there are some things we just cannot understand". I don't know if I like that.
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Originally Posted by seattledave
it doesn't make sense if you believe in the holy trinity, that jesus dying on the cross meant squat.
No real death actually accured, and what kind of sacrifice is it if you know the future, and know you'll come back to life minutes later?
the only thing i can see that happened was jesus took in some brutal pain. Would it really be a sacrifice for me if I gave my son to die, if I knew he'd come back to life with superpowers?
No real death actually accured, and what kind of sacrifice is it if you know the future, and know you'll come back to life minutes later?
the only thing i can see that happened was jesus took in some brutal pain. Would it really be a sacrifice for me if I gave my son to die, if I knew he'd come back to life with superpowers?
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I wonder if Christian teenaged boys ever make it into heaven. I doubt many can resist the urge of spilling their seed on a daily (or more) basis. Of all the things to make sinful...
All those fine Christian women who wear makeup.
All those Christians who don't have 17 children and use birth control.
All those Christian women who do up their hair (in braids in particular) or wear jewelry.
The women who do not remain silent in church; who do not instead wait and then ask their husband their question at home.
Seattledave... I triple dog dare you to make a new post about odd Bible verse and laws.
All those fine Christian women who wear makeup.
All those Christians who don't have 17 children and use birth control.
All those Christian women who do up their hair (in braids in particular) or wear jewelry.
The women who do not remain silent in church; who do not instead wait and then ask their husband their question at home.
Seattledave... I triple dog dare you to make a new post about odd Bible verse and laws.
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Originally Posted by seattledave
Originally Posted by nameless_ak
your second question know jesus did not have sex, and no he did not get drunk he said not to get drunk allthough he did drink wine, and no he did not lust, he was tempted to do all those things (being tempted is not sin acting upon that temptation is sin.) and what analogy are you talking about?
the one were adam hands over the keys to satan and jesus get's them back
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Originally Posted by Jenna
I wonder if Christian teenaged boys ever make it into heaven. I doubt many can resist the urge of spilling their seed on a daily (or more) basis. Of all the things to make sinful...
All those fine Christian women who wear makeup.
All those Christians who don't have 17 children and use birth control.
All those Christian women who do up their hair (in braids in particular) or wear jewelry.
The women who do not remain silent in church; who do not instead wait and then ask their husband their question at home.
Seattledave... I triple dog dare you to make a new post about odd Bible verse and laws.
All those fine Christian women who wear makeup.
All those Christians who don't have 17 children and use birth control.
All those Christian women who do up their hair (in braids in particular) or wear jewelry.
The women who do not remain silent in church; who do not instead wait and then ask their husband their question at home.
Seattledave... I triple dog dare you to make a new post about odd Bible verse and laws.
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Originally Posted by nameless_ak
im not sure what your gettin at with the trinity thing, but as for the other part yes a real death did occur and jesus did have a choice he chose to die for you and me and everyone else he could have called angels down to save him but he knew the only way for us to live out of relationship and not the law was to die,
Originally Posted by nameless_ak
and he had all power before he died so the son superpower thing doesnt really work. ohh and it was three days not a few minutes.
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Originally Posted by djct_watt
IMO, I think it's a sin to assume you know God's will. By nature, we are imperfect and incapable.
To assume God's will is to assume yourself to BE God. I think it is the worst sin you can commit.
I live my life constantly trying to learn, always assuming that I could be wrong, and trying to consider the alternatives. Even the Bible (supposedly) sent down from God is published, printed, and edited by people. Anybody ever play the "telephone" game?
My advice to people... Use the tools God (or Ala or evolution or whatever) have you (reason and logic) and make the best decisions you can. Do the most with what you have and have faith that you can do good if you put your mind to it. So long as you never become arrogant (as we are ALL imperfect, atheism or not), you should do well.
In a world with so much confusion and misleading paths, I'm fairly confident that God will be understanding. If not, well I wouldn't want a part in THAT heaven. Although I alwys give the benefit of the doubt, I'll stand up for what I think is right, even if it means eternal damnation.
Jesus would sacrifice himself for what is right, and that's the lesson I take away from him.
To assume God's will is to assume yourself to BE God. I think it is the worst sin you can commit.
I live my life constantly trying to learn, always assuming that I could be wrong, and trying to consider the alternatives. Even the Bible (supposedly) sent down from God is published, printed, and edited by people. Anybody ever play the "telephone" game?
My advice to people... Use the tools God (or Ala or evolution or whatever) have you (reason and logic) and make the best decisions you can. Do the most with what you have and have faith that you can do good if you put your mind to it. So long as you never become arrogant (as we are ALL imperfect, atheism or not), you should do well.
In a world with so much confusion and misleading paths, I'm fairly confident that God will be understanding. If not, well I wouldn't want a part in THAT heaven. Although I alwys give the benefit of the doubt, I'll stand up for what I think is right, even if it means eternal damnation.
Jesus would sacrifice himself for what is right, and that's the lesson I take away from him.
jk umm if you are talking to me about assuming Gods will then i think you are mistaken i am taking things straight from the bible everything i am saying can be backed up it might take some time however, and the worst sin you can commit is blasphaming (sp) the holy spirit, which none of you on this thread have done because if you did you wouldnt even be talking about this, and as far as you think the bible is inaccurate, well the bible is accurate the bible says that it is and allways will be and if someone changes that well they basically die, Long story. and sure there may be a few translation errors but it still get acoss the point, if you really want to be accurate i suggest using the kjv, nkjv, or niv.
