supercharger for Scion
02-09-2005, 02:57 AM
#42
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hmmm i highly highly doubt it cuz if turbo kit makers are only boosting 7psi but could easily boost 11 or 12 why would they only boost 6 or 7 or maybe 8? and el prototypes blew theirs with 8 lbs of boost. .........well they didnt but another shop that was doing non motor work decided to have fun with it and they blew it with only 8lbs boost. allblackxb blew his with i believe 7lbs boost.
can i see some sort of dyno? or 1/4 slip timesheet.
From my knowledge of boost and these motors 12 psi daily will kill it. i know i know only a 400 dollar motor but still a pain in the bum if it ever happens.
if i keep this motor i will run the p.e. s/c with header , custom cold air , full exhaust , and a nice bit of headwork. i think the motor with these mods can come up to about 160 or so whp. but just the header exhaust and s/c i highly doubt it having soo much power. i know it's alot faster than h.e.i. but still. i'm just one of the kinds of people that needs proof.
and the reason all the motors have blown was not lack of proper tuning it was the rod breaking near the wrist pin
can i see some sort of dyno? or 1/4 slip timesheet.
From my knowledge of boost and these motors 12 psi daily will kill it. i know i know only a 400 dollar motor but still a pain in the bum if it ever happens.
if i keep this motor i will run the p.e. s/c with header , custom cold air , full exhaust , and a nice bit of headwork. i think the motor with these mods can come up to about 160 or so whp. but just the header exhaust and s/c i highly doubt it having soo much power. i know it's alot faster than h.e.i. but still. i'm just one of the kinds of people that needs proof.
and the reason all the motors have blown was not lack of proper tuning it was the rod breaking near the wrist pin
02-09-2005, 03:49 AM
#43
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Originally Posted by hotbox05
well i'm thinking high 13's cuz 145whp will be mid 14's .
Sure the xB is light, but I'd wager that it's not optimal for drag racing (traction, motor mounts, etc).
Sorry, I don't mean to be a pest or a nay-sayer.
02-09-2005, 05:16 AM
#45
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Originally Posted by squarepants
hmm engine swap is not a bad idea,wish i could fit a 2005 corolla 1.8 vvt-i in my box with the xb weighting 2400 lbs that sucka would fly.......... 
with trd sc header , exhaust and a custom cold air intake think like 170+ whp. and more tq than a 2zz. oh and the 1zz tranny is the same case as the xb so... bolt in.
02-09-2005, 05:18 AM
#46
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Originally Posted by Derk-xB
Originally Posted by hotbox05
well i'm thinking high 13's cuz 145whp will be mid 14's .
Sure the xB is light, but I'd wager that it's not optimal for drag racing (traction, motor mounts, etc).
Sorry, I don't mean to be a pest or a nay-sayer.
02-09-2005, 05:19 AM
#47
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Originally Posted by squarepants
hmm engine swap is not a bad idea,wish i could fit a 2005 corolla 1.8 vvt-i in my box with the xb weighting 2400 lbs that sucka would fly..........
https://www.scionlife.com/forums/vie...r=asc&start=25
02-09-2005, 06:57 AM
#48
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Originally Posted by Minsk99
Originally Posted by squarepants
hmm engine swap is not a bad idea,wish i could fit a 2005 corolla 1.8 vvt-i in my box with the xb weighting 2400 lbs that sucka would fly..........
https://www.scionlife.com/forums/vie...r=asc&start=25
02-09-2005, 07:31 AM
#49
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Originally Posted by hotbox05
Originally Posted by Minsk99
Originally Posted by squarepants
hmm engine swap is not a bad idea,wish i could fit a 2005 corolla 1.8 vvt-i in my box with the xb weighting 2400 lbs that sucka would fly..........
https://www.scionlife.com/forums/vie...r=asc&start=25
02-09-2005, 08:58 AM
#50
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nah probably not , just ya know do it quick . and add stereo into her car at the same time just say the extra weight made it slower. lol , ha ha. do it man easy swap. swap out ecu's and everything. tranny's too , damn plop one in pluck one out.
