First off, I apologize for the length of this. There is a long story and a lot of info behind my question, and I really do need some help here...

I just joined this forum a moment ago after literally searching the internet for WEEKS and asking shops around town for help on a problem I am having. (Chicago area).

I have had an '06 TC for about a year and although I am new at modding, I have really been learning a lot and putting a lot of money into the car since buying it. I would say my knowledge is of the "average Joe", but with the intention of learning a lot.

Most recently, I had a shop put in a TRD Supercharger, AEM FIC piggyback, Weapon R Secret Weapon Ram Air intake, NST lightweight overdrive, Alt & WP pulleys, AEM boost, air/fuel & oil press gauges. Got the car back, and after a few miles, I noticed it running crappy, as if it were choking for fuel. "Hickupping" when accelerating. Boost was not able to get up past 3, and that was really pushing the car. Power gain was lacking big time. Not only could I tell I was not getting the power boost I think I should have been getting after the mods, but the car was generally running worse than it was when it was more "stock".

I called the shop back immediately and told them what was up. They told me this was a "common problem with the TC/Supercharger set up" and recommended changing the injectors. Now, I may be new to this, but I'm not an idiot. I know this is not a "common problem". Something else is up here. I told them forget it, and I have been looking for more info ever since. I got the feeling right away the shop that did the work took me for a fool and treated me like an idiot. I am NOT HAPPY.

I took the car to another shop that was highly recommended (unfortunately, only recommended AFTER the car was in process at the first shop) and told them my story, showed them my set up, took for a test drive and asked for a new opinion. They told me several things:

1. Car was not getting enough fuel (as I suspected)
2. Main problem is FIC system is not the right system when putting a SC in a TC and that a EMS is actually needed. Said the FIC system is good for Honda's and TC's with a TURBO, but not a SC. Said it's not capable of scrambling the fuel code to anything more than what the ECM would give on Toyota's and it's essentially just giving the ECM the same codes as stock. Apparently because Toyota's fuel systems are electronically operated, where as Honda's are vacuum operated?? (something to that effect. I am going by memory here and still learning).
3. Also recommended a larger fuel pump and injectors

He also had his tuner plug into the FIC and look at the codes and tweeked a few things for me for free. The car was running much better, but not great for about a week. I was even able to get the boost as high as about 7, not where I think it could be, but better than it was at first. Now it's back to running the way it was, and sometimes WORSE. He said he was not sure how long it would last and that I really need an EMS system to get the car running correctly.

He also said he had no idea why a tuner shop who SHOULD know what they are doing did the set up they did for me with an FIC system, and did not even ask me other questions or give me other options, like recommending the injectors, larger fuel pump, asking if I want the car tuned for economy or performance, etc. This only added to my frustration with the first shop I had given several thousand dollars to, and more importantly TRUSTED with my car.

I have not done anything more yet because I have been doing tons of research, searching the web, checking forums, etc. Now this leads me to where I'm at now and to where I get even more frustrated/confused.

Granted, I no longer trust the initial shop and would like to trust the second shop, I have read where other people ARE in fact running TC's with a supercharger and putting an AEM FIC system in it. In fact, I can't seem to find many people running an EMS system with a SC, nor do I understand if there IS A TRUE advantage. So, I'm asking myself "what's the deal???? Why am I having problems????"

Someone also brought to my attention that (although incredibly stupid and unlikely, yet possible) maybe the first clownheads that modded my car did not re-flash the damn ECU with the TRD map. Because of this recent revelation, I am taking the car back to the second shop I'm trying to trust and having them double check this for me to make sure the re-flash was complete.

Someone else that I was asking opinions on this issue with also told me that I should have the injectors changed (further confirming what the second shop already told me), and also said that if I had a ram air intake added to this set up, this changes that air flow that runs across the MAF sensor, and thus requires changes to the ECM's MAF tables, but "nobody has access to change this".

HUH????? Why would WR make a ram air intake system if this requires tune changes that "nobody has access to change". Either I am seriously misunderstanding my friend (who I trust very much and is EXTREMELY knowledgeable and also has a modded TC) or this is just a bad idea.

So, I'm stuck and frustrated.

PLEASE HELP ME. I need facts and opinions. I have spent tons of money on this car, even before this recent set up, and I am serious about it, even though I am just starting to learn. PLEASE no digging at me. I have been made to feel like a fool and taken advantage of enough by tuner shops. I am a member of other forums, but figured I'd ask the same question with you guys and see if anyone here can help me. I JUST NEED HELP to get the car running properly and need to know what course of action to take at this point.

Thank you!

 

FIc will work fine for supercharged - i highly recommend **NOT** flashing the ecu with the trd tune if you plan on using a fic for tuning - it just makes things more complicated - also you should be fine with the trd injectors - im using them on my 8.5 psi turbo setup making 250 ish whp and at 78% peak idc

 

Okay.

I've been told by many people that the re-flash is an absolute necessity. In fact if you drive it without it, you run the risk of seriously screwing up the car. So, now I'm more confused...

What do you think the problem could be then??? Car runs like crap now, not getting the power I know I could/should be and seems to be choking for fuel.

