Still 20-30 people unaccounted for as well.

 

and they see bodies, but they cant get to them right now because they are trapped. George W is coming tomorrow to see the site.

 

The NTSB said it may take over a year to reach a conclusion on what caused it... probably because those hacks can't just stamp 'pilot error' on it.

A little more cash spent on infrastructure could minimize things like this from happening. You see half the things they appropriate money for on congress.org and you wonder why it takes a steampipe bursting, or a bridge collapsing for them to allocate money, when they're gung ho about spending millions on observing and protecting like... the silver-toed otter or some crap like that.

 

The entire cost of replacing every medium and large size bridge in the United States could have been totally covered with a fraction of what it has cost us to depose Saddam Hussein (and the continuing war in Iraq that started when we invaded).

The bridge in Minneapolis could have been replaced with just a few hours of the cost of that war.

Instead we are spending vast quantities fighting battles we don't even know how to "win" and spending additional billions "rebuilding" the infrastructure in Iraq.

(Hell we still have families displaced by storm in New Orleans and surrounding areas that the government is yet to help.)

Upkeep and replacement of our vital infrastructure should have been a constant, ongoing process, not panic responses to disasters. You can't just build this stuff once, and expect it to last forever. UPKEEP is needed. Constant upkeep.

I'm sad for all those affected, family, friends, loved ones, by things like the bridge collapse, but I'm also angry at our governments, local, state, and federal, for not doing what they are hired to do.

Tom

 

It is not just the war. It is EVERYTHING we give away to the rest of the world.

We support every country that we can

We support every illegal immigrant that comes over and doesnt pay taxes, cause if we think of actually enforcing our laws, morons protest (including illegals with NO right to protest our laws)

We basically support everyone else first (and always have) and let our own suffer. It makes me sick frankly. I was for getting rid of sadaam, but it should have ended there. (Personally, a much more violent attack should have been focused on the country SUPPORTING many of these organizations, but that is another story). At some point they should be left to fight for thier own democracy so we can survive in our own that is dwindling away (well, we were never meant to be a democracy, we are a republic by definition.. but anywho)

But, that is all getting into another discussion. And a LOT of the blame is still on the states themselves and thier reluctance to spend thier money on thier bridges. Last I heard, most of the US is in WORSE shape when it comes to failing bridges than MN, so the problem is quite large.

But as far as calling the NTSB hacks... I wouldnt go that far. Some of the investigation they have done has been VERY well done. I have worked at boeing in avionics and can input that MOST commercial airline crashes are pilot/controller error. It is actually VERY hard to get a commercial airliner to a point that a pilot cannot fly it. We are talking about 6 - 8 systems failing at once. And reading many of those investigations in the past you will see that icing, controller error, etc are many times the obvious case. I also worked on a 3 month project at NASA during the columbia investigation, during which time I went to a few meetings, including Hal Gehmans pre-press release. You would not believe the amount of work and data looked at in an accident and the sheer amount of labor needed to come to a conclusion. Obviously, it is the case many times that a cause can be found to 80 - 90% accuracy earlier on, but when you think of the people on the line and the impact of blame, most prefer to take the time to be sure. For example, early into the investigation, everyone just KNEW a chunk of foam could not damage the leading edge of the shuttle wing. After sitting throug thier presentation, and seeing test where a peice of foam moving at the same relative speed to the wing as the accident blew a hole the size of a bowling ball through the wing, many peoples minds changed very suddenly

We will most likely find that the obvious flaws found in the steel played a big role in this. However, I am more concerned with getting the issue fixed and the bridge replaced than the ntsb being able to blame someone as soon as possible. Finding out what caused it in this case has no bearing on the replacement of the bridge, the impact on the families who lost loved ones, etc. People tend to place more importance on witch hunting and handing out the blame sometimes than actually getting the issue resolved, which is of primary importance.

 

Dave, I am glad to see that you weren't anywhere near the bridge. I still can't believe that bridge went down...I drove it every day going to school! So far, nobody I know was involved, but I was certainly one of those people calling every member of my family on their cell phones, making sure they weren't down there...

I have always said I don't miss Minneapolis too much, but I DO miss the people, and there are some amazing stories circulating about people who helped others without thinking of the danger. It is a very special town, and it is such a tragedy that this happened...