As you guys know I work very closely with Michael Kennedy from SET. Well looks like we took a tongue lashing from you guys because of the poor judging that went on during the event.

So to prove that we listen, adapt and learn from mistakes I present this idea to you.

Can we agree that we go to Exposed to have a good time? I mean it is obviously more than a show and free to its participants.

What if you were able to go to the show park your vehicle, clean it up and simply enjoy the show but still possibly go home with a trophy?

What we are considering is making trophies for the next event, nice ones, depicting the place and time but no classes. Then separate and apart from the swag raffles, raffle off the trophies to those that registered vehicles. That way you stand the same chance as I do at walking away with a nice ___ trophy for the event.

Understand that no matter what judging system is used there will always be drama. We want to eliminate that drama, provide a quality event and a tremendous keepsake for showing your support. Because in the end, if you are a trophy hound, there are hundreds of events between these for you to collect another piece of meaningless plastic.

Your thoughts?

 

I to work close with Kennedy and Ivan~ but ot play devils advocate~ why change it ? it seems to not work well for those who dont win.. the judges are qualified and know there stuff. its not like its me going to the cars and making notes and adding numbers.

Every time there is an event peoples choice or what not, its the same stuff... i think people need to look deep inside and see what they have done and compare it to what they can do or not do, and make it better next time, or leave it alone and go for the fun of it not the trophy!

cant please everyone...

steppin off box....

 

As an individual who is highly competitive and has a very competitive ride, I understand your point of view and support it.

However, these events are not a competitive event, the car show is almost secondary to what goes on before during and after the show. Unfortunately we are a fickle bunch and are quick to boycott or bad mouth events even if the outcome was just and that person just didn't stack up.

Now currently, we have yet to put together a judging team that serves the best interest of those that attend. as I go over the winners in my head, I can't help but agree that there were discrepancies and categories that were missed altogether.

I'm not here to dredge up mistakes, rather gauge the participants interest in what Exposed really means to them. Whatever the outcome we will work incredibly hard to become the premier Scion events in the country, bet on that..

 

Ivan, why dont you do the judging.. lol *ok maybe not*

just kiddin, maybe we can work with the judges we have and give them some scion training.. Allowing the "street team" to voice the opinions of what the owners want need etc. to there scions.. doest that make scense?

 

I have been in the show car/truck arena since 1990 and every show that I have been to it's the same old story of how someone who "thinks" thier ride is better should get a trophy and will complain and make a bunch of noise because they didn't. It doesn't matter if it's a group of judges from the host club, an outside group, or peoples choice...It's the same gripes and complaints. The only way to keep this from happening is to not have a judged event and trophies, the only problem is that those same people will then complain about NOT having trophies.

I too am a very competitive owner and do what I can to make my ride stand out and if a group of judges or people find that it is worthy of an award...Then Great! If not...Then Great! I didn't build my ride to impress judges, I built it to for my own personal enjoyment!

I would love to find out what is being said, because I am on many forums and have only seen a few things posted but nothing of any real concern. Ivan, PM me with what info you have and I will do what I can in the Atlanta area to make sure attitudes change.

 

I have pitched the idea for ages to allow me to build a core of judges that can establish a proper criteria for these types of events. However judging takes time. From my experience, 5 minutes would be a practical average for time needed to spend with a vehicle and its owner.

Now do the math ... and I'll make this easy knowing there was more at this particular event;

300 cars = 25 hours = 1 judge, 5 judges = 5 hours, that alone would have gone over time with the event. Plus judges have to eat.

You can't have two judges on the same class, no matter how well trained, opinions will vary affecting scores.
Then you need time to tally and verify results.

Logistically large shows are a nightmare and in this scenario I assumed everyone was standing at the ready waiting on a judge, which means you miss out on the show.

Now steps can be taken to avoid that fiasco too, but now the focus of the event is becoming the judging not the event itself .. you see where I'm heading?

I haven't even covered compensating the judges for this effort which is a whole other topic.

I'm all for a bloody head to head competition to crush egos, however to pull it off you need a serious staff and a couple days to judge it, ala NOPI Nationals. We are not there yet .. nor do I think it should go there.

So a new idea must come from its participants and not only be fair but rewarding for all who attend, this is my goal, chase the holy grail of car shows ..lol

 

Ivan, we didn't attend Exposed to try to win a trophy. Exposed is more of a Scion owners reunion than a trophy type show. I think Exposed is more about having fun and enjoying ourselves that trying so hard to win something. Mike Kennedy and his crew do a great job of making sure everyone has a great time and are well fed and are surrounded by fun things to do. Having World Racing, Rado, ScionPro and KillerGlass there was especially cool. And who can complain about the raffle? You all gave out some great prizes and everyone left with a goody bag full of cool stuff. Another Exposed t-shirt for my collection!

As far as judging goes, my XB and the XD next to me were the very last cars to be judged and I think they were still very thurough and didn't rush or skip anything. Maybe with 500+- Scions at the show, you might be able to do a 1st, 2nd and 3rd in each category, but as in past Exposed, everyones knows there is usually only one trophy for each. No big deal here. There will always be complainer and people who are "not happy with the judging" at every event and you just have to let that slide.

Overall it was an awsome event at a very nice location and an awsome time for all. Thanks again for everything!

 

I don't really see a reason to change it. I feel I'm within the top 5-10% of the cars for xB mild. I didn't win, and I'm not complaining at all. That isn't why I was there!

Scion exposed is all about going to a big scion meet and hanging out, having a good time, seeing what others have done to their cars, and enjoying the show.

Judging will always be a little biased. One person may like a particular style of one car and not of another. This is life, you aren't gonna win every show no matter how great your car is.

