deloreanz

Hey all, I've been watching scionlife for a few weeks, ever since I've considered buying a scion. I've come to the point where I will most likely buy one very soon and would appriciate some opinions:

A friend and I went to a local dealer yesterday and haggled a used manual BOP 2004 from 13995+tax/lic down to 13500 OTD (tax/lic included). It has 52k miles a few small dings and scratches here and there, and a few addons such as CAI, exhaust, spoiler, mats/cargo, cold cathode interior lighting, (i think security), and it looked lowered a bit (maybe not). Other than that, the exterior, engine, and interior looked very close to new, with only a few scuffs on a few plastic interior panels. Needless to say it still drove very well, with no mechanical issues. I believe it had a powertrain warranty of possibly a year or so, but I don't recall.

I'm fairly sure thats an excellent price for a dealer, but not as good (especially considering milage) for a private party sale. I guess this is a good time to mention I'm looking to buy an xB in SoCal, so email me if applicable. Although private party scions are a bit hard to come by in a close radius it seems.

I'd love to get some feedback, thanks

Mosh_xB

thats a great price.
especially since it has a few mods.

jamesgang

Sounds like quite a few miles for that price. I'd be weary of buying a 'kids' car with that many miles on it.
There was an O4, BOP, Manual, Mats, Spoiler, Cargo Cover, 15,000miles, for $13000 a little while ago - until the recent gas price hike.
Of course this was in the NorthEast. Maybe a whole different market for used here.

mill0048

I don't think it's a good price. You can get a new '06 manual for $14.5k. Who know how bad those 52k miles are, and for ~$1k-$2k difference between new and used, , I wouldn't chance it. Plus, used car interest rates are usually worse than new car interest rates. You might be pretty close to the same payment with a new one anyway. Either way, good luck.

fsr20det

i say get a new one with no accessories. buy them used or aftermarket. cost efficient and you get a new car.

TheScionicMan

Yeah seems like a lot of miles for that close to MSRP...

samshaft

buy new, thats to much for 52k miles. Watch out for the dealer trying to sell all the extras.

tommyboy_iceman

I agree with mill0048. I just got a new '06 and total after everything was only about 17k. That's with an armrest and decal. 52k miles is alot and what kind of miles are they.

BTW, don't get the armrest. You can get a much nicer one aftermarket or build one yourself.

deloreanz

Thanks so much for the replies.

Well, I'm not sure if I made it clear but the 13,500 for the used xB includes tax/lic, which at least here in CA, is roughly 10%. So really you'd be comparing the new xB 14,500 MSRP to roughly 12,000 before tax/lic for the used xB.

I have been debating between getting a completely new stock xB or getting a slightly used one, here are the figures I 've worked out:

Used 2004 xB I looked at:
$13,500 OTD

New 2006 xB from dealer - 14,500 + 1450 (tax/lic)
$15,950 OTD

~$2500 difference
(and probably after extra fees more like a $3000 diff)

BTW, I'm in OC CA, so I'm not sure to what degree that effects the market price, I only know its hard to find the one you want used. I'm keeping my eyes open for private seller xB's but they're a bit more scarce for my area it seems.

more comments very welcome

nuketroop463

That was a lot of miles. The 56k miles means there are only 4k miles left on the drivetrain warranty and no miles left on the bumper to bumper. Without a prsonal history of the car (even carfax can be useful) of the user, insurance history, or even if all the mods were factory/dealer it's definitely a case of buyer beware. You'd be better off spending the money for either a base model new scion or a lesser mileage car with a known history. Basically, you figure the dealer is going to make $1- $2k on the transaction. That means a private seller sold for that much less for the same car. Thats what the car is really worth. What is this dealer going to provide you worth that much over the true cost of a vehicle? Extended warranty? Really cheap financing? Overlooking "problems" you might have (just talking here)? Having a vehicle now instead of 1-4 weeks for a new order? Back to how the previous owner may have treated the vehicle, have you had a mechanic inspect it? Any options beyond factory installs are worth only 1/2 new cost and only if they were what you wanted in the first place. Any other options are worth $0 if you did not want them. Look for a new one or a lower mileage one with a positive carfax and mechanics report.

deloreanz

I'm not sure what kind of miles they are. I would assume being in the OC, they're mostly highway.

There was no mechanic's inspection or carfax. However, I would of course do those things before putting any $ down. Speaking of $, I would be paying cash for most of it, and financing a small portion through my credit union, so no dealer financing should come into play.

