So here is my idea for the new scion tc. I am a tc owner and I bought it for the combination of sporty feel along with the efficient motor and great reliability. Oh yeah – and the killer looks. And of course the nice price… anyway, I am not a huge mechanical car guy, but I keep up with car magazines and car news etc, and I keep reading that scion isn’t quite as well as they used to be. And of course to a certain extent that is expected in this time, but I just think it would be great for scion to really nail a new car out there. This may have all been said before, but searched about it and I just wanted to throw my 2 cents out there.

I have never really gotten into the posting on forums stuff, but I look at scionlife from time to time, and I really want to get people’s opinion on this stuff. Here ya go:


Drivetrain
First of all, I believe that many people out there are hoping that the new tc will be something besides fwd. fwd is fine for people who don’t really care about performance, but lets face it… it needs to be awd or rwd if it is going to be able to be slightly quick. And though I believe this isn’t the primary goal of the tc, (obviously someone wanted a super high performance machine, they wouldn’t choose the tc). When I see fellow tC owners willing to dump thousands and thousands of dollars into their fwd tCs, its frustrating to think how difficult it will be to get these cars to be well rounded quick cars. I mean yeah, I have considered throwing a turbo onto my tC, but all I would probably end up with is a huge hole in my wallet, lots of wheelspin and torquesteer. So anyway, I think the tc should go with awd, because I like the safety of awd in all types of weather conditions and awd cars are very capable of being well rounded, quick cars. And I think that if Toyota/scion wants to make this car rwd, they might as well just call it the next Toyota Supra (which I personally think would be a huge success as well, but that’s another story). so I think the new tc should be awd, and I believe this should only add around 150 lbs of weight, and say 1500 to the pricetag. So in summary:
Price mods – Awd cars are generally more expensive and though Toyota could just rip the awd system from another vehicle in their lineup, lets say it adds 1500 bucks.
Performance mods – awd= loads of grip (especially off the line and in the corners) – should be fantastic handling potential since the car doesn’t weigh much either. weight should increase only 150ish lbs

Engine
I also think the new tc should utilize the supercharger for the 2.4L 4cyl as currently found in the tc. The motor isn’t bad the way it is, but it could use the extra pop of forced induction. This will get people started on putting more performance mods in their tc’s because of the performance potential of an awd car. Scion could also go with a turbo option, which would boost performance to an even higher level. There are many turbo companies that im sure would be willing to work with Toyota to develop a turbo kit (there are a lot of kits out there that boost hp >240). I think it would be great if scion/Toyota could get the 2.4 up to GM’s turboed 2.4 which produces 250hp and still returns 23/29mpg with the 5 speed tranny. Surely Toyota could at least keep up with those figures. That engine is utilized by gm in several vehicles, and I think Toyota could really benefit from having an engine that is capable of putting up those type of numbers. I am going to figure conservatively, so lets say they throw in the current supercharger only, they get it set up for a pound or two extra of boost, and so the total hp should get up to 200-220ish. (hopefully 180-200 at the wheels) So with an awd car with a modestly short shift kit – 0-60 should come around 6-6.5 seconds by my rough calculations and depending on gearing etc, the quarter hopefully would be around 15 flat, which is modestly quicker than the current tC.
Price mods – I believe the current trd supercharger system costs 2000 to add to a 2007-2005 tC, and since its being put directly into the new tC, lets say it will cost only 2000 to add to the msrp. Hopefully the new one will be able to push out a few more pounds of boost. TOTAL – 2000
Performance mods – Obviously the supercharger will help a ton, and tC tuners will eat this up! Hopefully power will be up to 220ish hp and 220 ft/lbs. Weight should go up slightly – say 50 lbs.

Transmission
I think it’s pretty evident that the tC runs quite hot at freeway speeds, and it could definitely benefit from a 6 speed gearbox. I believe while Toyota is at it they might as well update the old 4 speed auto while they are at it. The tc runs around 3k rpm at just 65mph. I can’t imagine if most other cars ran that hot in top gear at those speeds (I mean some 4 bangers will, but still…). And though its not extremely loud, it just makes sense to have it running at a lower rpm so that there is less stress on the engine (and hopefully longer life), and also hopefully better gas mileage. So with that new tranny hopefully cancelling the slight amount of gas mileage that may have been lost due to the extra weight and the supercharging. Thus the gas mileage should remain around 23/30. Hopefully this should not affect weight either, so lets say the weight should be up to 3050 lbs. This would be a key to keeping the tc as quick and fuel efficient as it can be.
Price mods - A new tranny will also cost more, but it could really help the car too, so lets say it adds 500 to the price of the car
Performance mods - Hopefully with the new tranny, the engine will be more efficient. It should allow the tc to get the same mileage despite the increase in power. Will also affect top speed… Shouldn’t affect weight

Exterior
I believe it is safe to say that the tc does very well the way it is now. The exterior is an absolutely killer look, and I believe it is one of the best looking cars on the road. And for the price it starts it, it is a great looking bargin! For the money, it is absolutely the best looking car you can buy. So I believe the new tc should definitely keep several of the exterior parts of the current tc. The new one should obviously look more modern, but I don’t believe too many changes are needed. However, side mirrors that fold may be nice.
Price mods – none hopefully
Performance mods – maybe more aerodynamic…?

