Dealer Salesmen: STUPID?
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Joined: Sep 2004
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From: Mountain View, CA
1) Snake oil guy. He can sell ice to eskimos and a bloody popcicle to a bride in her dress. Avoid at all costs, or you may wind up paying 17k for a 3 year old Neon with 40k mi (seen it happen). They are easy to spot and thus easy to avoid. They hop around from dealership to dealership buring bridges with dealers and whacking the crap out of customers, and move to keep from getting burned themselves.
2) Cigarette smoking coffee guy. This type is your "typical" guy. He'll have a cup of coffee in one hand, sunglasses, and cigarette. Been in the buisness since the dawn of time, may or may not know anything about his merchandise, but does well enough (usually just a notch above average) to make a living. Not horrible to deal with, but still you can do better.
3) Newbie. Eager to serve, hasn't been demoralized by the buying public yet, and usually is just happy to see the back of the car leaving the lot. You can push this one around all you want, and they'll keep comming back for more....like a blue healer.
4) Oxygen transfer meat sacks. After talking with them for about a minute and a half, you wonder how many times they pass out because they forget to breathe. Brain has been destroyed by years of partying like it's 1979 and they live at club 54. Offer them a bump, and they'll get you another 500 to a grand off.
5) The Pro. They know what they are doing, genuinely look after your needs, and stay planted at a store for a long time. This is who you really want to deal with. You may pay more, but price isn't everything, and they know how to shave hours off of doing business.
2) Cigarette smoking coffee guy. This type is your "typical" guy. He'll have a cup of coffee in one hand, sunglasses, and cigarette. Been in the buisness since the dawn of time, may or may not know anything about his merchandise, but does well enough (usually just a notch above average) to make a living. Not horrible to deal with, but still you can do better.
3) Newbie. Eager to serve, hasn't been demoralized by the buying public yet, and usually is just happy to see the back of the car leaving the lot. You can push this one around all you want, and they'll keep comming back for more....like a blue healer.
4) Oxygen transfer meat sacks. After talking with them for about a minute and a half, you wonder how many times they pass out because they forget to breathe. Brain has been destroyed by years of partying like it's 1979 and they live at club 54. Offer them a bump, and they'll get you another 500 to a grand off.
5) The Pro. They know what they are doing, genuinely look after your needs, and stay planted at a store for a long time. This is who you really want to deal with. You may pay more, but price isn't everything, and they know how to shave hours off of doing business.
20-25 salespeople just seems like a lot of people. Are these guys all on commission only?
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DeepSouth Scions
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,512
Guess that is the standard dealership experience, I had to give my dealership touch up paint code because they failed in getting it themselves, the man didnt know what clear coat was and looked like i made the word up..Maybe i'll become a car dealer if I don't make it through college lol.
When I went to the dealership, the guy i bought mine from didnt even know that the release series existed, or that there was also a spec version. I asked him about both and he gave me this blank look and i knew that he knew nothing about what i was sayin...
i could get a job at the dealership selling scions like crazy - i have been on these boards not even a year yet and i already have gained a ton of knowledge about scions, i love it....stupid dealers,,,,
i could get a job at the dealership selling scions like crazy - i have been on these boards not even a year yet and i already have gained a ton of knowledge about scions, i love it....stupid dealers,,,,
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Scinergy
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 181
From: Atlanta, GA
I researched the ____ out of my car before I even went in to buy.
When the salesman took me out to look at the tC, I basically showed him where everything was and how it worked. He even complimented me on my knowledge, which was him basically admitting he was clueless.
The only real difficulty I had was when I went in and said, "I want a bottom of the barrel, stock tC with nothing added in White."
To which they replied, "Okay, but you think you could settle for silver. We have already gotten our alotment for the month and there is a very nice silver one over there."
I told them NO and that I would only except white. ( Hey if I was buying used maybe I would settle, but new...no way! )
They somewhat told me I was out of luck til next month.
Two days later, they call to tell me it's coming off the truck. :D
When the salesman took me out to look at the tC, I basically showed him where everything was and how it worked. He even complimented me on my knowledge, which was him basically admitting he was clueless.
