So I am sitting on S-Techs. and the rear camber is drastically off on the passenger side from the driver side. I havent had it on a rack to check what its at, but if I was to guess, I would say the driver side is at like -1 degrees and the passenger is at like -3... its cambered enough where you can visibly see it being different between the two...

Again, I havent looked, but I have heard that we dont have any adjustability in the rear... sooooo, my questions are as follows: anyone else with S-Techs notice a difference in the rear camber on thier own tC2? and anyone have any ideas on what can be done to fix it?

I had my car aligned and it is at -1.8 on the drivers side and -3 on the passenger side. If some camber bolts come out, then you can just install those. But I don't know of any yet.

^^^yea, I dont like the idea of waiting on something like this...


http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/Project%20Machine/IMAG0659.jpg



http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/Project%20Machine/IMAG0661.jpghttp://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/Project%20Machine/IMAG0660.jpg

I just looked at the TRD Spring install PDF and at the end regarding alignment for the rear it mentions it's not adjustable. Oh really Toyota!? I haven't seen how the setup is for the assembly to get an idea what can be done.

I saw the post mentioning camber bolts, I know the fronts they have different bolt combinations to get the alignment in spec, maybe that can be done for the rear.

The fronts can be adjusted, but the rears can't. I had them get as close to specs as possible, but they said it needs a camber kit.

Same problem here. no measurements, just eyeballing it.

I have the same issue on mine. I don't know why one would be off more then the other on the same drop but mine is -3 on my passenger and -1.5 driver side in the rears. I'm just waiting on some camber arms to be available for our cars

Any updates on camber kits? just got my trds installed today and i don't like the idea of wearing my tires unevenly

I could see mine are off too (eyeball) with TRDs on.

^^^yea, I dont like the idea of waiting on something like this...
http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/Project%20Machine/IMAG0660.jpg

Wellesley... I like the way you have the tail lights red. Looks really good and clean!! Did you just paint it or had it done or a kit for it?? I want to do mine like that.

LOL, ChikagoKid, I am the OG on the red out tails. Its paint btw, did it myself.

LOL, ChikagoKid, I am the OG on the red out tails. Its paint btw, did it myself.

Nice!! What kind of paint did you use and where can we get one?

search ebay for red taillight tint

Not sure if this is what you are looking for:

http://www.ptuning.com/html/Item-Desc.cfm?PartNo=PTSPC81290&MakeCode=scion&ModelCode=tC&ModelYear=2011%20All%20%28Front%20Camber%29&ModelDesc=tC

It says FRONT, but... maybe you can get a hold of the company and see if they are doing anything for the rear as well?

Already tried. They do not make anything for the rear, they actually said that the only adjustment in the rear is for Toe... and thats factory...

dont worry about your camber its fine lol. when it looks like this than id start to worry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gAlQLH9O0A

Wow. That's just slightly ridiculous.

there is a shim kit that could be used that any quality alignment shop knows about. it is a plastic disc that rotates and I believe it could do +/- 1.5 degrees.

you could even have some camber plates made that bolt up behind the hub. something simular to realcamber.com

he was doing some -3 or -5 plates for the xb2 which I would assume is running the same solid beam rear set up.

I emailed real camber to see if they would be willing to make a camber correction kit for us. We will see what they say.

Looks like the price might be about $160 per pair... (real chamber).

Well it looks like RealCamber is at least willing to look at it. I sent them some pictures I have of the rear suspension in exploded view. Hopefully he says its not a problem and then we will have a quick fix for the camber differences between the two sides of the rear. :)

And hopefully he'll be able to do different plates for different height drops (some has 1" drops, some 2" drops, etc). But not sure if that would make a difference at all?

Those with TRD's are reporting -1.5 to -1.8 on the driver side and -3 on the passenger side, which is the same for me with a S-Tech drop.

So I dont think it matters too much on how dropped you are, seems like the camber being off stays the same...


CAN PEOPLE WITH LOWERING SPRINGS CONFIRM THIS??
Please post your spring and rear camber after the drop. If we can compare enough different drops we can determine if this is the case and then we will know that the camber correction kit will work universally...

I will post up my actual specs next weekend after new wheels are mounted. I have not bothered to align the car for the same reason as most, we can't.
It drives straight, no noise and handles great so I have not sweated it. I would like to get my camber even on both sides as well, especially before I invest in new tires. I'm thinking -1 to -1.5 front, and -2 rear will be optimal for every day driving with this car. Correct me if I am wrong.

Watching this

^^Yep

Just went with my friend today to get an alignment on her 2011 tC with S Techs. -1.8 in the front driver side ( rear) and -2.4 passenger side (rear).

CAN PEOPLE WITH LOWERING SPRINGS CONFIRM THIS??
Please post your spring and rear camber after the drop. If we can compare enough different drops we can determine if this is the case and then we will know that the camber correction kit will work universally...

Right before I installed my Sportlines yesterday, I took a look at the camber on STOCK springs, and saw a noticeable difference between driver side and passenger side. With the Sportlines on, it's the same. No better, no worse.

With that being said, I think this camber issue is going to affect everyone, not just those with lowering springs.

Are we in need of a recall?...

I just eyeballed mine. 1800 miles. Slightly more camber on the drivers side rear. Maybe -2 but that's just a guess. But you can see the difference. I don't mind the camber but I really don't like a difference.

http://i56.tinypic.com/25exks0.jpg

sitting on TRD springs...this is after my alignment..both rear tires sit inward also...looks like sh!t to me but cant do anything without the camber kit:evil:

:(

Didn’t 1stOne say in another post someplace that the rear camber is perfect…therefore no adjustment is needed?
I found it here http://www.scionlife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=201423
This looks good to me…not!
http://www.scionlife.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=2626&pictureid=9832

Here is another thread on rear camber adjustment...
http://www.scionlife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=201772 (http://www.scionlife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=201772)

That first thread you posted was mind boggling. I'm trying to figure put why anyone would think that large of a discrepancy in rear camber could ever be a good thing.

