And what does the 160hp scion tc offer over the 220 (actually its more like 260-280hp) of the neon srt4?

 

its 2928lbs and its totally a diferent type of car compared to the neon.

 

Ok, people keep bring up the neon... IT'S A NEON OK?!?! No matter how much you dress it up, or how much engine you put in it, it's still a neon. How can you compare a european designed/Japanese built Toyota/Scion product with a neon... give me a break. Do you want a REAL car, or just something to impress your friends with for a little while until your neon breaks down...

 

[quote="Pablo xB"]Ok, people keep bring up the neon... quote]

Agreed.. to a point. The neon doesn't belong in the same class. The neon is more of a econobox with a SH*T load of power. The TC looks like a RSX rival. at thousands of dollars less may I add.

 

well said!

 

Last I checked, they were both small, 4 seater, front wheel drive, 2,900pound, $19k, 4 cylinder cars.

How are these different types of cars?


Instead of presenting me with vauge arguments about european design, can someone present some features the TC has, or design advantages the TC has over the neon? Does the TC even have a limited slip diff?

As it is, the neon has proven itself very capable both in SCCA solo2 competition and even did well in the one lap of america.

Ive just seen people sporting all sorts of wood for the Scion TC, so I was just wondering why. From the specs I see I don't see anything spectacular about it.

Im not a neon owner or anything. I'm a z06 corvette owner in the market for a Scion XA. weird huh? =)

 

The basic difference is personal choice.... Do you want a throw back to the muscle car or are you looking for something a little more sophisticated....

 

I have already made up my mind about both....I will be neither and go buy a xB

I betcha will have a higher resale value ratio in the long run compared to the Neon.....Neons have one of the worst resale values in the nation

 

they are both great cars, but toyota has reliabilty. if i didn't get all my maintence services for free i would probably get a srt-4. i hate that people call it just a neon. it is completely different then the neon. the srt-4 will walk all over evo's and wrx's, so it is not just a neon.

 

Walk all over Evo's and WRX's? in terms of what? Drag racing? Yea your right it would.....but drag racing is over rated......The Evo and the WRX would double penetrate ___ wrap the SRT-4 on the twisties and on a rally course....thats real racing

 

actually the SRT4 has proven its self to be just as quick as the WRX on autocross courses (probably quicker), though not quicker than the EVO or WRX-STI

I speak from extensive autocross experience, every weekend for the last 2 years, various divisional level events etc. Not just "omg onetime I saw a guy get beat by this car those cars must suck"


=)

Im hoping the SCION XA will be competitive in HSTOCK, though I think the BMW 318 and MINI Cooper will still rule.

but since I cant even find USED mini coopers under like $19k...screw that =)

 

when i say walk all over the wrx and evo, i am talking about real life driving on the street. with some minor suspension mods i am sure the srt-4 can keep up with the wrx and maybe the evo.

 

to answer the initial question: the weight of the tC is 2,900.

 

Oddly enough, based on standard features, body style/dimensions/weight and the upcoming supercharger option, your best apples-to-apples comparison is the Mercedes-Benz Sport coupe..the "entry level" C230 Kompressor coupe/hatch to be exact.

Before you flame, check it out yourself and compare.....

http://www.mbusa.com/brand/models/C230K.jsp

There may be a few features here and there that don't match exactly, and of course, no one in their right mind at Mercedes would even dare invite such a comparison, but take a good, close look at features, specs, dimensions, engine (again, I'm referring to TC WITH s/c.)...and consider that a) we don't know what extra options will be offered for the TC upon release, and B) that out of the gate, the Tc is pretty damn loaded for 30% less than this thing, even if you assume the s/c option will elict a $20K price for the Tc.

But don't belive what I say...see for yourselves.

 

More food for thought;
Here are MB's performance numbers for the C230:
Curb weight 3,250 lb/1,475 kg (manual), 3,280 lb/1,490 kg (automatic) vehicle.

engine: 1,796-cc intercooled supercharged DOHC 16-valve inline-4. Dual balance shafts. High-pressure die-cast alloy cylinder block. Alloy heads.

Net power 189 hp @ 5,800 rpm

Net torque 192 lb-ft @ 3,500-4,000 rpm

Performance

Acceleration1 0-60 mph in 7.2 seconds (manual), 7.5 seconds (automatic)


Okay, so there you have it. a vehicle with VERY similar dimensions/ features, and options... yet 300 lbs heavier.

assuming the Tc with S/C's torque numbers go up 20%, as it would seems the hp number's are (N/A-160 hp. S/C-200hp verified via dividing NA hp by .80, or 20%)
you get this: NA tq-163 ft/lbs. S/C tq (assumed) 203ft/lbs.

Factor in the 300 lb curb weight difference, it's likely the Scion will, with supercharger, break into the 6 second 0-60 range, from the factory. And that's before that s/c's boost output gets tweaked up a notch or two. I know I'LL do it.

Not bad for 20K.

And Screw the SRT-4. After they beat you at the track, you can give all their girlfriends and groupies a nice phat ride home while the SRT-$ pilots're at the side of the road, waiting for a AAA tow truck and wondering why $19k went out the window.

 

the mb coupe is pretty close to the tC. would rather have a tC compared to those.

 

2'900 lbs!!! For a car that small!!? That's too much weight!! C'mon Toyota!! The Celica GT-S is 2'500 lbs!! This much weight just crushed my interest in the car. I hope this number is incorrect. If it were more like 2'400 - 2'600 lbs, like it looks like it should be, this would be a rocket with the SC and other mods. The Celica GT-S's downfall was crap gearing and a narrow power band. It looks like the tC's will be weight! Toyota is going to stop making the Celica just so they can narrowly miss the mark again!? Keep trying guys. I guess us Toyota fans will have to keep reaching into the 90's for exciting Toyota's. I'll stick with my All Trac for now.

 

final word:

we tell this to people all the time when they try and compare something in the Toyota line to Dodge.

"Ma'am, Sir, have you ever looked up dodge in the dictionary? It means to avoid."

 

Okay, maybe I was a little harsh. After getting over the initial shock of the tC's weight, I did some thinking. I used to own a 93' Prelude Si with similar specs (2'900lbs, 2.3L engine, 160hp, 155tq, 5-spd) and it was pretty quick with intake, header & exhaust. The tC should move out swiftly with similar mods + SC. Besides, it does look cool, and it is a Toyota.





2000 Celica GT-S (sold)
1988 Celica All Trac (rare rocket)

 

dude, given that new cars come with warranties, you are going to have a hard time convincing me to give up 120hp and an LSD just so I can have slightly higher reliability or better looks.

you do know the 04 SRT4s are putting like 235hp to the wheels right? thats like 260-280hp at the crank....running 13s in the 1/4 mile stock. and EASY to make way more power.

I just don't think the Tc has anything to offer in this category. If it came in like the celica at 2,600lbs I wouldn't be saying this.