ok,ive had 7 different boxes in my scion xb. started out with two jl audio 8w7's ended up blowing them.then got two jl 12 w3's tried several boxes.oh and all these boxes are ported slots.well after trying different things facing it different ways.it didnt work
i now have a brand new jl audio 12 w7 .man its a trip.45lb's. man its crazy looking.so anyways i built a heavy duty box with a double face plate and bottom and sides.3/4 pieces stuck together.i dynomated almost the entire wagon,i was woundering which way eveybody had theyre woofers firing.i had my 12w7 firing backwards and now its facing up.this has been the hardest car ive ever had to make boom i wanna feel the bass.and you would think that 12 w7 would slam.well im not to impressed.the box is built correct and i have plenty of power.everyone says its the vehicle.has anyone else had problems making your xb shake and vibrate the seats and steering wheel?
i called jl audio today and they said to put my box in one of my friends rides to see what it would do.he said its got to be the scion.and that sux.i love my scion.well any ideas i would appreaciate it guys.

 

I just have the optional bazooka and it shakes my seat slightly and my rear view mirror so I don't see why you'd have problems no matter what way they face. Mine is pointed to the back. Is your box too massive? Maybe it's absorbing a lot more than you think, after all, my bazooka is a pretty thin plastic so most of it gets out and it's only 74 WRMS.

 

Firing position? I usually just hold my hand outside the car and aim at the trunk. Chances are, I'll hit something important to make that blaring, stupid Puff Doodle music go away at the stoplight.

I'm sorry, what was the question?

 

There must be something wrong in the system if you can't get any strong bass out of that. I was running 2 Elemental Designs 12"s in a sealed enclosure firing up in mine and it could practically shake the car apart.

 

I run 2 12's firing up in the rear and 2 8's under the seats and it shakes things loose.....

 

I have 2 12' Memphis M3s firing up with a slot port and no dynomat. That being said I shake my car allot. I have not heard a XB with dynomat to know the difference but that would cut down on the vibration some but make the system louder. Have you tried to put it on a SPL meter to see what it is hitting the compare with what that speaker can hit? There could be many reasons why it is not that loud. size of car, interior of car, size of box, position of box, size of box, what the box is made of, power of amp, power supply to amp. Bottom line is I do not think it is the car as a whole. It might be a part of the car or a combo of things. You just have to keep toying with things to see what works.

 

In all the cars I've owned so far (no system in the xB) I had the best luck with the subs pointed backwards.

 

You sound like my dad. Not sure which he hates more, rap music or the square scion xb.

 

Lance, bring the xB by my house and let me take a look at it.
Enclosure design, amplification, charging system, etc., all are factors to the performance of your setup. If any one of them is lacking in any way, you will be disappointed in the overall performance of the setup.
Shoot me a PM or give me a call on my cell. I'll give you directions to the house.

 

well i got it now,haha i had it facing the back the whole time then i faced it up and it sounded alright then i made a rack to set the box on and have blue lights under it.and it was all bolted down.so i got to thinking if i ever have a flat im screwed.it would take alot to get to my spare.so i built a new rack or cabinet for the box to sit on and its bolted down to the body and the spare tire sits in the rack.well i made it 12'' tall and tested it out.it was ok but to tall ,so i cut off 3'' and put the rack back in and put my box back in and bolted everything down,and JACKPOT.it is jamin hard.the sub is about well just guessing 15 or 20 inches from the roof and its firing up.and man im pretty happy.now when i had it firing up when the box was down low it didnt boom like it does higher up.im pretty excited.its all bolted down tight looks good and my spare tire is on the left side and i have a brace and the other side works as a storage space.i'll try and get in touch with you jeff ,haha maybe this time i'll catch up with ya.

later.

 

Get off my lawn!

 

for bass, there really isn't anything known as firing direction unless you are dealing with a subwoofer horn design. bass waves are omni directional which means they go where ever they want. BUT... there is such thing as cancellation where if two similar waves were to hit each other on opposing wave travel, the two will cancel each other out where as two similar waves traveling at an even wave travel will cause an increase of amplitude. many very small and stupid things can cause this such as different length wires, driver placement and phasing. to fix phasing, simply take the connecting power wires and flop the poles *negative on positive and positive on negative* this will take the driver *speaker* and put it into a pull motion rather then in a push. this is known as a 180 degree phase change and sometimes fixes small issues like this.

cancellation can be caused by driver surface areas *the front facing cone* to be facing one another at a rather precise parallel level to one another and all phasing, wire lengths and single pulse strength is of nearly exact to one another. only takes a small amount of similarities to cause a noticeable amount of cancellation.