Me too…I’m just pointing out how much (read that as little) 1stOne knows about suspensions…

I’ve already got an idea on how to make the rear camber adjustable. Once I finish my F-Sport rear BBK project, I’ll start on the rear camber adjustment.

I look forward. It looks very obvious especially after the lowering springs. I am afraid at the thought ofl how that tire is wearing.

The Camber that is induced from lowering our cars may help in looks or autocross but i would live for it to be equal, last time i checked my car has a wheel to turn in both directions and would love to be able to have the same response left or right from the car.
With the price of gas and tires, Setting the aliment ALOT closer to 0 deg is much more cost effective in the long run.
Our cars spend 90 precent of the time as people movers and depending where you live parked on freeways or idling along them for hours on end and the factory settings and what acceptable is some what scary, for a daily driver.
I keep looking at making my own rear upper arms for adjustment just life and work keep getting in the way right now.
This is the car from the factory and we have put TRD springs in it and have not re measured it for we know WHY bother right now
From the factory
FR -.21 camber
FL -.78 camber
Front toe -1/16"
RR -1.45 camber
RL -2.05 camber
Rear toe + 1/8"

Is it true if your gonna get the coilovers instead of lowering springs, the camber will be even?

Answer is NO.
I can not say that your car is or is not alined correctly but to Scion's factory spec like the most is a very wide range of acceptably thats not the most street friendly aliment.
Ours from the factory makes the car very unstable over bumps.
Lowering the car on coil-oversor or springs to get the stance you like will not improve the aliment but add to the problem that most seam to have.
We have camber correction bolts for the front and toe adjustment front and rear and as of writhing this thats all

I'm fairly new to this market, but for those who have lowered their tC's...are your rear tires wearing down worse/faster than your fronts? Are you rotating tires more often than what the manual says to?

ive been on stechs since december 2010 and have a slight camber forgot what it is at though. ive never rotated my tires even though i know i should it just slips my mind. but with about 15k miles with the springs and stock tires. i still have yet to see any wear on the tires other than whats normal. and cant compare them to the front because the front are actually more bald than the rear due to all the peel outs i do lol.

So are you saying you aren't even taking advantage of your free

^
Darn mobile site. You aren't taking advantage of the free 25000 miles of maintenance from Toyota? They include tire rotations every 5000.

Well it looks like RealCamber is at least willing to look at it. I sent them some pictures I have of the rear suspension in exploded view. Hopefully he says its not a problem and then we will have a quick fix for the camber differences between the two sides of the rear. :)

So I emailed realcamber.com about the rear camber kit they have......

Backinblacktc2 wrote:

Will these work on the new scion tc second gen? If not do you have any plans to make some? There are alot of people in need of a rear camber kit. So far noone has come through for the tc2 community.

Realcamber.com wrote:
Sorry I don't know if these work for that car. I've never seen what the rear setup looks like. If you can take pics from behind the rear hub I can see if these can be made for it.

Can anyone do this^^^??? Send in the pics?? E-mail: vipdancar@yahoo.com aka Realcamber.com. it seems as if they are interested. The camber issue is the main reason why I'm still on the stock suspension.

TB Performance also showed interest... Fingers crossed!

^
Are you saying get under the car and shoot a photo from the inside/under the car facing outwards towards the wheel?

^
Are you saying get under the car and shoot a photo from the inside/under the car facing outwards towards the wheel?

That's all the info they gave me in the e-mail. Might want to e-mail them for more info.

I also have a question about their product. So is this something that just adds more camber? Is there any way to reduce camber with this product?

I also have a question about their product. So is this something that just adds more camber? Is there any way to reduce camber with this product?

Im just guessing.....If they can do it I'm sure that they could make a kit to do both. But I like camber.... Not to much though lol I just want the camber to match on both sides.

Better ask them....

Heh yeah it seems like I am part of the minority that wants close to zero camber all around.

If i am reading right they are looking at a shim kit of X deg that is predetermined by them?
I'll hold out an make my own upper control arm, or if someone makes them before hand buy theres.

I had sent them pictures a while ago. He said that he would make another batch of camber shims for the xB2 and send one to me so I can test fit it. He never got back to me after that.

If someone else wants to give it a go, please do.

I had sent them pictures a while ago. He said that he would make another batch of camber shims for the xB2 and send one to me so I can test fit it. He never got back to me after that.

If someone else wants to give it a go, please do.

Have you tried to contact them since the first time you sent the pics? Also I'm not sure what thread I read this but does the tc2 have the xb2 rear suspension?

I just emailed him again.

No, the rear suspension is not the same as the xB2.

Watching and waiting. It seems a lot of companys are dragging their feet on aftermarket products for the tC2.

would love to get a rear camber kit for my '11 too...just dont like the tires leaning in at the top.. i asked a few places online about if/when something will be avail and all they say is "We have no information" and even emailed TRDsparks..no news either. :frown:

deff watching this one!

^x2

I just emailed him again.

Did they respond to your e-mail? Any update?

Did they respond to your e-mail? Any update?

I got nothing from them

I just got off the phone with fastscions.com and was told that Eibach is releasing a rear camber kit early next year. The guy (I can't remember his name) said February. I don't know about the reliability of this information, but it is what I was told.

Also, is there any space/give in the bracket where the camber arm attaches? I know there is a little in 1st gen tCs, but I can't find any information about this for tC2s.
I know the TRD instructions state that it isn't adjustable, but I thought maybe, with some extra space, a little difference could be made.
I have been reading for an hour and haven't found the answer, so if this was already answered somewhere, I apologize.

The first Gens had adjustable rear upper control arms so you can go up to -4 degrees of camber. the second gens have no movement for camber at all, only toe.

