Trdkamuri510

funny thing is you can also put a BOV on a supercharged vehicle. esp a centrifugal force one. www.rippmods.com has one for the 5s-fe used in a few cars (esp. camry)

with the one for the TC you can also put on a BOV. more than likely it has one.

there went that excuse of turbo over supercharger.

KAuss

If this was made BY Toyota... Designed to sport a trubo, then all parts mentioned would be stock... There would be no need for "extra" parts since they'll have the proper parts to support the extra air flow...

Even if it was aftermarket... You'll have to do the same thing with a supercharged car... Why wouldn't you need to up the headers, intake, and injectors if you're running a supercharge but you had to with turbo?

I agree with the stupid kid's part... A lot more Toyota lots would be filled by turbo charged Scions by dumb people trying to put 300 hp into their totally stock tCs... However, the turbo takes a bit more tuning, the supercharger takes a LOT longer to develop... From a manufacture's standpoint, they would be much better off slapping on a turbo then tunning it rather than producing a unique supercharger for a new car...

To an idiot the turbo would be less reliable... A supercharger has more parts, period. That in anything engineered would mean it'll break easier... The more parts the more complication and the more chances something will go wrong... A turbo is just a turbine... Under proper tuning, the turbo should run with absolutely no problem at all... You have to replace the pulley in the supercharger and replace the oil... With a turbo it's pretty much power for the rest of the car's life and no upkeep if you tuned it right... A poorly tuned supercharger would be worst than a wrongly tuned turbo... (well they'll both be bad so I guess they're even) The thing is, You can't really tune a supercharger unless you start from scratch... I'm not too big with superchargers so the amount of things you can do with it...

I second the I'm sick of people who wants a turbo because of the BOV....

This is exactly why Toyota might not want to make a turbo tC... Because of people who think this is ok...

ASUgradinWA

very sound observations KAuss. I'm glad to find someone who actually knows more about FI than "The turbo makes a really cool noise"

I just think TRD was trying to devolope something that would appeal to the largest audiance. While there are those of us (like me) that enjoy the power potential of a Turbocharger most people are not looking for potential, just results.

The Supercharger is just giving 40 more horses. It gives a power boost through the entire rpm range. It is also dealer installed with a TRD warrenty. Make it simple, easy, and reliable.

Besides, it means when I throw on my turbo set-up I'll be one of the few that decided to go the less traveled road.

OompaLoompa

Some more inupt: I was thinking along different lines. I was talking about (when i said a turbo needs more extras) TRD supplying an aftermarket turbo that doesn't come from the factory. If the Tc were to have a turbo stock, then my point wouldn't matter. And as for the boost controller, i don't see any problem with that. Yes, 12 psi. would be pushing it, but agian i was talking about toyota cars in general. But, an increase of 2 psi wouldn't be much of an issue. One of the first things many people do when they get a turbocharged car is put a boost controller in it.

BizzyDaKid

And what do you think a Turbo sounds like spooling up? :?:

tC4me

I personally like the noise of both turbos and superchargers. The reason why i like turbos is b/c when you race someone, and you have lag, they think they are going really fast, and then the turbo kicks in....and pttssss, your way past them. At least thats my experiance with a turbo. But hey, to each his own.

BizzyDaKid

I love the sound of both as well.....I am more of a turbo guy but it just depends the car I would force induct....old muscle car-S/C, import-turbo, just depends

djimpak

i also like both sc and tc. but if i were to go FI, it will depend on what i want, lots of power or limited power.

StormX02

[quote="KAuss"]Dude that isn't fair, the BoV was but ONE thing that happened to stand out because you throw me in with everyone else.
You're going to persecute me because I mentioned it? is it really so wrong to like something that everyone else just happens to like? Hell I might as well not like Toyota then because everyone and their grandma drives a corolla.



It's not the same at all. Have you heard them both in real life?

Matt687

Well a supercharger is being used because it is better than a turbocharger, you have constant boost pressure, so better off the line.

