NB? His posts were back in July of 2004. I did read the whole thread, but after almost 2 years, it was not at all clear that you were refering to him.

 

I have used both the petroleum oils and synthetics in several cars. I ran a Maxima for 210,000 miles on petroleum oil. The engine, an inline six never used a drop of oil or leaked the entire time iI owned it. Like one person said the rest of the car will most likely fail before you reach 300,000 miles.

Presently I use sythethics because of the extra protection and the oil changes for the brand I am using can go for 7,500 miles or six months. The oil change is twice the price of a standard oil change, but I don't have to change the oil as many times. Also, I am not disposing an additonal eight to nine quarts of oil per car a year.

To me that is good enough. My Scion xB is great. I really enjoy everyones view point and all the modifications that can be done to the Scion. I just changed the oil at 1012 miles and I am using Amsoil XL 7500, 5-30. I believe Mobil 1 has an extended life oil also.

 

The truth is Manufacturers recommend Oil Change intervals to protect themselves from warranty claims....Scion/Toyota recommend you change the Oil every 5,000 miles with non-synth Oil along with an OEM Filter. That's all that's required.

When they develop a new Engine they run them to failure, they collect data and determine how long an engine will run without an Oil change before damage occurs and half it, they then take into account that some drivers will be very hard on their Cars, so they half the intervals again....they are then pretty sure that if Joe Blow drives the heck out of his Car his engine will last untill way past the warranty period, then they're off the Hook.

So, simply change your Oil at 5K miles, or 6 months, whichever comes first, have it recorded in the service Book they gave you in case you have a warranty claim and you'll be golden....

You won't be keeping your Scion for more than 100,000 miles because a new updated Model will come out long before then and you'll just have to have one...right?

 

...adding fuel to fire...
I am a mechanic...(but or and) when I bought my xB i took it back for my first comp. oil change at 1500mi. (just like I do with my customers engine builds).
Of course the oil was clean and my dealer thought I was wasting time/money. I got my second comp. oil change at 3K mi and they still thought I was off base. Who cares? It was FREE!
The third change wasat 6K, and the first one I did myself. The a** at the dealership put the filter on so tight I thought I was never going to get it off!
When I did the 6K, 11K, and 16K services I used Prolong engine treatment, a Toyota filter and Carquest brand oil (Havoline, I believe).
So I am not 'synth', but I change every 5K and spend the extra $7 on Prolong. I do believe the Toyota filter is worth it. The difference in cost (from aftermarket) when I checked was pennies.
Toyota's oil? I dunno. I have never had a customer request it, and I have never seen an engine die for lack of it. The price difference compares to using an additive like Prolong, or synth oil. They just don't make the same boasts.
For the record, I kept it under 85 (with much effort) for the 1st 5K, and varying speeds without maintaining constant RPM or racing like a nut is the correct way to brake it in. (Read TFOM)
OBTW I like Royal Purple in a race engine, but their own rep told me that it should not be used in street cars that experience long (i.e. 5K) oil change intervals due to the fact that race oils like theirs do not contain the additives that help to suspend combustion byproducts.
Oh, and about that third free oil change... my wife can use it when she's at the coast or whatever... I still have 26 mos. to use it!
Just in case I havent infuriated everybody yet... unless your engine came with synth in it, you shouldn't put it in (or any other additive) until you know the rings have seated. I tracked this on my xB from day 1 and saw the mpg increase on the tank which I filled up at 2840.6 mi. (Read the label, your results may vary.)
I do hope this helps. Not to end the debate, but to bring practical reasonable and recent experience to the topic.

 

I will have to check, but I believe my 06 came with synth in it. I haven't even taken a peek yet, but are oil changes relatively easy on the xB?

 

What makes you think Toyota put some after market synth in the Scion on the assembly line in Japan, when all they make is Toyota oil?
Oi changes are easier than a transmission oil change, because it takes one less layer of 2x lumber to raise the car and you don't have to remove the plastic shrouds:
http://s49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...0Oil%20Change/

 

I plan on switching to Mobil 1 at my first oil change @3000 miles. I will then change that oil once a year or approx. every 10000 miles. I work for Porsche and that very same oil is put in the $200000 GT2 is also good for 15000 miles(or once a year) according to Porsche. So i don't think i'll be hurting an exceptionally built econocar engine with my plan.

 

I was told by an oil and engine expert that the Scions come with some really good synthic from the factory - better than what the dealers put in it when they change it for you - that's what he said. WHen I changed my at about 3700 it was pretty dirty but not really bad.

 

Engine breaking in has been great wiyh my short ram intake and strup axle back. I have about 2000 miles on it now i put 600 on it today running between 80 and 90 on the interstate. It wouldn't do but 103mph stock but i got 108mph out of it today after upgrades.

 

I have not read this yet in the thread, but how about making your own synthetic blend(same weight oil) = say 1/2 Mobile 1, and 1/2 Mobile clean 5000 ?? Would that be similar to going with Castrol sythetic blend ?