I dont think I have previously posted this but here is the Toyota parts break down of the rear suspension:
http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/b2dcaef6.jpg

This picture has the RUCA boxed in red and is the part that needs to be adjustable to be able to change the camber on our tC2's...

http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/b2dcaef6-1.jpg

Just heard back from Real Camber:
"I don't make any for that car sorry. The xb ones I'm sure won't work. And the kits I make are to give the car camber. Not make it back to zero."

Hope this is new information, I didn't see anywhere where someone had heard back definitively about this issue.

I got nothing from them

No but I did e-mail hotchkis no dice. They said that they had no plans for this platform.

no one is doing issshhhh with our platform... w..ttt.....fff

So, Welles, are you driving around on that tire with the camber way off or did you switch back to stock springs?

Still nothing, eh?

We currently have another thread going where a guy is gathering interest in rear upper control arms to correct this.

Yea I am riding on the -3 degrees passenger side, havent had any problems with it asside from people commenting that they are not even on both sides...
I want adjustable RUCA's so I can even out the driver side to -3, not zero both sides out...

I can't understand WHY the camber is off only on the rear passenger side wheel. I took off my wheels today and dropped them off to be powder coated. When I got home I looked at the rotors and see that the rear passenger side is about 1/4" higher than the rear driver's side. I just can't think of any reason this should be so. Why would it only affect one side of the vehicle?

I've read this thread and others and haven't found an explanation. Just a vague conclusion that something to do with the sportlines causes it.

If you have your wheels off the car, take a bunch of pictures and post them up so we can see both sides and compare them.

Yea I am riding on the -3 degrees passenger side, havent had any problems with it asside from people commenting that they are not even on both sides...
I want adjustable RUCA's so I can even out the driver side to -3, not zero both sides out...
Zero camber all the way

http://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/adf.jpghttp://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/SAM_1246.jpghttp://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/SAM_1253.jpghttp://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/SAM_1252.jpghttp://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/SAM_1250-Copy.jpghttp://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/SAM_1251.jpg

Yea I am riding on the -3 degrees passenger side, havent had any problems with it asside from people commenting that they are not even on both sides...
I want adjustable RUCA's so I can even out the driver side to -3, not zero both sides out...

This is the reason why my new tires were rubbing on the drivers side and not the passengers side when I was lowered on sportlines but was pretty much ok after rolling fenders.

Ultimaniac, take the same shot of the second picture you posted, but stand on the left hand side of the rotor instead of the right, then get the same shot from the opposite side of the car.

From that angle we should be able to see the factory RUCA's.




EDIT: if you have a measuring tape, take a measurement of the distance of bolts of the lower swing arms, use the bolts closest to the hub to the frame bolts.

unless the knuckles themselves are designed differently, the Swing arms or the RUCA's are the only things that I can see that would be the culprit to our camber problems...

Ultimaniac, take the same shot of the second picture you posted, but stand on the left hand side of the rotor instead of the right, then get the same shot from the opposite side of the car.

From that angle we should be able to see the factory RUCA's.

Going to do that now, be up in a sec.

http://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/SAM_1275.jpghttp://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/SAM_1273.jpghttp://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/SAM_1270.jpghttp://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx333/u171m4n14c/SAM_1269.jpg

Measure these 2 spots on each side to see if they are both the same, once we have those numbers we will know if it is caused by an arm or by the knuckles themselves.

http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/heretohere2.jpg
http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/heretohere.jpg

They are the same, there might be a 1/16" difference, the passenger side RUCA being the slightly longer.

Ok so there is either a discrepency in the knuckles or the mounting points for either the swing arms or RUCA's...

I just measured again to triple check. Looks like there's a 1/8" difference in the lower control arms, and a 1/8" in the upper.

Is this a factory discrepancy?

Are the discrepancies on oposite sides??? So 1/8 on the driver swing arm and 1/8 on the passenger control arm?

That might be exactly what the problem is.

Right. There is a 1/8" difference between the passenger and driver side RUCA's.

There is also a 1/8" difference in the lower control arm between the two sides.

Figures, way to go Scion/Toyota quality control. They need there ISO certification stripped if they have it to begin with.

Right. There is a 1/8" difference between the passenger and driver side RUCA's.

There is also a 1/8" difference in the lower control arm between the two sides.

could this be to compensate for driver's weight?

My rear camber passenger side looks off (and i'm not even dropped). took it to the dealer and they put it on the alignment machine and said it was "within spec", but it LOOKS visibly off. It really does drive me crazy.

I really don't know. I'm waiting for someone more knowledgeable to give an answer. If I had to speculate I'd say maybe one side of the car is heavier than the other so this design was to compensate, but I'm probably wrong.

Maybe there was a discrepancy in the arms but since the stock suspension could be made to reach within spec they decided it was fine. When we lower the suspension this difference is exacerbated to the point where the alignment can no longer be made to meet specifications.

I'd be interested to hear if anyone has a lowered suspension and does not have this issue.

Well knowing that we are off by 1/8" on each side, then we can add some washers to the correct locations of the knuckle and be able to "fix" the camber.

I just talked to my friend at a Toyota parts department and he told me that all tC's built between 08/2010 to 11/2011 use a lower control arm with the part numbers:
48730-75010 (right)
48740-75010 (left)

All tC's built after 12/2011 use the part number 48730-21120, for both sides. No pricing was available yet. Perhaps to fix the camber issue, in an indirect way. I don't know.

He also mentioned that the upper control arm part number has not changed from 2011 to 2012 models, so I was wondering has anybody tried the adjustable upper control arms by Hotchkis ?

I just talked to my friend at a Toyota parts department and he told me that all tC's built between 08/2010 to 11/2011 use a lower control arm with the part numbers:
48730-75010 (right)
48740-75010 (left)

All tC's built after 12/2011 use the part number 48730-21120, for both sides. No pricing was available yet. Perhaps to fix the camber issue, in an indirect way. I don't know.

He also mentioned that the upper control arm part number has not changed from 2011 to 2012 models, so I was wondering has anybody tried the adjustable upper control arms by Hotchkis ?

