Dude, I used to sell cars for Freeman Mazda in Irving. Mr. Freeman has a Toyota dealer in Hurst, about a 25 min drive from Dallas with no traffic. I highly reccomend that family owned dealership. I also worked for Toyota of Fort Worth, and they could not pay be enough to buy a car from them. As far as I understand Toyota of Dallas is pretty shady too. Richardson might not be that bad, but I can definitly vouch for Freeman dealerships.
Go to Freeman Toyota, they will get you a car, and remain firm on the fact that you want nothing on it. I can almost gaurentee that if they cant find one barebones, they will give you whatever junk it has added for no charge.

Same thing happened to me when I got my 2011, the only one they could find in manual and grey had floor mats and the protection package. I did not pay for these items. (not bought at Freeman, bought from a local family owned dealer in AR, but I would have gone to Freeman Hurst had I had the time off to drive there.)

Someone said above about possibly needing the protection package? No, its junk. I have at least 15+ rock chips in my front bumper after 9k miles, just like everyone else. It is basicly just a wax and scotchgaurd on the seats, which you could do yourself for alot less than the $349 they charge. The only visable thing you get out if the package is these clear triangle shaped stickers just before the rear wheels. I did not even notice them untill I waxed the car and had to scrape the left over wax from the edge of the stickers with a toothpick. More like a PITA than a "feature" if you ask me.

 

My most recent visit yesterday to check out the Katzkin in person, the salesman said their dealer charges a "dealer preparation fee"...and had no comment when I sheepishly asked: "isn't that already included in the delivery fee per Scion websight?".

This is after I busted him twice already on other bull____ charges like the vehicle inventory tax, complete with the page # from the dealers manual it can be found in saying customers don't pay this.

Why are salesman so damn stupid as to think they can continue to pull the wool over the buyers eyes after you have clearly done your homework?
Example:
Me: did you know Apple makes an iphone 8?
Him: No they don't.
Me: I own Apple, I'm the CEO(extend hand with drivers license)
Him: they don't make an iphone 8
Me:

 

Its such crap that these dealers can just add something on like an "ozone protection" package that is either bull or does nothing and charge anything they want for it. I Wish I could go to work and tell my boss that I will be charging him a "see my smiling face" fee. ;)

 

Up here some dealers stick to this "pure pricing" thing. While others went deep to get a sale.

The discounts I got were all weather mats, spoiler, hood deflector tossed in. Half price for rust module. They couldn't budge on leather + security since thats "factory installed"

Wheel locks is standard up here which I love.. And the rear wiper too!

 

Leather is factory installed in Canadia? Lucky you...how much was it by the way converted to American please?

Over here I saw from the same dealer one Katzkin leather TC added for $1490 while the one next to it was discounted to $1190. Calling the place where they get it done I was quoted $1095.

The $1190 being taxed at 6.25 vs 8.25 makes the difference smaller too, and I don't have to sit around all day waiting for it, but some dealership clown will be driving my car before I do...a dilemma indeed. Finanacing won't apply this time around

 

so I had a interesting experience at the local scion dealership. Mind you I have never shopped Toyota or Scion before so I don't really know what to expect when I visit a dealer.

First off I started by calling in and looking for a TC RS 7.0, the lady who picked up the phone said they had 1 in stock. She then asked me what color I was looking for. I guess that should have been a instant flag, but I explained to her the car only comes in yellow. I then told her I was only looking for a M/T car. She said, well lucky you this one just happens to be a manual car.

So I drive about 30 min to the dealership after work all excited. I get there and I see the TC RS7.0 parked out on this pedestal. I am like, awesome. When I get into the dealership she hands me to their "scion specialist".


When I told the "specialist" the comment the lady made to me about what color I was interested in, he laughed and goes "well the employee turnover rate here is so high, shes probably new and doesn't know much about the Release Series Cars". He then informs me that the car they have is Automatic, and all the scions (2 on the lot) are Automatic so I won't beable to test drive the 6 spd MT. Sucks. He pauses and follows up telling me that the TC RS 7.0 does not come in stick. Sigh.

I ended up test driving the AT TC RS 7.0 but I will wait till I can test drive a MT one so I can figure out if its really the car for me. Jeeze I don't understand how people can work at a dealership and be so uninformed about their products.

 

I believe the 7.0 is available in schtick...I assume you knew that, hence the "sigh"? Yea, they are clowns to the nth degree. On my manual drive the guy said he worked there for only FOUR months...so he couldn't tell me if the new style TC was new for 2012 or 2011. Four months!

Hey jackass, if you're selling a product, perhaps you should brief yourself on the product...nah, that's asking too much. What is the point of even having a salesman then? They are 100% useless 100% of the time.

 

I can agree with you on this last statement........ somewhat. I feel I should explain to you more about how it works and maybe they (salesman) won’t upset you as much. From all of your posts, it seems you are in fact a little disturbed by the salesman, and that’s ok. The only profession people hate more than a car salesman is an IRS auditor.

