I absolutely agree. As a matter of fact, when my wife and I bought our first xB in 2005, we immediately compared it to our 1972 very basic, very thin walled, very underpowered, very understeered one way and oversteered the other way (because Toyota did not prpoerly balance the battery when they made it into the opposite driver position) and absolutely loveable little car with, I believe a 1.5 engine. It was a great little car as is the Gen1 xB.

 

Not only Toyota and GMs have grown in weight and size, 99% of all cars have grown in weight and size during the years, even the beloved and respected mini cooper and BMW 3 series has doubled their weight since introduced. So if Toyota is growing in size its not because its following GM, they are following what the world wants.

 

I think everyone should calm down a little bit. While the xB isnt as boxy, it still is a box.

xb or t2b or xtc or whatever its still a scion. Dont like the name? Debadge it and go custom up a new badge.


For those talking about toyota loosing there insight in the marketplace? you are talking about it like they just released 5 models and each one goes against what scion is about.


its one model. heck for all we know in a year or two they will release a pentagon shaped car and call it the xP

 

my problem with the xB1 was that it was so slow and didnt get outstanding MPG. Now i have a car that has twice the power and gets THE SAME mpg. im on my 1st tank from the dealer and im getting 27mpg! My insurance went up $9/mon over the xB! that was scary to think about. how unsafe is the xB1!?

Though it seems the safty and interior/ride is much improved over the xB1. I dont like the look of the xB2 at all and i dont like large 4 bangers in heavy cars because they tend to be thirsty. i also didnt want such a large car, its normaly just me and my gf so there was no reason for me to buy a minivan.

 

I'd like to point out that the writer of this article is lacking in the fundamentals of research. This statement:

is absolutely ridiculous. In a REAL comparison, the new xB actually gets BETTER mileage than the HHR. The adjusted EPA rating for the HHR is 19/28 compared to the xB's 22/28. A little bit of research would have gone a long way here.

 

That really "proves" nothing. There will always be tons of folks who just have to have the latest thing when it comes out. The new 06 Civic last year, Mazdaspeed3, the S2000 and RX-8 when they launched, the new Accord this fall - all had or will have folks lined up to buy - and at full price or more. Some have proven to be real slow sellers after the intial excitement (the RX-8 and S2000) - so saying they sold like hotcakes when launched means nothing.

In some areas the xB and xA models sold out as soon as they rolled off the truck, other dealers had more trouble moving and seemed to always have some in stock. IN the high demand areas you could sell a used xB for what you paid for it or more to someone who could not wait for the next truck to come in.

In most areas NOW, the areas the xB2 will sell out as quick as the bring them in. What remains to be seen is what happens to sales after all the "gotta be the first on the block" folks get theirs.

Dennis

 

I'm still PO'd the new XB does not offer all wheel drive. Can you say "08 WRX".

 

should have put the xD engine into the new 08 xB...still more power, but not all the MPG fuss...new xB will be a dissappointment no matter what...it has so much to follow from the previous version...i'm gonna stick with my 06 xB...

 

I still predict poor sales for the XB2 in the long run, esp. if gas prices continue to climb. The car is a poor comprimise in terms of power, MPG, and looks. If you look at it, every feature or spec is outshined by at least one competitor, while the overall package is not recieving rave reviews by anyone. The phrase "jack of all trades, master of none" comes to mind. While the Xb and to a lesser extent the Xa were almost a cultural phenomenon, I just don't see a clear target market for this car. I think Scion still has a chance to do something really cool with the eventual Tc replacement... something like a Supra for the new millenium...

 

if scion had the ***** to build a rwd coupe and keep it under 20k they would have a HUGE hit...but i doubt they would do that.

 

i think a flaw in the scion thinking that they didnt account for is that if things are going to stay "cool" they need to get better each time and be totally diff. the Scion “gimmick” was the dealer friendly mods + nice standard features + good price. There really isn’t anything that makes the new cars better then the 1st gen, let alone any other car out there. Scion needed to come up with some crazy and new. I feel like this is just more of the same, just bigger.

How about this line up.
4wd, ~130hp, < $16,000
FWD Hyrbid(!) xB style car < $18,000
RWD 2dr coupe ~160hp < $20,000

They have a car for each pocketbook and driving style. sure they might not make alot of profit but at least they will have customers who will probably end up buying more toyota products in the end. its not like toyota is hurting for money

 

I think Toyota is a smart company and adjusts a lot quicker then GM or other companies do. Just like all great companies they make mistakes but what separates them from others is how quickly they correct them.

The echo in concept sounded like an interesting low end car but it was a dud. I remember my niece looking at one and in concept I really suggested it until we saw it in person. She ended up getting something completely different. A year or so later they came out with a matrix which blew away the Echo and was close enough in size and price that it would have fit my niece's needs if it was there with the echo. Great car.

Now they are trying the Yaris. Once again try and bring over the smaller foreign cars to see if they will sell. Maybe or Maybe not. Whatever happens I am sure they will make the right adjustments.

The XB was another attempt at bringing over the foreign small car to the US. This time they did a good job but in this case it became more of a cult following. Either you really loved it a lot or your hated it. True Cult Style.