Link to said hotchkis part?

Oh boy, big mistake on my part. Sorry. I see now that the upper camber arms are for the 1st gen, ie. upto 2010. Must do more research before posting.

^^^ LOL, NBD

S tech springs for 7 months now. Camber problem is visibly noticeable . Among a slew of other complaints.

IMO, this scion was thrown together with little thought, due the fact the fr-s will overshadow every scion to date. Enjoy the after market support while it last.
They did the same thing with the 05 si (ugly hatch), then released the cleaner 8th Gen civic.

UH OH GEORGE!! where's 1stONE with his chime in???

S tech springs for 7 months now. Camber problem is visibly noticeable . Among a slew of other complaints.

IMO, this scion was thrown together with little thought, due the fact the fr-s will overshadow every scion to date. Enjoy the after market support while it last.
They did the same thing with the 05 si (ugly hatch), then released the cleaner 8th Gen civic.

i've talked to many companies...from presidents to r&d to salesmen...yes, almost all of them will definitely do the FR-S/BRZ, BUT...many are also VERY interested in the tC2 and the xB2/2.5

anything older than those are pretty much dead to them (meaning the xA, xD, tC1, xB1

so just wait for all the FR-S stuff to die down (probably a few months after the first batch is release sinced most companies want their stuff out around the same time - May)

Well knowing that we are off by 1/8" on each side, then we can add some washers to the correct locations of the knuckle and be able to "fix" the camber.

Did anyone try this?

If it's 1/8 difference then i wonder is the driver side longer than the passenger side? if so, then why not try using the driver side upper part on the passenger side?

Also, who here had their car lowered with TRD's at the dealer? And what was their explanation from dealer tech's about it? Just a thought. This issue is really bugging me. I had my '09 Tc sitting nice on S-tech's and loved the ride with factory struts. Buyer's remorse i guess.

Every 2011 Tc I have looked at has this problem from the factory. Even at stock height you can spot it a mile away. I have not seen the 2012's yet, not up close anyways. if the suspension arms are shorter which makes total sense, Scion should replace them all with the proper length arms.

I don't know if this is BS but someone from my dealer told me that some springs for Toyota are not only biased by front to rear but also Left to Right. They said that it's a safety feature that if a driver falls asleep that the vehicle will slowly veer to the right over time. I don't know if this is true, but was just curious if anyone thinks that it's even a possibility. This is the explanation that I got from the dealer for the camber being more aggressive that the other on the rear. Sounds BS to me.

I don't know if this is BS but someone from my dealer told me that some springs for Toyota are not only biased by front to rear but also Left to Right. They said that it's a safety feature that if a driver falls asleep that the vehicle will slowly veer to the right over time. I don't know if this is true, but was just curious if anyone thinks that it's even a possibility. This is the explanation that I got from the dealer for the camber being more aggressive that the other on the rear. Sounds BS to me.

I second BS

I second BS

I third BS

That might be one of the dumbest things i've ever heard a dealership say

lol

if you hold the steering wheel straight, does the car veer off to one side?

^YES!!! to right. on TRD springs!

Thank you. I don't know where he got that information but even though I worked in automotive almost a decade ago, he had me second guessing myself. He sold it really well.

On another note: So even following instructions through TRD spring install regardless of brand, the known rear camber problem is still apparent? I'm gonna take the plunge regardless. I can't roll stock. My '09 tc was on Tein S-techs and loved the stance. I feel like I'm in a fancy Tacoma right now with factory ride height. LOL.

Ok so I browsed this thread and tried to read all of it but I got kinda lost in all the specs talk. Essentially, I just wanna know if there is a way to fix this yet and get the camber to as near neutral looking as possible? It bugs THE HELL outta me that I got a brand new car, nicely dropped on a set of volks, and to see the rears sitting like this: /----\

No, nothing yet. There is a member here independantly doing his own camber correction piece and although I don't know if a large company will buy the design and mass produce it or not, I'm still excited that someone is doing something.

No, nothing yet. There is a member here independantly doing his own camber correction piece and although I don't know if a large company will buy the design and mass produce it or not, I'm still excited that someone is doing something.

Yeah, I guess the fact that at least one person is taking an interest in our problem is reason enough to celebrate... Still sucks tho to be ignored by all the major companies, as if we aren't good enough for their attention (or to hand them our money!). Kinda makes me wanna hate the FRS since it's gonna get all the attention in the Scion family for sure

I know what you mean and I also feel your pain. Who would've ever thought that the Tc would come second at any point. I'm not saying it's first. But when it comes to scions I think the only ones without too much support right now are the Xd's and IQ's. That's like saying a company isn't interested in making parts for a civic because the S2000 is coming back. I'm just trying to be optimistic that once one is made and flies off the shelf, that the big companies will jump on the band wagon.

I'm at stock height and the left rear is at -.5 degrees and the right rear is at -1.5 degrees. Both values are within spec. The range is -1.9 to -.4. It seems like both are at each end of the spectrum, I cant even begin to imagine how off lowered cars are.

I'm at stock height and the left rear is at -.5 degrees and the right rear is at -1.5 degrees. Both values are within spec. The range is -1.9 to -.4. It seems like both are at each end of the spectrum, I cant even begin to imagine how off lowered cars are.

I thought u really wanted sportlines? not anymore?

here is my alignment on TRDs

http://www.scionlife.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3986985&postcount=1321

Let me start off with.....I'm NOT car smart! LOL

But I have a 2007 scion tc(bought it Nov. 06...so I'm the only owner)

Summer 2009 lowered my car with S-techs (tires were 1 year old at this point). Same tires lasted me until 12/23/2010 & Bought 4 new tires. Same tires I had before. (94,000 total miles on car)8k later...have to buy 2 more tires for the rear(9/20/2011). Got front & rear camber kit & an alignment(2/2/2012. 2/22/2012 another new tire. (100,363 total miles on car)3/8/2012 another new tire. Noticed today that my rear passenger is pretty smooth! Rear driver is just getting there!