Interior
Once again I believe the tc is extremely functional. Though there are a lot of cheap plastics, the interior is very useable! It is one of the roomiest coupes on the market, and the split fold seats in the back help provide plenty of cargo room. The trunk isn’t too bad either. Though the interior is fairly basic, it keeps the price down, and there really shouldn’t be any large changes, though your typical modernizations of the next generation of tc should be done. I think leather would be a great option to add, and I think with the performance mods as listed earlier, there may be people who want the tc to be a racer, and so I think it may not be a terrible idea to make the sunroof an option. Though I love my sunroof, I think the racers may appreciate it without it, thus saving weight, and it would also help to lower the base-price of the new tc. Obviously the 9 airbags should remain standard as well. What a great safety feature!
Price mods – sunroof delete takes off say 700 from the msrp. Leather optional
Performance mods – sunroof should maybe save 100 lbs?

Total price change = + 2800ish – current tc starts at 17000, so total now close to 20K
Total weight change = + 100ish? – current tc is 2900 lbs – so new tc should be 3000lbs
Total power change = + 60ish hp…? Same torque plus having awd … and a sweet new tranny

Other random bits
Release series stuff – Its always interesting to see what the new release series will be. and I think it would be a great thing to continue, but I think the best release series for the tc was the first one because of the color and wheel combination. The new release serieses seem to just be a slightly different color, and a slightly tweaked body kit, and release series stuff badged all over the inside = not near as fun as the original. Make the release series stuff bold! Bring out new crazy colors! Stuff that makes a scion a scion! Set our cars apart from others on the road! Have some cool interior options as well – this has been done fairly well. Bring back the custom rim choices too!!!

So to review I hope the new tc should be a 220ish hp awd 6-speed good looking machine that weighs roughly 3000 lbs and gets 23-30 mpg. Price should increase some, but with my estimates it should increase to lets say 20K starting price. Sounds like fun!!!!

In some ways I picture this car to be similar to the 2000-2006 audi tt in several respects. I would say that price would obviously be cheaper, and the interior would be more functional, but both are light coupes with +2 seating and a decent trunk. Both are awd and both have 6-speed manuals hooked up to forced induction 4 bangers. The audi had 225 hp and it weighed 3200ish pounds. 0-60 was around 6.3 and the quarter was right around 14.4 (starting msrp was 36,000). So in many respects, this car would be similar. HOWEVER, this car would be way cheaper, have a more functional interior (especially backseats you can actually sit in), hopefully look sweeter, be safer, more common, sell better, be more customizable, and overall a much better value, which is so so important in this time of economic difficulty.

From a marketing standpoint, this car could easily be marketed to a wide variety of people. Obviously, Scion in general has been aimed at generation Y, of which I am a part, and I think that’s great. But from a pure marketing standpoint, I could easily understand why older people may be interested in this car as well. And the tc now isn’t a bad retirement car in itself. Its nice to just throw down the sunroof and cruise along comfortably, and I believe the next generation tc could easily fit that category as well. And who knows, a convertible could even be down the line… also Toyota/scion could easily trd accessorize the heck out of this car. Lots of performance parts I believe would appear on the market once again… also when you break this car down, there really aren’t many parts that Toyota doesn’t have in their arsenal already.

Competition for this car? VW gti, audi tt, maybe sneak in the mix against the muscle cars (challenger, camero, mustang), Honda civic, mazda rx8, mini cooper, Mitsubishi eclipse, Mitsubishi lancer ralliart, Volvo s40, Hyundai genesis coupe, chevy cobalt ss, Subaru wrx, mazdaspeed 3

How much work would it really be for Toyota/scion? I honestly don’t believe it would cost scion too much to produce this car. Take the same wheelbase of the current tc, grab an awd system from the new Venza or whatever else. The most expensive part is the transmission. I think this is truly critical though. It’s unfortunate that the current auto transmission is so smooth, and the 5 speed works fine. It’s just that I know how much more potential that engine is capable of, and the transmission just seems to be holding it back. So the last part that scion would have to develop is a new body. This shouldn’t be too difficult for the people from scion, as they always seem to be full of new creative ideas!


