I see your point...But I think its a little different when I ask God to let me be with my family when I die, then to ask God to physically change me into a freak

 

what makes my hope of a belief when I was 7, different than you christians?

Books stating first hand experience.
Witnesses alive today that propose to have seen them.
People in many different countries of different religions even, that all say about the same thing.

Actually it almost seems like mine has more of a chance of being true as christianity, right?

 

Wow I've heard plenty of Christians assume plenty of things about God but this one is by far the funniest...
God kills innocent babies so that the people that don't even believe in him will be happy. That's theist logic for ya.

 

heres a good read

http://wiki.cotch.net/index.php/Sea_...n_mountaintops

http://wiki.cotch.net/index.php/Intelligent_Design

http://wiki.cotch.net/index.php/Theory_of_Evolution

 

I see YOUR point...But I think its a little different when billions of people ask God to end starvation for millions of children, then to ask God to give you a comfortable afterlife

see how yours now is as petty as mine, when you look at the whole picture?

 

Afternoon guys,
Sorry I haven't posted today. Work's a bit crazy today and I can't spend as much time in here as I wish I could.

That being said I have a question for the Atheist. It seems like the Christians are the ones answering the questions so please excuse me for asking one back.

Let's pretend there was a being, that existed outside of time and space, created all of existence as we know it, takes part in the way everything is going/will go, and this being is omnipotent.
Ok well my question is this. If this being could see EVERYTHING that was going to happen and knew that as awful as it seems to us in the here and now, that by doing something like killing a baby He could in turn save ten other babies. Where would we be able to question the one creature that gave that one baby it's life to begin with and why is it our place to say, no you can't kill that one baby!

 

aren't you christians doing that already?

I believe "the needs of the many, outweight the needs of the few." just like spock.

But how is killing 10 kids in africa or india helping 100 kids anywhere else.
in a place like ethopia, you got enough food for 10 kids for every 100. it's not food for 100 out of 110.

and the kids that don't die, are severly malnurished

Isn't that the pro-choice argument?

 

Wait...If were going to pretend then can I have Magneto's powers from x-men? LOL...
We can "pretend" all day long but that is the opposite of what debates like this are about. The Atheist are trying to get away from the pretend world.
So basically we are God's creations so he can do with us as he wants? The bible says that God is now a compassionate God so that isn't even helping your case. There are a million other reasons your question is invalid (like killing 1 baby in africa doesn't save ten, they all die) but I don't have time.

 

Edited my post above. read the links if your your a theist. this stuff pretty much repeats (somethings in greater detail) why things like the flood in the bible are incorrect.

 

You know what I actually find pretty funny? How I sat there and tried to answer questions for you guys for quite a while here, but the minute I decide to ask one back you all become quite defensive and catty.
Even all the little jabs I took for the answers I gave didn't make me attack any of your questions.

I'm kinda shocked how easily the "Enlightened" on here are the quickest to resort to mudslinging.

Makes me wonder why the word Debate is even in the title of this thread.

 

seriously man, what did you ask of atheists.
you just asked if god kills 10 kids to save 100, isn't that ok? I said yes, but then asked how is killing 10 kids in a place like ethopia saving even 1 kid, or 100.

you're arriving late into the game, and when me or someone else has to reexplain the same thing over and over, because you guys aren't reading the discusion, yeah the second or third time i'll answer the same question, each reanswer is going to get more sarcastic or belittling. It's like when you have to tell a child something 10 times because they weren't paying attention the first 9. The first time you say something, you say it straight, you butter up your words to sound nice. then when you learn that falls on deaf ears, frustration builds, and it doesn't come out as nice. sorry. please read the debate. but i'll now be nice and patient and answer the same questions again just like i did the first time.

You can easily read the few atheist here have been spending tons of time playing "explain how the science that we all learned in elementary school and junior high works because I forgot". even my christian school taught us plate techtonics and subduction.

 

meh dont mind the attitudes in here. i get into these heated debates all the time here and some heavy words get thrown around. but it doesnt really bother me because at the end of the day i know that these same people love the same thing as much as i do...scions.

so we may yell and scream, but we mean it in the best way, hoping that we can put that all aside and be friends.

 

Did any of our questions begin with "pretend"? We could pretend an infinite amount of things all day long and it would get us nowhere because all were interested in is reality.

Nobody was mudslinging, you simply did not like our answer.