Soooooo Friday I have an appt for tires & another appt to get my car checked out! See what else it could be. But since I've had it for so long & its getting up in age. Don't know how much more I want to put into it. Thinking a new car sounds nice Hahaha

Well if your alignment is checking out okay then that would point to suspension. If your struts were blown, then your tires would be choppy (looks like a bunch of ramps from side view of side wall). What kind of tires are you buying and what speed rating? The factory tires were performance rated but were also a harder rubber. I had the S-techs on my 2009 tc and when I bought new tires noticed how much softer the ride got. I expected the opposite because I purchased H rated tires since I didn't have plans on going over 130 MPH or anywhere close to that. I didn't use any camber kits since it didn't look too bad to me. I never even got my car aligned after lowering it. I know you're over 100K but Hondas and Toyotas are made to last. I've owned multiple models of both makes and reached a minimum of 160K mile. My 4Runner died after 275K miles and my old '91 si hatch was still racing down the 1/4 mile past 229K miles when I sold it to a friend. Look at the load index and speed rating of the tires you purchased and compare them to factory specs. You can find the terms or definitions to them anywhere online. Just google it. Tire dealers will sell you what they have in stock that's why it always seems like you're getting a deal. Just go to Discount/America's Tires buy the Road Hazard Warranty and pretend someone vandalized your tires. All you'd have to pay for is new warranties and labor but the tires are free. You didn't hear that from me though. LOL

Well if your alignment is checking out okay then that would point to suspension. If your struts were blown, then your tires would be choppy (looks like a bunch of ramps from side view of side wall). What kind of tires are you buying and what speed rating? The factory tires were performance rated but were also a harder rubber. I had the S-techs on my 2009 tc and when I bought new tires noticed how much softer the ride got. I expected the opposite because I purchased H rated tires since I didn't have plans on going over 130 MPH or anywhere close to that. I didn't use any camber kits since it didn't look too bad to me. I never even got my car aligned after lowering it. I know you're over 100K but Hondas and Toyotas are made to last. I've owned multiple models of both makes and reached a minimum of 160K mile. My 4Runner died after 275K miles and my old '91 si hatch was still racing down the 1/4 mile past 229K miles when I sold it to a friend. Look at the load index and speed rating of the tires you purchased and compare them to factory specs. You can find the terms or definitions to them anywhere online. Just google it. Tire dealers will sell you what they have in stock that's why it always seems like you're getting a deal. Just go to Discount/America's Tires buy the Road Hazard Warranty and pretend someone vandalized your tires. All you'd have to pay for is new warranties and labor but the tires are free. You didn't hear that from me though. LOL


Hahahahaha I got all these tires at discount. They're Kumho Ecstatic Ast. Speed H. They aren't the best tires but I just use my car to commute....so rarely go over 75. I had these same tires on the same set up for over 30k before this issue. SOOOO idk! Hahaha! But I bought the warranty from discount & they only gave me a little discount because they said it was because I didn't have a camber kit. Which I didn't at that time. However I have it front & rear now with no improvement. Other than less money in my pocket! My front tires are new & don't need replaced. So think I'll try 2 new tires in the back. Thinking about trying out Yokohama yk580 maybe! At this point I don't even care about mismatch tires! LOL! Just want them to last more than 8k miles! But I'm going to have my shop totally check out my car on Friday! Hopefully they find something! It just seems like my back tires are like dragging along instead of rolling!

So it's only the rears that are wearing down? That's weird. I think you and I had the same tires. I did flip all 4 tires when I noticed excessive wear on the inner tread (but on or below the wear bar). I will admit that although I don't race at all anymore, I did do a lot of spirited driving and do a constant speed of about 80 MPH.

Yeah only the rears are wearing out & the rear pass. is the worst. But my tires wear so quick that they don't even want to rotate them. it's THAT bad! hahaha! by the time its time to rotate the wear has already got to the rears. i will just end up buying all 4 all the time if i rotate them! hahah! I am however glad to see i'm not the only one! SORRY! Now i'm kind of sad i lowered my car! HAHA!

Kailey, are you sure they are even doing an alignment on your car? My car is def lowered(on 18s, just barely tucking tread), I do not have a camber kit installed as the factory hardware adjusts fine(well the front has little wiggle room unless you get camber bolts, the rear can be adjusted a few degrees), my rear camber is at -1.5 driver side and -1.9 passenger if I recall, now have 6,000 miles on Continental ExtremeContact DWS without issues, also tell them you want the toe set even left to right, and set to 0(I think it's the rears that have a bit negative toe to be in spec, go with that). The warranty being limited I call BS, I don't have a camber kit installed at all, and the alignment is within specs, and still have full hazard warranty on it. If you can tell us your alignment specs that would help, or a picture of the screen or printout.

I know we've been talking about the 1st gen tc. But this thread is about the Tc2. So considering that what this thread is talking is the Tc2, there are no adjustments for rear camber on this car except for one person who went about designing and making his own.

Kailey, are you sure they are even doing an alignment on your car? My car is def lowered(on 18s, just barely tucking tread), I do not have a camber kit installed as the factory hardware adjusts fine(well the front has little wiggle room unless you get camber bolts, the rear can be adjusted a few degrees), my rear camber is at -1.5 driver side and -1.9 passenger if I recall, now have 6,000 miles on Continental ExtremeContact DWS without issues, also tell them you want the toe set even left to right, and set to 0(I think it's the rears that have a bit negative toe to be in spec, go with that). The warranty being limited I call BS, I don't have a camber kit installed at all, and the alignment is within specs, and still have full hazard warranty on it. If you can tell us your alignment specs that would help, or a picture of the screen or printout.

