ScionFred

iTrader: (1)

I hope you guys don't mind me posting XB2 questions here but there are so few boosted XB2s and aside from Cory, they rarely post at SL.

Basically I have the only turbocharged AT XB2, a Boomslang harness and a 1910 FIC. The FIC continues to cause misfiring with or without the resistor mod. I haven't tried every possible combination but I have tried running 2.2K, 4.7K, 1.1K on crk and cam, 2.2K on cam, none on crk and no resistors on either. Running 2.2K on the cam only gave the best results by far but I still had some misfires and P0335 CELs that went away if I bypassed the FIC. I'm tired of trouble-shooting this known FIC problem of limited crk/cam sensor compatibility.

As I see it, I have 3 options left:

1) Keep the FIC for fuel, MAF and O2 maps only. Tap the crk and lose ign timing retard.
2) Sell the FIC and try the Greddy Ultimate or something else.
3) Pull the turbo kit, part it out and buy a different car.

I'm only running 5-6psi on a T3/T04E 50 trim with a Treadstone log mani and stock exhaust. My target is only ~225whp (~260bhp) and I have to pass emission testing in MD. My setup hits 5psi before 3000rpm and long before open loop so I need good closed loop fuel tuning. Can the Ultimate handle this? TIA.

gingles

iTrader: (1)

ive tuned cory's xb2 and we havent had any misfires and as far as i know he didnt do the resistor mod. he got a pnp harness from someone and it works fine. ill try to see who he got it from and let ya know. also where ya from?

ScionFred

iTrader: (1)

Cory got his harness from Boomslang, as did I. His harness had the 2.2K crk/cam resistors installed, as did mine. For whatever reason, my AT XB2 just doesn't like the FIC's crk/cam signals. I could try new crk/cam sensors, shielding the crk/cam sensor wires and a million other things but I'm tired of wasting my time with what I consider to be an inherent FIC problem. The FIC is great, when it works, but there are very good reasons why AEM has different FIC versions and all of them are related to crk/cam sensor compatibility. Like AEM told me, "we haven't validated the FIC for your car so it may or may not work".

I'm sure that this problem can be fixed, but I'm not willing to do all the R&D to fix it.
I already spent weeks fixing Boomslang's XB2 FIC harness.

Edit: I forgot to add that I'm in Baltimore, MD. Need to fix my sig...

rhythmnsmoke

FIC does not like the AT on the tC, so I assume the same issues you are having are the same that plague it when coupled with an AT tC. They are having success with the Ultimate though. The tuner needs to competent, and being in MD, I suggest you take it to PTuning.

crush02342002

iTrader: (2)

not exactly....no issues with the 07-up auto tc that i have seen but i have seen 05-06 auto tc have issues with the TB motor staying on after shutoff. I recently had a customer with this issue but as soon as i pull out his fic from his glove box to get a better look at the wireing the problem went away, couldnt trace it down. tried all day to try to get the car to do it again but wouldnt for some odd reason. not saying the problem is fixed but i just couldnt get it to do it again.

cburglb34

dude im going to ptuning weds ( i told you tuesday but toan is out tuesday) meet me there and you can discuss things with him on weds its shouldnt take long at all for him to adjust somethings

rhythmnsmoke

All I was saying was that there were documented issues, and he could be suffering from the same fate. He seems to be tired of trouble shooting it, so no better plan than to just to go a different route.

crush02342002

iTrader: (2)

and possibly end up with the same problem only to find out it wasnt the managment?...i get what your saying but it still is possible.

hey fred did you ever swap out sensors with someone? or fic's?

crush02342002

iTrader: (2)

refresh my memory...whats the issue?

cburglb34

chris i know that scionfred has tried out like 3 or 4 different units i actually have one of them

thendawg

iTrader: (2)

Maybe I just got lucky, but Ive never had a misfire issue, throttle body staying on after the power to the car is cut, or any of these crazy issues with my 07 at tc. However unlike 99% of people, I hardwired the fic myself, soldering and heatshrinking all connections. Im also using 2.2kohm resistors on my cam and crank signals. Im thinking maybe some people are connecting the resistors wrong or theres an issue with the pnp harnesses? loose connections/pins? I dunno

thendawg

iTrader: (2)

You dont happen to have access to an oscope do you? id like to check your cam/crank signals. I know mine had quite a bit of noise without the resistors - after i added the resistors it made the signal nearly perfect on the little usb oscope I have - I know it probably doesnt have the best resolution but still - before hand there was some strange almost harmonic like noise i would see at certain rpm - prob whats causing ppl's misfire issue.

crush02342002

iTrader: (2)

yeah i forgot what all he has tried.

cburglb34

i feel for the man being a grown man and having to deal with these problems isnt cool and id be thinking same thing sell it and buy a new car but before i do that i would def let an expert (ptuning) look at it

rhythmnsmoke

Not if the management he switches to is already proven to work.

