I'm hoping to collect user experience with various gaskets and hardware in one thread for general reference.

I'll start by sharing what little I've learned along the way.

Whenever possible, studs are preferable to bolts. Especially in cast iron or aluminum.
Zinc plating doesn't last long in close proximity to a turbocharger
Metric SS fasteners are hard to find
The oem MLS exhaust manifold gasket works best
Copper T3 gaskets don't last (one time use)
Embossed SS gaskets last but don't seal very well unless the mating surfaces are very flat (too hard)
Cut lock washers lose their temper and become useless near turbo heat
Nordlock split-washers work great! Available in SS too!
Permatex ultra high-temp copper RTV actually works for sealing very small voids
A thin layer of grease leaves a thin carbon "gasket" after the grease burns off (okay for filling tiny surface voids)
If the mating surfaces are flat enough, no gasket is required.


That's all I can think of right now. There's a lot I don't know about hardware and general metalurgy. For instance, is it okay to use SS bolts/studs in cast iron or AL?

Feel free to correct me on anything I've posted so far and to add your own experience and opinions. I'm hoping to compile a list of the best gaskets and hardware for a typical turbo installation and learn some things.

 

why is it i can get only steel metric allen head bolts local while ss SAE allen head bolts are all over the place. Most metric (other than steel fastners) I cant get unless i order the stuff.

http://www.mmsacc-stainless.com/metr...ric_allen.html

http://www.boltdepot.com/metric-hex-bolts.aspx

http://www.boltdepot.com/product.asp...&cm=53&cd=1407

 

Good question. I'm wondering why I can't even find SS unequal length studs at McMasterCarr? If I find them, is 18-8 okay? Is 316 strong enough? Should I get 17-4 ph or Bumax 88 instead? Do I need self-locking or is standard okay?

My head hurts...

 

lol...i have no idea

 

I swear you need to be a metalurgist to order the right stuff from McMasterCarr...

All I really know is that I'd like to replace all my turbo/mani hardware with SS and that SS is softer than high-strength carbon steel. What I don't know is whether 18-8 or 316 SS is hard enough for mounting my manifold, turbo and wastegate. For that matter, is it wise to mix them? SS expands more than carbon steel. Will SS nuts on carbon steel studs have a tendency to loosen? <sigh>

 

I would give it a shot...I havnt used any ss hardware on my mani or turbo so i really couldnt say.

 

I'll look a bit more for SS studs and if I can't find them I'll just get SS nuts and hope the Nordlock washers keep them tight. With the shiny new SS manifold I'm trying to eliminate all the rusty bits.

 

I use Grade 8 Steel bolts for turbo to manifold and downpipe (metric have to be ordered), because i've had horrible luck breaking studs.

Dont use zinc plated for anyting under high stress/tension. its a very soft, and bendable steel. it tends to break easily

Ive NEVER had a problem using stainless steel hardware, even on a wastegate, manifold, and turbo

Use hardened steel for the exhaust manifold studs, no mild steel ace hardware crap. you have to order them usually, or go to a race shop to find them.

MLS gaskets have always worked for the exhaust manifold. The graphite one i used at one point went out after about 2 days with my turbo

SS gaskets - ive always had problems getting them to seal. but if you can, they will last forever.

RTV black works great for the oil pan, and NPT fittings (teflon tape always failed me on oil lines, fuel lines...etc.)

I always use motor oil when i put in injectors. a tad on the top and bottom always makes a perfect seal. also ive always had a problem where the bottom o-ring would fall off as im putting into the head, usually just on aftermarket injectors. so i just take a toothpick and dab a TINY amount of rtv in the o ring to the injector so that it stays put while installing

also when removing studs, i double nut. when installing studs, i notch the top of the new stud with a dremel just enough so i can fit a screw driver in it, and turn it in.

theres a few small tricks ive picked up. i have tons more i could dig out of my brain...hope this helps!

 

Thanks! Good info.

You reminded me that The Right Stuff also works great for oil pans (very similar to Toyota stuff). Also good to hear that SS hardware has worked well for you. My concern with the typical 18-8 and 316 SS fasteners is that they are hardness rated the same as general purpose steel fasteners (grade 5). This is probably why I can't find any SS studs except for very expensive grade 8 ARP SS studs. I have found grade 8 SS nuts and bolts made of Bumax 88 with the same corrosion resistance as softer 316 SS.

