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Accident: xB rolls; all OK
https://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=52901

RPM

 

A while ago I saw a post here somewhere of an xB with an aftermarket internal roll-cage.
Anyone know where we can buy something like that?

 

Rallyxb: I'd recommend that you pose your question as a separate post. I think you will get a better response that way. :D RPM

 

the one with the harness bars you mean? I never saw a full roll cage... I saw someone post a pic of one in another car...

I have actually, I do appreciate the fact that side impact bags would prevent severity of head injuries. However, there are drawbacks other than cost. Side air bags are inherently more sensitive in order for them to be effective. Which means that they can and will deploy in situations where they were not necessary. Air bags are inherently designed to prevent severity of injury... but not frequency of injury. Actually in most cases of air bag deployment... some sort of injury will be sustained, even in cases where no injury would not normally have been (which means higher frequency of injury).
"Safer" thereby is then subjective... while not quite this extreme, but which would you consider "safer", a system which breaks your arm on every impact, or a system which has a 1% chance of death on every impact?

My issue with SABs is not whether they work... its whether they're the best solution. And so far the US gov has agreed with me. While there is some push to get SABs standardized on every vehicle... one of the reasons it is not a federal regulation is b/c doing so would stifle an auto maker's options as to vehicle and safety feature design, railroading it into what I consider an imperfect compromise.

I also appreciate the fact that certain european car manufacturers do care a great deal about safety (most notably volvo). However I do object to the broad generalization of saying all euro car manufacturers are quite that way and asian/american cars are not. Not to pick on VW, cuz I do like them, but they've been having quite a few reliability problems of late... leading them to be ranked among the most unreliable just last year. Which to me IS a safety issue.

VSC is valuable to me b/c it puts control back into the driver's hands... Yes its not going to help me from getting T-boned by some idiot breaking the law... but it will give me a fighting chance of avoiding it (which, I'm sorry but... any careful attentive driver should be able to ... barring extreme circumstances/acts of God... and in that case... well maybe it was just your time). Isn't one of the first lessons you learn when dealing with roads is... "look both ways before you cross the street?"
Also getting hit by a truck... assuming driver's side impact - t-boned at something like 40 mph or so... I doubt any sort of side impact bags will protect you much from that.

Anyhow all i'm saying is it makes no sense to me to discount a car simply b/c it doesn't have the latest safety "feature". I mean have you seen what toyota charges for side air... or how much they cost to replace if they pop? I doubt its as simple as a cost issue. Its probably something more like... the A-pillar we have is extremely far away from us. which would make deployment from there ineffective and impractical. Having such features doesn't automatically make a car "safe" or "unsafe". That judgement should be reserved for looking at the design of something as a whole.

 

I finally found the pic of Glenn Mauer's OVERDOSE Scion Xb with a custom internal rollcage (aka: 6 point Safety Cage). Is there any other aftermarket place that makes these?

 

Well said and I agree.

I think the possibility of head trauma is greatly reduced because of our car's boxy shape.
Your head is very far from the A-pillar and window frame, as apposed to the sloped sides and roofline of almost every other car on the road.
Remember it's not the impact that kills you... but the sudden stop of your body smashing into the inside of the car.
Sometimes it's good to be square!
:D

 

I agree with both of you above.

Another side impact safety issue is shattering glass and resulting injury from glass shards. I have high quality window tint on my side windows and a tint band on the top of my windshield. I believe this tint provides some level of safety in a side impact collision.

Rallyxb? What's your "on the job" experience with this? Thanks. RPM

 

well, it seems to me (not being a critic...and happy everyone survived) that the only reason the box wasnt "cut in half" was b/c of all the safety equipment install on that thing. dont get me wrong, but the factory box isnt that safe (though it was ranked in C&D's list of top five 2005 safe cars), as it pertains to this particular accident, if the roll cage wasnt installed.

 

Wow. That was some crazy story.

The xB is not safe? Whaaaat?

 

The xB is safer than you could reasonably expect a 2400 lb car designed 6 years ago to be.

And I wouldn't discount it, or hesitate to recommend it as Tom and Ray have...

