Please define "over the hill" please...
And speak up....I'm a bit deaf!!

 

That center module would have been a deal breaker had the xD been so equipped.

Nothing more irritating in my opinion. Of course, it's just my opinion...

 

alot of people were crying that the cars were underpower so they changed that so now there's this ha ha ha ha people are never happy.

the only part I think scion did wrong was to listen to its customer so fast they should of waited a bit longer right now the xa and 1st gen xb would of been selling alot. (I saw a xa go for 17k on an auction with 43k miles) also the 2nd gen Xb shouldn't have been called XB they should of gone with XE or what ever other letter.

you want something different bring back the MR2 under scion or even this..

The iQ





Source:
http://www.goodcleantech.com/2007/09...pt_will_se.php

 

As I said in the blog posts I linked to, Scion was constantly asking "What should we change?" and those folks in their survey samples who didn't like the xB as it was gave them a bunch of answers, including "more power" "bigger" "more streamlined" and "better styling," all of which were saying "more mainstream."

Those who actually liked the xB Classic, the fanatics who had made Scion the initial success it was, didn't really want big changes so didn't have an answer.

Therefore the xB haters won, being the only ones insisting on changes, while the folks who ate up the idea and feel of this new type of vehicle on the American scene, thumbing it's nose at everyone, lost: A new Camry station wagon was developed and given the same name as their quirky box.

In a parking lot it looks like all the others, whereas the xB Classic looked like nothing else.

The xB2 is today's high-value mom-car, perfect for mom, 2.3 kids and a dog on the way to the park.

Scion took it's eye off the ball, and instead of a brash new interpretation of the little city car box driving through the doors, lights flashing and music blaring, they brought out a polite, civilized, overweight, gas sucking van without the sliding doors. Sorry, wrong vehicle.

I'm still waiting for Scion to wake up and realize that the odd, off-kilter, up-yours, in-your-face, it's-mine-you-don't-have-to-like-it car is what they need, not some committee-think, let's-blend-in mom-car.

The xB2 is a great value, but it doesn't get the wild eyed fanatical following of something truly different and polarizing like the original box.

(Yes, I'm one of the wild-eyed fanatics... Why do you ask?)



P.S. Does this thread really belong in a tC forum? How 'bout 'Toyota News?'

 

[quote="Tomas"]Buddy, this is a business. I'm sure Toyota wished the original xB had sold 3X the volume it did. Toyota didn't intend to be a small niche player with Scion - it wanted to be the next iPod - something ubiquitous.

The old xB was quirky and somewhat scarce - that was never the point.

 

"Tomas" Hear-Hear. Very well said.

 

I'm sure Toyota wishes the NEW xB was selling even close to the volume the old one did. Whoops!

Everything Toyota has ever said about the brand indicates that Scion was intended to become a small niche player - i.e. quirky young people. Show me the press release that says "We launched Scion to sell as many cars as we possibly could, LOL."

Even if that was the point (as if Toyota has problems selling cars), it's still a failure, because Soccer Moms have a lot more options to choose from than strapped-for-cash 20-somethings. There was nothing competing with the original. The new B's have the entire crossover and cute ute industry to contend with.

You haven't seen the sales graph floating around this site? New xB sales haven't even come close to the old peaks, by some 20%. Even if the point WAS simply to "sell lots of cars lol," it's still a miss.

 

Actually, Toyota DID intend for the Scion marque to be a low volume niche player, and has issued numerous public statements saying that.

They are a low-profit-per-unit loss-leader to get new much younger customers into something from Toyota. That is the sole purpose of the entire brand, and we've been told that since even before they introduced their first car.

Since 2003 they've repeatedly emphasized that is the purpose of Scion, and have not changed that purpose in the past five years.

They want to catch the "rebels," those folks, primarily young, who reject the usual car advertising and usual brands as being too "main stream" or being too "commercial" or having "sold out." They want the same folks who like the indy bands for the same reasons.

That's a hard demographic to reach, and out of all the car brands, Scion has actually been the best at it.

That's exactly the young folks Toyota is trying to appeal to with the Scion brand, with no major commercial advertising, but instead, product placements and commercials on Adult Swim, commercial leaders and trailers on select films in theaters, music events, bands, sponsorship of meets, get-togethers, and other Scion community events to build up an "in crowd," a tight community to spread the word virally by word-of-mouth.

Toyota's hope is that once those hard to reach folks get involved with Scion and have a good experience, it will carry over to Toyota and Lexus when time comes for those folks to move on.

That's the multi-million-dollar gamble.

It's too soon to see if it is actually going to work, but Scion needs to stay extremely focused on that demographic and NOT succumb to designing middle-of-the-road, community designed vehicles like the xB2. They need to remain edgy and odd, and NOT liked by the mainstream, not watered down by consensus.

They need to take PRIDE in not following in lockstep with all the other brands.

They need to remain "different" and seem not to care if mom and dad "get it" or not.

They need cars that would look good with spiked hair, tattoos and piercings, black leather and studs, sculls and spiders, obnoxious colors, strange lights and LOUD noises coming from within. They don't need Camry station wagons.

Scion sales are down, but so are all the other brands. It's tough times right now. BUT, Scion still needs to sell their cars to the right people, and they temporarily lost sight of that need of edginess, and went with a committee designed or community designed pair of cars (xB2 and xD) that appeal to the average, not the edge.

Hopefully they will get it back together and introduce another cult car, built with quality and pride and with a low price, but for right now we can only hope.

Tom
(The old guy in the back of the room who HAS been paying attention and taking notes...)