Yeah...sure seems that way! But luckily i know they did because i watched them! Plus my best friends dad owns the shop. I've known them since i was 2! Otherwise i would be wondering! Also my car has 101k miles. I've been lowered probably over half of the time. It was a pain in the (you know what) to get aligned. SO i'll have them check it out again friday with new tires. I'll post the specs after that! :) I'm going to have them check out my struts & shocks to make sure that isnt an issue. however its wearing smooth and even! So i dont think it is. Visually it looks good! So that is what is crazy to me! But i'll make sure they triple check the toe. But it's got to be something deeper than that. Since it was just done early Feb this year! But who knows that! But my car was a peach for the first 90k miles! it's just been recently!

Yup...mine too! Here are my readings on TRD springs, TRD sway bars and TRD front tower brace.
http://www.scionlife.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=4038&pictureid=14450

A fix for this problem is posted here...
http://www.scionlife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=212975

Wife just picked up a brand new one today, and I'm already researching upgrades. As much as I'd love to throw some drop springs on, it looks like I'll be waiting until a remedy is available for the camber issue. Hope somebody can do something about this.

Wife just picked up a brand new one today, and I'm already researching upgrades. As much as I'd love to throw some drop springs on, it looks like I'll be waiting until a remedy is available for the camber issue. Hope somebody can do something about this.

Already done...see bottom of post #119. This is post #121. There is a link. The camber issue is still there whether the car is lowered or not. here is the link again. http://www.scionlife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=212975

Already done...see bottom of post #119. This is post #121. There is a link. The camber issue is still there whether the car is lowered or not. here is the link again. http://www.scionlife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=212975


Yeah I read the whole thread, and seen that particular post as well. Thanks. I simply meant I won't be lowering the car until there is a solution in place, so as to not further increase the difference in camber.

I was originally going to wait for a solution to this whole camber problem but now my Tein S-tech springs are on the way finally. They've been back ordered for a while now. I'm confident that there will be a solution for consumers to get and I already have the front camber bolts from my previous generation Tc. When lowering a car I always expect to be burning up 2 tires. It's just this time it won't be the fronts. Although everyone I talk to says they haven't had problems with rear camber tire wear.

I was originally going to wait for a solution to this whole camber problem but now my Tein S-tech springs are on the way finally. They've been back ordered for a while now. I'm confident that there will be a solution for consumers to get and I already have the front camber bolts from my previous generation Tc. When lowering a car I always expect to be burning up 2 tires. It's just this time it won't be the fronts. Although everyone I talk to says they haven't had problems with rear camber tire wear.

I'm going through rear tires every 3 months/4k miles just about. Camber kit & alignments done. To the point of throwing the stock springs back on and throwing my Tein S-Techs off a cliff! Or the whole car....LOL

UH OH GEORGE!! where's 1stONE with his chime in???

Hi.

Think I'm going to fuel the fire here? Nope.

I'm going through rear tires every 3 months/4k miles just about. Camber kit & alignments done. To the point of throwing the stock springs back on and throwing my Tein S-Techs off a cliff! Or the whole car....LOL

That sucks to hear. I have a combined 35,000kms on my 19" Toyo Proxies, 18" Advan AD08's, and 18" Bridgestone Blizzaks, all of which have been driven with TRD springs and a proper OE alignment since new. My rear camber matches that of those complaining...but my tire wear and driving dynamic has been no issue.

...but my tire wear and driving dynamic has been no issue.[/quote]

What do you mean by this? I don't want to assume. Do you mean that the tire wear is due to driving style? Please clarify thank you. Sorry my brain has just finished 36 hours of work in 3 nights and still have one more 12 hour shift to go. Brain no work now.

He means his tires are wearing normally bud. The rear camber issue is not affecting our tire wear. I had over 5k on my stock tires and about 6k on my current tires since I lowered my ride with no alignment. My tires are wearing evenly. I do rotate them every 3-5k though.

Thank you for clarifying. Luckily I have the front camber bolts for the Tc1 which not surprisingly works with our new Tc. I never installed it because the tc1 was still pretty much close to spec even on S-Techs. Good looking out Blackedout011tc.

Hey guys i just lowered my tc2 on S-techs and i get a clicking noise when i turn my wheels to left or right when just sitting still. Anyone else have this problem? NEED HELP PLEASE

I just lowered my car on S-Techs last Thursday and I don't have that problem. You need to make sure that the blue dots on the top of the front struts go back to their original position and that you reuse all of the rubber grommets on the top and bottom of the springs. In the video of how to lower a Tc2 it shows you must mark the whole strut assembly to ensure everything goes back the way it came out by drawing a line with a marker from the top to bottom to be sure everything is lined up. Give it a couple more days. Sometimes it could be the springs just settling into place.

Hey guys i just lowered my tc2 on S-techs and i get a clicking noise when i turn my wheels to left or right when just sitting still. Anyone else have this problem? NEED HELP PLEASE

The S-techs are the coilovers by tein correct? I have their Super Sport version and I have recently experienced this problem. Had them on for a little over a year. I'm not 100% sure what caused this but I'm getting the noise coming from the upper right coilover. My layman's guess is that I've put too much pressure on this particular coil bucause I have an incredibly high driveway that I need to get up on for my house. When I'm going up the curb, at one point my tires literally leave the ground :( I'm getting this checked out at a shop soon. Will keep posted. Idk, maybe we have something similar. Good luck man.

The S-Tech's are just the springs, not coilovers. I'd look in there and make sure everythings tight and nothing's rubbing to cause the clicking. If not, then it's because too much of your grease rubbed off on from the rubber on the top of the strut assembly

Hi.

That sucks to hear. I have a combined 35,000kms on my 19" Toyo Proxies, 18" Advan AD08's, and 18" Bridgestone Blizzaks, all of which have been driven with TRD springs and a proper OE alignment since new. My rear camber matches that of those complaining...but my tire wear and driving dynamic has been no issue.