 

You will need a reflash OR a proper tune using the fic or other piggyback or a standalone. Tuning with a piggyback after having the reflash makes things a bit more difficult

 

did you get bigger injectors put in with the S/C? the TRD kit comes with 440cc IIRC... that could be the main issue

 

wow...your tc is failing hard dude...

okay...look at my profile and mods listed. i am running the trd reflash, and my car runs perfect. no hiccuping, lack of boost, power whatever. 9.5 psi on the trd tune, no fic tuning done whatsoever, and i just completed a 2000 mile round trip to florida, and having driven with the supercharger overa year now, hell, i autocrossed the hell out of it today. this is using factory fuel pump and the injectors that came with the supercharger.

from the sounds of things, whatever shop installed the supercharger did a $HITTY job. was this a brand new supercharger kit? if so, why didn't you just have a good dealership install it? they would atleast stand by the work and have it fixed?

anyway, the trd supercharger kit is a full standalone kit, it is made to work and operate like the car came from the factory with it. if a complete kit is purchased new and installed properly, it will run perfectly fine, and in my case, even if you tweak it alittle with pulleys, bpv, header etc.

so i say you should get the reflash, the car needs it to operate, or toss the supercharger, get a turbo kit, cuz that supercharger might be screwed up now, or the shop that installed it messed up seriously.

 

The TRD injectors that came with the kit were installed. So, injectors can't be the issue.

Yes, the shop did a $HITTY JOB. To anyone who lives in the Illinois area, don't go to Performance Autowerks. They could not get the car running right, AND I have reason to believe they made fraudulent purchases on my credit card after I paid them.

Anyways... The TRD SC kit was purchased BRAND NEW. It has less than 500 miles on it now and is only about a month old.

I did not have the dealer install it because I had so many other mods installed at the same time. Dealer won't touch that stuff, especially when you put on the lightweight overdrive SC pulley.

I know that it's a stand alone kit and is a Toyota part and is designed to run without further tuning, which is why I am confused and leads me to believe it MUST have something to do with either the re-flash, FIC system, or possibly the ram air intake system. Could adding more air flow or possibly replacing the alt, wp or crank pulleys cause any reason for the car to run like crap if not tuned accordingly?

 

yeah dude, you shouldn't have done all those upgrades at the same time man, cuz now you have a butt load of things that could be causing the problems.

when i got my supercharger installed, that was the only thing i had done at that time because there are complications that can arise from that. so i just had it installed, and slowly broke in the supercharger over 1000 miles to make sure everything was working okay. once i was confident in the supercharger, i swapped the pulley about half a year later.

but you went and threw handful of bolt-on parts into your car and now something is wrong and you don't know what. you might have to start taking things off and putting them back to stock to find out.

first thing would be the intake, and piggyback ecu. the car should run fine with stock intake and 9.5 psi pulley if it was reflashed properly.

also, you didn't happen to put a light weight underdrive crank pulley on the car did you? that would make the supercharger spin slower and lose power.

 

Can you send me your fic map so i can take a look at it?

 

Sounds like its the fic. I would take out your fic and go get the trd reflash done at the dealer. It should run good after that. It will be a good starting point to see if you have any other problems.

 

Too many problems. Sigh.

So many people telling so many different things, granted it could be any f them.

I am overwhelmed and upset.

 

I can tell you when I got my s/c installed I had headers and 3in exhaust and my car was stock slow for a month or so. I've heard these cars need to relearn itself after the s/c install and other mods. This is just hear say tho, but after driving it for a while one day it all came together and ran good.

 

I also have Weapon R header and a cat back performance exhaust. Didn't think that would make a difference though. Had that on the car for several months prior and it ran OUTSTANDING with the header/cat back set up.

 

I'm sure it wouldn't be exhaust, since its not a turbo I wouldn't worry to much if it would be an exhaust leak. Might be a boost leak maybe, you really should video tape you driving around or just starting up. Gives some of these guru's something to see visually.

But if its putting around something isn't right. I would do what old boy said and disconnect the FIC and go from there. I have the TRD reflash and with a 9.5 pulley, intake, header and exhaust works great. Not as fast as a turbo but its quick on her toes.

 

I hear ya'. That was my goal as well. I have the 9.5 pulley also.

My next plan is to take it back to the shop I am working with now and, like you said disconnect the FIY. He's going to check and make sure the re-flash was done.

I donno how to put video footage on the web LOL.

 

its easy bro, go to youtube and sign up. Get a digital camera get the wifey, kid, friend or someone that needs a ride to video you going threw 1st and 2nd. Maybe some idle shots of the RPM gauge and a shot of the engine bay. Go onto youtube, plug your sd card/digital camera into your computer. Find where the upload button is. Press it and find the video you recorded and hit upload/download button. Then it will be some place that says post in forums copy that and paste it here... Now I think about it thats pretty complicated.

 

What id like to see - and what would really help - would e if u had a wideband connected to the fic so you could run a few datalogs on a pull - and send the datalogs to me - thatd tell me everything i need to knw

 

I'll see what I can do about that. I'll ask the guy who owns the shop I'm working with now to help me with that and see if I can get something to you.

Have to give me a few days. Next time I can get to his shop is Wednesday.

 

When i got mine reflashed they wrote "TRD reflash" on my ecu. I'm in chicago also. You need to go to a good shop, Sound Performance is one i would recommend, but its expensive its right by O'hare off of Irving and York in Bensenville.

I would also recommend you don't go to the dealer for a reflash, that would be pointless as you already have a piggyback.

 

Hey, where in Chicago are you located dude?

I will take a look for that place.