A "show room" sales person at a new car dealer is little more than a pawn on a chess board. They have no authority what so ever to discount anything, mark up anything or change any prices up or down, period. When I was selling cars, I watched countless guys get fired because they would tell a customer they could get them X amount off sticker. There is a very high turnover rate in the car business because of all the pressure to sell sell sell. In order to learn a new product, it takes time. You need to study, you need to read, but when you are faced with "sell X amount of cars by the 15th or you’re fired!" Are you going to spend those 15 days reading? No, you are going to go out on the lot and chase down every person you see so you can sell those cars, and feed your family. Frankly, the typical new car buyer, (Women over 30 and men over 35. Odviously, these are NOT scion stats, these are Toyota, which they sell a hell of alot more of) does not care how much HP the car has, what packages it comes in, where it is made. They care about how it looks, gas milage, and price, so why would a salesman waste his time learning everything about the 20 diffrent models in an infanite number of configurations they could come in?
Most people get in the car business for 1 of 2 most common reasons: 1) The promise of huge, easy $$$ which in fact is far from the truth. You have to be willing to hussle, work 70hrs+ a week, and do ALOT of VERY uncomfertable cold calling to make money as a new salesman. Life does get alot easier once you have established yourself, but that could take over a year. Or 2) they got fired/laid off and REALLY needed a job. Car dealers will give ANYONE a job at sales, why? because 99% of salesman work off 100% commission and bonuses. If they don’t sell, they get fired and the dealer has lost nothing, if they do sell, then the dealer wins.

If you would like to be angry at someone over price/options/pressure from the salesman, go knock on the "glass box" in the rear corner (usually) of the showroom floor. The sales managers are the guys who decide to order every car with the "magical protection package" and whatever else they think will not only sell, but offer the largest profit margin. This is also the group of clowns that is threating each sales person daily to produce sales, or get fired. This is why you get stalked down by salesman; this is why car salesman calls you 3 times a day, the day after you were at the dealership. The sales manager is also the person who has the authority to increase or decrease the price. If you think when you sit down to negotiate price, it is you against the salesman, you are DEAD WRONG. "Usually", it is you and the salesman, against the sales manager. (unless you have a trade in, then it’s you against the salesman, the sales manager, and the used car manager. Please people, don’t trade your cars in, just don’t....)

But it doesent end there.... IF you are REALLY ANGRY about the way the car buisness works, track down the GM. He is the guy threatining the sales managers every day to get their salesman to sell more cars, and make higher profits, or "I will fire your a$$!"

To avoid the dumb new guy, and you are at a Toyota/Scion dealer, just ask for the Scion manager!

NOTE: I say "usually" because; most salesmen don’t give a crap how much you buy the car for, as long as you buy one, because the dealership will offer them a bonus for X amount of cars sold for either the total month or the day. When I worked for Toyota, the standard Saturday bonus was $300 cash for 3 cars sold that day, and $100 cash to whoever sold the most that day. Also, an extra $1000 for the top salesman of the month as long as they also sold over 30 cars.
Now, let’s do some math: Typically, the salesman is going to make 25% of the PROFIT margin above invoice. So, on a new car, at $200 over invoice, he makes $50 ($50 is also the dealer minimum payment). At $500 over he makes $125. So, let’s say the salesman sells 4 cars on a Saturday, all for $200 over invoice, and each sale took 2 hours because there was very little back and forth; Plus he was the top seller, he made $600 for the day. Now if he would have fought with every customer over a few hundred bucks, for 4 hours, there is no way he can sell more than 3 cars that day now. He will simply run out of time. Furthermore, the profit margin on a new car is TINY! The profit margin on a 2011 Corolla LE with a radio is $1232. If they discount it $1000, which most people would think is NOT a good discount at all, the salesman is only going to make $58....

Think of how long a typical car sale takes... Do you really think it is worth it to the salesman to fight with you over $300 for an extra hour+ when all that is going to make him is another $75 in his pocket? He could be done with you, and out selling another car in hopes of a bonus, which will make him more money than fighting with each and every customer for table scraps. It is the sales manager, who is being forced by the GM, that FORCES that salesman to go back and forth with you for hours over a few hundred bucks.

If you want a hassle free salesman, you have 2.5 options: 1) go to the dealerships website and send an email to the online sales guy. This is one of only 2 (usually) sales people who HAVE the authority to discount cars, but he has his limits. Usually, it is up to $300-200 over invoice. If you want lower, guess who the internet sales guy has to go talk too? The sales manager. 2) your second option is to call the dealership and ask for the Fleet manager. Don’t be fooled, he is just a glorified salesman, but he also has the authority to discount, just like the internet guy. (I was a fleet manager, and it is the only time I truly enjoyed selling cars) However, using these options, DO NOT expect these guys to know anything about the cars. These guys sell 40-50 cars a month, they don’t have time to read, or learn about jack. They are also ineligible to get the monthly bonus *sadface* Option 2.5) only pertains to Scions, and dealers that have Scion managers. IF they do, ask for that guy and your experience will be much more pleasant.