Then then followed the XB with an XB2 which increased the potential market for their car big time. For example, I love the XB1 but it was just not enough for what I needed where as the XB2 fixed that problem. And another example, is my wife does not like XB1 at all but really likes XB2.

The good news for XB1 owners is that now they have a classic. Take care of them since they will be considered major cult classics in the future.

What is next ? It reminds me of the mustang. As it evolved people put their stakes in the ground on which was the best. It went through many concepts and now its back to looking very much like the originals. Similar with corvettes. Everyone has their favorite style: 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, 00s and they do NOT look alike. I think its cool their kept the name.

Keeping the XB name creates a similar future as the mustang and corvette with each generation claiming theirs is the best. A classic like that needs to keep the name going.

 

the best cars on the road in any category are the ones that EVOLVE as the years go on. Porsche 911, the Corvette, Honda Accord, Toyota Camry, VW Jetta…they get “better” as they go on because the company listens to what the owners want and improve. Sure sometimes they miss, but the good cars correct the problem the next time, because the company listens to the owners.

Example. Porsche 996 had the bubble headlights, but the owners wanted the classic look of the round headlights, the 997 now has them. we will see what Toyota does next time.

For me the xB2 is like the C3 Corvette, it’s a fine car and gets the job done, but when compared to its brothers its not going to look very good.

 

how about this, you have the new xd which is the high mpg scion. the 2nd gen xb, or xb2, as the big person hauler, and the tc, and whatever replaces the tc as the sporty model. it is great model diversity for whatever your needs may be. you want high mpg, get the xd, funky urban cargo hauler, get the xb, classy sporty hatchback, the tc.

the xa and first xb were nearly identical mechanically, and people chose the xb because of its iconic looks. the xa didn't distinguish itsellf from the toyota echo enough to be successful. i think it is great that this next lineup has far more diversity. different models with different roles.

 

how about this, you have the new xd which is the high mpg scion. the 2nd gen xb, or xb2, as the big person hauler, and the tc, and whatever replaces the tc as the sporty model. it is great model diversity for whatever your needs may be. you want high mpg, get the xd, funky urban cargo hauler, get the xb, classy sporty hatchback, the tc.

the xa and first xb were nearly identical mechanically, and people chose the xb because of its iconic looks. the xa didn't distinguish itsellf from the toyota echo enough to be successful. i think it is great that this next lineup has far more diversity. different models with different roles.

 

Good point above me.


This car will become a classic if scion continues to develop each xB.

20-30 years from now it might be the equivalent too what a mustang is as said before.

 

I am a big scion fan, not just the xB. I was thinking about trading my own xB for the new one once I seen it, but when I saw it in person, I began to feel small next to it. Apparently its bigger like everyone said, but there is one body line I really dont like and the line is on the hood. The 2nd Gen xB is rounded all over, which in my opinion a good thing, but this line is too sharp for my own taste and throws off the body lines (yes i am **** about those things).

Since my parents are in the market for another car and they love my car so much, my brother and I are trying to persuade them to get the new xB due to the size (my mom loves the micro cars) and the power (my dad likes more power). Maybe ill like the car if I drive it more.... oh well my opinion..

 

I've read this multiple times in this thread - xb1 gets lower gas mileage than the xb2, or that the xb1 doesn't get great gas mileage.

In my manual, I was averaging over 30mpg. In my auto, solely city driving with lots of idling, I'm getting over 27, bare minimum. My wife's tC (auto) hasn't gone over 25mpg city, ever.

As for the first tank of gas - the ECU has to learn your driving style before anyone can claim an average mpg. Let's see what the MPG is after 4 or 5 tanks of gas.

As for safety... well, it's not necessarily that the xB1 is unsafe... rather, it's unsafe if hit by larger, bulkier cars *cough*. That's pretty much true across the board for all small cars.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=3580

 

True, the IIHS (Insurance Institute for Highway Safety) crashes a large, tall crash sled representing something the size and weight of a Ford Expedition or Chevy Suburban into the side of a stationary small car at 31 MPH.

The US Government (NHTSA) side impact crash tests use a somewhat lighter, lower crash sled representing the "average" vehicle into the side of the victim vehicle at 38.5 MPH.

The NHTSA and IIHS tests mimic very different scenarios. I suppose next the IIHS folks will build a sled that imitates maybe a runaway double-trailered Kenworth with a bumper at window height and smack it into test vehicles. (No matter what you drive, within reason, there will be something out there bigger and faster enough to hurt you.

(Maybe they could just park their test cars on train tracks...) :D

Tom

 

I don't know why people keep saying this. It's not like you can put a 4-cyl engine in a Suburban and it will suddenly get 30 MPG. (Cadillac tried this in the 80s by putting 6-cyl engines in their full-size cars and it didn't save one drop of gas).

A smaller engine in the 08 xB would not improve fuel economy much if at all. In fact it might be worse. The determining factor here is curb weight. You want an engine with capabilities that match the weight of the vehicle. With the increase in weight of the 08 xB, it needs more torque than a 1.5 or 1.8 liter is going to have. The larger 2.4 has the right torque characteristics for the 08 xB.

If you don't like the increased size and weight of the 08 xB then that is one thing. (I personally think the size/weight increase is a very, very minimal, incremental and modest increase.) But don't think that just putting a smaller engine in the car is going to magically increase MPG.