 

I do recall my salesman talking about Scions being limited on production. He talked on how this helps a bit with the re-sale value. I wasn't sure if this was dealership garbage but but it makes sense to lean towards the 'demand' side of it all, especially with a 'new' brand.

 

Brilliantly said, Tomas, and far more eloquently than I. Though I would add one thing...

...and hopefully those of us WITH spiked hair and piercings won't have bought Cubes or Souls in the meantime.

AMEN

 

Anyone ever noticed the xD RS 1 is orange?????


Sounds like someone was snooping around on this site?? Since we said Toyota should come with orange paint!

 

I think this sums it up.

 

Well it is different. Its not that i dotn liek the psoitioning its that the gauge with everythign in one is harder to read. Thats my opinion anyways. Its wierd to me to drive with the gauge over there. Im not knocking it its originial and diffrnt. So +1 for that but for me i dont liek it. I would still get one hands down. As a second car. But for me the xb2 has more of what i want. I dont think it gets lost in the crowd at all. They are still very different from the other cars on the road. I dont know how yall think they look like other small suv/crossovers. But anyways thats my opinion and you have yours.

 

:D

 

Now do a Scion xB and Ford FLEX

 

xB Classic and Flex is easy, just stretch the xB silhouette to about 1 1/2 times as long and pump it up to full size...

Seriously, the Flex from some angles really does make it look like Ford designers spent too long near a Scion meet...

 

It looks like a good car-until you see the F-ound O-n R-oad D-ead badge.

I actually saw one in person and it's not bad-not my cup o tea-but if the focus was a downsized version of this (like 1st gen xB size) without the chrome garbage and had that SVT package that would be an almost good enough reason to buy a ford...

(I threw up in my mouth a litle bit when I said that)

Throw a PT, and HHR and a 2nd gen xB together-they might as well be a Sonata, a Camry and Accord as far as they all look close enough to be the same. They all sell well, they all have similar and yet different ideas but they are interchangeable (the camry and 2nd gen xB being the best quality of the bunch)

What can you put next to an xB and have it be similar like that (even the cube is just too different).

I saw my xb next to a 2nd gen today and because of this I see why the 2nd gen is similar to it and different from other cars but the visual cues are watered down versions of the 1st gen and that is why I am so glad I have a 1st gen-it is what it is! (it is not a version of anything else, or a revised and comprimising version of anything else)

 

ok ok ok, I've only read the 2 pages of this thread. I'm sure there's redudnant postings too. I may be repeating this but!!! the 2nd Gen xB is in the Same situation as the 1st Gen. Both are love it or hate it styles. edginess, styling, etc are all aspects of beauty, which is subject to one's personal tastes. I hate the herd mentality. Why does a boxy style have to be "Edgy and Daring?" This is Why I feel that Scion should never had baded the 2nd Gen xB as "xB." instead they should have done what they originally had wanted and retired the xB and call this one the x2B, tB, whatever!!! Everyone wanted what was in the t2B concept, the styling of the New xB is very similar. Obviously they couldn't be exactly the same as the Concept, that car wouldn't have been in the same price range.

Wooo. Scion sales slumped 8%. This is to be expected, gas rising,economy shot to $#!t, model year switchover. Sales are down, but My dealership did better than we did last July!!! And need we even talk about the Domestic Market?

What about the Hako concept. I know how people felt. I saw everybody's jaws DROP faster and wider than our current financial deficit! But who knows? That may be sooo out there it will take off where the Gen 1 xB ended.

Hmm Toyota will not bring that Suburu Joint Venture RWD coupe to the US. H... Howabout they Make it an AWD Scion coupe. They're changing the Current 2.4 engine into a 2.5 Dual VVTi version. And there's a 2.7 version for the Highlander and Venza. The Next Scions could be really something...

Anyways, about the people ____ing and moaning about Scion losing it's uniqueness, edginess. "Scion is ready to kill itself" Scion has a lot to do to redesign it's image, and it's on ly 5yrs old, yadda yadda blech... Helloooo I highly doubt that. The 5th's Fiscal year isn't even over and already people are saying Scion can't hack it? People also said that Toyota should "come out with quality cars instead of introducing cheap models that no one will buy" in 2002/03 when Toyota announced they were introducing Scion. People can doubt all they want. Wait till the 5 years are up before digging Scion's grave.

I still think they should have kept the xP idea and went through with it.

How could there be sooo many Scions out there that "everyone and their sister" has one? there's over 5 million people in NYC alone. There's less than a million Scions (xA, xB, tC, xD, xB2 combined) in the entire US!!!
"
Still, it is hard to argue with Scion's success.

More than 500,000 of the 600,000 Scions sold have been to people who never had been inside a Toyota store. More than 80 percent buy another Scion or move on to a Toyota or Lexus. Accessory sales per vehicle are double those for the typical Toyota. Lentz also is proud that the dealer body has kept the brands separate. " - Automotive News 08/08/08

Well, I'm done with my Rant.... Have fun tearing my post apart

 

Bravo^^ Soem good insight. Thanks.

 

that new commercial that someone linked to in the tC forum certainly isn't helping. I hope this isn't the "good marketing" they see fixing the brand. It's just another example of "trying" too hard.



I wonder how the whole credit thing has been effecting Scion? Are young people getting turned down for loans? Is Toyota making it easy or hard for people with a limited credit history to fiance a Scion? It seems to me a lot of them will sign on the dotted line no matter how retarded the terms are. Any of you dealer people shed some light?

Young people are more likely to have to fiance the whole thing (unless Mommy comes to the dealership), the old folks at least seem to bring some more cash to put on the table - I'm sure this has some effect on sales. I'm guessing not enough to make the larger problems irrelevant.