I do hear what your saying with the high miles as well as "extras" it has installed. Overall the cold cathodes are really the only thing I don't really want. I'm guessing unless (after researching and knowing market prices) I don't feel like its a steal, I probably shouldn't go for it. I know I got my FZR600 with tons of mods in excellent condition for a very good price, a price I felt good about paying. Wheras with this scion in particular, I don't feel its quite where it should be, considering the miles and blemishes.

Keitaro

Way to many miles. With that CAI and exhuast mod, I doudt it was driven kindly. I wouldn't driven kindly at all if I had a CAI and exhuast.

Price (estimated)
Used 2004 per post: 13500-10% (per your post on tax, lic fees)= dealer markup $12150
New 2005 per Scion.com (bone stock, manual): 14395+10%= $15835.5
Difference= $3684.5
Knowing that you have a brand new, un-abused, non-overpriced used vehicle= PRICELESS

Warranty-
Old - passed basic (window motor, etc,) and very to close to the end of the powertrain warranty (engine, tranny)
New - You have 36K/3Yr basic warranty and 60K/5yr powertrain warranty remaining

Manual Tranny-
Old - I've read several times that some manaul xB owners came into the service department to replace the manual tranny. Typically due to abuse.

New - It's new.

Stereo-
Old - Ewwwww push button volume *****. Possible "stock CD player ate or scratch my disc"

New - Volume ****! Looks better. Kinks from 2004 and 2005 gone.

Carpet-
Old - 2004 floor mats typically last 12K

New - I think they've improved it

Lowered suspension-
Old - Not sure when the person lowered it. But if he/she lowered it at 0K miles, you are looking for new struts very very soon.

New - Fresh from the Aichi Manufacturing plant in Japan.

TSBs
2004 - Loads of them. If the A/C TSBs (yes there are more than 1-A/C tsb) were not taken cared off, you will be paying ($$$) for a new A/C compressor and other A/C components when it doesn't blow as cold. A/C components only work on the first 3yr/36K mile warranty.
2006 - Most should have been fixed either in Japan or at Port. A/C TSBs for 2006 is non existant since they replaced the components in Japan.

Bite the bullet. Order a 2006 STOCK (no options) manual xB (I prefer auto) with the color of your choice.

Just IMO.

Jamo

52000 miles in 2 years? Wow. Not unheard of, but that's kind of excessive. 12000-15000 miles per year is about average. That xB should have somewhere between, say, 24000 and 30000 miles on it. Even if they are "highway" miles, they're excessive. I bet the car was bought by a kid (no offense to the "kids" out there), used and abused, and traded-in when the "new" wore off of it or it wasn't "cool enough" anymore.

Buyer beware!

I also recommend buying a new one.

deloreanz

Thanks for the breakdown. I always thought (before checking price comparisons on the xB) that buying a new car was a total waste of money. But after checking around, it seems it might not be a horrible idea (as you menionted) knowing no one abused it.

I suppose really at this point I would go for a slightly used 05 or 06 xB thats in like new condition, or just go all out for the completely stock new 06 xB.

socalxb

Normally, one doesn't recover the cost of the "mods" anyway, so I wouldn't even bother to factor those things in the car. The big concern that I'd have on the car would be the miles. If you're bound and determined to get this car, get the dealer to drop the price by a huge chunk due to the mileage. What's it worth on Kelly Blue Book as a trade-in, and work from there. I'd deduct the things like the CAI and exhaust, because you know how "picky" CA state emissions are, even if those things are CARB-approved.

I agree with the others who recommend passing on that used one, and spend the extra money to get a new one w/o all the mods. At least that way you'll know it's new, and hasn't been abused over it's short, busy life...

deloreanz

Actually I think your calculation is wrong; you're comparing the used '04 @ 12150 (before tax/lic) to a new '06 @ 15835 (after tax/lic). I think it should read:

"Price (estimated)
Used 2004 per post: 12150+10% (per your post on tax, lic fees)= $13500
New 2005 per Scion.com (bone stock, manual): 14395+10%= $15835.50
Difference= $2335.50"

So the actual difference between the two is ~$2335.50; a much more attractive margin.

(keitaro, love hina fan?)

tacomatrd

Its going to be worth more in 50k miles the used one with over 100k im not so sure. GET NEW striped out dude i mean no options no extended warranty, no paint sealent nothinggggggg!!!!!!!!!1 If you want a jeep wrangler dude i got a premo one with 33kmiles,6cyl, lifted and stuff gunmetal blue color $13,995 takes it.

BiggSugg

Go with the new one. Once you get an xB, you're gonna want to hang on to it. I LOVE mine!!!

mal75

Definetly get a new one.

brome

I'm Canadian, and a dealership here in Vancouver wants to sell me one, brand new, for $28k CDN... which roughly translates to $23k USD. It's stock, nothing new/added to it.

Grr