I was wondering what the limits of the front wheel drive set up are. Acura/ Honda believes 270 hp is right about the limit right now and the forseeable future. I see people on this site getting as much as 300+ but I am wondering how much of that actually gets to the ground. It is obvious at some point it would really benefit to have awd or even rwd vs the fwd set up we have. Has anyone bothered with a conversion or checked into what that would cost? I wonder if a car that has 300 hp rwd could consistently outrun a car that has 350 hp fwd; after all the traction on the fwd is always going to be an issue once the hp gets that high.

 

One thing to consider: RWD cars have more drivetrain loss than FWD cars do. So a 300hp RWD car would have less whp than a 300hp FWD car. Typically, RWD cars suffer about a 20% drivetain loss whereas FWD cars suffer about 15%.

 

How much would it cost to convert to RWD..

Probably around $4,000.00

seriously..

and that is lowballing

 

with FWD, a low weight vehicle with moderate power is the way to go. Adding lots of power to any FWD car is going to result in no traction, and little to no street driveability. Your best bet is probably to gut the hell out of the tC, and go one step further than boltons.

I would say this route (if you have a 5 speed, if not I don't see the point):
Get the TRD supercharger
get a header
full exhaust
suspension
gut the interior clean besides the nescessary parts of the dash
remove A/C system
install lightweigh racing seats
replace glass roof with lighter metal
take glass out of the doors, and exchange them with fixed lexan
no sound deadning
lightweight wheels


All of that would make your car usably fast. It would cost a fraction of what it would cost for a RWD conversion (this is so out of the question as far as money goes), and would be just about as crazy. If you don't care about comfort, noise, having no A/C, and only track driving your car, thats the way to go.

If not, enjoy the Toyota reliability, and do bolt-ons like everyone else.

 

It really depends on the car. Some cars can do 300+ without a problem. I drove an Acura TL and it probably shouldnt have any more power. Converting to RWD is all custom most likely so its going to cost a lot. Id say 4k is very low unless you can do and make those parts yourself. I dont think many cars on the road today lose more than 15% even for RWD autos. I think a tC is about 12-13% since most people got about 140 whp stock.

 

If you are talking about just the general FWD set up. Then there are already FWD cars that are 1000+. General street cars 400 whp seem to catch the eye of the magazines. Yah know.. usually the gutted out ones that grace the covers of the magazines.

 

RAAMaudio has done some great work lightening his ride up a bit.... CF roof instead on glass and such.... CF lightweight seats and more.... pretty nice setup IMHO, and he's going to go TC or SC soon enough as well....

 

i've seen a civic with 400+hp, no kidding, he was doing 10 secs on track, crraaazzyy..

 

My teachers civic si with stage 4 turbo pulled a 8.7 second run on the 1/4 mile. He brought in video and time sheets to prove it too. Fools loaded though so he got everything he could lol

 

No he didn't. Maybe 1/8mile with TERRIBLE driving.

 

First... that civic did not do an 8.7 sec 1/4 mile. If he has time slips, they are most likely fake, or it was a bad 1/8th mile time.

For FWD, you can cram a lot of HP in there, but the FWD is a poor platform for power overall. One reason that manufacturers began using FWD was because of the low power 4 bangers that began coming out. FWD has less loss than RWD, enabling you to use a lower powered engine with better fuel economy. Now that the "muscle" cars are coming back (gto, mustang GT, viper, etc) they are moving back to RWD for those apps.

It is correct to state that a 300HP RWD will not put as much to the ground as a 300HP FWD, but 9 times out of ten it will spank the FWD in a 1/4 mile, and will spank it worse on a track given the suspension/handling components being equal. A RWD naturally uses the weight shift on launch to its advantage rather than a detriment meaning it is much easier to get the power to the ground. You can also cram very large rear end components under them very easily as contrasted to a FWD where rack and pinion and other front end components are crammed in much more closely, making them a bit harder to work on.

For a fun street car and some light hearted racing, a FWD is a fun choice. And when running a 4 banger with moderate power they are great for getting the power to the ground. But, if I build a car for serious performance, the FWD wouldnt even cross my mind. I will take a RWD or AWD any day. And for 1/4 mile performance, give me the RWD all the way.

Here are things to consider about the two for both straight line and track performance:

1) The weight transfer on launch for a FWD is a serious issue, while being a slight advantage on a RWD car

2) You can many times cram a huge rear end under a RWD

3) Final gearing is MUCH easier to change on a RWD vehicle

4) Understeer is recoverable by letting off the throttle a bit and hoping it grabs before you slide off the track. Oversteer (RWD) is MUCH easier to handle using the throttle. Plus, forcing a slight bit of drift using the RWD is a nice way to carry momentum into a corner.. as well as saving your a$$ after hitting a corner a bit too fast

5) Torque steer is not an issue with a RWD. Yes, an LSD helps dramatically on a FWD, but you still have some torque steer due to the predominantly unequal length output shafts on a FWD. One side is longer than the other, allowing more flex. Mini has worked on this by creating a setup with equi-length shafts.


Basically, the FWD is not made to be a performance setup, although you can make them very competitive. But, like I said, for what I want out of a street car it works ok. Sorry for the long a$$ reply

 

And I agree completely with the posters saying low weight, moderate power. That is the best setup for FWD imo

 

Ive seen a civic hb with 800whp gimme sec and ill find the link

http://www.cheesefrog.com/modules.ph...p=getit&lid=15

here we go 802whp if listen closely youll hear the blow off make an alarm go off on a car that you cant see i think

 

You can make the power, but the manufacturers are looking more at what is practical. Anyone that wonders, if you ever get a chance, drive a 400HP+ FWD around for a few days and tell me how you like it. They can handle it, but driving them is not a lot of fun unless you are racing.