Front Camber Adjustment Bolts
03-22-2011, 06:37 PM
#1
Banned
SL Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,075
Front Camber Adjustment Bolts
Camber adjustment bolts are now available for the Gen 2 from Specialty Products Company..they are $46.37 though.
They have a camber adjustment range of -1.75 through +1.75 degrees.
This is one of the best handling improvements you can make on your car...but you need to find a shop that will adjust your camber to 0.00 degrees and not just to the OEM specs. That usually costs extra, but well worth it!
http://www.spcalignment.com/componen...AFrom&to=USATo
They have a camber adjustment range of -1.75 through +1.75 degrees.
This is one of the best handling improvements you can make on your car...but you need to find a shop that will adjust your camber to 0.00 degrees and not just to the OEM specs. That usually costs extra, but well worth it!
http://www.spcalignment.com/componen...AFrom&to=USATo
03-22-2011, 10:33 PM
#4
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 779
Camber adjustment bolts are now available for the Gen 2 from Specialty Products Company..they are $46.37 though.
They have a camber adjustment range of -1.75 through +1.75 degrees.
This is one of the best handling improvements you can make on your car...but you need to find a shop that will adjust your camber to 0.00 degrees and not just to the OEM specs. That usually costs extra, but well worth it!
http://www.spcalignment.com/componen...AFrom&to=USATo
They have a camber adjustment range of -1.75 through +1.75 degrees.
This is one of the best handling improvements you can make on your car...but you need to find a shop that will adjust your camber to 0.00 degrees and not just to the OEM specs. That usually costs extra, but well worth it!
http://www.spcalignment.com/componen...AFrom&to=USATo
What you want is 0 degrees of toe with some negative camber.
I would love to get these bolts but like Papa_Bear, I'm waiting on rears myself.
Oh, and SPC bolts are the same as Eibach bolts. SPC makes them for Eibach, but sometimes the prices vary, so check with both before buying.
03-23-2011, 07:32 PM
#5
Banned
SL Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,075
Looking at the installation instructions for the TRD Lowering Springs, the wheel alignment data is included;
Lowering Spring
Part Number: PTR11-21100
Front:
Total Toe = 1.0 ± 2.0 mm (0.04 ± 0.08 in.)
Camber = -0°13' ± 45' (-0.22° ± 0.75°)
Rear:
Total Toe = 3 ± 2 mm (0.12 ± 0 .08 in.)
Camber = -2°0' ± 30' (-2.00° ± 0.50°)(Modified by TRD USA ) Note: camber is not adjustable
You can go anywhere from -0.97° to +0.53° and still be within spec on the front...
Your statement is not accurate and not founded.
Lowering Spring
Part Number: PTR11-21100
Front:
Total Toe = 1.0 ± 2.0 mm (0.04 ± 0.08 in.)
Camber = -0°13' ± 45' (-0.22° ± 0.75°)
Rear:
Total Toe = 3 ± 2 mm (0.12 ± 0 .08 in.)
Camber = -2°0' ± 30' (-2.00° ± 0.50°)(Modified by TRD USA ) Note: camber is not adjustable
You can go anywhere from -0.97° to +0.53° and still be within spec on the front...
Your statement is not accurate and not founded.
03-23-2011, 10:43 PM
#6
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 779
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tirete...e.jsp?techid=4
I assure you that I am not foreign to vehicle alignment settings. I can also assure you that while 0 camber may be ideal for tire wear, it is not ideal for any sort of performance driving.
Think of it this way, you have tire wear and driving performance. As you lean towards one, you lose the other. At 0 camber, driving performance is gone.
And by performance I don't mean racing. Every car comes from factory with camber for a reason. Its like riding a bike. When your riding and go to turn, do you not lean a little to ease in the turn or do you keep the bike perfectly upright and turn only the handle bars? Doing the later is like having 0 camber or positive camber in the car. Steering is light, but turning ability sucks.
To each his own. Your car has factory camber now, so if you plan to correct it to nothing, then what's the point in lowering it? Clearly not for enjoyment of the drive...
I assure you that I am not foreign to vehicle alignment settings. I can also assure you that while 0 camber may be ideal for tire wear, it is not ideal for any sort of performance driving.
Think of it this way, you have tire wear and driving performance. As you lean towards one, you lose the other. At 0 camber, driving performance is gone.
And by performance I don't mean racing. Every car comes from factory with camber for a reason. Its like riding a bike. When your riding and go to turn, do you not lean a little to ease in the turn or do you keep the bike perfectly upright and turn only the handle bars? Doing the later is like having 0 camber or positive camber in the car. Steering is light, but turning ability sucks.
To each his own. Your car has factory camber now, so if you plan to correct it to nothing, then what's the point in lowering it? Clearly not for enjoyment of the drive...
03-24-2011, 01:35 AM
#9
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 779
Did you even read the article?
Different driving styles can also influence the desired camber angle as well. An enthusiastic driver who corners faster than a reserved driver will receive more cornering grip and longer tire life from a tire aligned with more negative camber.
The goal is to use enough negative camber to provide good cornering performance while not requiring the tire to put too much of its load on the inner edge while traveling in a straight line. Less negative camber (until the tire is perpendicular to the road at zero camber) typically will reduce the cornering ability, but results in more even wear.
You do know your suspension "loads" right? In a turn, weight is transferred to the outside corner of the vehicle. As the weight transfers, the suspension articulates. With negative camber, as the vehicle loads, the vehicle will "stand" on the tire utilizing the entire contact patch. With positive camber, it will already be past this point before it begins to load. At 0 camber, it will exceed the maximum contact patch as soon as weight begins to transfer.