Not one Atheist will ever tell you he is enlightened. We claim to know far far far less than any theist. You are the ones who know for sure what happens after we die and also how the world was created, Atheist cannot claim such things for sure.

 

Please kahuna, ask a question based on reality. Hell I'll even let you ask a question that assumes there is a god but it must make sense. No babies are dying to save other babies in this earth so your question was completely IRRELEVANT! Tell me how I am wrong... tell me what relevance your question had to this earth.

 

I find this pretty gosh darn interesting as the very definition of Atheism is:
aˇtheˇist [ áythee ist ] (plural aˇtheˇists)
noun
Definition:
unbeliever in God or deities: somebody who does not believe in God or deities

So I guess that by you calling yourselves atheists you are in fact taking up the mantle that you know for a fact no god exists. If however that is not what you believe then I humbly ask that you begin to refer to yourself as an Agnostic:
agˇnosˇtic [ ag nóstik ] (plural agˇnosˇtics)
noun
Definition:
1. somebody denying God's existence is provable: somebody who believes that it is impossible to know whether or not God exists
2. somebody denying something is knowable: somebody who doubts that a question has one correct answer or that something can be completely understood
I'm an agnostic concerning space aliens.


Now I hate to play the semantics card here but seeing how I was blasted for saying the word pretend I guess its ok.

As far as being so called "Enlightened" read any Atheist website about the "Age of Enlightment" and how this time period allowed the "enlightened and reasoned were allowed to be the atheist they knew they were." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment

 

So what you are saying is that if someone comes late in the game they don't deserve to take place in the conversation? The only reason I used the "Dead Baby" arguement is because it was the one that you and your fellow atheists used countless times. You could pick any thing and put it in the same place.
However it just seems that its easier to put the question down then to answer it.

 

Dude, he answered all your questions that had already been answered so obviously he isn't saying you can't coe into the conversation late.

In regards to Atheist being enlightened I already explained to you that while you "know" what happens after death/how the world was created we don't, so who would you consider more enlightened.
You still haven't taken me up on my offer to simply post a question you want answered that makes sense and isn't based in a fantasy "pretend" world.

 

im very torn on what i am.

Id say i was an atheist because i do not believe there is a god, and i feel fairly strong about this.

But, i could say im agnostic because i dont believe in god because there is no proof suggesting his existence. But if someone were to somehow prove that god existed (and i dont know how they could), id be the first one in line to be converted as a believer...but god better have some good explanations for some tough questions i have.

i think any person would be an idiot if god could be proven beyond a reasonable doubt and they still didnt believe. is that too unreasonable?


Now, i am completely anti-church. Churches and their documents have been repeatedly proven wrong, or explanations have been witnessed, tested, and repeated when they state supernatural events occur.

Churches brainwash people for their own gain, its disgusting.

 

Any logical thinking Atheist will tell you that God is a possibility, just like it is a possibility that invisible people run around amongst us, or there is an invisible fairy world in dave's closet.
Theists will tell you that there not being a god is not a possibility (if you say it is possible for there to not be a god you don't go to heaven so be careful).
So who is more closed minded?

(oh, by the way kahuna, this is an example of a question based in reality.)

 

i do sorta agree. I am an atheist.
I believe in the big bang. I believe in evolution. but I take diagreement with
"you are in fact taking up the mantle that you know for a fact no god exists"
if I could prove that no god exists, then I would be able to prove something isn't. Something that can't be done by any scientist, christian or atheist.

I can prove through logical deduction the many of the ideas of genesis says is true is false. I can prove you, like most people, got your original idea of a god from people who believed in the bible, and i believe if the bible is false, and that then your idea of a god came from something that is false.

Agnostics don't know one way or another. I believe god is a fabric of some cavemens' imaginations, and it has transformed into the many religions we have today.

a deity is totally provable. especially one that has all these magical powers like you claim. we could simply wait for any of these miracles to happen and observe them, but you christians like to say "he won't actually do real miracles nowadays, just ones that could be natural occuring coincidences".

Christians keep their idea of a god from ever being able to be proven, by saying "god is magic, and magic can do anything it wants." again, you can only prove something is. you can't not prove something isn't. the burden of proof is on the claimant, not the person being told the story. If I say magic exists, I shouldn't say "i'm not proving it, you need to prove it can't happen" that doesn't prove anything besides me being a dumbazz.

people who believe in god make up insane criteria for non-believer to prove that is not based in reality.