02-09-2005, 10:41 AM
#51
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Originally Posted by hotbox05
hmmm i highly highly doubt it cuz if turbo kit makers are only boosting 7psi but could easily boost 11 or 12 why would they only boost 6 or 7 or maybe 8? and el prototypes blew theirs with 8 lbs of boost. .........well they didnt but another shop that was doing non motor work decided to have fun with it and they blew it with only 8lbs boost. allblackxb blew his with i believe 7lbs boost.
can i see some sort of dyno? or 1/4 slip timesheet.
From my knowledge of boost and these motors 12 psi daily will kill it. i know i know only a 400 dollar motor but still a pain in the bum if it ever happens.
if i keep this motor i will run the p.e. s/c with header , custom cold air , full exhaust , and a nice bit of headwork. i think the motor with these mods can come up to about 160 or so whp. but just the header exhaust and s/c i highly doubt it having soo much power. i know it's alot faster than h.e.i. but still. i'm just one of the kinds of people that needs proof.
and the reason all the motors have blown was not lack of proper tuning it was the rod breaking near the wrist pin
can i see some sort of dyno? or 1/4 slip timesheet.
From my knowledge of boost and these motors 12 psi daily will kill it. i know i know only a 400 dollar motor but still a pain in the bum if it ever happens.
if i keep this motor i will run the p.e. s/c with header , custom cold air , full exhaust , and a nice bit of headwork. i think the motor with these mods can come up to about 160 or so whp. but just the header exhaust and s/c i highly doubt it having soo much power. i know it's alot faster than h.e.i. but still. i'm just one of the kinds of people that needs proof.
and the reason all the motors have blown was not lack of proper tuning it was the rod breaking near the wrist pin
its been running 12 psi since October....
if you keep the motor we will have the same setup...(minus the head work...i notice you didn't say anything about rods!!!)
the PE unit come with an intake (will b making a new one because it looks like crap in there.
i find it hard to believe the rods crack at the wrist pins, the rods have an offset crank bearing to reduce the stress on the rods....
just do it and become a believer
02-09-2005, 11:17 AM
#52
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actually the offset crank reduces friction on the piston wrings against the cylinder walls. They used the offset crank as a way of gaining 15% better fuel economy and getting less wear on the walls and rings. .... but the weird off camber setup creates an odd stress when pushed down too hard , too fast . resulting in breakage.
If I were to run a pe s/c I wouldnt boost 11 or 12 psi , at 7 psi the rods will not have problems , so I would boost at most 8psi. but the kit is 7psi and since I wont be changing the pulley the psi created by the supercharger stays the same .
I'm tellin ya man go to www.howstuffworks.com and look up how a supercharger works. I know the pe comes with an intake but it's sucking hot air.
I'm not arguing to argue I think you're a cool guy I just think something isnt quite right , perhaps the boost gauge is hooked up to an incorrect vacumm line? Who knows all i'm saying is if these motors could safely run with 11 or 12 psi wouldnt all the turbo and supercharger kits boost at that level? What other upgrades have you done? If u are pushing 11 or 12 psi you would need massively improved fuel and spark tuning. more than what comes in a pe kit.
hmm I just wanna see the dyno lol.
If I go f.i. with the 1nz I will run a pe s/c . That's if I keep the 1nz, I just see alot more potential with the 1zz powerplant. I mean right out of the box it has almost the same hp as most f.i. 1nz kits are making. Not to mention the power of a modded TRD supercharged 1zz. a modded s/c'd 1zz can easily have 200 whp . and around 170tq.
Oh and the reason I would not be adding rods is 1 cracking the motor , 2 there are no rods made for this motor and they would have to be custom fabbed. alot of money.
If I were to run a pe s/c I wouldnt boost 11 or 12 psi , at 7 psi the rods will not have problems , so I would boost at most 8psi. but the kit is 7psi and since I wont be changing the pulley the psi created by the supercharger stays the same .
I'm tellin ya man go to www.howstuffworks.com and look up how a supercharger works. I know the pe comes with an intake but it's sucking hot air.
I'm not arguing to argue I think you're a cool guy I just think something isnt quite right , perhaps the boost gauge is hooked up to an incorrect vacumm line? Who knows all i'm saying is if these motors could safely run with 11 or 12 psi wouldnt all the turbo and supercharger kits boost at that level? What other upgrades have you done? If u are pushing 11 or 12 psi you would need massively improved fuel and spark tuning. more than what comes in a pe kit.
hmm I just wanna see the dyno lol.
