tywen

I'm thinking of getting an xB manual trans.... BUT.....
I've only owned driven manual trans starting with the following:
1984 Rabbit GTI
1989 Civic DX Hatchback
1992 Mazda 323SE Hatchback

I never owned a Toyota, but test drove a Corolla/Tercel in 1989 and thought
the shifter was loose, unlike the GTI.

I test drove the xB manual this past weekend and noticed that it was a bit
high rev and noisy in 5th gear at 65 mph. Actually I don't think it has
much power. I killed the engine once at a stop light, just to see if I was
reving it too much to get it in 1st, but it needs about 1500-2000 revs
I think on flat surface....I'm thinking that the auto may be quieter at 65 mph,
and since it really is a Echo clutch and people have problems, maybe the
auto trans warranty is better. Clutches are considered wear and tear items,
probably not warrantied... Auto trans don't burn out, but if they do they
usually are warrantied.

I thought the GTI had a tighter shifter, the Civic was buttery (good),
and the Mazda has the best low end torque...... the xB well I don't
know right now...... I wasn't blown away .....

Has anyone else driven any of these cars and can compare also???

I'm a bit disappointed in the manual xB trans.......I know you're all
enthusiasts, but just maybe someone noticed the same things.

hayalex6

The only manuals I've driven other than my xB are the following:

2004 BMW x3
2001 BMW 530i
2006 BMW 325i
1999 Toyota HiLux
2000 VW Beetle (gross)
1995 Nissan Hardbody
1993 Honda Accord



By far, the xB has the easiest clutch I've ever driven it. I've never stalled it.

vintage42

I've had a lot of manual transmissions, both front and rear drive.
Stude Lark
Hillman Husky
Renault Dauphine
VW Beetle (2)
VW Rabbit (2)
Toyota Corolla (2)
BMW 2002 (2)
Isuzu truck
Mazda truck
The xB engine revs nicely with a willing feel and healthy sound. Shifting is enjoyable for an inexpensive front drive car - the shifter and clutch work with an effortless light touch. However, if you need to drive the xB hard, with quick takeoffs and fast upshifts, the clutch and transmission might not satisfy you or last as long as you would want.

vintage42

The auto turns 500 rpm slower than the manual in top gear, 3500 vs 4000 at 80 mph. So the auto gets better mpg and is quieter, but has slower acceleration and is not as much fun to drive (at least for me). I don't find my manual is very loud at 65 or 70. The engine likes high rpms, but all the sound does become very noticeable by 75 or 80, especially if you want to listen to the radio whose volume increases with speed.

The xB does not have much power at all. It is lively under 60. But with only 108 hp pushing a high box, the engine accelerates slowly against the drag at higher speeds. The auto is drag-limited to 100 because at that speed the resistance equals the hp made by its 4400 rpms. The manual is turning 5000 rpms at that speed which makes enough additional hp to continue some ways past 100. Note that the Minicooper, which has an engine of very similar specs, reaches 125 due to its better aerodynamics.

If you are looking for a sportier xB, try the Minicooper. The xB is a sporty econobox, but the Mini is a real sport car.

trainman0978

It is not a race car, by no means. But fun, yes the best imo. My girlfriend has a new IS350 , and we drive my xb more than her car. 2 reasons, this is her 3rd lexus so I am not all that impressed anymore ( lexus builds one helluva vehicle ) and second I really have fun in my xb, I had a civic and was bored with it and a jeep TJ before that and the xB is by far the most fun. If it was built to go offroad that would be even better, but pavement pounding with a nice stereo and really cool lighting is fun. Now if my tein s-techs will show up I can start scraping......

hotbox05

this shifter will feel like crap. why? cause it's like 2 feet lkong.......

djct_watt

It's good enough. . . could it be better? YES! But thank Toyota it's no Chevy Aveo shifter.

I think R&T had it right. . . "like trying to free a jammed broomstick from a garbage disposal."

Considering the price range of the xB, the manual tranny is satisfactory, and IMO the power increase is worth the added "inconvenience" of shifting. Although I personally enjoy shifting.

tywen

Since I haven't ordered my xB, yet, I'm in a position to
listen to your points of view and I thank you for your quick
responses.

I'm also going to look at the 2007 VW Rabbit and the
new Honda FIT. I like the exterior looks of the xB the most.
Interior.... well I have to see how the Honda looks in person.

Since the dealer told me they sell about 60% automatics,
its good to hear different opionions, from AT and MT owners.

Thanks... and keep them coming... hopefully some has driven
a Mazda 323 MT (90 HP) ... or Civic MT (92 HP) for comparision.

eburgsspeedyxb

I guess I can say I'm certified to speak up here since I've owned an '04 Automatic xB and now an '06 Manual xB.

With the 'whenever the dealer is finished ' addition of the TRD Performance Clutch & Short Shifter being worked on as we speak, I cannot speak for them, yet. However, with the only manual driven before this xB being a '91 Race-Ready RX-7 with full tranny upgrades, the stock shifter is lousy (too much throw for my liking), but the clutch is your really bottom-end clutch, not meant to handle more power than it already has spinning it. I drive my new box more agressivly than my old box, and it doesn't seem like it can handle high-end shifting like an aftermarket transmission setup can.

