Only thing I saw that sucked about the si, was the powertrane warranty is only 3yr / 36K.... the tc's basic is 5yr / 60K.


There is a simple reason for this, Honda knows that their stuff will not last as long.

End of quality debate=)

 

If you don't mind, please leave this off this thread. I understand you have had problems in the past with Honda's, however you don't make up the majority of owners. If you could do so I would appreciate it, thank you.

 

Someone was talking about Honda being a motorcycle company at heart.. and.. that's a bad thing?

No man, if only Honda were even more of a motorcycle company. The only problem would be engine blocks sticking out of the hood.. Man, wouldn't it be nice to be packing narrow angle ports into the combustion cylinder? Freakin 9000 RPM redlines and whatnot. Yea, Toyota is a car, truck, and loom company but Toyota's foray into high performance was not met with a huge success until now.. you know, after they discontinued the MKIV Supra, arguably the best sports car Toyota has ever made.

But then again, I guess it takes a discontinuation to make a car great. I mean, look what happened to the Integra after it got replaced. I'm sure there were candle light vigils at Acura dealerships everywhere. In my opinion, the RSX can never quite be equal to the Integra. Well.. that's mainly because of the front Macpherson struts which I guess isn't too big of a deal.

BTW, I just have to say seeing a thread of this nature progress the way it has is quite refreshing. Refreshing indeed.

Wow, that was horribly off topic. I think that the tC would've had the race by about a car length in the beginning if it had an LSD. At the end though, I think the results would have been the same. I'm just glad someone finally did this race with what appears to be relatively equal drivers. It's good to hear about the canyon run too.

This just goes to show what a great car the tC is. With a pretty modest FI set up and the suspension that, IMO, should have came from the factory, it was able to keep up pretty well with a performance bred car when it was made to compete with the LX and EX level of cars.



for the record: Family's Camry has been serviced more times than the Civic. Friends family, the opposite. My verdict: They both have been serviced about half as many times as the Saturn and the Taurus.

 

Yeah, I have to say, that is not needed. I just pointed it out. Chevy's have the same kind of warranty and my dad gets hundreds of thousands of miles out of them. Only reason they probably gave it a lower warranty is because they know for a fact the cars will be beat on hard. I would not be suprised if scion lowered there warranty on the tc because of how hard people beat on them as well. The 2az if drivin as a daily driver like it was built for would have 1/10ththe problems it has if the vast majority of owners were not 17-20 and beating the crap out of there rides.

 

And yes, toyota ended it's performance line of engines long ago. Great legends such as the 4age, 4agze, 3sge, 3sgte, 7mge, 7mgte, 2jzge, 2jzgte etc... I do not consider the 2zz to be worth a penny in my book, but then again we all have opinions



Someone also mentioned a few posts back about the camry engine being upgraded, yes it is true. The camry is now getting the tc version of the 2az. Toyota uses the scion line for testing out products and new idea's. Great way to do it! Give the new designs to a mostly younger croud to pound on and when the bugs are worked out, put the technology into higher $$$ cars! And they make tons of money while doingit. Awsome toyota!

 

I know you love it's back. haha

 

$19,700 for my new Si (X-Mas eve) + Destination

The powertrain warranty on the Si is 5/60. I have no idea where you got your misinformation. A quick net search will bring up the information at a glance.

_____________________

As to the tC and Si (quoting myself from one of the other tC/Si threads):

Being both a former tC owner, as well as a current Si owner I can say that I really enjoyed my tC. The tC was fun, great 'bang for the buck', and handled much better once the TRD springs/struts were put on. If the S/C for the tC had arrived earlier (like 6 months) I might still be in the tC. (had a truck fiasco in between the tC and Si, heh)

Comparing my tC with TRD suspension to my stock Si, the LSD is really where the difference lies (in handling), allowing me to pull the Si through corners a bit more agressively. I also agree with the other poster, in that my tC with TRD suspension might have exihited a bit more roll. I would be very interested to see how a tC with the TRD suspension and S/C and quaife LSD would handle.

I think the only _____ I ever had about my tC was the paint. Heh. Everything else was just peachy.

 

The miss-information was taken from motor trends review and from an edmunds review And yes, to clarify that data is wrong. The si does have the same exact basic warranty as the tc. 5yr 60K mile powertrane.


On another note! I just got word that a friend of a friend bought an si a few weeks ago and wants to meet up possibly tommorow! If that happens, will get some awsome video going and photo's. See how that baby compares! I cannot wait to drive it.