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Originally Posted by nameless_ak
God did not torture anyone not jesus not anyone, he let that happen because he gave us free will, it is our decission to accept him or not.
And you said that God set the rules. He set up the rules and he made it so someone had to be tortured in order so others may have eternal life.
And the gum wrapper thing i if you drop a gum wrapper on the street you are not going to hell, if you hate the person who has to clean it up and did it to get back at him for somthing because you hate him then its a sin, i would not suggest throwing gum wrappers on the ground anyway. To us sins are not the same we see big and small to god you sinned whether it was big or small, it was a sin and you should be sorry,
If someone is trying to live a pure life and then falls back into sin and they do not repent then yes they are going to hell, they have to realize that they are sinning (which they probably allready know) then they have to be sorry they did and repent
There are many things that you could argue about whether it is a sin or not, but overall try to live as best as you can asking God to help you and you will make it, but remember relationship is very important. to know God and his heart He will show you good bad and how you should live.
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Originally Posted by seattledave
Originally Posted by nameless_ak
im not sure what your gettin at with the trinity thing, but as for the other part yes a real death did occur and jesus did have a choice he chose to die for you and me and everyone else he could have called angels down to save him but he knew the only way for us to live out of relationship and not the law was to die,
Originally Posted by nameless_ak
and he had all power before he died so the son superpower thing doesnt really work. ohh and it was three days not a few minutes.
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Originally Posted by nameless_ak
Ok you are confusing now, do you think makeup is sinful and jewlry? and the bible never says birth control is sinful, as long as you are not using it with someone outside or marriage. be a bit more specific if you would.
1 Timothy 2:9 - I also want women to dress modestly, with decency and propriety, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or expensive clothes, 10but with good deeds, appropriate for women who profess to worship God.
Genesis 1:28 - God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it.
Genesis 38 tells of Judah's sons, Er and Onan. Er married a woman named Tamar, but he was wicked and the Lord killed him, leaving Tamar with no husband or children. Tamar was given in marriage to Er's brother, Onan, in accordance with the law of levirate marriage in Deuteronomy 25:5-6. Onan did not want to split his inheritance with any child that he might sire on Tamar on his brother's behalf, so he practiced the oldest form of birth control. Genesis 38:10 says "What he did was wicked in the Lord's sight; so He put him to death also." Onan's motivation was selfish: he used Tamar for his own pleasure, but refused to perform his “brotherly” duty of creating an heir for his deceased brother. This passage is often pointed to as evidence that God does not approve of birth control. However, it was not the act of contraception that caused the Lord to put Onan to death, but rather Onan’s selfish motives behind the action.
Here are some verses that describe children from God's perspective. Children are a gift from God (Genesis 4:1; Genesis 33:5). Children are a heritage from the Lord (Psalm 127:3-5). Children are a blessing from God (Luke 1:42). Children are a crown to the aged (Proverbs 17:6). God blesses barren women with children (Psalm 113:9; Genesis 21:1-3; 25:21-22; 30:1-2; 1 Samuel 1:6-8; Luke 1:7, 24-25). God forms children in the womb (Psalm 139:13-16). God knows children before their birth (Jeremiah 1:5; Galatians 1:15).
Here are some verses that describe children from God's perspective. Children are a gift from God (Genesis 4:1; Genesis 33:5). Children are a heritage from the Lord (Psalm 127:3-5). Children are a blessing from God (Luke 1:42). Children are a crown to the aged (Proverbs 17:6). God blesses barren women with children (Psalm 113:9; Genesis 21:1-3; 25:21-22; 30:1-2; 1 Samuel 1:6-8; Luke 1:7, 24-25). God forms children in the womb (Psalm 139:13-16). God knows children before their birth (Jeremiah 1:5; Galatians 1:15).
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he had to die because if someone dies with sin they go to hell if they die and have accepted jesus... then they go to heaven jesus was crucified because people (pherasies mostly) thought he was a false prophit and so on, he was killed when he had no sin but he took on the sin of everyone including ones that hadnt happened so that we could have a relatioship with God, jesus died and most people dont understand this but he died and went to hell because he had everyones sin, he took the "keys" back because satain wasnt allowed to have people in hell who hadnt commited sin, He rose again on the THIRD day, he was in the tomb for three days. and yeah thats that.[/quote]
Again, to repeat what Dave said. Why can't an all powerful and all knowing God just clap his hands and have the sin forgiven. Why doesn't he just clap his hands and rid us of hell... I mean, he loves us so why would he risk any of us going to such a place? Why does Jesus have to take on the sin of everyone in order for us to go to heaven?
Why does any of that far fetched story have to be? God is all powerful... he didn't have to make it all screwy like that.
Again, to repeat what Dave said. Why can't an all powerful and all knowing God just clap his hands and have the sin forgiven. Why doesn't he just clap his hands and rid us of hell... I mean, he loves us so why would he risk any of us going to such a place? Why does Jesus have to take on the sin of everyone in order for us to go to heaven?
Why does any of that far fetched story have to be? God is all powerful... he didn't have to make it all screwy like that.