However, I don't think its necessary for us to make excuses for it and pretend its just as safe without side airbags or side-curtain airbags as it would be with them.

All the talk about distance to the A pillar and what-not is just dancing around the issue. Your head hitting anything other than an airbag = BAD.

Lets just be honest and stop making excuses. The car is very safe for such a small car. It would be safer with the airbags, but it's not expected in a car in this price range so you can't exactly call Toyota irresponsible for not retro-engineering them in.

 

I think the car in the accident was stock...
someone else is mentioning the internal roll cage thing...
otherwise how would the context of the article make sense if they had to install aftermarket safety equipment

 

All car windows are made of safety glass that is designed to break up in to little square pieces so you end up with only minor surface lacerations (like paper cuts) instead major damage (like severed arteries) from a chunk of sheet glass (aka: home window glass) which cuts like a big knife.

Plastic window tint film on the inside of a car window will help to keep some of the small pieces from flying around as much, thereby reducing lacerations received to the head & neck as well as limiting the amount that can damage the cornea (eye).

The front window is laminated with a strong plastic film in-between a sandwich of glass that is supposed to prevent objects (people) from going through in a crash.

Hence reason to "Always wear your seat-belt!"

 

Thanks for your response to my question. I always wear my seatbelt and make sure all my passengers wear theirs.

This is what I thought. In the event of an accident, I like the idea of less cuts to my passengers' and my head, face, neck and eyes. I'm glad I have plastic tint film.

Thanks again. RPM

 

There are a few companys that make special, extra thick, safety window tint film for car windows and buildings. Here's one to give you an idea

"SAFETY & SECURITY window film"
The film is fitted to the inside of the car windows and will:
Deter smash and grab attacks
Stop attackers getting into the car
Reduce the chance of injuries from broken glass
http://www.solarsafetyshield.co.za/

 

you guys know it is actually a lot more dangerous to ride in a car with roll bar then without, especially without a helmet, bucketseats and 5 pt harness because it takes away from the crumble zone the car was designed with to help absorbe the intial shock from the impact.

 

Good Point!

But... what about a Jeep Wrangler? They are designed with internal roll bars (when the hard-top is on) that are only covered by some thin foam padding. Are they considered safe?

As for crumple zones, the passenger compartment (or safety cage) of the car is NOT supposed to collapse. The crumple zones are built into the front & rear of the car to absorb impact energy in a crash...

"A car's crumple zones do the real work of softening the blow. Crumple zones are areas in the front and rear of a car that collapse relatively easily. Instead of the entire car coming to an abrupt stop when it hits an obstacle, it absorbs some of the impact force by flattening, like an empty soda can. The car's cabin is much sturdier, so it does not crumple around the passengers. It continues moving briefly, crushing the front of the car against the obstacle. Of course, crumple zones will only protect you if you move with the cab of the car -- that is, if you are secured to the seat by your seatbelt." Source: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/seatbelt2.htm

Also, I wonder if after market sub-frame connectors and a heavy steel strut tower bar will make the xB stronger and safer just by stiffening it up?

 

i hope i get that car. im new by the way

 

That's good to hear!! great job xB!!

 

My thoughts are with those friends of a fellow SLer who are in the hospital, hopefully they heal 100% and return to normal, painfree life.

.. was that roll cage one off or is that commercially available? Anybody?

 

hmmm.. somewhere(I haven't a clue as to where) I remember reading that a toyota engineer said that because of the way the(current) xB is constructed it was impossible to fit with side curtains or bags..however, from reading the above story, the box must be quite sturdy...
I have witnessed several "Median roll overs" where the vehicle had side curtains/air bags.. the occupants sustained severe injuries from the explosive force of the "safety features" much more so than if it had just side impact bars..
btw.. those side curtains have an explosive force (aimed downward) to deploy them..can break/crush shoulders & arms..
I would hate to just hit a pothole and have it deploy..
(I have seen this happen due to a South Dakota interstate construction zone speed bump..aka pavement transition lift)

If I thought that the xB was unsafe I wouldn't have bought 2
just my 1.5 cents worth

3.5+ million miler and still a rookie