Two maxims / proverbs come to mind…

“Knowledge in itself is power”…now that you’ve got the book, use it and abuse it. Have it in you hip pocket to show to the tech inspectors…read this as (shove it down their throats and ask them how it tastes?

And

“A book is like a mirror, if a monkey looks into it, you can’t expect an apostle to look back.” I can't help you there...

 

Can not agree more. I have the TEIN basics for exactly this reason. You will lose a decent amount of ride comfort, but your handling will improve dramatically with just the coilovers. On top of that, you don't have to worry about blowing out your stock struts because they're constantly lower than designed. Better to go with something meant to ride that low all the time.

And this will be my next investment

I will also echo 1stOne's advice, because that's basically what I've been doing. Take your car out stock, get to know exactly how it behaves and go piece by piece from there, and take it out in between upgrades so you can gauge exactly how your car is changing. Just because you bolted on new parts doesn't mean it will necessarily perform better.

 

Well I have the stock springs sitting in my apartment, so I guess ill have to switch them out. BTW, do I need to get some new bump stops?

 

Install the TRD springs...they come with new bump stops.

 

Okay, thanks.

 

@Scratch: No riddles man! I'm Ammo, I can't handle the confusion!

@Everyone else: So I have a couple questions come to mind. Running stock to improve skills makes perfect sense. (Same holds true for shooting. You practice with iron sights and bolt on the optics for competition/combat.) But is there any real benefit of going back to stock if I already have the springs installed? They may not help the performance, but I can't see them hurting it... And doesn't the tC already have a rear sway bar? Will upgrading it make that much of a difference?

Thanks!

 

I'll put it this way. My buddy, I took him shooting for the first time ever a month or three back, and he wanted to only shoot a .22LR but in a handgun. So I let him use the only .22 I had at that time, a Sig Hammerli Trailside (Xesse) Competition model, fully decked out. Then he got himself a Ruger MkIII and didn't like it. So he did learn, but now he wants my Sig, which I may have to kill him.

So you'll be fine, you'll learn fine, and you'll probably run well. Myself I just don't know WTH I'll be doing on the track so I want to be in the lowest beginner class possible with other people that also don't know what is up. (Plus the 2011 is lumped in with the Gen1s which is sweet)

 

No one here said that you will go slower with a stiffer sprung, lowered car. Nor did anyone say to go back to stock if your car already had shocks and springs installed…what was said, is that you don’t have to have a modified car to go out on a race track to have fun and hone your driving skills. To use 1stOne as an example, he goes out on a race track in a stock car and has more fun than any one of you on the streets, goes faster for longer and safer too…not to mention legality, than any one of you on the streets.

A stiffer chassis (roll cage, tower bars, X-braces, fender bars, etc.) will get you a more precise car…no question. Do you need it to hone your driving skills on the race track, hell no! Do the professionals have them, hell yeah! The same analogy applies for big brakes, shocks, springs, sway bars, etc.

Your experiences in races are like nothing else…once you’ve raced, you’re done…you’re addicted. Does this sound like sex? If you haven’t been in a sanctioned race, you aren’t qualified to have an opinion here. No disrespect to those of you who have not raced yet, it’s just like trying to describe how to have great sex being a virgin. None of us want to be virgins, stop reading this thread and get out on the track! Good luck!

 

First off, read my comments below and note that I am not here to argue, just clarifying some more.

This thread is great. A lot of great info and a lot of focus on "improve yourself, not the car". Racing is 10% car, 90% driver (and another 10000% *****). If you think that bolt on parts will make your car faster, your right, but if you think it will make you faster, your wrong. Get my drift? While an STI might get me in the straights, I can get them in the turns because I've done it before. Power means nothing if you can't use it, so learn to use it before you get more.

TRD shifter = WIN. In the same light, the TWM = WIN. Great for feel, wont make you faster. Just makes it feel more sporty which can really help your mental game and push you to push the car. WIN, WIN.

However, I would NEVER buy a suspension kit, no matter who makes it. It that because they suck? No. Hell no. Its because its not a tuning tool when you don't know what your "tuning". Bigger sway bars will not improve anything unless you know what your trying to improve. Suspension companies sell performance based on feel, because in the end, that's all we can do. If it "feels" faster, it must be right? Test that theory on a track and you'll find its very, very wrong. Again, don't bolt parts on and expect results. If you feel the car is leaning too much, ask yourself: how can I fix this? Research and learn. Sometimes its as simple as a set of $30 camber bolts and an alignment. Sometimes its more. Knowing what you want from the car is half the battle, the other half is knowing how to get it. Ask here, we are all here to help.