BizzyDaKid

I know they don't sound the same at all, but I was just pointing out that they both make noise...and yes I have heard them both

Imprtracr1

Centrifugal supercharger = Turbo without exhaust housing... same thing basically.. same basic design, same means of compressing the intake air charge.. same delivery, different exhaust path then a turbo.. only in the fact that it exits the motor normally, and when i say normally i mean that it exits via an exhaust manifold/header directly into the exhaust system... the means by which the centrifugal supercharger recieves its drive power is via the shaft connecting a pulley at one end to meet the drive belts.. the other end of the shaft is connected to the supercharger housing where on a turbo there would be the exhaust housing, and no shaft connecting the main housing to recieve drive power from the drive belts.. so yes u can still up the boost on a centrifugal supercharger ... it all depends on what the boost output of that supercharger is set to produce.. or the turbines trim characteristics.. if the centrifugal supercharger is capable of producing 15psi but is using only 6 or 7 psi , should be able to have a means of boost control to up the additional psi that is being bled off by the waste gate. Additionally, you also can put on a blow off valve on the system beacause boost is still being built relative to engine speed on this type of system but not because of freewheeling of the turbine and not because like on a turbo exhaust gas of the previous rpm range is still making that exhaust turbine spin, but because when the throttle body closes the engine is still at a certian rpm making the drive belts turn that supercharger relative to that engine speed, but as it drops between shifts suddenly, that boost and engine speed in relation to that throttle bodys position suddenly being closed is not the same, thus boost is built up between the throttle body and the charge coming from the Supercharger. As that boost exceedes the set level within that section of pipe the pressure must be released and thats where the Blow off valve comes in.. PSSSHHHHT!, additionally, if the supercharger is producing max boost due to the size of the pully used to created the ratio between revolutions of engine speed vs. revolution of supercharger speed, a different pulley size can be employed to create a different ratio.. thus making the supercharger turn faster in relation to the engines speed, creating more available boost... so... i guess the real question will be what will the max boost pressure from this TRD Supercharger be capable in stock trim.. are we being limited by the pully size or by a wastegate...thats the real question...

KAuss

If you are someone that likes turbo because it goes PSSHH, then include yourself in my hated circle..

If you are not, then ignore the comment...

I don't have to like anyone here and I certianly don't like people that like turbos because they have a BOV

djimpak

to me.. the PSSSh of the BOV on turbo is just a plus. i like the power the turbo gives your car.

jocappy

Toyota doesnt currently use Turbos on smaller engines like 1.5 and 2.4l engines. But they did use them in 2.0L MR2's in the early and mid 90's. The reason is they will eventually mess the engine up on the smaller liter engines. That is what I was told.

theheckwithyou

uhh any FI to any engine will mess it up, cuz basicly ur forcing more air in to the engine. its like this you can only drink so much water at one time for someone to force more water will make u choke. i really think car companys like toyota stopped making turbos is that the engine won't last every long and it doesn't really mater what size the engine is.

o fyi supras where turboed too in the mid 90s untill 97.

jocappy

o fyi supras where turboed too in the mid 90s untill 97.[/quote]


Oh, I didnt know there were 2.0L Surpra's ever. I only new of MR2's with the 2.0L Turbo. Huh.

KAuss

2.4L engine is SOOO not small... Also, putting turbos in smaller engines gives the best gains since it would show the most significant boost in the shortest amount of time... Trying to fill a bigger area would mean more PSI and usually with added PSI means slower spool times... Not to mention having a small engine turbo car built to be sold would cost cheaper with comparable performance to large N/A engine cars... To the consumer this is a "value" which IMO all companies should take advantage of...

They already have displacement on demand, now they just need to put a BIT of complication to the simple turbo design and make F/I on demand... Now everyone would flock to buy a Civic and find themselves in a better situation than someone driving a huge V6 or V8 car while not using the power all the time...

I'm sort of happy at least they're still putting F/I into cars... This died for so long and we haven't seen ANY F/I cars until the WRX release... After that, we're seeing a small but steady market investing some time making F/I cars for us to buy... This might just be the era for superchargers and eventually, maybe the American culture will steer away from the high torque bias to give turbo another chance... With new sports like drifting and the AWD imports creating a stir in the rally scene... They'll soon see the turbo dominance in those sports and the car makers WILL see the difference and put turbos in cars...

NHRA or drag in general SHOULD be supercharger dominated and for those that are serious about doing that SHOULD give superchargers a chance and do a bit of research into the advantages a S/C will give you off the line...

theheckwithyou

Oh, I didnt know there were 2.0L Surpra's ever. I only new of MR2's with the 2.0L Turbo. Huh. [/quote]

i never said that supras where 2.0L

avus

a rather obvious reason is emissions. most new cars being developed with forced induction are leaning towards the s/c. while current turbo'd cars can meet current EPA and EU emissions, pretty much all of them will not when stricter emissions guidelines take effect in 2006 or 2007, both here and in Europe
so, why spend development money on making a turbo meet emissions standards when an s/c offers fewer of these worries?