Kill 2 "cooling" Birds with 1 Intercooler? - Pic
11-20-2005, 06:52 PM
#1
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Kill 2 "cooling" Birds with 1 Intercooler? - Pic
Well, I received the PWR Air2Water setup and I'm very impressed. I was concerned about the pump...but it's a nice Bosch.
Let me know if this plan sounds right for setup.
I planned on running the pump output to the PWR Charge pipe cooler, then out of the charge pipe to the turbo top, then out of the turbo bottom to the radiator bottom....out of the radiator top to the inline radiator cap/filler...out of the filler to the pump input.
Off of the radiator cap I will have a little container for overflow.
I'm trying to keep it in order of what would raise the coolant temp the least to the hottest piece "turbo" as last right before the radiator. Does this sound right?
I expect the benefits of cooling the turbo as well with this kit to be a very nice addition...unless it overwhelms the coolant system.
Let me know if this plan sounds right for setup.
I planned on running the pump output to the PWR Charge pipe cooler, then out of the charge pipe to the turbo top, then out of the turbo bottom to the radiator bottom....out of the radiator top to the inline radiator cap/filler...out of the filler to the pump input.
Off of the radiator cap I will have a little container for overflow.I'm trying to keep it in order of what would raise the coolant temp the least to the hottest piece "turbo" as last right before the radiator. Does this sound right?
I expect the benefits of cooling the turbo as well with this kit to be a very nice addition...unless it overwhelms the coolant system.
11-20-2005, 08:48 PM
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That sounds pretty solid to me, so as long as the water coming off the turbo isn't too incredibly pressurized. The order at least makes sense to me. Did it ship with water lines?
Also, how much did this thing run you? I'm curious.
Also, how much did this thing run you? I'm curious.
11-20-2005, 11:17 PM
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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DO NOT circulate this through the turbo. DO NOT, NEGATIVE, NO, NO, NEVER, NO.
turbo = 1500 degrees, you want charge pipe to be below or at ambivilent temperature (outside air). running it through the turbo would first slow down coolant flow a large amount and greatly increase the temps.
I'd recommend this if you want the best cooling. run from chargepipe directly to heat exchanger. this is the only way to help cool it down.
for your turbo, you shoudl be running it off the radiator. you can use the water lines that run to your trottlebody. they are for defrosting the TB if its cold, which is unneeded. just loop them to your turbo.
but if you loop it through your turbo, you might as well not have a intercooler.
i now you like the idea of killing two birds with one stone, but that would kill water flow & 1500 degree device isn't going to help cool 150 degree air. you have to remember you are trying to cool air temps form around 150 to lower.
if you don't beleive me, call Earl again and run that by him and he'll agree with me
DO NOT circulate this through the turbo. DO NOT, NEGATIVE, NO, NO, NEVER, NO.
turbo = 1500 degrees, you want charge pipe to be below or at ambivilent temperature (outside air). running it through the turbo would first slow down coolant flow a large amount and greatly increase the temps.
I'd recommend this if you want the best cooling. run from chargepipe directly to heat exchanger. this is the only way to help cool it down.
for your turbo, you shoudl be running it off the radiator. you can use the water lines that run to your trottlebody. they are for defrosting the TB if its cold, which is unneeded. just loop them to your turbo.
but if you loop it through your turbo, you might as well not have a intercooler.
i now you like the idea of killing two birds with one stone, but that would kill water flow & 1500 degree device isn't going to help cool 150 degree air. you have to remember you are trying to cool air temps form around 150 to lower.
if you don't beleive me, call Earl again and run that by him and he'll agree with me
11-20-2005, 11:21 PM
#4
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oh yeah, buy a containor for coolant for that pump.
get like a 1 gallon cell or 1/2 gallon storage area and store it maybe by the bumper. like in front of the wheel behind the cover between bumper & black cover. so you have storage area, to pump to vent tube to intercooler back to storage area. the bigger the sotrage area, the better coolant.
get like a 1 gallon cell or 1/2 gallon storage area and store it maybe by the bumper. like in front of the wheel behind the cover between bumper & black cover. so you have storage area, to pump to vent tube to intercooler back to storage area. the bigger the sotrage area, the better coolant.
11-20-2005, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by seen4ever
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DO NOT circulate this through the turbo. DO NOT, NEGATIVE, NO, NO, NEVER, NO.
turbo = 1500 degrees, you want charge pipe to be below or at ambivilent temperature (outside air). running it through the turbo would first slow down coolant flow a large amount and greatly increase the temps.
I'd recommend this if you want the best cooling. run from chargepipe directly to heat exchanger. this is the only way to help cool it down.
for your turbo, you shoudl be running it off the radiator. you can use the water lines that run to your trottlebody. they are for defrosting the TB if its cold, which is unneeded. just loop them to your turbo.
but if you loop it through your turbo, you might as well not have a intercooler.
i now you like the idea of killing two birds with one stone, but that would kill water flow & 1500 degree device isn't going to help cool 150 degree air. you have to remember you are trying to cool air temps form around 150 to lower.
if you don't beleive me, call Earl again and run that by him and he'll agree with me
DO NOT circulate this through the turbo. DO NOT, NEGATIVE, NO, NO, NEVER, NO.
turbo = 1500 degrees, you want charge pipe to be below or at ambivilent temperature (outside air). running it through the turbo would first slow down coolant flow a large amount and greatly increase the temps.