As 2tCornot2tC said, the TRD's come with new. I can't support this spring enough; its great. If your class allows for anything, know your limits. Don't build the car for the top of the class because you'll be really upset when a car right off the showroom floor, with 100 less horsepower spanks you in the event.

I said go stock because its free and it gets you learning what you need. Springs hide a lot of feedback that stock provides. They are supposed to, that's why they "feel" better. But, in this game, results are key, and lap times will be your only end results. Get some seat time, no matter how you have it setup now, and see what you like and hate. You will probably hate the Tein springs (they are poo poo for handling), so raising it up to TRD's might be best, or go the free route and back to stock for a little and see the difference....

Sways make a huge difference, especially in a heavy turd like the tC. It leans a lot, and even more when you have grip (tires). But on street tires, adding bigger bars and removing sway from the car might hurt it, as the tires will overload when in a turn and force too much understeer/oversteer. Pushing tires past their limit is useless. Smooth is fast. In my case, I need sways. The car has so much grip with 255's that I can feel it lean as the tires force the car to continue to transfer weight. So much so that the tires start to scream as they reach their limits. The sways, in my case, will help keep this fat turd (the tC) a little more balanced and therefore put less stress on the tires, less on the brakes, and provide for quicker entry/exit speeds.

So yes, big difference, if you know when and why you should install them...

 

Yes... IMO upgrading to a large rear sway bar is in the top 5 of best performance upgrade you can do to the tC.

 

Thanks 1stOne, I really appreciate your advice. You told me exactly what I need to hear. I wasn't trying to upset anyone with my newbish question, I'm just coming from Drag/Street racing to auto x. So this is all 100% new to me and I feel this is more for me anyway. I like the mature crowd that does Auto x. Thanks for the help everyone!

 

Great advice all and thanks. All the talk inspired me to look up the SCCA in my area and what would you know, there was an event today! Here are the only 2 pictures I took, but I'll post more in my thread once I get them. Don't want to thread jack.

 

This is the auto x thread man, thread jack away!

 

Lol. I guess now I'm (thread) jacking...

 

Can we get technical here too? Here is what I mean…

You guys that autocross, you could post here your autocrossing experiences…example;

In high speed corners, the car tends to understeer, I think that a stiffer rear sway bar could help.

or;

On a bumpy section of track, the car tends to hop; I think I need to increase the rebound damping on the front suspension, then report your results.

like;

In my first run, the car tended to understeer, so I reduced the rear tire pressure from x-psi to y-psi and I gained 1.5-seconds...it reduced the amount of understeer so then on my third run, I reduced the rear tire pressure another 0.5-PSI and I lost 1-second.

We could all chime in and help out all of us in the long run as a brand...

 

^^ sounds like a great idea to me.

 

Sounds like a great idea. Since I was really just learning the car, I didn't make any changes during the race. Here's what I know and what the car felt like:

- I ran 34 psi in the front and 36 psi in back (cold pressure).
- 90-95 degrees & sunny for the first 4 runs
- 85-90 degrees & dusk for the last 4 runs
- ~1/2 mile course with 1 straight of 50-75m
- I stayed in 2nd gear the whole course
- Top speed of ~40 mph (whatever 5500 rpm in 2nd works out to)

- Serious understeer was corrected with minor braking
- Minor understeer was corrected with hard acceleration
- Back seemed to follow fine when the front tires dug in
- Plenty of power for the track. Better traction is what I really needed
- Lightweight 7.5" wide wheels and 225 wide, sticky tires are the first race mod I really need.

Don't know that this is insightful or helpful at all, but it's all I can think of.

Question though: Anyone know of lightweight 18x7.5 wheels with a stock or wider offset? I'd like to get to 16.5 lbs per wheel or less.

 

http://www.wheelweights.net/

download the excel file and it is pretty complete. just organize the table by size first then copy and paste that to a different table and then sort again by weight to find the wheels that are the lightest for a given size.

for 18x7.5 you should get:
SSR Type-C, Volk RE30, SSR GT2, Work Emotion, Weds TC005, and Enkei RPF1 near the top of your list with the rpf1 probably being the most cost efficient option and weighing 17lbs/wheel

 

Thanks! I've looked at most of those (along with O.Z. Alleggerita HLT on Tirerack) and I'll check out the rest, but I'm running into issues with the offset. Seems when I find these online, they have a +48 offset and the last thing I want to do is make my wheels more sunken.

 

These are 18.5lbs. offset +37 per Enkei's website, they would be a big improvement.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/18x7-...Q5fAccessories
Also to those talking about sway bars...You guys are forgetting the cheap simpler suspension mods. Upgrade the mushy bushings to a firmer aftermarket one. It would be easy to match up the sway bar bushings to something off the rack.