I have 2 Pioneer Amps in the back of my xB. Just recently I have run into a problem where one of the amps does not want to turn. It started when I was driving and the sub just cut out. I initially thought that the mono-amp had fried and was no good. I left it hooked up in the car because I havent had time to work on car. Last night, I noticed that it had turned on again, became happy, and hooked the sub back up. Drove a few blocks, and the subwoofer cut out again. I pulled over and played with the wires and used my remote start to see if it would work. I noticed that the amp will turn on (because it has an led) but immediately shut itself off and not turn on again.

So this morning I switched the amps, and hooked up the 4-channel where the monoamp had previously been. This time the monoamp worked perfectly, but the 4-channel would start and then shut off as the monoamp had done before.

What is wrong?

Each amp has its own ground. The remote wire is connected to the gray ACC wire in the HU harness and then split in the back for each amp. I had the same amps in my tC and never had a problem. The only difference in the xB setup is that now I have the Eclipse AVN6600 as my HU.

Can any of you help me out?

 

Chris says ground issue.

Even though you know that from what I said on AIM, just wanted to post it here so people can agree with me.

 

from what Chris said, the tie hooks that I use for grounds are not very good. He recommended either putting the terminal ring under the tie hook thing with a metal washer and then bolting down or to use the seat bolts instead.

Thanks Chris. Your the Man!! He even went out to the eD xB to see what I was talking about.

 

Indeed...I took the sucker apart to figure out wtf was going on

 

I fully agree. It is a ground issue. Just as an added FYI, it is always best to have ONE ground for all your amps. This will prevent the possibility of ground loops which can cause the dreaded alternator whine.
You can use the seat bolts as a ground point. I would recommend that you grind the surface around the seat bolt that you are going to use. This will remove any paint that might prevent a good connection.

 

Got him on that one on AIM too I <3 Distro blocks.

 

gotta ask. what does alternator whine sound like?

 

WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Pitch of the WHEEEEE varies w/ RPM.

 

yea i would check the ground and power on the amp not working

 

omg i have been woundering what that wine was!! i thought i just got jiped with cheep audio cables... so i guess i need to get all 3 amps on the same ground.....hmmmmm....

 

yup, distro block as Chris (Mandos) said before.

 

well got home and solved the problem, at least temporarily. Instead of attching the ground terminal to the tie hook, I just scrwed the ground terminal with the bolt omitting the tie hook. Works fine now until this weekend when I go buy a distro block and fix the problem permanetly.

Thanks Chris for your help...

 

oh yeah, I guess that one would work too

 

or a ground loop isolator would/should work too... looks like a rca patch cord with like d-cell sized "magic cylnder" in the middle of it...
. at least thats what the one i had a year or 2 ago looked like... the "magic cylnder" was about the size of a d-cell battery coverd by some unmarked plastic coating

 

hmmm im gana try the ground loop isolater this weekend... do you need one for every amp
?

 

Alternator noise can come up even with high quality wires. In addition to previous tips, make sure that your power wire and RCA wires are not running parallel. Never put your power wire less than two or three feet from your RCA’s. It is best to run power wire down one side of the car, and RCA's down the other. It is ok to cross RCA’s with power wire at a 90 degree angle.

 

Ground issues are 95% of all DIY car audio problems. Rather than purchasing additional equipment in efforts to eliminate alternator whine, why not ensure you have installed the audio equipment correctly first? Here are a few simple guidelines for installing amplifiers and such.

1. NEVER mess with any connections with the power ON!!! It is safest to disconnect the negative on the battery when installing and/or troubleshooting audio problems. This includes RCAs and especially speaker wires. Crossing a - and + speaker wire with the amp powered on will give a 0 ohm load to the amp causing it to dramatically increase its power output to the point of frying the amp and anything else attached to it. Most amps have a protection circuit to prevent permanent damage, but why take the chance?

2. Always use adequate fuses. These are for the safety of you and your equipment. Would you rather blow a fuse or cook an amp?

3. Use adequate guage wire for your power AND ground. Though most amplifiers take up to 8 guage wire for power, it is not a wise idea to run 8 guage wire the length of the vehicle for power and ground. Use a larger guage wire (at least 4awg for one amp, 2awg and up for multiple amps) for your main power run and a distribution block to step down the wire size to the amp. Keep in mind that 8awg wire is going to have higher resistance over a shorter distance, and power is absorbed and transferred through resistance in the form of heat, so keep these smaller power and ground wires as short as possible to avoid possible power loss and additional heat! Use the same guage wire for ground as you do for power! This is very important as you are building a circuit. The circuit is only as strong as its weakest link. Use a distribution block to step the amp's ground wire up to a matching guage ground wire for the main. Do yourself a favor and keep the ground points to a minimum. It is best to have 1 main power lead that steps down to separate amps via a distribution block. The same goes for your ground. Use a distribution block to step up the amps' ground wires to 1 main ground lead. One ground point means less ground problems.

4. Keep your ground side of your audio power circuit as short as possible. This will help to prevent ground loops, which as we all have learned, create signal noise in the form of alternator whine.

5. Ground points MUST adequately conduct electricity. Anything that might prevent adequate flow of electricity MUST be removed. This includes grease, dirt, glue, plastic, carpet, rubber, and even paint. Always clean and clear your ground point of everything. It is best to grind or sand the area of metal to which you intend to attach your main ground. The area is generally the size of a quarter, so make sure you have enough clear surface area to accomodate your ground connection and bolt. The best ground connection is one that attaches directly to the grounded frame of the vehicle.

6. Always secure everything! It is never a smart idea to allow amps, sub boxes, speakers, capacitors, distribution blocks, etc., to freely move about with just the restraint of the wires to which they are connected. This can and will cause a short and may even arc to start a fire! BIG TIME DANGEROUS!

7. Isolate and secure your power and ground circuit away from your signal wires. This will prevent things from coming loose causing a short, and will also prevent signal noise. This is always a safe practice, even with the most shielded and expensive sets of signal wires. This even holds true for systems using Balanced Line Drivers, as any power can and will introduce interference.

8. Isolate any and all signal wires away from everything else. There are multiple wires that run the length of the vehicle that pass current that can introduce noise into your system. If your signal wires must cross some sort of power or ground wire, do so at a 90 degree angle to the power wire to prevent any ambient interference.

9. Use adequate speaker wire for your connections to the speakers. You've come this far to create the ultimate stereo system for your vehicle, why cheap out now? Speaker wire is relatively cheap, and the same physical rules apply to speaker wire as do to power wire. Thinner guage wire will produce more resistance over longer distances than thicker guage wire. This is not anywhere near as important here as it is with power and ground, but it can play a role if you cheap out and use too thin a guage of wire.

10. Above all, make sure everything is secure BEFORE you connect the negative at the battery and start the car. This is just common sense, but it is quite common a mistake that happens to the best of us.

I know this is quite long, but it is well worth the read for everyone (even the pros) as we all take things for granted when we're in a rush and can easily make a stupid mistake that could cost us.
I hope this helps others out on their individual quests for the ultimate audio system.

UV7

 

I'll give that an x 4.

I remember all to well in my younger days when I tapped a live power wire into the bare metal in my Neons trunk because I didn't think to unhook the battery.

Fun happy bluish green sparks.

 

good post UV7

 

Great Post u7! That should help them.