I'd recommend this if you want the best cooling. run from chargepipe directly to heat exchanger. this is the only way to help cool it down.
for your turbo, you shoudl be running it off the radiator. you can use the water lines that run to your trottlebody. they are for defrosting the TB if its cold, which is unneeded. just loop them to your turbo.
but if you loop it through your turbo, you might as well not have a intercooler.
i now you like the idea of killing two birds with one stone, but that would kill water flow & 1500 degree device isn't going to help cool 150 degree air. you have to remember you are trying to cool air temps form around 150 to lower.
if you don't beleive me, call Earl again and run that by him and he'll agree with me
I'll just keep it simple and leave it setup for the air.
I really like this setup. I'm redoing the charge pipe this week and should be ready for install.
Thanks again seen4ever for the heads up.
11-21-2005, 12:21 AM
#6
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Sean is 100 percent correct. Running it through the turbo would be soooo counter productive.
It looks like a very nice setup though. I'm looking forward to the pics of it on the car.
Charles
It looks like a very nice setup though. I'm looking forward to the pics of it on the car.
Charles
11-21-2005, 01:21 AM
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honda guy to the rescue
sciondad, i'm really looking forward to the install. as it should really help. Be sure to keep an eye on your plugs, as things are going to change a fair amount.
just try to get a container to hold coolant to go with it. the more fluid you have the more its able to keep cool. This is how the vortec kits are for thier stuff with the aftercoolers. they all have a resevoir to help keep the water cool.
sciondad, i'm really looking forward to the install. as it should really help. Be sure to keep an eye on your plugs, as things are going to change a fair amount.
just try to get a container to hold coolant to go with it. the more fluid you have the more its able to keep cool. This is how the vortec kits are for thier stuff with the aftercoolers. they all have a resevoir to help keep the water cool.
11-21-2005, 05:08 PM
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if you put a FMIC on a car it will block airflow to the heat exchanger of the a/w intercooler. the A/W heat exchanger will work to heat up the FMIC as its directly behind it. the coldest the intake air could ever be was ambevielent, aka the outside air temperature. the FMIC & heat exhanger would counteract one another so the heat exchanger wouldn't work as effectively as it could, thereby not cooling the air as much and thereby actually heating up the air that the FMIC allows through it. not to mention the drain on the turbo system to have to push air through two dense cores, would cause massive pressure lose. so 10psi at the turbo may turn into 5psi at the trottlebody after the two cores.
its all up to you, if you want to be dumb and do something pointless to lose money, go for it. I know for my 550whp civic, i don't have to run 2 intercoolers to have my intake air temps slightly higher than ambevielent. but if you know better, go out and prove us all wrong. run a SC and a turbo because we all know that parasitic drag that the SC places on the engine is a good thing. we also know that the SC massive restriction on the intake path will be good, as the turbo will be forced to blow through it at all times. likewise it will be really smart to have intercooled air form a turbo be shoot into a roots sc to have intake temps skyrocket due to the lack of a intercooler device on the supercharger due to space constraints.
that's freaking genuis, hurry out stat to build your twin intercooled twin boosted car so that everyone with the normal proven setup can fly past you as you deal with constant mechanical issues.
its all up to you, if you want to be dumb and do something pointless to lose money, go for it. I know for my 550whp civic, i don't have to run 2 intercoolers to have my intake air temps slightly higher than ambevielent. but if you know better, go out and prove us all wrong. run a SC and a turbo because we all know that parasitic drag that the SC places on the engine is a good thing. we also know that the SC massive restriction on the intake path will be good, as the turbo will be forced to blow through it at all times. likewise it will be really smart to have intercooled air form a turbo be shoot into a roots sc to have intake temps skyrocket due to the lack of a intercooler device on the supercharger due to space constraints.
that's freaking genuis, hurry out stat to build your twin intercooled twin boosted car so that everyone with the normal proven setup can fly past you as you deal with constant mechanical issues.
11-21-2005, 05:32 PM
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hahaha!
I am not going to do it. It is my ignorance that is making these questions come up! I have never ran anything but a FMIC and was wondering if there would be any benifits to running a water cooled system too. I guess not.
As far as the S/C turboed car, it has been done! With success. It does have its benifits, but the cost is not worth the minimal extra gain you get.
I am not going to do it. It is my ignorance that is making these questions come up! I have never ran anything but a FMIC and was wondering if there would be any benifits to running a water cooled system too. I guess not.
As far as the S/C turboed car, it has been done! With success. It does have its benifits, but the cost is not worth the minimal extra gain you get.
11-21-2005, 05:56 PM
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i know of that mini, have you see its dyno of when it was just turbo? compared to it being twincharged? it picked up 50whp in the midrange with the SCr but lost 30whp up top due to the restriction of the intake.
is the extra 3k worth that midrange? i always say get a proper sized turbo and be done with it. a good ball-bearing turbo will give you a damn good midrange and power output.
is the extra 3k worth that midrange? i always say get a proper sized turbo and be done with it. a good ball-bearing turbo will give you a damn good midrange and power output.
11-21-2005, 06:11 PM
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But if your looking to be quicker in a 1/4 mile then 50hp mid range would be better then 30hp in the top range! Like I said before it is pricey with a minimal gain! But hey if you've got the money to do it I don't think 3k is an obstical!
11-21-2005, 06:51 PM
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its all area under the curve, if that 50whp in the midrange only lasts for 300rpms but costs you 30whp for 1200rpms, then i would say otherwise but i'm far to lazy to get calculus equations out here.
but i'm far to lazy to get calculus equations out here.
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