What does everyone think?:

http://editorial.autos.msn.com/artic...umentid=656470

 

YAY i can pedal mash once again its on all future cars anyways so manual trannys will always be here as used cars trucks tractors

 

MT will never die. There will always be a demand for them because some people actually like to drive their car rather than having the car drive them.

 

The article is very US-centric. Go to the UK or Europe and you'll find many more manual transmissions than here in the US.

However, technology is catching up. As automated gearboxes pass manuals in efficiency and reliability they will eventually take over. They already have in expensive cars, and they eventually will in cheaper ones.

At the moment, I consider a stick as an anti-theft device. Many potential thieves don't know how to drive stick!

 

Hehe, didn't think of that one

 

There are a bunch of crooks serving hard time because they couldn't drive stick. Saw it on one of those "true forensic" shows.

Here's the scenario:

Drug dealer kills another dealer because he got stiffed on product.

The product is hidden in the victim's 350Z at his mother's house. All the murderer has to do is quietly drive it away. Unfortunately, he doesn't drive stick.

Murderer hires a low-life who does drive stick to retrieve the car. Murderer retrieves the product and gives the car to the low-life as payment for retrieving it.

Low-life strips car, then washes it to remove fingerprints. Unfortunately he misses fingerprints on the inside of the steel wheels he slapped on when he took off the bling wheels.

Fingerprint leads cops to low-life. Low-life doesn't want to take the fall so he fingers the murderer.

Murderer is sitting in the grey-bar hotel wishing he had taken driving lessons more seriously.

Moral: If you want to be a successful murderer, learn to drive stick.

 

i think this is the kind of transmission you can get in the GTI... the "manumatic" actually has a faster 0-60 time than the standard 6spd.

 

Yes, the dual clutch transmissions allow you to keep your foot buried with the geartrain continuously engaged and driving the car. No letup to shift means better acceleration.

Drag cars have run automatics for a long time, but they aren't concerned about efficiency.

The dual clutch manumatics have the best of both worlds, but the price is still well above my pay scale.

 

word! i drive a Peterbilt with an 18sp eaton trans everyday at work & i love it! and 5 over 4 double ____ers are even more fun!

and the only reason my xB is an auto is cause my gf cant drive manual & unfortunately, doesnt wanna learn stick

 

Manual's may eventually die. But by the time that happens a lot of cars that used to be gas guzzling power hounds are run on power cells with limited amounts of power in reserve. Most cheaper cars (ours) will always be available with standard tranny's because they're always cheaper to make and easier to maintain.

What was it Bill Maher said about our 'Guitar Hero' culture? Everyone wants to be a rockstar but nobody wants to learn the chords. Seems like everyone wants to be in a nice car but no one wants to drive it. Now we have cars that parallel park themselves and stop on their own if the mom in the drivers seat, sucking down a latte and changing a diaper isn't looking at the road.

Basically every little new trinket on the market is designed to protect the consumer from his/her own stupidity.

 

"Always" is a very long time! It used to be that you could adjust your ignition timing with a lever on the steering wheel. Creating an automatic system was considered to be difficult, so a linkage allowed the driver to adjust his own timing as needed.

Time marches on, however, and clever designers figured out a way to adjust ignition timing automatically, reliably, and better than any driver. In fact, there have been three redesigns with centrifugal, vacuum, and computer systems each taking on the task.

We never hear of anyone longing for the "good old days" of adjusting our own spark, do we?

The same will eventually happen to transmissions. All my cars happen to be sticks and I like to shift my own but that won't change the future.

 

i hated setting my own points talk about real p.i.t.a.

 

I don't understand the reasoning that people think MT is easier to maintain than an AT?

MT you have to replace fluids more often, replace clutches, differential, and the fact you can really destroy a MT if you don't know what your doing (worse case), and the gears are destroyed.

With modern AT's, you *might* have to replace the fluid as many have "life-time" fluid, but even so, changes are easier than an oil change. They can easily last 100,000 or 200,000 miles, if not longer. If anything ,you pay $1-2k for a new one or get it rebuilt when the time comes that it is toast. Other then that, its much less maintenance. MT may be cheaper, even with replacements and upkeep over the AT plus purchase price, but I wouldn't say they are less maintenance IMO. Replace the fluid, that's it. Modern AT's are very reliable and are starting to be even more-so than MT.

I mean if somebody can help me out here understand it more, please do. Not saying I am right,I am just sharing my thoughts!

 

The automatic transmission is one of the most complicated and thus one of the less reliable parts of a vehicle.

Assuming you know how to drive a manual and arnt racing off the line, MTs rarely fail in my experience. With all my past vechicles with MTs never had to replace a clutch or flywheel components. 1 of them I bought used and put over 150K miles on. This was at a time when I didnt believe in changing MT fluid either. Try going 150K on an AT without mantaining it.

MTs are a simple drain and fill and THAT is almost as easy as an oil change. ATs require a pan drop, which is more work and time than an oil change. Not sure where you got the idea AT fluid is lifetime. I seem to remember that Scion recommends replacement every 3yrs/36K miles (for both MT and AT) but I dont have a service guide right in front of me\, so dont quote me on that.

As you said, right of the line, manuals cost, what, about $1K less than autos. That savings alone would pay for all services needed for the entire life on a MT.

But the #1 reason I choose MT - they are more fun to drive and offer more control.

 

Thats only $20 in car payment and harder to learn. Americans are getting fatter and lazier in life. I could see MT going away, just not excited about it.

 

Heathen,

I don't drive a MT (or know how to) which is why I asked for somebody to correct me if I am wrong. I don't want to assume any information, I was just curious. Appreciate the detailed response though. I was not sure on how fast the different components wore out or needed replaced.

As far as the fluid, the new xB is filled with the Toyota WS (lifetime) ATF Fluid. I changed mine already and plan to do it every so often just because it is so easy, but the new xB has the newer fluid that you don't "need" to change, only replace if inspection "tells" you to do otherwise.

I think the reason MT vehicles are dying here in the US is because for most of us, the roads are busy. I would hate to have to play around with my gears when I get stuck in the city or get in a traffic jam. Most people think this same way. Second, there are less and less people to teach others how to drive a manual. Nobody I know drives one, period. People don't want to buy cars with a MT if they don't know how to drive them and risk ruining it. Im sure there are more reasons, but those two I feel are the largest.

I would love to learn a MT, but I can't exactly go find a car and go play with it. It is just unavailable to me.

For those of you who can drive a MT consider yourselves "lucky", because not everybody has somebody to teach them or wants to rely on internet "DIY" to learn it.

 

It's not exactly rocket science. Once you learn how to get underway (one or two attempts, most likely) and that you always push the left pedal before moving the gear lever or bringing the car to a stop you know everything you need to prevent damage. The rest is just practice to get smooth.

Now in the Oulde Dayse before synchromesh...

 

I haven't had an auto in years, primarily because the one I had was a train wreck. I'm sure they've gotten beefier. But from my experience they can't take the prolonged amounts of hard driving while keeping the maintenance cost even in the same ballpark as a manual. Replace a clutch every 50K if your a freak behind the wheel in a manual. But when auto's go bad, prepare to fork out close to four digits.

 

I wish the internet was around when I accidentally bought a stick shift. Learned the basics over a payphone- "Hey, I bought a car. How do I drive 4 speed?" I really do like having the option of a roll start too.

 

Where are you finding quality rebuilt automatics for less than a thousand?