okay, I just called him... $299 / month is possible.. here's what you have to do... '04 BMW 325i Automatic, Moonroof and heated seats... you HAVE to get this option set... color = white, black or red... interior = tan leatherette... these are also required... now for the cash'ola... $5000 DOWN... 10k miles / year... and you'll also have to pay the TTL (about $2500 for the full purchase price, so figure about $1250 or so)...

here's what most people get... MSRP $35,500 '01 BMW 325i w/ leather and sport package (or parts of it)... automatic... $0 down... 15k miles / year... $580 / month...

sounds like a bad deal...

 

Go to the BMW website, it'll be $2500-$3500 down and $299-$399 a month for any 3 series w/options. A hot deal when you consider that ALL maintenance (even wear items like oil, brakes, clutch, etc.) is included in that price.

 

well, I promise that you cannot lease a 330i auto leather xenons sport package w/ MSRP of $43k for that price... $580 gets you $35,5k with TTL included... and no down... and 15k...

$299 isn't possible, because the most base car that they make will be $299 and that doesn't include charges and TTL... you might could find a model that would get out for $350, but that gets you 10k miles / year and you would have to put down every bit of that maximum... don't trust the ad, go talk to a saleman...

oh yeah, and you'll need flawless credit to match... minimum score I think is in the upper 700s.... so you'll need a long credit history, 4 or 5 active account, zero bad marks, and extremely low balances of existing loans...

it doesn't cost money, they can give you a good estimate in under an hour... let me know what you find out...

 

the last i checked with this thread it was about if there was a catch about the tC and the price and not comparing the tC to a luxury car.

 

Thanks for checking buddy, have a pop tart.

 

The catch is that even with what it offers, it's not the standout in its price range.

There's a good crop of contenders under $20k, and some absolute madness (WRX, SRT-4) just over $20k. I'm curious to see how the tC does in some head-to-head tests against its rivals.

-Justin

 

"just over" is obviously a relative term considering the base WRX msrp is $24,795..the only catch i can see is the horrendous communication Scion is displaying with it's dealerships and customers.

 

You can still get out the door in an SRT4 for less than $20k, and now that the WRX hype has calmed, I would bet it doesn't take much argument to walk one of those out the door for very close to $20k.

But under 20 you still have some serious contenders like the Sentra SER and SER Spec V, Civic Si, Mazdaspeed Protege.

-Justin

 

It's not the fastest car it's class (that's the SRT-4, easily). Of course, it's several grand cheaper than the SRT-4.

There is no catch, as far as I can tell. The quality problems mentioned both don't apply (AT ALL) to the tC, but to the xA and xB only, and mostly AREN'T actually quality problems but design problems (lack of power in something that has an ECHO engine is NOT a quality problem). Lack of headroom may be a problem, but I honestly think the Detriot News guy is full of ____ on that and other things-I'll see for sure after a test drive. This is a car that is quick (not fast) for 18 grand (and it can be made quicker for a couple grand more if you get the supercharger). Other than leather and a nav system, the car is loaded as is, too. What other car, starting for $16,500, comes with:

A/C
Power windows (with one touch up and down)/door locks (with keyless entry)/mirrors
Panorama moonroof
Rear window defogger
Digital clock
Outside temperture guage
Tilt steering wheel
Cruise control
Turn signals on the mirrors
6 speaker AM/FM/CD/MP3 stereo
Driver knee airbag
Side airbags ($650 option)
ABS
160 horsepower/163 lb ft torque 2.4 liter DOHC engine

It is front wheel drive, as is every other car currently sold under 20 grand or so.

Toyota is probably NOT making a lot of money off of any of the Scions, although I'm sure they are making some. Plus everybody has established the accessories are overpriced, so there's some significant profit there. The goal is for everybody who buys one of these to consider, five to ten years from now, when they are married and have kids and/or fat wallets, to consider a Camry or Sienna or Land Cruiser or Lexus or whatever.

 

From a dealer standpoint. I can tell you what the catch is exactly. People are creatures of habit. Whether it be a tool, a stereo part, a phone, food, TV, etc., people buy what they have bought in the past 80% of the time if they have no problems with it.

Big deal, right?

Well the average age for the new toyota purchaser has been creeping upwards for the past twenty years. Today its age 47. Thats getting up there in terms of repeat buyer potential. Toyota has been focusing on the core competency that they have excelled at for so long, the camry. They know that when you buy the Scion, that you may be looking at cool/cost/whatever now, but in 10-15 years you'll be back to get another Toyota.

So thats the catch. They'll get you now with what is quite frankly a bargain, very low-profit car that is going to be for the most part very trouble free and reliable, have a good resale value, and is safe. You can bet that 80% of you will be back to get another some time in the future.

Mike

 

Well, I am 47 and buying a tC mainly due to my past Toyotas (Camry, Corolla, and Highlander) being very reliable cars. I had looked at the Mazda 3 but Mazda cannot compare to the Toyota reputation (even with the JD Power ratings on the Scion).

Kevin

 

You are correct, and not alone, and a real-world example of the catch in action. About half of the Scions I have sold thus far are savvy repeat customers that recognize that they are getting a corolla for $4000 less. The target demographic however, is the people under age 30 that haven't necessarily bought a toyota in the past. Those of us outside the demographic are really winning with this car, as we already know what to expect from the brand. Its been a fun deal too. Now if we could only get more delivered we'd all be happy.

Mike

 

Let's not make it out as if Toyota is giving away these cars or selling at a loss.

They are sticker priced lower than some competitors, but there is also a good amount of wiggle room in the other manufacturer's prices while the Scion actually sells at te sticker price.

SE-R Spec V carries a sticker price of $17,300 and is a serious little vehicle as far as performance goes, and the Mazda 3 S is priced at $16,400. Tiburon is $16,249.

The tC is certainly a nice looking car that should provide good performance and will certainly be a good value, but it's not so far from its competitors to make it a no contest decision for buyers. Subtract $3000 or drop a 200hp motor in it and it becomes the clear choice, though.

-Justin

 

How wise is it to buy a first run of a new car? I have been told many times that I should wait for a 2nd or 3rd gen..but I want this TC so bad :twisted:

 

I may end up waiting a year because of money. But if money was not a problem then I would probably buy it in August or September, After I have test driven it, read many reviews, and the bugs are known.

 

That's why they have the warranty. Right? or nah :?

Better not be any major problems!! If so, they better fix it for FREE!

 

I wouldn't hesitate to buy a first model year product from a Japanese manufacturer.

-Justin

 

Isn't it true that Scion tC will be close to a $500 loser per copy in its base form to Toyota? One of the guys I know that works as a Scion field rep said something like that. They want it as inexpensive so you will want to add accessories and Love Toyota so you will keep buying them. Good for us. Heck the main comp is Civic,Mazda 3, and Focus ( Ugh!! ). The tC is by far the better deal. Heck a fully trimmed S Mazda 3 is around $20k, the civic is almost $18k and a focus is one of the worst production cars in human history. Yes you can play with it but dang it is poorly built.

tC all the way
:D

 

plus you get them buying your brand......

What happens when the Tc owner grows up & gets married & needs a family car? Had good experiance with a Toyota (Scion)? Might as well look at that Camry or 4 runner.

$50 says that the Tc will have less wide spread problems then the new Cobalt or V6 mustang. They are introducing in 2005. I also bet the resale value will be higher than those two down the road.

 

If they're losing money selling the tC at a similar price to what competing cars go for, it's they're own fault.

The person may have been speaking about 'invoice' price, which is just a sales tools of dealerships and often has very little to do with what the dealer actually pays the manufacturer for the car.

-Justin