The cars that won deserved to win. Were there other cars there better then the winners? Well that all depends on personal taste.

To all those whining about the event judging: How much was your entrance fee? NOTHING. Did you get free food? YES. Did you get free gifts and free raffle tickets? YES.

What are you complaining for! Its not as if you paid to enter. Don't try to count gas cost or hotel prices, it was your choice to come to this show. Scion put on a great show and thanks to them and the sponcers that were there, there were great prizes given away in the raffle, which you had just as much a chance as I had at winning.

trikkonceptz, how about next year you guys give out a scion exposed plaque to the first 50-100 people to arrive or first people RSVPed for the show, numbered like the release series cars? Something small to keep production cost down.

 

ivan, mike and everyone @ SET thanks for awsome show...i honestly was not expecting to win after i saw some really nice xB's there. i also put mild in the class section of the registration and i ended up winning best wild xB. its was cool to win because i had never won a best in class nor had i ever been placed in the wild catagory.

as far as judging coming from someone who won seemed a lil bit bias towards JDM cars rather than some one building a car to their likings. thats were i think a judge needs to put apart his like or dislikes and judge the car for what it is not if it meets his/her standards.

i also was talking with some friends after the show and just as an idea we were thinking that for next years exposed SET should close off Ocean Ave. which is right on the water in Miami Beach and have the car show there. they close it anyways for any little photo gallery or a paint show or a festival so why not do it for SCIONS. the back drop and the scenery would be amazing... just an idea over all win or no win exposed was awsome. i really had a good time with other scion owners that i met and spent a hell of a good time at the hotel with my c.c. so cant wait for next year and do it all over again.

again thanks to everyone who had anything to do with putting this show together...Ivan can you please have Mike call me i have to talk to him.

 

I totally agree with you though i was unable to make it for financial means to this exposed, i did talk to people who went tho(i went to tampa for HIN the weekend before since for my club it was mandatory) when i went to exposed my idea is alot of us scions converging on a location and meeting people and sharing interests....its like a SUPER-MEET...hell the overall experience in general is what its for! anyways i have a very competitive car i'd say i'm the rare few that did it for the artistic endeavor not really the competitive nature of the car show scene(could care less)...because they ALWAYS lead to drama which i could do without.

i think its fine the way it is...people are never satisfied, you give the world(FREE) for nothing and some complain about it, life goes on...there is more important matters in life to be arguing or giving a damn about. i'd say leave trophies out of it honestly...

there are some of us that appreciate the time people take to set up theses events, they dedicate there free time and think about us and what we'd like...so dont trash them because in the end your slapping a someone in the face honestly and if you got slapped in the face would you want to do things for people again?

 

Over the past 3 years since I have been involved in the "show scene" I have heard this argument many time...and it is usually from the same group of people who don't go to the events for the right reasons - they go to "collect plastic".

People need to be happy that we are involved with a company that WANTS to hold LARGE events for the owners and works hard to get the dealers to so the same with their own shows and stop complaining if they didn't get a trophy, or a raffle prize and there were not enough classes! It's a simple fact that not everyone can win ALL the time... Now, before anyone says "But you won"...yes, this time. But, I have been beaten many times by better cars and even by stock cars. It's not always a "check mark = points" system. There is a lot of subjective play in judging a car show and a lot of personal opinion comes into play. And, as someone who has judged several shows, I can tell you that even with a detailed scoring sheet, your own personal likes and dislikes tend to come through. And that is going to happen if you have club judging, professional judging or people's choice.

Bottom line - We need to leave the set up as it is because you are not going to please EVERYONE and raffling off a trophy like a door prize will undermine a LOT of people's hard work and pride... And, it takes away from the main ideal of Scion - United by Individuality!

 

 

more securtiy!! i got my $400 Radar stolen thru my sunroof!

 

People who do the judging deserve a credit as well. It's no "joke" judging 200 to 500 cars all day. Busting their *ss, specially judging on a very hot weather. You can't blame judge cause you didn't win a trophy. They did what they really think who deserve to win it. You cannot make everyone happy. Someone always will be complaining why they didn't win. So, props to everyone "Mike Kennedy, Judge people, volunteer,sponsor, and to all that always makes the Scion Exposed a fun event for all scion owner.

 

I say leave it the way it is. Raffling off trophys is just a silly idea. Adding 2nd and 3rd places will just lead to even more complaints. No matter how good the judging is there will always be complaints.
That being said there needs to be more judges. I would say at least 1 judge for every 50-75 cars. It shouldn't be too hard to put toghether a group of judges with Scion knowledge. Just from the people that have posted in this thread I see 3 or 4 people with Judging experience that have been in the Scion scene for a while.
After all the judging and points have been added up the top 2 or 3 vote getters from each category should be given a second look by the judges, and a winner decided by concensus.
Also bring back the Peoples choice award...That chalkboard xB would have totally won it .

 

Well thank you for the input and keep it coming ... Exposed 007 is going to make history. As I secure details I will be sure to leak some out to you to keep the buzz going.

I can promise you this. It will be a show the likes you have never seen before ANYWHERE.

For the first time, it will be put together by tuners for tuners. And if you think you want to help think twice. All those helping are having their tongues removed to keep them from talking .. LOL

Laterz,

Ivan

 

they should keep everything but only add 1st 2nd 3rd to every mild and wild category because there are so many ppl who show their hard work and dedication for their rides so i think not only 1 person should be recognized for the class their in

 

Will there be ameture drag/circuit racing next year? That would be a hell of a lot of fun to watch and participate in. Fastest xB , tC, xA, xD trophies?

 

^^ive seen video of scion exposed in texas and they had a drag strip they were running on so that would be an awsome idea...

 

That would be real cool if it could work out