The only real difficulty I had was when I went in and said, "I want a bottom of the barrel, stock tC with nothing added in White."
To which they replied, "Okay, but you think you could settle for silver. We have already gotten our alotment for the month and there is a very nice silver one over there."
I told them NO and that I would only except white. ( Hey if I was buying used maybe I would settle, but new...no way! )
They somewhat told me I was out of luck til next month.
Two days later, they call to tell me it's coming off the truck. :D
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,409
From: Redneck Riveria
Hee. A scion dealership should have only Pro's and Newbies. (In a perfect world) It's supposed to be pure price right? The snake oil guy trying to push the car kind of defeats the purpose of pure pricing right? I guess he would just be trying to push accessories then.
20-25 salespeople just seems like a lot of people. Are these guys all on commission only?
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 257
From: Glassboro, NJ
Hee. A scion dealership should have only Pro's and Newbies. (In a perfect world) It's supposed to be pure price right? The snake oil guy trying to push the car kind of defeats the purpose of pure pricing right? I guess he would just be trying to push accessories then.only.
I'm actually suprised to see that these guys are getting the boot from dealerships even though they are making the store a lot of money. Most dealerships are realizing that in the long run these types actually destroy their rep. so they are getting smart. Slowly but surely.
20-25 salespeople just seems like a lot of people. Are these guys all on commission only?
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,320
Yea... it happens dude. The first salesperson I got at Toyota of Orlando barely knew what was going on. I knew exactly what I wanted...
Remember, this guy is a Toyota salesperson, and I asked about some things he should know, like color. "Flint Mica," I said. He was very confused, then smiled and pointed - "hey, how about this blue color? It's really nice!" Well, it was a NBM tC, but an auto.
"I want a 5 speed."
"uhh... manual?"
"yea."
<really weird look> "WHY would you want a manual?!!?"
... as if I made the most ridiculous option ever.
Took a test drive anyway in an auto (didn't know how to drive stick at the time, but intended to buy one and learn). He didn't know anything about the car - at ALL. He even said "I'm trying to learn about these myself ha ha ha."
Whatever. I sort of felt sorry for him, I think he just got bumped up from wash boy.
I left there, since needless to say, they didn't deserve my business even though they had exactly what I wanted in stock immediately. Went to Courtesy Toyota where I was in contact with a salesperson, Chi Chang - he personally called me and tried to get me back there.
Went there instead, and he knew I knew exactly what I wanted and never tried to do anything differently. Sure, I did have to wait for my tC to come to the dealership, but whatever, the experience was SO much more worth it. Chi really knew his stuff, and it was obvious he used to be one of us.
What stood out most about him, though, was his honesty. He straight up told me about all the fees, even the ridiculous documentation fee. He told me it was indeed ridiculous, but that that's their profit, plain and simple, and there's no way he can get it taken off. I didn't even have to ask about it.
So it didn't even take two weeks... more like a week (about?). Anyway, got a fresh tC with only 1.9 miles on it. I can't complain at all.
Remember, this guy is a Toyota salesperson, and I asked about some things he should know, like color. "Flint Mica," I said. He was very confused, then smiled and pointed - "hey, how about this blue color? It's really nice!" Well, it was a NBM tC, but an auto.
"I want a 5 speed."
"uhh... manual?"
"yea."
<really weird look> "WHY would you want a manual?!!?"
... as if I made the most ridiculous option ever.
Took a test drive anyway in an auto (didn't know how to drive stick at the time, but intended to buy one and learn). He didn't know anything about the car - at ALL. He even said "I'm trying to learn about these myself ha ha ha."
Whatever. I sort of felt sorry for him, I think he just got bumped up from wash boy.
I left there, since needless to say, they didn't deserve my business even though they had exactly what I wanted in stock immediately. Went to Courtesy Toyota where I was in contact with a salesperson, Chi Chang - he personally called me and tried to get me back there.
Went there instead, and he knew I knew exactly what I wanted and never tried to do anything differently. Sure, I did have to wait for my tC to come to the dealership, but whatever, the experience was SO much more worth it. Chi really knew his stuff, and it was obvious he used to be one of us.