And throwing this out there – if anyone from scion sees this, I would love to discuss it with you, and I might only ask for 5% of each sale haha.

 

By doing those changes and bumping the cost up more it would no longer be a Scion. Trust me, i'm all for rear wheel drive, or all wheel drive, but I have no issues with Front wheel. Keep the cost down, make it affordable, if they increase the costs then Scion will no longer be Scion. The TC has already went through several price increases since its inception, the youth are not made of money, they want a slick car for an affordable price. 15-17k is fair, asking 20k is a bit ridiculous. Its like GM and Dodge making the new Camero, GTO, Challenger but they are 35k+ in price. These cars used to be driven by YOUTH, now only older people who want a nice summer ride and spare cash purchase them.


There already was an article about how Scion is losing its image, in 2005 and 2006 it was a big hit with the 17-25 range of people, but as the years went on and the introduction of XB2Gen older people are purchasing the cars for their toyota reliability and affordability(cheapest toyota cars you can own next to the Yaris).


They should do some remodel changes, keep the cost low, re-create the supercharger to be more reliable, less prone to problems, make an optional turbo kit, and bring these accessories and parts in line with their aftermarket counterparts. TRD stuff is nice, but paying nearly two-three times the price for a part you can get aftermarket for far less is crazy!

 

nice description.....but remember toyota is no longer going to make the 2.4l engine anymore...... so the next Tc might have a 2.5L or 2.7 motor

 

saberz: yeah, i know what you mean about jacking up the price, but at the same time, isn't it a little frustrating to know that ppl put so much into performance parts on a fwd car? Maybe they can even offer an awd version of the car...

Also, i wansnt really sure how much awd would add to the price. minus the awd, the car would be back around 18 or so.

Exodus: ahh thanks for that heads up! i just did some reading about those new engines. looks like they should be an improvement. what are the chances of toyota/scion switching to a 6 speed manual?

 

If you want a high performance car, dont get a tc. Period. The only way to make our cars fast (not even fast) is putting a turbo in. Then again, as you mentioned, wheelspin cause its FWD. What can you do? Scion could realistically make the next tc a RWD, but thats about it. Aftermarket companies can take it from there.

IMO the tc is an average looking car when its bone stock. Its too rounded and does not look aggresive. Whats amazing is a simple drop and then the tc starts to look very aggresive, add a few exterior mods and youre set.

 

I would love an AWD, but in this price range its a bit tough, the only way to do it is to sacrifice on other things. Look at the Suzuki SX4 Sport. Its AWD, but only a 140 HP motor, and bunch of other smaller more economical things to keep the price really low. Rear Wheel would be nice, but then again most people in the east coast would be kinda fubared like the people driving Camaro's and Mustangs. The price would cost more since some people end up buying a set of Winter tires and summer tires forgoing the all year round ones. Its a tough choice, but I know if the Toybaru car comes out its going to be expensive. Scion needs to be sub 18k or they will hurt the market that they have been trying to get market share in


All in all though, your write up is good, if they could implement all of that for 18k and under it would be a car to be reckoned with and force every other manufacturer to reprice and rethink their manufacturing process.

 

yeah, i think this car will decimate all if you after you put in about 15 grand or more if we have to - overnight parts from japan.


hahaha

 

"stupid racers"

 

changes are afoot
https://www.scionlife.com/forums/vie...876&highlight=

 

They have something like that already....its called a Subaru WRX...go and check it out.

 

it would be too expensive to be scion...but realistically a rwd is possible!

 

You can scrap the s/c idea too. On top of its many issues that have come up with it, TRD announced that they are no longer going to make the s/c for the tc.

Turbo is the best route for Toyota to go. They have years of experience making turbo'd engines. Unless they go with a roots type s/c.

 

ok fast and furious hahahaha

 

that's a smart move to stop makin the s/c and save a lot of tc owners the trip of going through hell and back :l

 

yeah the turboed boxer engine gets only 25 mpg highway with 220 horse - not great at all... and i hear they aren't the most reliable. so no thanks

 

 

I thought WRX had 265hp and 244lb-ft torque?

 

hmm wheel spin..did you notice that you will get substantial wheel spin with any car other then AWD? Like the saying goes, you can make any car fast..as long as you have money. The tC is a great platform for drag and can be fast around the track. Plenty of potential, look at Chris Rado and Ptuning.

 

yeah, if i had wanted a wrx, i would have bought one, wait, i didnt have the money.

and also, i hate to think what the insurance rates would be... with the car aimed at such a young demographic.

 

damn no more s/c??? I didnt hear this