ScionFred

iTrader: (1)

I've searched the AEM forum and found dozens of threads about misfiring and crk sensor codes with the FIC. Boomslang sent me a 1911 FIC to test and while it handled the crk sensor perfectly, it wasn't compatible with the cam sensor. BTW, I took apart a 1910 and 1911 to see what AEM changed. All they did was a simple resistance mod on the PCB to boost the crk and cam output signal voltage. Maybe one day AEM will make a FIC that works for my car but I'm not holding my breath. Thanks for the advice on the Ultimate.

Thanks for the offer Martin but I have plans for wednesday. Besides, all they could do is put an occilloscope on it and start experimenting with various resistors, shielding, etc. Problems like this are rarely easy to fix even though the fix, when found, is usually something simple. Then again, I might need a modified FIC like the Honda, Acura, Subaru and Chysler guys.


Hey Crush, I haven't tried new sensors but my current sensors work perfectly as long as the FIC isn't connected. Many people have the same problem with the FIC and the usual fix is to tap the crk signal rather than intercepting it. Of course this means losing timing retard.

When I had the 2.2K resistors installed the crk signal was too weak, which caused misfiring at high rpm. Removing the crk resistor made a huge improvement but now it appears that noise is an issue and causing less severe misfiring at high rpm. When I removed the cam resistor I got a P0335 at startup, the engine barely idled and it was undriveable. I could try different combinations of resistance on the crk and cam signals and possibly find a working combination but I'm more than a little frustrated and tired of screwing with it. I'd also need to buy an o-scope of course.

I believe you are absolutely correct. I'm convinced that the problem is a combination of signal voltage and noise on my crk/cam signals. It seems that the 2.2k resistor made my crk signal too weak. However, I don't have access to an o-scope and the 2.2k resistor mod didn't work for me at all. By far the best combination I've found has been a 2.2k resistor on the cam and no R on the crk. Maybe I'll try a 4.7K on the crk and 2.2k on the cam but I really need an o-scope to trouble shoot this and I'm fed up with trying to make this "universal" FIC work for me.

BTW, I know it's inevitable that questions will arise as to whether I wired the resistors properly, etc. I can assure you that I did, several times in fact. This is a simple problem of the FIC having limited compatibility with various crk/cam sensors and ECUs. This is why AEM has modified the FIC/6 into 4 different versions, each of them modified to work with specific vehicles crk and cam sensors and ECUs. If the FIC worked as it should, there would be no reason to add resistors between the +/- signal inputs. IMO I might just need different value resistors but I also need an o-scope and more of my valuable time. I'm undecided...

One final question for you tuners out there. How important is timing retard for my very modest boost setup? The easiest fix for me is to keep the FIC and mod my harness to only tap the crk. If timing retard is a must at 6psi, I suppose I'll either have to get an o-scope and fix it myself, pay someone like P-Tuning several hundred to trouble-shoot it or swap the FIC for an Ultimate.

Thanks to all for your help.

ScionFred

iTrader: (1)

BTW, I forgot to ask, how is closed loop tuning with the Ultimate? Is it much harder to tune than the FIC? Is it strictly static like the FIC or does it have any adaptive capability?

rhythmnsmoke

I wouldn't worry about retarding the timing until your pushing 10+ PSI.

crush02342002

iTrader: (2)

Travis please think before speaking

the fic has been used in the following apps that concern us
05-06 Tc auto and 5speed
07-up Tc auto and 5speed
xb1
xb2 5speed

thes are the ones i know about and can link a few threads to em, not many peeps have been boosting the xb2 auto that i know of but then again i dont follow the xb very much.

now tell me this travis have you seen a street tc using the ultimate that didnt have a cel? just curious cause the ultimate doesnt have an 02map that im aware of.

cburglb34

lol you two are going at it again...


travis the OP wants to be able to pass emissions and not have check engines... sorry but i have yet to see a tc with the ultimate that doesnt have a check engine like chris stated.

and also i beg to differ about the pulling timing till 10psi this is all dependant on temps, setups, and fueling

with his sidemount intercooler and 440 cc injectors i suggest atleast .5 degree retard at 6psi