What stood out most about him, though, was his honesty. He straight up told me about all the fees, even the ridiculous documentation fee. He told me it was indeed ridiculous, but that that's their profit, plain and simple, and there's no way he can get it taken off. I didn't even have to ask about it.
So it didn't even take two weeks... more like a week (about?). Anyway, got a fresh tC with only 1.9 miles on it. I can't complain at all.
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Team Scionce
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 104
From: Neptune
chevy....
Originally Posted by dCvingtC
I researched the ____ out of my car before I even went in to buy.
When the salesman took me out to look at the tC, I basically showed him where everything was and how it worked. He even complimented me on my knowledge, which was him basically admitting he was clueless.
The only real difficulty I had was when I went in and said, "I want a bottom of the barrel, stock tC with nothing added in White."
To which they replied, "Okay, but you think you could settle for silver. We have already gotten our alotment for the month and there is a very nice silver one over there."
I told them NO and that I would only except white. ( Hey if I was buying used maybe I would settle, but new...no way! )
They somewhat told me I was out of luck til next month.
Two days later, they call to tell me it's coming off the truck. :D
When the salesman took me out to look at the tC, I basically showed him where everything was and how it worked. He even complimented me on my knowledge, which was him basically admitting he was clueless.
The only real difficulty I had was when I went in and said, "I want a bottom of the barrel, stock tC with nothing added in White."
To which they replied, "Okay, but you think you could settle for silver. We have already gotten our alotment for the month and there is a very nice silver one over there."
I told them NO and that I would only except white. ( Hey if I was buying used maybe I would settle, but new...no way! )
They somewhat told me I was out of luck til next month.
Two days later, they call to tell me it's coming off the truck. :D
Re: Dealer Salesmen: STUPID?
Originally Posted by nig_nig_the_conqueror
How is that the Scion salesman at my dealership knows less about current and upcoming scion vehicles than I do?
I was there trying to get my money's worth out of the service package I bought (stupid) when one of the scion salesmen recognized me and said hey. He asked me if I had seen the "Special Edition tC" yet. I said "Special Edition? You mean the new Release Series?"
He seemed to have no idea what I was talking about, and being a young guy, all he could tell me about was it's "awesome body kit" (which sucks, imo) and then proceeded to talk about the "awesome euro taillights" which he first called "Evo taillights" and then corrected himself. He also seemed to be thrilled with the factory sub and where it's located, and was possibly under the impression that this was the only car with the option of getting the sub. When I told him the only things I liked about the car were the grille and the headlights, he seemed confused. He then made sure I was aware of the "suede" multicolored interior. When I told him it was ugly, he asked me to "check out" the shifter. I gave up. On the way back inside, we small talked. He couldn't tell the difference between the stock tc headlights and the RS3 headlights. He knew nothing about the TRD supercharger other than...it exists. He continued calling the RS3 the "Special Edition tC". I told him I had to leave. "See ya DUDE" he said.
I had a similar experience at a Mitsubishi dealership when I went there with the single purpose of test driving an Evo IX MR. Before getting in the car, I was taking note of the things I liked. Before long, he just HAD to show me the optional factory subwoofer. WHY if I'm an auto enthusiast, interested in a performance car simply because of it's performance, do I care about the optional factory subwoofer??? I told him I didn't care about it, nor would I want it. It weighs too much. I don't think he understood.
How do they get into this line of work? Is this like how people get into being police officers or in the military? Just by failing high school or college and having no marketable skills? No offense intended, really. Just joking, kind of. Don't shoot.
I was there trying to get my money's worth out of the service package I bought (stupid) when one of the scion salesmen recognized me and said hey. He asked me if I had seen the "Special Edition tC" yet. I said "Special Edition? You mean the new Release Series?"
He seemed to have no idea what I was talking about, and being a young guy, all he could tell me about was it's "awesome body kit" (which sucks, imo) and then proceeded to talk about the "awesome euro taillights" which he first called "Evo taillights" and then corrected himself. He also seemed to be thrilled with the factory sub and where it's located, and was possibly under the impression that this was the only car with the option of getting the sub. When I told him the only things I liked about the car were the grille and the headlights, he seemed confused. He then made sure I was aware of the "suede" multicolored interior. When I told him it was ugly, he asked me to "check out" the shifter. I gave up. On the way back inside, we small talked. He couldn't tell the difference between the stock tc headlights and the RS3 headlights. He knew nothing about the TRD supercharger other than...it exists. He continued calling the RS3 the "Special Edition tC". I told him I had to leave. "See ya DUDE" he said.