My cars been lowered for almost 4 years? this problem just started a year and a half ago. My first set of tires lasted 50ishK miles! I got a Speed rates Z tire on now and better quality than the previous! So we shall see! Alignment and all that is good!

hello, i just joined the forums since i plan to pick up a tC2 in the near future and i will be lowering it soon after i get it; so i am very interested in this topic...

i read thru the whole thread and basically...

rear camber is off, from the factory, and lowering the vehicle with either springs or coilovers may/may not make the rear camber worse...

despite the rear camber differences between the driver's and passenger's side, many people are reporting even tire wear, albeit they rotate their tires every 5k miles or less...

2tCornot2tC is working on a kit, but eta is still unknown...

i would like to know if this camber "problem" exists on the 2012 models as well, for those who own the newer ones...

i will be purchasing the tC2 at the end of summer, so i hope there will be a fix by then...

Yes it does. My Super White Tc was made on January of this year. I already lowered my car with Tein S-Techs and love how much better the car looks thank stock height. I think I only drove 1 car at factory height since I've started lowering cars.

^^ Agreed. Every 2012 model I looked at last April had the problem.

Wish i knew this.

Had this posted in another thread but Ill add it to this. Might be a temporary fix or a really good product. Who wants to try it out and let us know?

http://www.fastscions.com/spc-performance-rear-camber-kit-scion-tc-2011-2012-2013-75600-1.aspx

Why don’t you get it right from the source?
http://www.spcperformance.com/

Didn't see pricing or a place to order them. Also fastscions is offering them 2 for 1. Thought it was a good deal.

I can’t believe how lazy and incompetent you people are…I have to spoon feed you all with everything! http://www.spcalignment.com/buy-it-now (http://www.spcalignment.com/buy-it-now)
Think again how good a deal you got...$15.82

Oooook... Thanks for the info. Still not sure if I want to go through with the drop. I'll give it some more thought and research these shins more.

I ran those shims on the back of my Honda Fit…they worked. The difference is that on my Honda, the wheel spindle mounted on 4 bolts and there was only a small (about 12-mm) that centered on the suspension. On the tC2, those shims force the bearing…and the bearing is almost press fitted into the suspension. These shims cock the bearing in the press fit bore! These shims are made of plastic and only take out up to 1.5 degrees. The tC2 needs about 2 degrees correction. Yes, the 1.5 will make it better… The two problems are that they are plastic and that they cock the rear wheel bearing.

Hmmm sounds like they might work for awhile but cause future problems. Might have to get ahold of my friends with the machine shop and see if we can fab some similar to what you did.

Is the camber problem still going on? i picked up a 2013 tc. I was lookin into getting the s-techs. but i'm 2nd guessing myself if the camber is still screwed up.

Yes. I myself was in your position last May about doing the S-Tech springs. I've been on them since June with now problem. It's not as bad as people think. My tires are wearing down pretty evenly. How fast your tires wear down depends on how much fun you have with them.

If all you are doing with your car is getting groceries or driving Miss Daisy then yes, it is no big deal...you don’t know any better anyway. Also if your car is slammed, then you’ve already done other more serious damage to the handling of the car and this makes no difference to you guys either.

If all you are doing with your car is getting groceries or driving Miss Daisy then yes, it is no big deal...you don’t know any better anyway. Also if your car is slammed, then you’ve already done other more serious damage to the handling of the car and this makes no difference to you guys either.

If its too expensive to produce, are you at least considering selling it to a company that can afford to mass produce and drive prices lower?

The only way to drive the price down is to forge the arms. That way they can be “stamped” out. In order for that to make economic sense is if you have mass demand. There is not enough demand. If you can make it happen…let’s talk.

The only way to drive the price down is to forge the arms. That way they can be “stamped” out. In order for that to make economic sense is if you have mass demand. There is not enough demand. If you can make it happen…let’s talk.

The only company local to me that would consider it is PTuning. It would be a matter of scouting the market to make their investment worthwhile. Also the PTuning name carries a lot more weight than JJ. Lets collect a list of interested people here, and then determine if it makes sense to make.

This is a case where some of the possible customers don't even know this is a problem. If its made a big deal, then more people will start caring about it. Carbon monoxide sensors didn't become popular until the news started reporting deaths.

IM IN!!!

I'm interested.

I'm interested if they dont cost 1,000 bucks:pray:

I would be Interested

Interested!

Interested, but I don't have much hope lol

im down, if we can get these down to around 500 for the pair

Interested if cheaper

same but can definitely do without the arrogance. But whatever.

I contacted Godspeed and they said they're coming out with rear camber kits within 2-3 months. They have rough products available, you just have to contact them.

So if I get TRD springs for my tC and then get it aligned at a shop a week after the install, the shop mechanic is going to tell me that he couldn't do a proper OEM spec alignment because the rear camber has issues?

Its a daily driver and its driven normally - will it even matter it the alignment is not perfect as OEM?

So if I get TRD springs for my tC and then get it aligned at a shop a week after the install, the shop mechanic is going to tell me that he couldn't do a proper OEM spec alignment because the rear camber has issues?

Its a daily driver and its driven normally - will it even matter it the alignment is not perfect as OEM?

Yea, the rear camber will be out of spec. And especially because its a daily driver it matters. You'll get uneven tire wear in the rear and will go through them faster.

So then how does everybody who has TRD springs(or any other spring) on their tCs deal with this problem? (for example what did you do to fix it?)

Godspeed is in the process of producing some camber correction kits as we speak. There's also someone that made their own and someone else that rigged a 2006 Civic Si arm to work and hasn't had any problems. Me, I haven done anything because the tire wear isn't as bad as one would expect. Believe me I know about camber wear. I used to drive a civic with a 3.25" drop in the 90's. That was bad. Just my opinion so I know someone will oppose.

so its not extreme, it just makes the rear tires wear slightly faster than normal?
which means that even stock tC2s wear tires faster than most other cars right?

