Brakefade

I have a couple of questions I hope you guys can answer.

1. Some turbo kits come with BOVs (ZPI stage 1), and others with BPVs (Turbonetics). So is it a given that the ones with BOVs will run a rich, or does the computer take care of that? And how about the ones that come with no computer?

2. Are there any problems with taking a NA equipped with a turbo, to the track/circuit every other weekend? Obviously life of the car will be shorten, and how well maintained the car is will play a big role, but are there any inherit problems from racing a NA car with a bolt on turbo kit?

-Thanks

zer0

The turbonetics comes with their Raptor BOV, its just recirculated.

jwaggz82

iTrader: (1)

i think its dezod that comes w/ the bpv

zer0

Nah, they switch to the HKS SSQV instead of the Tial.

The only app that uses a BPV is the TRD S/C.

Joe_Dezod

All turbo kit companies are using a blow off valve. Turbnetics usues a recirculated blow-off valve.

We did recently switch to the HKS due to other upgrades we're making to the kit. With a new engine management system, we needed a BOV that could be recirculated if we tried it.

As for Drag/Circuit... two TOTALLY different beasts.

Ideally different things work better for each application. Drag radials or slicks for the dragway, then you have a choice of your low-pros, r compounds, or even slicks depending on class.

With a drag setup, a larger turbo with more boost is more tolerable. You can make more top end power and because your're not flooring it for long periods of time. At a circuit however it's the exact opposite. Heat is the enemy! With higher boost comes higher intake temps. The temps will wear at your motor when you add in the higher combustion pressures and more fuel. The head will get hot, and your cooling system will be working over-board.

I don't think there's a kit out right now that's really safe to run on a bi-weekly basis on a multi-lap cicuit and expect to drive it around town every day bewteen. I'm being 100% honest. Even our S1 is not designed to do that. There's many things to consider. Ditch the cat if you racing on laps for over 5-10 min at WOT. Another thing to consider is a fast spooling turbo so you don't fall off the torque curve when you're coming out of a long corner. You also want lower boost so the prolong abuse isn't as rough.

The biggest limitation to the track right now is a really good enigne management system. I know I'm lighting a bunch of fires when I say it, but for the most part it's true. The TRD flash with stock boost, and the AEM (any stand-alone for that matter) are the only systems out there I'd race for a full multi-lap circuit event. The reason being, closed loop tuning! There is NO piggy back our for the Scion right now that allows anyone to tune the partial throttle A/F curves. SURE it allows you to adjust it, but for those of us fortunate enough to have a wide-band and other gauges, we all see that it does absolutely nothing unless we floor it. What's the result you ask? An AVG 14.7 AFR (somtimes as high as 15.5 or so). That's even at 10+ PSI!!! That's way too lean for our motor. With the high compression, advanced timing, and week rings, it's just asking for trouble. WOT is fine, but if you're racing to the edge, you're constantly modulating the gas to get the most out of each turn.

This will change soon though. I know the AEM should be out soon. I also know that we plan on releasing our new plug and play piggy back system at the end of this week. Our new system is completely different than what any EMS has done on the tC. It's wired differently, configured differently, and upgradeable. It will allow us to modiify patial throttle maps, making daly driving and circuit racing MUCH more safe for all.

I drag the car often, and at a little over, or right around 10psi. I dd at 9psi. The car has done great with about 9k miles on the turbo kit. I expect some severe engine wear if I circuit the car though. This is why we're releasing our S2 and new EMS. It's a true racer package that can properly cater to more demanding racing elements.

BTW - LIGHT flywheels are great for road racing. You need special high-temp brake pads, and higher boiling point fluids so when the temps go up your system stays sound.

Any other q's ask away!

THansenite

^^^Very nice write up. I didn't realize that you couldn't adjust the AFR throughout the fuel map. I am definately interested to see how that new AEM works with turbo'd tCs.

rhythmnsmoke

1) Being rich is a matter of the tuning, not wether you are using a BPV or a BOV.

2) We spend just about every weekend drag racing. There has yet to be seen a tC on FI track/circuit racing. There is one S/C guy though that is AutoX'ing.

Joe_Dezod

We plan on doing full course racing soon. We're developing a lot of things to get there right now. I feel that's a true testament to the engineering and tuning of a system.

toyotaracer9

I think he meant when you dump the air that has already been metered by the MAF . it makes for a rich condition .

unlimited77

Joe, I had a question. WHen you referred to the AEM, are you talking about the plug and play EMS system? I was on their site and couldn't find any info really. Or can we use the universal ems and harness?

I might be way off, but I know what the AEM does, the features, but what time frame are we looking at do you think? And for other vehicles I been seeing anywhere from $2100~$2500, for the Tc would it cost more or around similar price range?
I really want this and think its a more have to for me for safety reason since I live in the middle of nowhere, and was actually waiting on people to get this and test before I go f/i.

thank you

rhythmnsmoke

oh

nonetheless, it runs good either way.

Brakefade

So the computer does nothing to correct the F/A mixture when the BOV opens up? So it's a given that unrecerculated BOV turbo kits will run rich in that instance?

Very nice write up Joe. A lot of good info. I think I'll work on some of the handling aspecs of the car before I decide on a power adder.

rhythmnsmoke

^^Apparently the recir kits are coming shipped pre-tuned to run rich as well(depending on your location). So, either way, you need to retune it to lean out the mixture.

Joe_Dezod

Thanks...

Braking and handling will shave more time off your lap times than power (to a certain extent of course. But for the money, lap times get shorter more for the money with handling and braking mods.

I like the coilover with rear progress sway setup. I have the "oem" Hotchkis front upper strut bar, and will be using the Ingalls rear strut tower brace when it shows up.

As for brakes I'm using Brembo cross-drilled vented fronts, crossdrilled rears. Axxis ultimate pads (not intended for road racing, it's a street temp pad). And I'm using ATE fluid. Also awaiting my Ingalls brake lines and clutch line.

I switched my tranny fluid to Royal Purlpe Synchro shift and the dif is night and day. Reliable shifts indirectly cut your lap times down because you have less chance of missing gears which kills your time.

GL!

ELNENE

Can anyone tell me if you can use the sc oil sw. adapter for the oil line from the pan on the the turbo kits I was told it bolts on with out retapping the head. thanks