you however shouldn't really be needing to worry about this TOO much. you're not running a rather large live system. BUT these are some causes that can sometimes be seen in small applications. also, check the sensitivity of of your new drivers and compare them to the older ones you were using before. that with comparable diameters give you output ratios and will tell you right then and there aswell for a basic comparison.

let UV7 take a good look at it, could also be just as simple as a improper enclosure design. the internal volume may be correct, but shape has every little much to do with it's sound as well as it's tuning and volume does. you can't have an oblong shaped box that's vented, the sound and air ventilation needs to be just right and can't have uneven flow or movement. only a sealed box can be any shape it wishes *to a point*.

i'll leave it to UV7 though, i don't want to continue getting too technical and loose ya . when it comes to my audio, i go down 20,000 leagues deep including matching amplifier AP, cone movement, box placement, wave modeling *to find cancellation points within the work i'm working with*, phasing ect... i do what is normally done for a fully developed live audio or studio system for the best outcome possible

 

pictures?

 

its just me.i had two jl audio 8w7's in a ported enclosure in my single cab z71 and they moved you.it hit low and deep and it was the kind of bass that you can feel more than you can hear.and once you get that sound and you know what you like.its hard to get it again.my 12w7 jams hard and vibrates everything and you can feel it deep in your chest.i just had my hopes built up that this 45lb sub was going to do back flips im very picky and hard to please when it comes to my bass.ive been bassing since my first car in 1988 and ive had a system in every ride ive owned everything from 18's to 8's and everyone that has heard my scion now says it jams.i will hook up with jeff since he lives right down the rd from meand we'll see what he has to say about it.right here.so happy trails guys.my next project is building some home speakers with my new jlw3's with the front piece made out of beautiful cedar.i have an unlimited supply of cedarand it looks great when sanded and minwax.
welp later guys.thanX

lance
p.s. jeff holler at me bro.

 

i'd recommend against using cedar being it is a very soft wood and doesn't really hold the acoustic characteristics of that of MDF or Birch Ply. what i would do is use a thin piece to overlay a stronger actual baffle rather then using solid cedar. it'll be stronger that way with holding a heavy sub and will be acoustically sound.

also, another problem you are probably facing is being use to the impact of an 8" sub and how much more control a smaller driver's transducer has over a smaller cone rather then just going with shear size and expecting it to hit. a bigger sub does mean more surface area for higher SPL levels, yes... but this also means reduced total control that the transducer has over the cone because the transducer *motor assembly or AKA magnet and voice coil design* is having to move more total mass and thus having more of a delay time with it's response on tighter notes. this is why i prefer using 10's, it's a perfect balance between accuracy with tight notes with an ability of keeping the low end satisfactory. that is... in a generalized view of it all... it's REALLY upto the TS parameters of a given speaker and what it's true designed purpose is meant for. just because it's labeled as a sub-woofer doesn't mean it's actual capability says it's purpose is for a sub-woofer range, it could very well perform flawlessly for higher bass to mid ranges where as it sucks donkey ***** at what it's "labeled" to do. TS specs tell you exactly that.

 

For a sub enclosure, I wholeheartedly agree with using MDF and then sheeting it with sanded Cedar for the finish. Cedar doesn't have the density that MDF does and will introduce its own resonant characteristics into the reproduction, making the output very "boomy" and hollow, while limiting the low end. For a mid and high cabinet, Cedar might work well where the softness of the wood is more in range to lend a warm tone to mids.
One of the other characteristics of the 8W7 setup that hasn't been mentioned is the fact that the enclosure was probably behind the seats in the cab of Lance's Z71. Most would bring up the fact that the seats would have an absorbing affect, bringing the output down a bit, which is true, but would overlook the fact that the woofers would be in MUCH closer proximity to the driver and passenger than a typical trunk-located sub setup. This is why I built a custom enclosure extension to my fiberglass center console that houses a 10" directly behind the front seats. Even though sub output is omni-directional, it does bring the impact up closer to the rest of the sound stage, lending itself to the creation of a more accurate reproduction.
The other possibility is that the gains on the 8W7 setup could possibly have been set a little beyond the edge of clipping since the distortion would have been masked a small bit by the absorption of the seats directly in front of the enclosure. This could, of course, be a bad thing for the woofers over time, but the W7s are VERY beefy and capable of taking a great deal of punishment.
Lance, I'll give you a shout this weekend. I'm anxious to hear your 12W7 setup! I've got to feed my snakes this weekend, so it may be late Saturday afternoon or Sunday, unless you want to come by and watch the feeding, which you are more than welcome. It's nothing you haven't seen before, other than the fact that my snakes might be a little larger than what you typically encounter.