I had a similar experience at a Mitsubishi dealership when I went there with the single purpose of test driving an Evo IX MR. Before getting in the car, I was taking note of the things I liked. Before long, he just HAD to show me the optional factory subwoofer. WHY if I'm an auto enthusiast, interested in a performance car simply because of it's performance, do I care about the optional factory subwoofer??? I told him I didn't care about it, nor would I want it. It weighs too much. I don't think he understood.
How do they get into this line of work? Is this like how people get into being police officers or in the military? Just by failing high school or college and having no marketable skills? No offense intended, really. Just joking, kind of. Don't shoot.
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 6
Re: Dealer Salesmen: STUPID?
Originally Posted by nig_nig_the_conqueror
How do they get into this line of work? Is this like how people get into being police officers or in the military? Just by failing high school or college and having no marketable skills? No offense intended, really. Just joking, kind of. Don't shoot.
P.S. I'm military... and no i didnt fail high school or college... And obviously computer degrees are not marketable skills...
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Posts: 310
Re: Dealer Salesmen: STUPID?
Originally Posted by chrischoi
Serious. He's just doing his job. If he's older than you. He just thinks you think it's cool. No reason to call him stupid.
And no, I don't believe in this "just doing his job" stuff I keep hearing. It seems that if he were doing his job, he would at least be aware of the Release Series vehicles. I hope that if he were given a whole f*cking book of specs on every single car, he could at least get the title of the f*cking thing.
All I know is that if I were given all of the information I needed to excel at the job, I doubt I would know so little about the vehicles. I don't know what everybody here does for a living, but think about it, are you as bad at what you do as these salesmen are? I'm going to go out on a limb and say that I (and most others) probably have to know and be aware of a lot more than they are in their everyday job.
No, I wouldn't be able to remember everything that everybody would ever want to know. BUT I would be able to call a car by its correct name.
I don't really need the salesmen, as I know or can easily figure out everything I need to know about the cars. But through the small talk the salesmen force on me, I've discovered that they are often seemingly uneducated in an area that I would have expected them to be near experts. My naivete I guess.
Originally Posted by Spyd3r
While I agree your experience sucked, I think your last statement kinda makes me just laugh that it was that you had to deal with a crappy salesperson. thanks for the insult though...
P.S. I'm military... and no i didnt fail high school or college... And obviously computer degrees are not marketable skills...
P.S. I'm military... and no i didnt fail high school or college... And obviously computer degrees are not marketable skills...
And no, a DEGREE is not a marketable SKILL.
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 396
From: Chatan, Okinawa Japan
Woo hoo i get to speak from the other side of the coin. I sold Ford/Dodge for 2 years and heres the reason for that.
MOST people want the trivial things pointed out to them. They think oh cool, and its to create value in the customers eyes, so there more acepting of the assrape in price. "Well its got that underfloor subwoofer, and those awesome tailights, and a bodykit (sorry the RS3 has a lipkit with a plack on it. The regualar Scion lip kit looks better) so its gotta be worth the deal there giving me"
Its all in the sale. Now maybe that guy gets alot of customers that are wowed by that. Maybe he thinks hes gonna get extra money on a low turnover car (Scions are sold not much above invoice) in which case his selling style makes no sense
I worked with alot of people who couldnt tell you a lugnut from a sparkplug. But they sold because they would point out all the trivial ____ and the unknowing customer would eat it up. And alot of customers are not car people, they just want someone that will smile at them and ask how are you today. A very select few are car people, or even come in prepared. Youd be suprised how many people just drop by, and dont consult the internet, and they are a salesmans dream. Because theyre allmost a guarantee to make it a good payday.
Me personally, if i cant talk cars with the guy im paying to give me the car i want, then ill find a salesman that does know there stuff and let them get the payday.