If I go f.i. with the 1nz I will run a pe s/c . That's if I keep the 1nz, I just see alot more potential with the 1zz powerplant. I mean right out of the box it has almost the same hp as most f.i. 1nz kits are making. Not to mention the power of a modded TRD supercharged 1zz. a modded s/c'd 1zz can easily have 200 whp . and around 170tq.
Oh and the reason I would not be adding rods is 1 cracking the motor , 2 there are no rods made for this motor and they would have to be custom fabbed. alot of money.
02-09-2005, 12:43 PM
#53
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i know how superchargers work....kinda stupid of me to put a supercharger on my car if i didn't know how it worked....lol
the boost gauge is in the pipe about 14-16 inches from the throttle body...no vacuum lines...i only wanted to read boost...
don't worry about arguing, right now its all been a good discussion....
all i am saying is that i am running 12psi safely, so far...i am not sure how long this will last, but so far its all been good to me...(keeps fingers crossed)
and i want to see the dyno numbers myself...(i am feeling 145-150hp..i think i can get another 5 in the mid band with some more tuning...)...who knows...i'll get the box run soon after the clutch is done...
i would love to tweak a 1zz motor next...
the boost gauge is in the pipe about 14-16 inches from the throttle body...no vacuum lines...i only wanted to read boost...
don't worry about arguing, right now its all been a good discussion....
all i am saying is that i am running 12psi safely, so far...i am not sure how long this will last, but so far its all been good to me...(keeps fingers crossed)
and i want to see the dyno numbers myself...(i am feeling 145-150hp..i think i can get another 5 in the mid band with some more tuning...)...who knows...i'll get the box run soon after the clutch is done...
i would love to tweak a 1zz motor next...
02-09-2005, 04:48 PM
#54
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Have you seen any dynos of the PE300 with stock boost? If it can get up to around 135 WHP safely I'll probably go for it.
I keep seeing $400 for the motor thrown around, is that for the entire motor? If so then I don't much care if I blow it. My family owns a tranny shop so the motor is all I am concerned about. Has anyone actually looked up the cost for a brand new motor just in case?
I keep seeing $400 for the motor thrown around, is that for the entire motor? If so then I don't much care if I blow it. My family owns a tranny shop so the motor is all I am concerned about. Has anyone actually looked up the cost for a brand new motor just in case?
02-09-2005, 05:22 PM
#55
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02-09-2005, 07:32 PM
#56
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400 is normally a long block jdm style or a thrashed full us motor. pr5oblem with ebay is sure it's 300 but the shipping is at leas t200 so... lol.
oh and if stock 7psi of boost with a pe is 135 at 11 or 12 psi you'd have approximately 170 hp. hell probably more.
hey dg what fuel and spark tuning do you have?
oh and if stock 7psi of boost with a pe is 135 at 11 or 12 psi you'd have approximately 170 hp. hell probably more.
hey dg what fuel and spark tuning do you have?
02-09-2005, 07:41 PM
#59
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Originally Posted by dgHotLava
motor with 700 miles and 5 spd tranny 650.00 with 3yr 36,000 mile warranty (just as good as toyota's...lol)
hey this is for all in case you havent read any of e.l. prototypes stuff
Quote:
It responds to boost quite nicely with a properly sized turbo. But its downfalls are the internals and its engine management.
Lets touch on the internals. First and foremost are the rods. Although quite strong for their size, they are designed for normal aspiration only. A half point higher in compression is about all they can handle daily without failure. Once boost is added to the equation, it becomes Russian roulette as to when they will let loose. You may last eight months with 50,000 miles or blow it the first pass down the street; there are no warning signs.
Quote:
These engines have the crankshaft offset 12mm to the thrust side of the cylinder bore centerline. This reduces the side force generated at maximum compression, for reduced friction and improved fuel economy. Toyota calculates the offset crankshaft configuration reduces fuel consumption by between one and three percent. Unfortunately, this throws the angle of the rod way out on its upward travel causing the rod to just give up under boost and snap. If there is any detonation or pre-ignition this breakage will occur at an accelerated rate.