 

Then they got it wrong

Edmunds own Civic Si page on warranties:

http://www.edmunds.com/new/2006/hond...arranties.html

Others:

http://autos.yahoo.com/newcars/honda...rranty.html%7D

http://www.conceptcarz.com/vehicle/z10769/default.aspx

 

great post but i have a question for you. because the k20z3 is the same displament as the k20a2 shouldn't engine internals be more or less interchangeablemore so with the bottom end cause the si's engine uses a different vtec system then the k20a2

 

The only difference between K20A2 and K20Z3 are JDM cams, and JDM intake manifold off the ITR. I have no idea what you mean by a different VTEC system though because it's the exact same. The motors I would consider almost identical but are paired with different transmissions. Just because a motor has same displacement does not mean that internals can be interchanged. The blocks can be different design.

K20A3 -- Base RSX
K20A2 -- 02-04 RSX Type-S
K20Z1 -- 05-06 RSX Type-S
K20Z3 -- 06 Si

The 06 Si also has JDM FD, LSD and TSX 6th gear.

 

Hey HondaSi. Just a few pointers.First of all you need to go to 1/4 mile track. You raced for an 1/8 mile(70 to 80 mph) so the advantage in such a short race would go to the higher Torque car, specially if you had problems launching the Si. Also, the tach in Hondas are off (Done in purpose to make owners shift earlier). The fuel cut off is at 8500 rpm, but in reality the car is doing only 8000 rpm, so make sure you shift at 8450 for the best times(which means you'll be shifting in reality at 7950 rpm). I've been shifting at 8450 rpm for 7 years at hundreds of races in my 99 Si and never had any problems.

Anyway if you haven't mastered launching your car PM me. I'll go over a few pointers.

I've said it before and I will say it again. The 06 Si and S/C Tc are EQUALLY fast. They both are trapping the same mph at the 1/4 mile, so it all comes down to who's the better driver.

And to the person who wrote this:

Yeah I just saw motortrends 15.7 @ 93.9mph 1320 for the si, I know that car has to be quicker than that. And yes, times vary allot with magazines! I would say 14.9 is a good average for a basically stock sc tc.

I posted about that at motortrend.com and one of the Admn.(Brandy) confirmed that it was a typo. the correct time the 06 Si did was 15.07. I'll post a link later.

So HondaSi, have fun racing your friend. With these 2 cars you gouys will know for sure who's the better driver, and will have bragging rights for the rest of your lives.

 

that's funny cause the 2zz motor is the most comparable to honduh motor that toyota has ever had. higher redline , lift. no torque.

 

He did say that hes been doing this for years, didn't he? I might also point out, fuel cut off is always higher than redline this isn't just a honda thing. Shifting above redline doesn't do too much on a stock motor, usually right after redline you start to loose power. Some cases this isn't true, but in most it is. Just thought i would point that out.

 

In the K20Z3, the motor doesn't lose power past redline, but the key point in shifting past redline is because when you shift, your RPMs will still be in VTEC. If you shift before redline, you fall out of VTEC after the shift in the following gear.

 

I know, i used to own a gsr. I didn't know if there was a loss of power after redline with the k20z3 or not, i wouldn't recommend shifting at 8,450rpm with a stock motor often though. But thats just me.

 

Heheh, alrite cool. Yah, no power loss, but no gain either.

I wouldn't shift at 8450rpm NORMALLY or OFTEN, but you can. The valve springs on the K20A2/Z1/Z3 are the same as the ones in the K20 (JDM ITR) and they're redline is set at 8600rpm so it's safe. With Hondata, my redline/fuel cutoff is set at 8600 and I can do it daily if I wanted to... it's just a waste of gas

 

DrR, when Mike and I had our fun a few days ago, I shifted around 8,200rpm. Shifting around 8,450rpm like you suggested I wouldn't recommend to anyone. While fuel cut off is 8,500rpm, you can cause some significant damange to your motor and trans if you did this often. 8,200rpm is the highest I will go on a non built motor. However, thank you for your input but I believe almost fifteen years of track experience has taught me something.

itzjere, the head on the k20z3 is also part design of the k24a2 head. (tsx) The k20z3 shares many parts with both worlds of honda's motors. (jdm and usdm) I would compare performance wise to the k20a2, It's a very similar motor in more ways than one. Then again so is the k20z1 and k24a2 as well.

Thank you everyone for keeping this friendly, I've noticed some of the threads on Scion Life can be quite brutal.

 

Yeah, when i had the gsr i raised the redline to 8,600rpm. Fuel cut off was around 9,000rpm. I never felt like pushing it all the way till fuel cut off but, it was around there.

 

Yah, I don't think I've ever hit my rev limiter/fuel cut off before... well, maybe once, but yah, wouldn't do it often at all.. i don't even think there is any situation where you'd need to hit the fuel cut off.. not even 1/4 mile