MOST people want the trivial things pointed out to them. They think oh cool, and its to create value in the customers eyes, so there more acepting of the assrape in price. "Well its got that underfloor subwoofer, and those awesome tailights, and a bodykit (sorry the RS3 has a lipkit with a plack on it. The regualar Scion lip kit looks better) so its gotta be worth the deal there giving me"
Its all in the sale. Now maybe that guy gets alot of customers that are wowed by that. Maybe he thinks hes gonna get extra money on a low turnover car (Scions are sold not much above invoice) in which case his selling style makes no sense
I worked with alot of people who couldnt tell you a lugnut from a sparkplug. But they sold because they would point out all the trivial ____ and the unknowing customer would eat it up. And alot of customers are not car people, they just want someone that will smile at them and ask how are you today. A very select few are car people, or even come in prepared. Youd be suprised how many people just drop by, and dont consult the internet, and they are a salesmans dream. Because theyre allmost a guarantee to make it a good payday.
Me personally, if i cant talk cars with the guy im paying to give me the car i want, then ill find a salesman that does know there stuff and let them get the payday.
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Joined: Mar 2006
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From: Redneck Riveria
BTW, the guy who started Waste Management and Blockbuster, Wayne Heizenga (sp?) started a little company called Auto Nation. He, just like you nig, thought the salesman was irrelivant to the process, so he set up Auto Nation with the idea that people would just walk up to a terminal and pay for a car like a gallon of milk. However, it didn't work like that, the company was on the brink of bankruptcy until he decided the salesmen make or break a dealership.
BTW, no business gets done anywhere in any industry without a sales force of some kind.
BTW, no business gets done anywhere in any industry without a sales force of some kind.
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Originally Posted by scionofPCFL
BTW, the guy who started Waste Management and Blockbuster, Wayne Heizenga (sp?) started a little company called Auto Nation. He, just like you nig, thought the salesman was irrelivant to the process, so he set up Auto Nation with the idea that people would just walk up to a terminal and pay for a car like a gallon of milk. However, it didn't work like that, the company was on the brink of bankruptcy until he decided the salesmen make or break a dealership.
BTW, no business gets done anywhere in any industry without a sales force of some kind.
BTW, no business gets done anywhere in any industry without a sales force of some kind.
My point, in a nutshell, is this:
Let's say it is your job to sell cars. Theoretically, the more you know about a car, the more things you can bring up to convince the soccer mom to buy the thing, right? All I'm saying is that it can't hurt you at all to know a little more to increase your chances of not looking like a complete douchebag. And the very least you could do is not try to start a conversation about cars with someone you know just bought a new car (me) when you don't know a damn thing about them.
It's not like he was trying to sell me one. The guy knew I was there with my '07 getting it serviced.
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From: Redneck Riveria
Theoretically, the more you know about a car, the more things you can bring up to convince the soccer mom to buy the thing, right?
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Scion Evolution
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,372
From: Baltimore, MD
as a salesperson, i will agree with the majority of you. your typical sales person wont know as much as the person that has researched the car (any make/model). i am the scion champion at my dealer, and i know the in's and outs of all the models, and i know alot more then the typical person about the xD and new xB, no to mention i know the tC the best because i own one.
but here is a perfect example from teh sales end. If i get a scion customer, im in heaven cause i can USUALLY relate with them, and give them more then enough information about the cars, accessories, aftermarket, community, shows/events, etc. but If i get a toyota customer, i know the basic stuff about the toyota models, but nothing deep, and usually the customer (if they did their homework on that model) know's alot more about that model then myself. but if there is a question they have, and i dont have the answer, i will get the anwser for them.
i figured it would be good to get a scion salesmen on this topic =]
but here is a perfect example from teh sales end. If i get a scion customer, im in heaven cause i can USUALLY relate with them, and give them more then enough information about the cars, accessories, aftermarket, community, shows/events, etc. but If i get a toyota customer, i know the basic stuff about the toyota models, but nothing deep, and usually the customer (if they did their homework on that model) know's alot more about that model then myself. but if there is a question they have, and i dont have the answer, i will get the anwser for them.
i figured it would be good to get a scion salesmen on this topic =]
