biGhuK

I basically have a stock motor with a K&N CAI on it and seen that ZPI has high compression pistons for the TC that puts it at 11:1 compression. This seems like a really good upgrade for the money does anyone know what the power output is on 93 octane after you've installed them and any kinda reprocussions and side effects of the install?

Thanks,
Curtis J

TurboCustomz

I dont believe that the power output has been tested but im sure you'll see a measurable amount with the extra compression. You'll of course have to run premiem octane fuel at all times with this mod. You need to keep in mind that you'll need to get some extra parts to install these. You engine has to come completely apart. Any non-reusable gaskets will have to be replaced and you should consider new bearings and a cylinder hone(touch hone) depending on the mileage that your car has.

Also, do these pistons come with rings??? If not you'll need them because you wont want to reuse the old ones.

Charles

seen4ever

also have to have the ring's gapped accordingly. since they are CP pistons, you may have to have your stock rods machined to accept the pistons. i would also think you will need a good standalone on the car to adjust the timing & fuel curve on the car.

Fushyuguru

Would like to revive an old thread here as recently I've changed my mind from FI to NA, and would like to find out some from ZPI, as I'm sure they've used their own pistons, right?

For ZPI: Have you an idea of the power gain from the compression change? Are you planning on producing more NA parts (valves, springs, cams) to make the swap worthwhile for the downtime and octane change?

As the best NA setup for our cars before motorwork seems to be (insert manufacturer) intake, (insert manufacturer) full exhaust, MMW Race header, and a Camcon VVTI/AFC controller. The list for motor parts is a bit lacking.

We have the 11.1 heads from ZPI and a throttle body (whos gains should be very minimal without aditional motorwork, much better use with FI for now). I know to make the purchase/downtime of pistons worthwhile, I would want to swap out a few other things (give me cams at least!).

Note: For anyone who wants to know the level of work involved in a piston swap before you get in over your head, just take a look at the factory service manual in regards to engine mechanical overhauls (do a search in our forums and you can grab an electronic copy). I personally have no problem taking my tC down for a few weeks to do the swap, but many don't have the transportation, patience, tools or the know how to get the job done right.

Stu_Gotti

I watched them gut my baby down.. its not fun, nor easy by no means!

Fushyuguru

It's a very involved and tedious process. You spend half the time rechecking tolerances as it's like open heart surgery on your motor. However if youve worked on, or heard a blown all motor setup, it is the most amazing thing. It's also potentially the safest way to make street power.

I run with RX7 folks mostly, just to get sidetracked for a seocnd, if any of you've heard a 20b 3-rotor all motor, its like if ferarri made a 20-foot tall chainsaw on WOT.

Stu_Gotti

Haha... nice

ZPIracing

To be honest we have not tested the N/A pistons. We had turbo pistons made and they offered to make us N/A ones also. We do stock these and would be willing to make someone a deal if they would do a review.

The pistons do come with rings for the price that we sell them for on our site. We would recommend our head package with these or a custom P&P.

You would need to get a Piggy back ECU to realize the true gains from this type of upgrade.

If you are not sure to the level of difficulty of a install like this then we recommend that you do not even try. If you are a moderate installer we would recommend that you simply remove your engine and send it to us or a local reputable machine shop.

-Kenny

Fushyuguru

Kenny, does ZPI have any intensions to pursue more engine internals? Also as far as I could draw your head swap is just stock with the new pistons, correct?

I'm glad that you offer these this early in the game, and would love to see more parts for NA down the road.

I agree a piggyback ecu is a must, I won't be doing internals until more parts are offered (get as much done in one rebuild) but I know Dezod has expressed interest in producing internals so hopefully by summer '06 they will be out and I will be doing the work then. A Camcon should give a good enough amount of control over the A/F for those going NA, thats what I have gone with. Even in the evnt of needing an emanage, Camcons should still fetch a good resale.

The biggest thing with rebuilds is to take your time, many people rush the job (it's their only car, get impatient an do stupid things to cut corners) and have dire consequences because of it. Some just don't realize the extent of the work, thats why FI is always an easy choice with those new to cars.

tc2nut4

Well.... i was running 12:1 in my B18c5 in my civic... and I didn't see much gain in it with just the compression... Compression doesn't really mean a damn thing without more air and more gas being able to get in there... Meaning a kickass intake and exhuast system with a crazy fuel pump and fuel lines... otherwise you won't be able to utilize that much of an increase ini compression... Keep in mind that once you do those pistons as everyone has said you just put yourself in the whole about $2000 in labor and another $500 in parts assuming nothing goes wrong. Not only that kick Forced induction out the window because the motor just won't take it unless you do a block guard, resleeve it, get a balanced crank and much more... So i don't think those pistons would be worth your time... Just my opinion but the TC comes with good pistons from the factory and its fairly low comp. so you can get much better and cheaper gains from forced induction... Cuz once the do higher compression and MAYBE srtoke it out and bore it you might see 20-30 whp extra... Thats about all i saw... maybe if you throw in a SAFC and a piggyback ecu with a fuel rail and fuel pressure regulator you'd see 50whp but now you're over $7500 in the whole for a whopping 50whp... Or you could go get a turbo and get an extra 100whp for about $6500 with installation... power for the dollar folks... never lose focus

TurboCustomz

Are you serious???