Don't believe me, grab yourself a pyrometer and go out driving around mildly aggressive in the turns. Immediately after taking a turn, get out and use the pyrometer on the inside, middle, and outside of the face of the tread on your tires; more specifically your front tires. You'll find that with a little negative camber, the middle of your tires will likely be the hottest point. With 0 camber, the hottest point will be the outside of the tire. Too much negative camber and the inside of your tire will be the hottest. This shows what portion of the tire is being used most during driving.
Again, believe whatever you want. All I'm saying is that in a street car application, 0 camber is not good. For those looking to add or remove negative camber, they should understand how much negative they must have in order for the car to perform properly. Cars are engineered this way for a reason.
03-24-2011, 02:17 AM
#10
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Hollister, CA
Posts: 406
Whoa, your getting defensive over something you claim to know like the back of your hand...
Did you even read the article?
Doesn't seem to me that the discussion on camber is to keep the tire upright for increased grip nor does it mention to have your alignment set at 0 degree.
You do know your suspension "loads" right? In a turn, weight is transferred to the outside corner of the vehicle. As the weight transfers, the suspension articulates. With negative camber, as the vehicle loads, the vehicle will "stand" on the tire utilizing the entire contact patch. With positive camber, it will already be past this point before it begins to load. At 0 camber, it will exceed the maximum contact patch as soon as weight begins to transfer.
Don't believe me, grab yourself a pyrometer and go out driving around mildly aggressive in the turns. Immediately after taking a turn, get out and use the pyrometer on the inside, middle, and outside of the face of the tread on your tires; more specifically your front tires. You'll find that with a little negative camber, the middle of your tires will likely be the hottest point. With 0 camber, the hottest point will be the outside of the tire. Too much negative camber and the inside of your tire will be the hottest. This shows what portion of the tire is being used most during driving.
Again, believe whatever you want. All I'm saying is that in a street car application, 0 camber is not good. For those looking to add or remove negative camber, they should understand how much negative they must have in order for the car to perform properly. Cars are engineered this way for a reason.
Did you even read the article?
Doesn't seem to me that the discussion on camber is to keep the tire upright for increased grip nor does it mention to have your alignment set at 0 degree.
You do know your suspension "loads" right? In a turn, weight is transferred to the outside corner of the vehicle. As the weight transfers, the suspension articulates. With negative camber, as the vehicle loads, the vehicle will "stand" on the tire utilizing the entire contact patch. With positive camber, it will already be past this point before it begins to load. At 0 camber, it will exceed the maximum contact patch as soon as weight begins to transfer.
Don't believe me, grab yourself a pyrometer and go out driving around mildly aggressive in the turns. Immediately after taking a turn, get out and use the pyrometer on the inside, middle, and outside of the face of the tread on your tires; more specifically your front tires. You'll find that with a little negative camber, the middle of your tires will likely be the hottest point. With 0 camber, the hottest point will be the outside of the tire. Too much negative camber and the inside of your tire will be the hottest. This shows what portion of the tire is being used most during driving.
Again, believe whatever you want. All I'm saying is that in a street car application, 0 camber is not good. For those looking to add or remove negative camber, they should understand how much negative they must have in order for the car to perform properly. Cars are engineered this way for a reason.
03-24-2011, 02:41 AM
#12
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Hollister, CA
Posts: 406
Trust me I am in the exact same boat. The issue is can someone learn or be open to learning and not being ignorant or a know it all on this forum? not directing this towards anyone, just saying that people need to be more open minded on here. Too much negativity
03-24-2011, 03:00 AM
#13
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 779
^Agreed. I will openly admit that I don't know everything, so I spend my time reading and posting only when I feel I can share some knowledge. I myself have been down the alignment road and have helped setup multiple track setups for myself and others.
You can learn more from reading then you can from speaking.
You can learn more from reading then you can from speaking.
04-03-2011, 01:13 PM
#14
If you want a car to corner better, - camber is a must on all 4 tires period. Ask any racer from off road to on road. Due to the reasons mentioned above.
Toe out up front increases turn in response. Toe in on front end decreases turning response but increases straight line stability. Rear end, toe in increases rear end stability. Toe out on rear end is generally not recommended, you will just scrub speed and kill tires.
These are just a few things I learned from 1/8th scale R/C, which is just as technical as any other motor sport. 1 degree off/ 1 ounce of weight off can make or break you. If you are not familiar with r/c racing, trust me. It is not grown men playing with toys. SERIOUS POO!! LOL.. I could have paid cash for my TC2 with what I spent on R/C in just a few years. As always I am hear to learn so if there is any discrepancies between what I posted vs. auto racing please enlighten me. I love to learn new stuff!
Toe out up front increases turn in response. Toe in on front end decreases turning response but increases straight line stability. Rear end, toe in increases rear end stability. Toe out on rear end is generally not recommended, you will just scrub speed and kill tires.
These are just a few things I learned from 1/8th scale R/C, which is just as technical as any other motor sport. 1 degree off/ 1 ounce of weight off can make or break you. If you are not familiar with r/c racing, trust me. It is not grown men playing with toys. SERIOUS POO!! LOL.. I could have paid cash for my TC2 with what I spent on R/C in just a few years. As always I am hear to learn so if there is any discrepancies between what I posted vs. auto racing please enlighten me. I love to learn new stuff!
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
evolving_machine
Scion tC 2G Drivetrain & Power
17
10-21-2023 01:16 PM
kleecker
Scion xB 2nd-Gen Suspension & Handling
5
01-02-2015 08:09 PM