Lastly, for the ultimate car buying experience....... Learn on your own about the car/price by using KBB, Edmunds, and manufactures websites. Then use a car buying service. Most credit unions and some banks have these programs. You will pay a few hundred over invoice, and in some cases, you don’t even have to set foot in the dealership. The car buying service will contact the fleet manager, and they will do the rest.

Good Goo, I am tired of typing!

 

Wow what a write up Druidiron!
When I bought my tC I dealt with the Scion sales rep (aka Brand Manager). He did a lot of talking with his manager for discounts and what not but I dealt with him because he knows everything.

One dealership I went to I spoke with a Toyota rep who knew the tC inside out but stuck to pure pricing... And then there was another dealership where the Toyota rep was clueless on the tC!

 

Fair enough write-up Druid. Actually I am aware of how salesmen work...which is why I tell them up front within the first minute of my arrival: "I'm just here to look, if you see someone else come in, go for them instead, I do not want to waste your time." "If I have a question I'll find you if you aren't busy".

They offer to let me take a random TC home for the day: "no thanks, I'd simply be putting miles on someone else's car and I'm not buying anytime soon anyway".

When it comes time to negotiate, I do it over the phone. I tell them what I want and make an offer. I tell them to take it or leave it, period. It's worked for my last 4 new cars, down to the cent.

 

My dealer "supposedly" sent for the car I wanted with the options I wanted. I show up to do paperwork and there is no spoiler and no fog lights. Further more they want me to pay labor costs to have them installed. I said I would pay for the part but not the labor...they didn't go for it. I said forget the foglights(140.00 labor cost), I would buy them and install it myself. I only got charged(that they explained)25 bucks to install the spoiler. Finding out what some of you guys got for free makes me want to go b*&ch slap the salesman. It was funny too when I called and asked to talk to the sales manager and they gave me to "MY" salesman, wouldn't have known it was a lie if he hadn't sold me the car!!

 

My RS has those. I wonder if it has the protection package?

 

paint protection is indeed garbage......I have the new hood to prove it. Its the only product I know that involves you wasting your money even if it does its job.

 

for new year models--------->very pure especially if the dealership is publicly owned
private dealership may drop the price but risk loosing the scion license
Also if they have some kind of discount then it has to remain like that for all Scions they sell for a given month.

 

I beleive so. Go pour some ketchup on your seats, let it sit there for a few hours and see if it soaks in. If it does, you dont have the package.

KIDDING! Please dont do that...lol

 

Did you already buy the fog lights? If not, save yourself some money and go to TRDsparks.com,

or http://www.fastscions.com/scion-tc2-...ghts-2011.aspx

Very simple install

 

Common sense would tell anyone that this ^^ is the way to do it. Problem with most dealerships is, if the sales manager sees ANYONE out on the lot without a sales person attached to their hip, they throw a fit. Which is why some places you go, you tell him that, and the salesman hangs out anyway. That and 99% of people, who buy a car that day, start out with “I am just looking, I don’t want to waste your time.”

It seemed at the start of my post I was trying to bash you, I did not realize this until after I read it again. That was NOT my intention.
I figured most people have no idea how it all really works, (I sure didn’t before I started doing it myself) and what better area to explain it in, than this thread.

Personally, I take a little different approach based off my experience, and I do not recommend this, use what I said in the last post! This method requires a lot of patience, stubbornness and an absolute knowledge that the dealer WILL do just about anything to sell a car. If you think for even a second they will not accept your offer, that’s when you start to compromise, and they will win.
I remember what it was like being that new guy salesman. It blows. When I was looking for my car, I called the dealer that was reputable and known for good customer service ahead of time, sweet talked the operator, and asked her who the newest salesman was. When I got there, that's who I asked for. I even wasted for him to finish with someone else. I already knew exactly what I wanted, and was not willing to budge on it. I had test drove one before at another dealer that has a HORRIBLE reputation, and I did that on purpose, screw them, it did not bother me at all to waste their time.
And of course at the good dealer, there was still a fight with the sales manager over the fact I was not willing to pay for ANYTHING that I did not ask for. About an hour back and forth of “Pay 75% of the cost for the add on's,” to my reply of “no.” over and over and over, until it was 0% of cost for the added junk. All the while, with my feet on the desk…. lol

The best part is after the paperwork is signed and the down payment check cashed, I get to tell them I used to do this for a living. The look is priceless!

 

Druidiron, haven't bought them yet but plan on it from Fastscions. Am probably doing intake and exhaust first though.

 

I took no offense to your post and actually did pick up a couple tips too.

 

No! It helps if there are several Toyota dealers in your area (there are 7 in my area) and you can still negotiate on price!! I use a $850.00 off promo coupon back in June that one dealer had going on that month and I use that to my advantage at the dealer closer to my house. They honored it cuz otherwise I would of just went to the other dealer. It was only $850 off but it was better than nothing.