 

I also heard of needing/having the piston rings seated(proper initial wear) , before even considering/doing - going to full synthetic oil. On the flip side, some say that our engines come from factory with the rings already seated ??!!!

Can anyone definitively conclude/give factual info. pertaining to the piston ring situation ??

 

Your rings are seated but the bores are not fully polished so gentle throttle for the first several thousand miles is good for improved break in. I know you guys take what I say with a grain of salt but I ran to Babylon NY on Long Island last Tuesday and back in rush hour traffic with the A/C on most of the time pretty much burned a tank of gas about 10 gallons in 421 miles in a day so calculate my MPG average . . . on Sylnube with 17,000 miles on the odometer and my first change was at 3700 miles and none since Synlube was put in the engine.

 

What is synlube ?

I've been calculating my mpg's since doing the snorkle removal + TRD drop in, its been about 4 full tanks now, and I've been getting an average of about 39 mpg's - thats probably 75% freeway driving, very-rarely using the AC- basicly not at all , I have 16" wheels, but the combined weight of the stock wheel = my 16" wheels/tires is identical. I've got 4400 miles on my odometer , proper break in period , first 4K milles, I didn't tack it above 3500 rpms (usually @ 3K ..... I think 1-2 times @ 4K rpms accidentaly). I dropped the stock oil @ 2500 miles, and put in 5w-30 Mobile Clean 5000 oil. I also have magnets on my oil filter now.

..... and I drive the more aero xA

 

It continues to break in at 4000 and beyond - you can rev it more but not with a lot of gas pedal - as the engine breaks in it will rev easier and reving it up gets the pistons and rings to travel a little bit further up the cylinder and really throws the oil in the crankcase around to cool and lube it better. There is more than just the rings breaking in - the timing chain and valves also move a lot as well as lifters and gearing in the tranny. You might consider changing just your tranny oil and see how much your mileage changes. Also add some more pressure to your tires like try 35-38psi for starters and watch your mileage go up.

Synlube is a long term lubricant typically 150,000 miles between changes with a couple of filter changes during that time. It has less friction than conventional oils at most RPMs and doesn't break down to form sludge like conventional oils with extended use.

 

I have a manual, so are you refering to some Mobile 1 syn. gear oil in my tranny ?

Is Synlube a engine lube ? When you change your oil, doesn't it just come out - or does it bond to the metal parts ? Is it like dura-lube ?

 

Yeah some Mobile 1 Gear lube would be great - I added some 20 year old Slick50 gear lube and saw improvements right away in my mileage.

Synlube is a oil replacement lubricant - you drain the engine and tranny and in my case the power steering fluid and put their stuff in. They have over 150 different prpoducts made for specific applications so you have to get the correct ones for the job and vehicle. Once you put the lube in the engine all you do is check it once a month and change the filter at 36,000 and 75,000 miles and keep it topped off with "Add Oil". You can change it and recycle it back to the company but it should last about 150,000 miles without changing it. Saves a lot of time and produces no waste products since they recycle it. It keeps on lubricating better than conventional and synthetic oils and ends up costing about half or less then them in the long run espically if you tend to change dino oils more frequently than usual. The hardest part of using it was getting used to the idea that I DON'T have to change it every 3-6 months to a year like I have been in all my prior vehicles. Engine runs better on it and is quieter and more efficient too and my gas mileage shows it works great also even at fast highway speeds I get better gas mileage than almost all other xBs out there.

 

On the slick-50 you used, does it last 20 years , or is it that you purchased it in 1987 - and somehow more superior to the current slick-50 out in the market ??

Is there a web-site to Synlube , and where do you purchase it ?

Thanks in advance.

 

Yeah it was a really old can of Slick 50 gear lube that had been open, had used some of it in my BMW motorcycle and it was still good once I mixed the teflon back into the oil - it had settled out. Still good after all those years and it was the old stuff. I put about 8 onces into the tranny and wow it made a difference about 4 mpg more. Replaced it with Synlube about a month later and got about the same results.

www.synlube.com and you buy it direct from the manufacturer, and you have to talk to Miro before they will sell you anything to make sure you get the right products and install them properly.

 

Thanks for the tip!

Are you also using the Synlube oil-filters as well ??
The Synlube filters cost looks to be very-similar cost as a oem Toyota filter(@$4.81 each through Toyota Sparks). Synlube filter = 36K miles @ $25-30 each vs. OEM Toyota filter can go 5K miles @ $4.81 each.

 

Yeah the oil filter is 5 micron high volume full flow filter and not the little can that comes from Toyota but a full sized filter. The first one is changed after 36000 because of the small amount of "Dino" oil that was in the engine from the first change which will have turned to sludge and been filtered out by the first filter and needs to be removed. The second filter goes to 75,000 miles - priced at $24 and you reuse the Neo Magnets of course.