dugzilla

PM'd about the struts

designed24

xB may be 85lbs more than xA but the echo's 300 lbs less than the xA and 400 than the xB. We are talking about echo spec shock/struts here, thats the issue.

xA_Factor

*SOLD*

vintage42

I did lose the thread. Here's the three weights.
The xB weighs 2,425 lbs.
The xA weighs 2,340 lbs.
The Echo weighs 2,085 ibs.

OrAnGeBoX

Ya I would say that the Koni's dropped my front end 1/2 an inch lower as well.

phillycaster

I already have the Sensa-Tracs on my xB and am pursuing the H-Tech's becuase there seemed to be quite a few here running that combination. I did a search on "Tein and Tech and Monroe" and found this thread from December that has a pic showing the difference between the stock & Monroe struts:

https://www.scionlife.com/forums/vie...in+tech+monroe

vintage42

The top photo shows the SensaTrac is about 1/4 inch shorter, and shows the progressive winding of the Tein spring which should make it softer at first. Quite different looking.
The top and bottom photos show the rubber dust cover of the SensaTrac has not been clamped to the shock with a zip tie yet.

phillycaster

First I've read of the zip tie...is this somethign that is recommended? And how is it done? Pics?

xA_Factor

The Monores do not come with dust boots. You just reuse the the OE boots and there's no need to zip-tie the bottom.

vintage42

The rear SensaTracs on my Mazda came with their own rubber dust boots. The shop attached the bottom of the rubber boot to the shock body with zip ties to keep dirt and salt and water off the piston. I assumed the same should be done with struts, regardless of where the rubber boot came from.

The rear SensaTracs for my xB came with no dust boots, because the xB dust boots are plastic and are part of the car not the shock.

xA_Factor

The factory dust boot is not meant to be secured at the bottom. The rubber material it's made of doesn't seem to have the ability to stretch much vertically. IMO, trying to secure it would either, not hold and/or would tear the boot.

KenzokuXB

Awesome thread. Learning a lot from all the post. So let me get this straight. The monroe shocks are dropping XB's about a 1/2 in. in the front, giving it the "demon" dropped look, correct?

I've been working on cars for about 7 years now and have always used Tokico shocks on all my past vehicles (91 CRX, 92 Honda Accord) and combined them with Eibach springs. This is the first I have ever heard of enthusiasts using Monroe shocks/struts mated with a lowering spring. I always thought Monroes were made for factory height vehicles. Can these Monroes handle the abuse a lowered ride will throw @ it? I'm confused now. I thought Koni & Tokico's were made specifically for lowered cars to handle the abuse?? Are monroes better than Tokico's & Koni's??

Sorri XB_Factor not trien to HiJack your thread. You guys just seem really knowledgeable about suspension tuning.

vintage42

Names:
Monroe is a division of Tenneco, who has SensaTracs made abroad. Tenneco also sells SensaTracs under the NAPA, Sear Midas and other brands.

Shorter:
From this photo, it looks like the SensaTrac strut on the rght is less than 1/2 shorter than the OEM Tokico strut on the left, whether looking at the top or the spring seat:
http://s49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...sSensaTrac.jpg

Lowering:
Monroe Sensatrac shocks and struts have a tapered groove machined into the inside housing. While the piston is in the groove, the ride is soft and comfortable, but when the piston travels above or below the groove, during rough roads or severe handling, the valving stiffens up. If the ride is lowered enough to get the piston out of the grooved area, the ride would become hard.
http://www.shockwarehouse.com/site/mon_sense.cfm

Application:
Alll the SensaTrac and Koni shocks and struts that we are using for the xB are listed in the product catalogs for the Echo application. The xB is too recent to appear in the aftermarket supplier catalogs.

Best:
As to which strut or shock is better, it depends on what you want and what you want to pay. The OEM rear KYB is a hard shock, perhaps selected for good handling with a full load. The OEM front Tokico is about right for most people, but a little firm for others. The rear SensaTrac is softer than the KYB and a good match for the front Tokico. Koni shocks and struts are adjustable from plush soft to rock hard. The Konis are the best, due to their high quality and adjustability to any setting.

Cost:
Rear SensaTracs shocks are about $75/pair.
Front SensaTrac struts are about $150/pair.
Rear Koni shocks are about $200/pair.
Front Koni struts are about $350/pair.

dugzilla

I have the Monroe sensa-track struts and the Koni shocks in back, and the ride is amazing!!

vintage42

I have SensaTracs in back only. Are front SensaTrac struts softer than the OEM Tokicos? Are they noticeably any lower?

dugzilla

A little lower and rides a lot better.

KenzokuXB

So is it possible the monroes are only working with lowered springs because they are brand new and haven't been ridin on for months yet? Depending on your drop (mine is with STechs) it is possible that the strut may sit outside this groove area correct?

vintage42

I don't follow the reason for the question. SensaTracs ("Monroe" does not appear on my boxes or shocks) should last for 30-50K miles.

If the grooved area is 4 inches, with the piston in the middle using stock Echo or xB springs, and you change to a spring that is 2 inches shorter, then the piston will be at the bottom end of the grooves in the strut. If you then hit a bump, the piston will be immediately driven lower and out of the grooved area. If the grooved area is 6 inches, then there would be 1 inch of soft travel left.

The question is how hard is a SensaTrac when the piston goes outside the grooves? Does the ungrooved area provide the same firmness as an ungrooved (Tockico) strut, or is it unusually stiff to act as a bumper? Since people are not complaining about using SensaTracs with Teins, the first case is probably true.

saronian

Excellent summation of an important issue now that the SensaTrac is getting so much attention. Have read of SensaTrac's being used with springs that lower between 1"-2+" with most reporting satisfactory results.

I'll report what I learn after installing Tein H-Tech's on my xA.

M-Flo

I have sensatracs on all fours w/s-techs and have no problems with ride height and shock travel. It rides tamer than lowering springs on stocks and coils. After messing around with the suspension for a while, I think this is the best combo for a good price.

I would recommend to the poster to check the Tien springs to see if they are original parts. There has been a rash of incidents of Scion owners with fake Tein springs.