Granted, I've seen no better or worse gas mileage between either car, so if that's your concern, it shouldn't be. I get 26-28 mpg. I do miss the auto sometimes (I will this weekend with a 2 hour drive to HIN and then back home when it's done), but not that I have my manual, I'm perfectly happy. I'll report by week's end with the TRD upgrades and let you know if they help.

Sciond

very easy to drive
other manuals I have had
Conquest TSI
Mustang GT
Mitsubishi P'up
MR2
928S4
Chevelle SS
GS 400
Cavaleir
etc..
ER I have had a few cars

superjeer

it's the crappiest feeling clutch and shifter I've ever had. but, it gets the job done, most times.

tywen

"it's the crappiest feeling clutch and shifter I've ever had. but, it gets the job done, most times."

Are you joking or really mean that.... Why did you buy 2 of them...
surely the price is not the only reason.

OldYeller

The 4 valve per cylinder engine is meant to run a high revs. The redline is way up at 6500 RPMs. The shifting is a lot better than on my old S10 pickup and a little easier than my old 85 MR2. I hear that the clutch may not last if you drive it hard. If it is power you want---go with something else.

d114

The good? Out of all the cars I've driven, this clutch has the easiest engagement. It's as smooth as butter, really. I have a centerforce in the saturn and after driving this car... that feels pretty harsh. I'm not sure how you're killing the car trying to start from idle. From a flat surface, I can get the car to a rolling start without using the gas. The engagement is smooth and predictable. The gear ratios are perfect for the amount of horsepower it has and allows for spirited driving. An echo tranny would make it feel like a slug. The engineers did a good job choosing the ratios for this car... I can really fly up the hills because the gears keep the engine revs high.

The bad ? The clamping force of the clutch is bearly enough for power of the engine and weight of the car. Basically the clutch is maxed out as-is. any other bolt-ons and you pretty much have to upgrade the clutch. I'm sure the friction disc is fine... it's really a big tradeoff between ease of drivability and power handling. If I floor the car, I can make the clutch slip in third gear during freeway onramp acceleration. But during normal driving, the clutch feels the same as it did from the factory.

The shifter, however, is TOTAL CRAP! My last two manual cars were a saturn SL2 and a Datsun 240z. The scion... a brand new car... has more shifter play than a ten year old saturn! What the heck is up with that. I've driven toyota and mazda trucks(87 B2000, a 1990 3VZE, and a 93 22RE)... though they're rwd, they feel quite a bit more secure in their gear engagement than the xB.

Let's put it this way. Put the vehicle in first gear. Mark out on the shifter the points in which the shifter can move left and right. Now put the shifter in third. Mark out the points in which the shifter can move left and right. On my car, there's about a half inch of overlap between first and third. The shifter itself can move about 1.3 inches. I've taken it to the dealer twice, and had no resolution other than them saying that toyota shifters are naturally this crappy feeling. Heck, my friend's 93 paseo with 150k of hard-driven miles has only slightly less play. And that car is 13 years old.

The second gear problem? Well shift from first to second too fast and you'll grind gears. There are a few here who've drive like my grandma drives her model-T and tell people to suck it up. My response? Well, this car is equipped with such short ratios that it's hard not to shift fast. If toyota wanted me to shift slow, they would have put an echo transmission inside. Heck, even a four speed. But not this transmission. The ratios just cry out to be gone thru like train night at the whorehouse.

The ugly? Scion/Toyota put us between a rock and a hard place with this particular vehicle. This is how:

1. Choose the manual and live with crappy and uncertain shifting.

2. get the automatic and stay in the slow lane with the seafood and taco trucks.

Yes, I'm very dissapointed in the shifter. However, I paid for a Tercel and I got a Tercel (which toyota rebadged as an xB). Basically... The shifter issue just reminds me I bought an economy car. (also true).

Tomas

...And I'm in the xB automatic a second (88 feet) behind you getting on the freeway.

The Auto really isn't slug slow, the difference is not all that great in the real world.

Rigley

That's why there are so many aftermarket options. If you change to the
B&M or TRD short shifter it will take up the slop. For a better clutch grab,
you will need an aftermarket clutch plate (ex. ACT brand). Toyota gives
you an acceptable drive train, but they no it can be improved on, that is
why even the dealers sell upgrades.

bitmapcomp

I have had the fortune being able to drive BOTH the manual and Auto various times over the past few weeks, at more than a couple hours at a time.

IMO I feel the Auto is perfect for Traffic situations like Orange Couty, due to the fact that you are nto really using the speed or torque but more likely to just cruise to and from work...

If I had my choice it would be a manual, no question, but after much deliberation, I have chosen to go with the AUTOMATIC...

I dont think you can go wrong either way, but the Auto is perfect for SOCAL...

hotbox05

6500 is way up there? compared to what trucks? lol

hotbox05

I agree with teh shifter comment.


the clutch pedal is nice, very smooth and easy. yummers. a perfect clutch for a beginner.


the clutch is crap but the cluth pedal feeling is nice.


my stage2+ spec with a braided clutch line is barely any harder than stock yet my clutch is SOOO much better. kinda sucks in traffic but i'll take the harsh engagement I now have over the inability to hold that the stock clutch had.

cinephile

One day after buying my XB, the dealer called me and asked how I liked it etc.
I told him it need two things, a 6 speed tranny and a 6 cylinder motor.

Dynamat in the rear hatch is coming soon. I do too much highway driving and need to cut down on the high-rev exhaust sound.

Dennis