Hondas performance cars are made to be a race cars. And regradless us what people say honda has enough power. It doesnt have as much low end torquwe as toyotas but have sufficeint enough to go around. Honda builds power different than most other maunfactures. High horse power and low torque. What that gives you is linear power with good fuel economy when not driven hard. I do think it is a good combination.

And by the way s2000 has 9000 rmp or lower redline depending on years. High reving engine make driving more enjoyable when driven hard and its true that it can be annoying as well in daiyling driving. not to mention s2000 has pretty stiff suspension as well. I think hondas are well balanced and power does not overwhelm handling and vise versa. I think their weakness always have been brakes tho. On the other has toyota build their cars totally different. They hae built some really good sortier cars, but not lately. most of toyota cars a about comfort and quiteness etc. TC is comfortable but as unbalanced as it can get. Has huge throttle lag, too much tq, no top end power, really really soft suspension. I find it kinda hard to drive the TC hard. Tough to shift quick and too much body roll. WHich all equates to comfortable but boring to drive. I guess it could be fun to spin tires. If i have to choose btn low end torque and top end power, I would alwyas choose top end. If i need low end tq i would get a truck or mustang.

I would def get toyota truck over hondas for low end tq, but as far as cars go Hondas are 100 times more fun to drive than toyotas. Honda cars just seem to have better overall balance and suspension.

People buy cars for different reasons and honda buyers and toyota buyers value different qualities of the car that are very different so there are going to be ours is better than urs sort of argument from some people. If you have hybrid car driver and big suv driver there is always going to some arguments

 

Oh, Zebman, you spoke too soon.

Just take a look at the aero & exterior forum... "how I do fix the wiring on my altezza tails?"

 

gotta love the rice flavor

 

For me I just hate the people driving the hondas. Their attitude and vibe I get from them when I get close to any kind of honda is stupid. Either they drive super slow for me to catch up or they go and rev their fart cannons at me. Never hated the actual car itself, only the people that are driving it.

 

honda is good acura is good i like'em
but i dont like the ones who make it look like cheap car

 

actually, most of the Civic's on the road are left STOCK, unlike the Scion croud.... in terms of modding tastefully, everyone has their input and some may find another person's car nasty and another may like it.
Unfortuntely, Civic (up until the 8thgeneration) has been an entry level car and many uneducated young people get one and think immediately "I'm going to do this and that". That is not unlike SL.... so there comes the clash. Adult version of "my toy car collection is better than yours".
But yeah, SL does have a lot of hate and a lot of hate is put upon SL. I have owned 2 Honda's before this and I know in the near future, I will be driving another. Honda's are great cars as are Toyota's but something about a Honda manual transmission really gets me going.

 

The Honda/ Toyota hate mostly comes from the juvenile sense of tribal brand rivalry between some owners, but the worst "hate" I ever encountered comes from members from VW sites like VortexVW Some people in there sound like they consider anyone driving anything other tha a VW or another so-called "Geman Engineered" car, are sub-human or something like it, and considers any Asian car as cheap boring junk on wheels. I've owned VWs and I know what the truth is about their cars, but I'd rather not share that dirty laundry. I think a lot of these haters sometimes fight or deny their hidden frustrations about their cars by just dissing others. again, it's just mostly tribal mentality which we are best to just ignore.
JMO

Chombi

 

It’s the top two Japanese auto makers, of course there's gonna be a rivalry.

I grew up riding Honda bikes from the 70’s. I got nothin but love for em. They’re well built machines that take a beating and last for ever. Honda tuners tend to get lumped in to a category because of the attitude a fair sized handful of the young ones have ...unfortunately I see that attitude all too often in the Scion community. I think it’s that typical high school alpha male inferiority complex coupled with hormonal over load that for some lingers thru their 20’s. I saw the same thing going down between the domestic fanboys when I was building vintage pro street cars a couple years back. It all boils down to Calvin ____ing on something.

 

everyone hates the scions even our own relatives (celicas) hate on us and i think we hate on them because they hate on us. Idk maybe its because scion seems to b taking over the import world. i just tell them to me a river (im 20)

 

i dunno, maybe its because of cars like these...



but seriously they are slow and incredibly riced out and they owners think they are racecars. I hate honda too, but I do have respect for fast ones...

its just a rivalry, because our cars are similar. Just like BMW and audi, or lambo and ferrari... the tc compares to the civics and acuras and being it is a toyota you can see where the rivalry comes from...

JOE

 

^ what does you being 20 have to do with anything?

I see a lot of misplaced hatred to Honda. It's not the company that makes their cars looks, sound, and drive like crap its the user error. Honda has only gotten a bad name from the fools who load their cars with walmart parts and try to race everyone.

there are a few though who actually try hard to make their Honda respectable and I respect that. I owned a '02 Honda Civic before this car and loved it, I will only buy Honda or Toyota products till I die.

 

this is the perfect explanation. Thank God most Honda owners are NOT like that.

edit: Here on SL, there is so much hate sometimes that Scion owners fight against each other.

 

I think we do have to be careful. I occasionally see (or HEAR :doh) tCs which, quite frankly, aren't much better than a riced-out Civic.

 

Reading through this thread I have seen so many generalizations that are really just uncalled for. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I really don't see how you can say a whole brand of cars is crap. I have seen countless Accords and Civics that are really clean and definitely modded tastefully and thoroughly. On the other side, I have seen a huge number of tC's sporting the eBay special parts that put us at the same level as the "typical" honda owners out there.

I think all this hatred comes from the fact that tC owners don't want to be the next civic, even though the ease of modification of the tCs will just lead to more cheap "civic-like" parts that people will modify their tCs with thus leading our cars to be the "rice" of the future.

We really owe it to the other brands who have influenced Toyota to develop a brand based on the ease of modification and customization. You can't hate everyone, you are just making the other owners look bad. I would think it would be more interesting to learn from the others and build our cars accordingly.

 

this is NOT me........

 

Knowledge
If you don't understand the engineering behind Honda engines, maybe you should read up on them before disliking them. That way, at least you know why you dislike them. A good point to start would be torque at the wheels via transmission gear ratios and the importance of flat torque curves.

Stereotypes
As for "rice", I see many tCs that fit that same definition here in SoCal. Sporty cars that are popular with young people will have a higher proportion of mods. It used to be Civics, it's now tCs and WRXs. The cars will change but the "rice" will always be there. Besides, most Civics are not modded.

Trying to sound wise
Whether you like a car or not is very subjective. Don't be a "fanboy" and bash things you don't understand.