Yes…but just think about it. It takes energy to rub off tires. Even if it rubs off the tires at a very slow rate, it is still burning off your tires…tires cost money. If you don’t give $h!t that your tires could have lasted 50,000 miles instead of the 40,000 miles that you got, that’s your call. Now that energy to burn your tires came from someplace…the gas that put into your tank. That means you could have gotten 26-mi/gal instead of the 25-mi/gal that you are getting now. Your call again. And yes, there is a small performance (handling) loss, but most of you here won’t be able to feel that. All that put together is the reason why I built the A-RUCAs. Even at $2,000, I’ll get the performance increase for free for the life of the car…provided I keep it longer than 5 years.

so what did you do before you built your camber correction? You had TRD spring on before that right?

Another question: if the springs cause problems with rear camber, do the sway bars cause anything similar, or are those ok, and won't have any alignment issues?

For any suspension modifications you want to get an alignment. With my TRD springs, my car veers to the right all the time because I haven't got an alignment, but it's a gradual lean which I barely notice if I keep my hands on the wheel.

Yes I will make sure to get an alignment after getting the sways. but will they have the same camber issues as the springs do? will I be able to get a successful alignment as opposed to an unsuccessful one if I got the springs?
Thanks if you can help guys.

Yes…but just think about it. It takes energy to rub off tires. Even if it rubs off the tires at a very slow rate, it is still burning off your tires…tires cost money. If you don’t give $h!t that your tires could have lasted 50,000 miles instead of the 40,000 miles that you got, that’s your call. Now that energy to burn your tires came from someplace…the gas that put into your tank. That means you could have gotten 26-mi/gal instead of the 25-mi/gal that you are getting now. Your call again. And yes, there is a small performance (handling) loss, but most of you here won’t be able to feel that. All that put together is the reason why I built the A-RUCAs. Even at $2,000, I’ll get the performance increase for free for the life of the car…provided I keep it longer than 5 years.

Basic assumptions: Drives 12,000 miles/ year
Keeps car for 5 years
Avg. cost per gallon = $4

Total miles in life = 12000*5 = 60,000 miles -> still have to buy tires @40,000 or @50,000. Cost is the same so not considered.

Lets do some dimensional analysis.
12000 mi /25 mi/gal = 480 gal * $4 = $1920 -> 5 years = $9600

12000 mi/yr / 26 mi/gal = 461.5 gal * $4 = $1846 -> 5 years = $9320

Cost of JJ ARUCA = $2,000
Money saved = $9600 - $9320 = $280

Doing a cost benefit analysis, they are not worth their price. You would have to keep the car for 30 years in order for the purchase to be justified. Added performance is the only valid argument here.

The average cost of an ARUCA is around $280. I'm excited to see what Godspeed has to offer because the current options are non-existent or outrageous.

I contacted Godspeed recently for a status update on the Rucas and they said it will take another two months as they are waiting for the "CNC" version to come.

Sweet, following this thread as i will be greatly interested in these A-RUCA from godspeed

Basic assumptions: Drives 12,000 miles/ year
Keeps car for 5 years
Avg. cost per gallon = $4

Total miles in life = 12000*5 = 60,000 miles -> still have to buy tires @40,000 or @50,000. Cost is the same so not considered.

Lets do some dimensional analysis.
12000 mi /25 mi/gal = 480 gal * $4 = $1920 -> 5 years = $9600

12000 mi/yr / 26 mi/gal = 461.5 gal * $4 = $1846 -> 5 years = $9320

Cost of JJ ARUCA = $2,000
Money saved = $9600 - $9320 = $280

Doing a cost benefit analysis, they are not worth their price. You would have to keep the car for 30 years in order for the purchase to be justified. Added performance is the only valid argument here.

The average cost of an ARUCA is around $280. I'm excited to see what Godspeed has to offer because the current options are non-existent or outrageous.
Do the same cost/benefit analysis on the tC you bought and compare it to a $1000 Honda or Toyota beater car you could have bought – then tell me what your return on investment your tC brought you.

Just so everyone knows, I have retro-fitted a pair of Civic Si RUCA's to fit my tC, and you all can do it as well. You can see on the noskatehate22 build thread.

Also I have a prototype pair of RUCA's being sent to me by a reputable suspension parts company, so stay tuned everyone!! There IS light at the end of the tunnel!

yay! sweet! keep us posted plz

trd is not super bad the rear camber is actually helping your handling a little bit if you cant afford the tires from being lowered don't lower your car.

What's going on with this camber issue I want a kit or something idk about that shim??? Helpp lol

I have that same problem. I went to a Bob Summerel in my area and they said since you cant adjust the rear camber you have to buy the camber kit for the back. So they are ordering a kit and either I will put it on or they will include it in the alignment. But what I am saying is, go to a Tire and suspension shop and they will probably help you out!

I was just about to order TRD springs and just slap them on. I am going to back out because I HATE camber wear . I went through that with my 2001 Mustang GT. It was a daily driver and my tires went FAST. Maybe when the camber kit is available Ill buy everything all at once and do it right the first time

I have that same problem. I went to a Bob Summerel in my area and they said since you cant adjust the rear camber you have to buy the camber kit for the back. So they are ordering a kit and either I will put it on or they will include it in the alignment. But what I am saying is, go to a Tire and suspension shop and they will probably help you out!

better find out what they are ordering since there isn't a real rear camber kit yet

...unless they get those shims...

^^^yea, I dont like the idea of waiting on something like this...


http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/Project%20Machine/IMAG0659.jpg



http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/Project%20Machine/IMAG0661.jpghttp://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac216/DT9Designs/Project%20Machine/IMAG0660.jpg

Sorry for the off-topic, but wut the wing/spoiler u got mate? interested in getting one as well =)

in case he doesn't respond (he's not as active)

it's a lip spoiler from ebay...i believe it was originally designed for a bmw. try to check his build thread. i think he posted it

Hey everyone! Noob here.... has anyone tried the Hotchkis kit?