Please try to punctuate or at least use some sort of grammer when you post. It saves everyone a lot of time trying to sort out what you have said.

The stock tC pistons are not "great". In fact, they kinda suck.

You cannot "bore" a 2az engine. They are "throw away" blocks and can only be touch honed.

How do you use a piggy back ecu and a SAFC at the same time?

Unless you convert to a return style system, you cannot use a regulator with the stock fuel system. Its in tank regulated.

If you spend 7500 dollars on only get 50HP you are a complete idiot and should not be allowed to work on cars ever again.

I lost focus and brain cells trying to comprehend that.

Charles

tc2nut4

sorry... i stopped caring about english when i graduated... don't know why you still care...anywho like i said and have openly admitted that i was previously a honda guy before, and ias far as combining a piggyback and a safc i meant or... and i said whp ___... theres a huge difference... keep in mind your average car loses 18% of its hp through the drivetrain... so next time you want to be a d-ick trying reading correctly

Joey_WRX

lol

Simplyscion

It seems like you are still stuck in honda world. This is a totally different ball game here. Im not trying to sound like an a$$, just trying to give you the heads up that our motors arent really too similar with honda blocks.

TurboCustomz

Yea, who needs english? What a waste.

I don't care if you did say WHP or CHP. 7500 dollars for 50 anykindahorsepower is a rip off on a stock car.

BTW, if there is anyway that you can refund me the brain cells I have lost trying to comprehend your posts, please let me know.

Charles

Garage1217

iTrader: (5)

I am no hater by anymeans but after reading this I have to agree... My eyes just crossed and started to tear up for no reason, then lost feeling in the left side of my face ahhh!

tc2nut4

yeah granted... english did suck but customz definitely had an inanimate object shoved into nether regions and should have it removed before his next post so that instead of just myself thinking he's a self righteous ***** the whole world thinks he is. But on a nicer note does anyone understand what i'm getting at... The start of this post was someone wanting to get 11:1 compression pistons, and what i was getting at was that I don't think that you would be able to utilize that increase in compression without upgrading the fuel system, intake, exhuast and adding a ECU (Piggyback OR stand alone). I mean do the numbers, Intakes run $150 plus, cat back exhaust run $600 and up, headers run like $250, an in-tank fuel pump is $300 for a cheap one, throw in all your fuel lines, plus you'll have to pay someone to install those pistons, and then someone to tune it for max performance. So if you take out the boring and stroking you're still over $4000 and you just eliminated the possibilty of forced induction and therefore setting yourself up to come to a screeching halt as far as horsepower is concerned, that is unless you want to squeeze nitrous of course, which is dangerous especially if you didn't plan on rebuilding the WHOLE motor in its entirety and I don't know what you can and can't do on the motors but its sounds like you wouldn't have a whole lot of options with N/A

TurboCustomz

This is the best laugh I have gotten on here in a very, VERY long time. It's obvious that you know NOTHING about modding a car or about dynamic engine theory. I'll just highlight a few things since I could type allllll night after that.

If you are paying $300 for a "cheap" intank fuel pump, then I'll sell you walboro 255's all day for 200bucks which is only about 100 percent over retail.

Nitrous is no more dangerous then any other type of power adder, especially if its used properly, but I'm more then sure you know nothing about that.

Im not sure how a catback cost 600 dollars when everyone on the web sells them for much MUCH cheaper.

Must I repeat myself once again? You CAN NOT BORE the 2AZ.

The ENGINE (motors are electrical, please stop using the wrong term) is setup especially strong. Save the pistons, everything else is fairly sturdy and can hold a fairly large amount of power.

6 Months ago there were not a whole lot of options for forced induction either. This is a new car and products are comming out all the time. If there is an interest if NA parts, they will be made.

The limitless boundaries of stupidity never cease to amaze me. No one on here is trying to talk down to you. We are trying to educate you. Please take the opportunity to make yourself seem like a a half way decent person and not resort to name calling and a plethera of run-on grammatically incorrect sentences.

Charles

Fushyuguru

I have to agree with turbocustomz on this one.

The reason i revived this thread wa sto try and stir up some more interest in NA, maybe drag some of the intensions out of ZPI/Dezod while doing it.

I agree, FI looks like the way to go if you have money in your pocket NOW, and limited know-how and ambition.

I totally agree raising the compression is worthless without other components, but its quite similar to adding a turbo setup without FMIC, upgraded fuel system, a piggy back and a tune, etc.

To speak personally, I am sitting on a tC with MMW Race headers, Full 2.5" exhaust, CA intake, all together with a Camcon AFC/VVTI controller. Come summer I will be looking at the available options given cost, availability, usable daily driver power, and downtime.

I have no problem taking 2 weeks of downtime to rebuild the engine if there are enough available afte market upgrades to go NA. I understand alot if not most people don't like to do the work themselves. For me it's the price of the parts, and the time for me to install and tune, no more.

I would love to see new cams, springs, valves etc come out to make the install of 11.1 pistons worth while. NA looks bleak right now as theres no parts available, but thats how FI looked a year ago.

tckurt

This is why Ive decided to hold off on doing any engine work for atleast a year and just do interior work b/c there are to many things that havent been addressed by companies for our cars to get full potential with a N/A setup.