Just curious but was that graphite gasket the internally mesh reinforced crap or the metal sandwiched type? I presume that the sandwich type lasts longer but wouldn't really want to use either.

 

its the gasket in the picture...not sure what type it is, but they SUCK

 

I have 3 of those in my basement and 2 of the even suckier kind. Paper with steel mesh inside. I'm glad I never installed any of them.

BTW, does anyone know how long our exhaust manifold studs are? I want to get new ones but I'm not sure how long. Also if anyone wants a set of ARP 300 SS manifold studs with 12pt nuts and washers, let me know. I'll be getting 10 and only need 5. I'll ship you 5 of them for $45.

 

Well I finally found some sources for ss metric studs. MD Metrics and MMS & Accessories. I believe the correct size to be M8x1.25x45mm overall length. The tap end is 10mm with a 13mm shank and the nut end is 22mm. These are about 1/4" longer than stock studs. Cost from MMS is $20 for 5 studs and ss flange nuts or $20 for their Datsun exhaust kit (same studs) with ss washers and your choice of ss or brass nuts. Minimum tensile strength of the studs is rated at 100,000 psi vs 170,000 psi for the strain-hardened 304 ARP studs.

I also bought an assortment of 316 Nordlock washers and 316 nuts from McMaster-Carr. I wanted all 316 fasteners but in the end decided that 304 is good enough. 316 has slightly higher working temp and better corrosion resistance. I already have 8.8 black studs for the turbo, wastegate and dump pipe attachment but I may just replace those with SS too.

All of this hardware is approx. equivalent to grade 5 steel fasteners. Sould I be looking at grade 8 (10.9) fasteners instead of corrosion resistant SS? A286 and titanium are out of my budget range, if I could even find them in metric sizes.

 

What is your opinion on the cosmetic exhaust manifold gasket Dezod sells.

http://www.dezod.com/pd-cometic-mult...sket-2azfe.cfm

 

It looks like it would work just as well as the less expensive oem MLS gasket.

 

Any MLS gasket will do.

 

This shouldn't be so hard... MMS & A has A2 (304) SS exhaust manifold studs but no shorter M8 studs for my Tial F38 wastegate or M10 studs for the T3 connection. MD Metric has the M10 studs I need in A4 (316) but the only M8 studs they have are too long. I already got M8 and M10 A4 nuts and Nordlocks from McMaster-Carr.


FWIW, the DIN spec for metric double ended studs is 939 and the lengths needed for a T3, Tial F38 2AZ-FE setup are listed below:

Exhaust manifold: M8x1.25x35mm (45mm overall length)
Wastegate studs: M8x1.25x25mm (35mm overall length)
T3 junction: M10x1.5x30mm (42mm overall length)
4 or 5 bolt exhaust flange: M8x1.25x25mm (35mm overall length)


With SS metric studs this hard to come by, it's probably better to simply use SS set screws or buy a length of SS all-thread and make your own studs.

 

cutting ss sucks hardcore. I used to make those coilpack covers out of ss sheets, ugh..never again without proper tools.

 

Yes it does! We made my downpipe from 304 and 409 and what a difference between them. The 304 ate through a bunch of saw blades and the 409 cut like mild steel. My preferred exhaust shop hates working with 304 and charges extra labor to do it. They like 409 much better.

BTW, I have all my new hardware on order and could use a recommendation on gaskets. What do you use?

 

beleave it or not

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/01-08...Q5fAccessories

though the only gaskets i used out of the "kit" was head gasket, exhaust mani gasket, valve cover gasket, and main oil seal. all that ended up being alot cheaper than oem or anything els.

use at your own risk though...ish is cheap...perhaps a little too cheap really...however worked in my case.

edit: iv built two 2azfe's with eristic gasket sets, so far so good...(fingers still crossed...lol)

 

Thanks. I can't tell much from the photo except that the exhaust mani gasket appears to be MLS, which is good. I should have been more specific with my question. I'm particularly interested in new T3 inlet and wastegate gaskets.

I used a SCE copper T3 last time and sealed but has disintegrated over time. I used the typical single-layer embossed SS gaskets on the WG but they both leaked a little. I'd like MLS but haven't found any. The mating surfaces are flat enough for RTV but it's so messy.