^ ^ Exactly.

alracer - before you try to help people on here, know the information you are putting out. just some friendly advice for next time, because just because you have camber doesn't mean you have toe problems.

Cya

 

So it is true...you (and I) do learn something new everyday. lol

 

Who exactly are you talking to?

Cya

 

to killerxromances lowering your car will result in camber changes as well as toe if you dont want to listen to my advice than do not all i said was to take it to a shop and get it checked out. if you dont care to listen thats fine.

 

well i got a cheap front set from goldline, it wouldnt hurt to throw thows on, i just havent done so yet, well actually for the past year... the fronts not bad for my 2 inch drop, the rear could probably use a kit though...

 

If you lower your car .5'', you are not going to have toe problems. Even dropping it with df210's, like i have, you are not going to have toe problems. If toe was enough to cause problems than a lot of df210 and s-tech owners would have chewed up tires way before now. Camber doesn't equal toe, nor vise versa. Your advice is fine but your advice isn't correct if you are telling others if you drop your car with springs at any rate, you will have toe. Thats incorrect information i'm sorry.

Cya

 

For those who don't know what toe is:

Toe-Out (Negative Toe) is a condition where the front of the wheel is farther from the geometric centerline than the rear of the same wheel. Toe-In (Positive Toe) is a condition where the front of the wheel is closer to the geometric centerline than the rear of the same wheel.

Lowering your car, as i said, does not cause this.

Camber is the "inward"/"outward" tilt of a wheel, "inward" being negative and "outward" being positive. Theres a big difference between Camber and Toe, and lowering your car does not cause toe.

Toe cause huge amounts of tread loss in a short given time frame once toe has been caused. Camber, does not harm tread loss as long as its within reason. Sixdegree camber would eat the tires up pretty fast, but as long as you keep it under 2.5degree camber for a daily driver you will notice virtually no difference and handling will be improved significantly.

Cya

 

i have never said camber and toe are the same thing. now the tc and xb have totaly diffrent suspension's tc uses a tierod to adjust toe because it is not of equal lenght as the lower arm's your toe will be changed if the car is lowered this can be adjusted simply enough. camber is a totaly diffrent adjustment there is a cam bolt on the upper arm so you can adjust camber. the front on the other hand has almost zero adjustabilty so if it need be adjusted there are cam bolts that can be used for the front. the reason why some coilover kits include camber plates is so you can adjust for track or street use two totaly diffrent thing's if you go to the nitto tire home page they have a exclent download about suspension change's and how they affect tire wear. now if you dont care about your tire's or preformance of your suspension do as you will i am just trying to explain the importance of a proporly setup suspension. also 2.5 degree of neg camber is a lot of neg camber neg 1 to 1.5 is about normal any more is going to start to wear on your tire's now you can rotate them but this is not a fix for a proporly adjusted suspension.

 

2.5 degrees is a lot of camber, but its still a set up you can do for a street car without much downfall. depends on your tire/rim set up and obviously, springs or coilovers. i know the tC has a different suspension set up, but i have never heard of any car having toe by lowering it 1.5 to 2.5''. Including the tC. Infact, i know someone that lowered his tC with s-techs and he has had them on for 9,000 miles with no more tread loss than if it were stock suspension. If he were to have toe, his tires would be trashed a long time before that. And no, he didn't have "toe corrected" because there was no toe to correct.

I speak from experience, and i have never seen a car dropped 1.5-2.5'' with toe issues.

Cya

 

I lowered my cavalier 4 times. Every time I measured the toe, camber and caster. The camber and caster never changed. The toe changed every time and had to be re-adjusted. It is not necessarily the drop that messes up the toe, but the fact that you have to take apart the front suspension and when it is re-assembled it is very difficult to get everything exactly back at the same point as it was without changing the angles a little bit here and there.

 

cam bolts to adjust camber for the front are cheap most shop's only charge around 50 to 100 bucks for an alignment why would you not take the car in to have this done. if you are going to lower your car then put on high preformance tire's then not get an alignment thats like buying a turbo kit and not hooking up an oil line sure it will work for a little while but you are shorting the life of your part's when some one is asking advice and wants to know what to do to fix his alignment everyone says dont worry about it or i have like 3 set's of tire's so i dont care you are giving bad advice to people if some thing is easy to fix like this you should fix it not say just live with it

 

https://www.scionlife.com/forums/vie...937489#2937489

 

wow! and s-techs arent even that low. you need alignment asap! ...and new tires. =P

 

Since apparently there is misinformation being spread, the reality is this:

If you lower your car and change your camber, you will have also, in doing so, changed your toe. Toe will eat up tires and also can cause unpredictable handling. Anytime you screw around with suspension on a strut type car, you need to have an alignment done. If you don't do this, perhaps you may get lucky and get away with it, but, again, camber change causes toe change. Alignment is extremely important both in terms of wear characteristics as well as handling.

 

because no one asnwered here it goes again..

i need some help guys...

i heard even if i get 4wheel alligment then that wont last too long.. i go over on the rails, and thats it... i could go to the shop every week to get my alligment fixed??

i have hotchkis springs.. and 1 year old tires and they are horrible.. the inner side is almost flat!!! 1-2 months and i have to buy new tires... so :

if i get camber kit thats gonna help??? i have neg camber already.. but i can set the camber kit from 0 to neg 3.

so if i have neg camber why should i need the kit what i can set only to the negative way??? to get mooooore neg camber?

im not sure whats the best number for this camber thing.. maybe neutral is the best or a slightly negative.. i dont know, but my tires are being eaten alive.. so how can i get less negative camber? and i need a solution wich is LAST for months, years..

i need this camber kit or not? its last longer than a regular alligment setup at the toyota dealership?


or i should just get tire rotation at every oil change???

oh btw i have positive camber on the front is that normal?


how can i check how much degree i have on my wheels?

 

I am having the same problem. I lowered my car using TRD springs and now have -2.0 and -2.3 degrees on the left and right rear respectively. With directional tires these things are being chewed up. The inside of the tire is nearly bald (I didnt think the camber was so bad....but it is). The tech is saying he can't adjust the rear camber (even though everyone is saying it's adjustable) and that I need a rear camber kit.

To everyone who is saying lowering your car won't cause camber.....you are absolutely 100% incorrect. Lowering your car 0.0000001 inch causes at least some camber. You have to make a sacrifice....allow some camber (which will give you slightly better cornering, but also wear your tire unevenly). If you have a daily driver...you want your camber to be 0.0 to 0.5 degrees...no more.

 

umm i dono whats up with your tech but TRD springs arnt that low, so getting them back to correct specs isn't hard. i think you need to go get it aligned el swear. i had my trd springs aligned and they were back to spec and im drunk and recovering from Santa barbra . OH yea i had both TRD's and Teins.

 

get an alignment.